I've got a party with two warlocks and I always feel pressured to give short rests for them to replenish slots and features. Of course there are a lot of other mechanisms that use a short rest to replenish as well.
I'm curious how often other DMs give a short rest, or rather how many per day between long rests? What is fair? How do I help players better understand that resources are not intended to be endless and readily available at all times, and that in fact this diminishes the creativity of resource management?
This also relates to the current mega-thread on the redisign of Warlocks in the UA forum.
Short rest aren't limited per day like long rest are so a party can decide to take as many as they want. My player characters usually take between 1-3 short rest per adventuring day, depending how busy or time pressured they are. On a day where no encounter occur or a few easy one, no short rest is taken but as soon as a normal or hard encounter happen, the party will try to take one immediately after if possible. More short rest are taken when more of such encounters occur so i voted 2 for average purposes but a more precise number would be 1.72 ☺
There isn’t a limit to short rests in a day like long rests, so technically the party can do them as much as they want. That being said, if you feel they are using them excessively and slowing down the progression there are a variety of mechanisms you as DM can use to discourage them resting every other scene. The easiest is having them be attacked by a wandering monster in a random encounter while trying to do the short rest. It can encourage them to be more careful and sure of their situational safety when doing a short rest. Remember, RAW is that a short rest is at least an hour long. That is a LONG time when in the middlE of a dungeon or whatever they are doing, so unless they can find someplace to properly secure and fortify, it’s very realistic they’d be attacked if they try and sit around for an hour
The guidance in the DMG is that A ty0ical adventuring day has 6 to 8 encounters with 2 short rests so thing are balaced along those lines.
This might be appropriate if the party are doing a dungeon crawl, you can set up the dungeon with 6 to 8 places for encounters and a couple of places that see little traffic with a decent chance of not being disturbed for an hour.
In reality it does not make sense to have 6 to 8 encounters in a day. If the party are travelling 20 miles between 2 towns they might come accross some bandits but to also be attacked by wolves, find a bridge over a deep ravine has broken, encounter a Charlemont trying to sell fake goods, get ambushed by some goblins and have the wheel of their cart fall off is stretching things somewhat.
As DM the things to bear in mind are 1) Is it reasonable to expect the party to be able to rest here without disturbance (options yes, no, maybe in the later case roll a dice) and 2) For balancing purposes SR features are meant to be used about 3 times as fast as LR features.
It is perfectly reasonable to add a house rule that you can only gain the benefits of a short rest X times per long rest (the long rest being restricted to once per 24 hour period). You do need to be upfront with your players and work that out with them, as ideally that would have been decided before they picked being warlocks. I think this is actually a common homebrew add, and it is quite possible your party will be receptive to it.
But, also keep in mind warlocks limited spell slot mechanic is meant and designed around having multiple short rests and that is where the class shines. It is OK that they are recharging often. You may want to just not try and fix/nerf that, and let it be.
I would take what Farling was hinting at, and remember the world is a living place and as the party rests ... things happen. Storming the castle clear out the ramparts and guardhouse and board up to take a rest? well the Keep knows your coming, and have prepared ... in fact they had an hour to prepare. That's going to be a harder fight now. Or maybe that hunting patrol came back, and they are now caught between two forced coordinating who otherwise wouldn't. Don't like, punish them for resting, but you know natural consequence. It is a fine line, and exp will help you navigate it. But, hopefully that ramped up tension adds fun and excitement to the game and replaces the lost tension of dwindling resources.
Short rests are something that the party decides to try to take, not the DM. The DM lets the party know the circumstances that the characters are aware of and then based on the circumstances the DM knows and the decision of the party, the DM determines whether the short rest is completed or is interrupted by other events.
The players try to take short rests, the DM simply determines whether the interactions with the game world allow the rests to be successful.
A short rest is a period of downtime, at least 1 hour long, during which a character does nothing more strenuous than eating, drinking, reading, and tending to wounds.
A character can spend one or more Hit Dice at the end of a short rest, up to the character's maximum number of Hit Dice, which is equal to the character's level. For each Hit Die spent in this way, the player rolls the die and adds the character's Constitution modifier to it. The character regains hit points equal to the total (minimum of 0). The player can decide to spend an additional Hit Die after each roll. A character regains some spent Hit Dice upon finishing a long rest, as explained below.
So if the PCs do nothing for an hour and you as the DM don’t have anything interrupt that, they get the benefits of a short rest. If they spend an hour in a cart or carriage being trucked along to some destination they just get the benefits of a short rest. That’s the rule. If you decide to alter those rules as the DM, that’s entirely up to you.
