I'm in the middle of running my first campaign. I've written it myself and I'm made up that it's going so well. My players are a dragonborn fighter/paladin (lawful good but very proud and prickly), a goliath cleric (chaotic good, stubborn and often misses the subtext in conversation with the smallfolk) and a human warlock (chaotic neutral, secretive, untrusting and conflicted after being tricked into a pact with her patron).
They're trapped in a prison city with loads of gangs (think escape from new York meets the warriors). As its a city I don't want them to be able to flit from one key place to another without a sense of it taking time or being dangerous. We've done one session in the prison and having a couple of small moral encounters worked well. Do they leave the guy being beaten by a rival gang in the street and save themselves for their objectives or intervene and risk arriving at "the real fight" understrength? They can't step in every time and get to the escape point on time so they have to pick and choose when to step in.
Can anyone help me with ideas for these mini encounters? They don't need to be combat based but defo can be. The only guidance I can give for the kind of ideas I'm after is that stepping away/ignoring it should leave a bad taste in the party's mouths.
Personally I would leave moral questions out of the game, unless that's the kind of thing you and your players want. You really don't want to give players two options, then have them emotionally regret their decision. I don't really have much advice on moral dilemmas but that's my take.
Moral dilemmas are great but don't only do moral dilemmas. It sounds like you already have some. The good news is there are tons of other risk-reward decisions you can toss out there besides just morality baiting. Because, well, two reasons. You risk accidentally 'teaching' the PCs to be murderhobos. If their callous behavior is always making things easier for them, they'll probably take the hint and become more and more callous. And two, it can become one note, emotionally flat, if you overdo it.
Offer them a shortcut that is too clear and out in the open. Make it feel like a trap without giving away if it really is one or not. Now there is a dilemma. Morality-free.
Have a chase scene where they get a short lead and have an opportunity to get away...but, also see a cache of supplies or equipment that'll take a few minutes to extract. Now you have a dilemma, grab the goods and risk getting caught, or, skip the goods and let them fall into the hands of the people chasing the party. Dilemma, morality-free.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
That's really helpful thanks. Defo doing those. I take your point about doing only morality stuff. I also don't want it to feel like I'm trying to make a point or make the game feel like I'm trying to "say something ". I guess I'd run that risk if I overplayed my hand too
The DM for a game I'm a player in is surprised by the number of times a moral dilemma happened in his game when it wasn't planned: he just thought we'd, for example, kill the dragon and be on our merry way. The dragon we'd been tasked to deal with was bound and thus unable to defend itself properly, but without the promise of it being good, we decided we could not allow it to be unleashed upon the world. The point to this being your players may decide among themselves the best course of action, and sometimes the best course of action may be the least horrible one given the prison environment they're in.
Don't present them moral options as such, rather do as you normally do as a DM: present them opportunities and let them interpret the morality of it. An abandoned cache of goodies might be an ordinary sight in a fantasy dungeon, but this could be supplies someone dropped before they ran away from a band of thugs, hoping to come collect them later. The players might never know whether taking them had doomed their previous owner to death by starvation. Don't guilt trip them, but as Ravnodaus says, make it feel like a trap that can be easily sidestepped if they so choose.
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Zero is the most important number in D&D: Session Zero sets the boundaries and the tone; Rule Zero dictates the Dungeon Master (DM) is the final arbiter; and Zero D&D is better than Bad D&D.
"Let us speak plainly now, and in earnest, for words mean little without the weight of conviction."
Be wary of moral choices like this; DnD is a game and the players need to feel that they can win. When there are two options and both seem bad, they get a feeling that they are being presented with situations that they can't win. This sounds gritty and tough, but in actuality just ends up being demoralising.
Also, consider that what you think of as a moral dilemma may not be one for the PCs! Present them with situations and let them figure them out. Never provide a scenario that they cannot win (e.g. you fight the troll and save the child, so the parents are eaten, or save the parents and the child is eaten). Present a scenario in which the parents and child are in danger and a troll tries to eat them. There must be a chance to win through!
There needs to be a way for them to win, but... you don't need to know what it is in advance as the DM. You don't need to put some obvious win-button into the mix.
Your players will surprise you with their creative problem solving if you give them the space to do so. They'll solve problems in ways you hadn't ever considered.
So, when the situation calls for it, you can absolutely present what seems like no-win situations to your players. Then, watch in amazement as they win anyway against all odds regardless. As long as you remain open to their creative problem solving, anything can happen. And in those moments are some of the magic of the game.
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I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Well the first one should be some innocent npc gets dragged out to the streets and starts getting beaten. Either they stay in shadows and move along or help. Have many potential threats in the nearby buildings.
They continue on, maybe a gang having dogs fighting each other. They are cheering when one of the slaves they weren't paying attention to makes a run for it. This would be a fight they almost certainly can't win, so they gotta watch this npc get caught by feral dogs and torn to pieces. Hehe.
As they turn a block corner they see a rival gang coming up to start a battle. Which could help them get out of that last situation if it went badly.
How about a classic one? The players witness a rich person being robbed by a poor, desperate person. What is being stolen, as well as whether or not the guards intervene is up to you. How do the players react, if they choose to at all? Does the answer to this question vary from player to player? Even simple, frequently used dilemmas like these have the potential for some interesting roleplay.
Panda-wat (I hate my username) is somehow convinced that he is objectively right about everything D&D related even though he obviously is not. Considering that, he'd probably make a great D&D youtuber.
"If I die, I can live with that." ~Luke Hart, the DM lair
There needs to be a way for them to win, but... you don't need to know what it is in advance as the DM. You don't need to put some obvious win-button into the mix.
Your players will surprise you with their creative problem solving if you give them the space to do so. They'll solve problems in ways you hadn't ever considered.
So, when the situation calls for it, you can absolutely present what seems like no-win situations to your players. Then, watch in amazement as they win anyway against all odds regardless. As long as you remain open to their creative problem solving, anything can happen. And in those moments are some of the magic of the game.
I actually agree with Rav on this one. I regularly throw situations at my players with absolutely no idea how they can overcome the challenge whatsoever, yet they always find a way. It’s the DM’s job to design the challenges, it’s the players’ job to figure out how to overcome them.
Party comes across a mortally wounded NPC. They could render aid, but they all smell in the sack beside him something unmistakable and quite wonderful. The NPC has the last 6 McRibs that were made available in the town for a limited time, and it's possible things as they are, the McRib may never come back.
Actually, no. I really wanted to frame this as a heart wrenching dilemma, but there is really only one thing the party can do here, I almost feel bad for rail roading them if not for the fact that the characters would get the boon of consuming these rare McRibs.
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Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
Look at what you've done. You spoiled it. You have nobody to blame but yourself. Go sit and think about your actions.
Don't be mean. Rudeness is a vicious cycle, and it has to stop somewhere. Exceptions for things that are funny. Go to the current Competition of the Finest 'Brews! It's a cool place where cool people make cool things.
How I'm posting based on text formatting: Mod Hat Off - Mod Hat Also Off (I'm not a mod)
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Evening,
I'm in the middle of running my first campaign. I've written it myself and I'm made up that it's going so well. My players are a dragonborn fighter/paladin (lawful good but very proud and prickly), a goliath cleric (chaotic good, stubborn and often misses the subtext in conversation with the smallfolk) and a human warlock (chaotic neutral, secretive, untrusting and conflicted after being tricked into a pact with her patron).
They're trapped in a prison city with loads of gangs (think escape from new York meets the warriors). As its a city I don't want them to be able to flit from one key place to another without a sense of it taking time or being dangerous. We've done one session in the prison and having a couple of small moral encounters worked well. Do they leave the guy being beaten by a rival gang in the street and save themselves for their objectives or intervene and risk arriving at "the real fight" understrength? They can't step in every time and get to the escape point on time so they have to pick and choose when to step in.
Can anyone help me with ideas for these mini encounters? They don't need to be combat based but defo can be. The only guidance I can give for the kind of ideas I'm after is that stepping away/ignoring it should leave a bad taste in the party's mouths.
Thanks for your help!
Personally I would leave moral questions out of the game, unless that's the kind of thing you and your players want. You really don't want to give players two options, then have them emotionally regret their decision. I don't really have much advice on moral dilemmas but that's my take.
[REDACTED]
Moral dilemmas are great but don't only do moral dilemmas. It sounds like you already have some. The good news is there are tons of other risk-reward decisions you can toss out there besides just morality baiting. Because, well, two reasons. You risk accidentally 'teaching' the PCs to be murderhobos. If their callous behavior is always making things easier for them, they'll probably take the hint and become more and more callous. And two, it can become one note, emotionally flat, if you overdo it.
Offer them a shortcut that is too clear and out in the open. Make it feel like a trap without giving away if it really is one or not. Now there is a dilemma. Morality-free.
Have a chase scene where they get a short lead and have an opportunity to get away...but, also see a cache of supplies or equipment that'll take a few minutes to extract. Now you have a dilemma, grab the goods and risk getting caught, or, skip the goods and let them fall into the hands of the people chasing the party. Dilemma, morality-free.
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
That's really helpful thanks. Defo doing those. I take your point about doing only morality stuff. I also don't want it to feel like I'm trying to make a point or make the game feel like I'm trying to "say something ". I guess I'd run that risk if I overplayed my hand too
The DM for a game I'm a player in is surprised by the number of times a moral dilemma happened in his game when it wasn't planned: he just thought we'd, for example, kill the dragon and be on our merry way. The dragon we'd been tasked to deal with was bound and thus unable to defend itself properly, but without the promise of it being good, we decided we could not allow it to be unleashed upon the world. The point to this being your players may decide among themselves the best course of action, and sometimes the best course of action may be the least horrible one given the prison environment they're in.
Don't present them moral options as such, rather do as you normally do as a DM: present them opportunities and let them interpret the morality of it. An abandoned cache of goodies might be an ordinary sight in a fantasy dungeon, but this could be supplies someone dropped before they ran away from a band of thugs, hoping to come collect them later. The players might never know whether taking them had doomed their previous owner to death by starvation. Don't guilt trip them, but as Ravnodaus says, make it feel like a trap that can be easily sidestepped if they so choose.
Zero is the most important number in D&D: Session Zero sets the boundaries and the tone; Rule Zero dictates the Dungeon Master (DM) is the final arbiter; and Zero D&D is better than Bad D&D.
"Let us speak plainly now, and in earnest, for words mean little without the weight of conviction."
- The Assemblage of Houses, World of Warcraft
Be wary of moral choices like this; DnD is a game and the players need to feel that they can win. When there are two options and both seem bad, they get a feeling that they are being presented with situations that they can't win. This sounds gritty and tough, but in actuality just ends up being demoralising.
Also, consider that what you think of as a moral dilemma may not be one for the PCs! Present them with situations and let them figure them out. Never provide a scenario that they cannot win (e.g. you fight the troll and save the child, so the parents are eaten, or save the parents and the child is eaten). Present a scenario in which the parents and child are in danger and a troll tries to eat them. There must be a chance to win through!
There needs to be a way for them to win, but... you don't need to know what it is in advance as the DM. You don't need to put some obvious win-button into the mix.
Your players will surprise you with their creative problem solving if you give them the space to do so. They'll solve problems in ways you hadn't ever considered.
So, when the situation calls for it, you can absolutely present what seems like no-win situations to your players. Then, watch in amazement as they win anyway against all odds regardless. As long as you remain open to their creative problem solving, anything can happen. And in those moments are some of the magic of the game.
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Well the first one should be some innocent npc gets dragged out to the streets and starts getting beaten. Either they stay in shadows and move along or help. Have many potential threats in the nearby buildings.
They continue on, maybe a gang having dogs fighting each other. They are cheering when one of the slaves they weren't paying attention to makes a run for it. This would be a fight they almost certainly can't win, so they gotta watch this npc get caught by feral dogs and torn to pieces. Hehe.
As they turn a block corner they see a rival gang coming up to start a battle. Which could help them get out of that last situation if it went badly.
How about a classic one? The players witness a rich person being robbed by a poor, desperate person. What is being stolen, as well as whether or not the guards intervene is up to you. How do the players react, if they choose to at all? Does the answer to this question vary from player to player? Even simple, frequently used dilemmas like these have the potential for some interesting roleplay.
Panda-wat (I hate my username) is somehow convinced that he is objectively right about everything D&D related even though he obviously is not. Considering that, he'd probably make a great D&D youtuber.
"If I die, I can live with that." ~Luke Hart, the DM lair
Try to help someone themselves, or alert the authorities? Both have consequences.
Helping someone risks exposing a secret.
Helping someone makes them a powerful enemy.
I actually agree with Rav on this one. I regularly throw situations at my players with absolutely no idea how they can overcome the challenge whatsoever, yet they always find a way. It’s the DM’s job to design the challenges, it’s the players’ job to figure out how to overcome them.
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Content Troubleshooting
Party comes across a mortally wounded NPC. They could render aid, but they all smell in the sack beside him something unmistakable and quite wonderful. The NPC has the last 6 McRibs that were made available in the town for a limited time, and it's possible things as they are, the McRib may never come back.
Actually, no. I really wanted to frame this as a heart wrenching dilemma, but there is really only one thing the party can do here, I almost feel bad for rail roading them if not for the fact that the characters would get the boon of consuming these rare McRibs.
Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
Easy. Give the players a choice.
completion of main quest
OR
dog
Look at what you've done. You spoiled it. You have nobody to blame but yourself. Go sit and think about your actions.
Don't be mean. Rudeness is a vicious cycle, and it has to stop somewhere. Exceptions for things that are funny.
Go to the current Competition of the Finest 'Brews! It's a cool place where cool people make cool things.
How I'm posting based on text formatting: Mod Hat Off - Mod Hat Also Off (I'm not a mod)