It may be worth distinguishing between short rests and meaningful short rests. If the PCs short rest and then nothing happens for the rest of the day, the fact that they got a short rest doesn't really matter.
I second the note that the players determine when, not the DM.
If you're using hit dice accurately, the short rest will only benefit a minority of the characters, and pushes time forward. If time is not an element in your campaign, it's worth introducing "The prisoners are being moved tomorrow morning", so multiple short rests are consequential. You can also have short rests get interrupted.
You could also establish a minimum duration short rest required for full effect, say 2 hours.
At the same time, it's a primary feature of warlocks that make them not suck, so if these short rests ONLY benefit warlocks, then its not a terrible thing. If it was only 1 warlock, then it wouldn't be an issue right? But who allowed 2 warlocks at the table? The DM. So I think its fair play on them.
Warlocks aren't meant to cast levelled spells in every round of every fight, that's why they have cantrips, invocations, and access to better weapons (depending on subclass). My groups limit it to 2 short rests per day, otherwise there's always someone who insists on taking a short rest after every encounter, using something like Tenser's FLoating Disk or Leomund's Tiny Hut to block doors to make sure the rest is uninterrupted. That's because they want to be able to blow thru all their spells and abilities in EVERY fight instead of managing their resources the way they should be.
The whole point of 5e's cantrips were that spellcasters no longer needed to cast levelled spells every round.
If left up to players, they'd be taking short or long rests after every fight - it's up to the DM to keep the game moving at the proper pace.
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ZERO lol i generally run my games with a skirmish and a big encounter each session. Generally speaking the group patches up after the skirmish and goes on to the main event if they want to do more than that they understand we are rolling to see if random mobs interrupt them. Generally speaking I do long rests between sessions so the players understand the cadence of the campaign and this is nothing new or surprising. Letting players understand the cadence of what your doing so they can plan accordingly for usages of spell slots etc I find to be a use full mechanic - as a dm you aren't trying to ***** the players yet you cant have them dumping all their big spells on every fight, its a balance.
My party take short rests when they choose to, and I decide whether their rest is interrupted.
If you are concerned about short rests then make them use at least 1 hit die to make it qualify as a rest and not just a boring downtime. If you use the long rest rules correctly (which seldom people do) then they recover up to half their hit dice on a long rest, so taking multiple short rests every adventuring day will A) wear down their hit dice, and B) get easier as they become more experienced adventurers.
I let my player's decide when and where they take a short rest. Choose badly and you'll be interrupted. Too often and the dungeon/environment may notice you and adapt.
I go a little strict and say 8 hours of short resting becomes a long rest attempt which is limited per day. This mostly does nothing except avoid shenanigans with sorlock and reminds Players that the difficulty budget has fully reset and they have been wasting time they could have been adventuring or actually resting. As time passes problems escalate. So the most in a day I would allow is 7 before severe consequences.
I've got a party with two warlocks and I always feel pressured to give short rests for them to replenish slots and features. Of course there are a lot of other mechanisms that use a short rest to replenish as well.
I'm curious how often other DMs give a short rest, or rather how many per day between long rests? What is fair? How do I help players better understand that resources are not intended to be endless and readily available at all times, and that in fact this diminishes the creativity of resource management?
This also relates to the current mega-thread on the redisign of Warlocks in the UA forum.
The party decide when to short rest. The DM can then decide whether the conditions are right for them to short rest.
Short rest aren't limited per day like long rest are so a party can decide to take as many as they want. My player characters usually take between 1-3 short rest per adventuring day, depending how busy or time pressured they are. On a day where no encounter occur or a few easy one, no short rest is taken but as soon as a normal or hard encounter happen, the party will try to take one immediately after if possible. More short rest are taken when more of such encounters occur so i voted 2 for average purposes but a more precise number would be 1.72 ☺
There isn’t a limit to short rests in a day like long rests, so technically the party can do them as much as they want. That being said, if you feel they are using them excessively and slowing down the progression there are a variety of mechanisms you as DM can use to discourage them resting every other scene. The easiest is having them be attacked by a wandering monster in a random encounter while trying to do the short rest. It can encourage them to be more careful and sure of their situational safety when doing a short rest. Remember, RAW is that a short rest is at least an hour long. That is a LONG time when in the middlE of a dungeon or whatever they are doing, so unless they can find someplace to properly secure and fortify, it’s very realistic they’d be attacked if they try and sit around for an hour
Technically speaking, short rest are limited to 24/day
But with catnap and a few genie warlocks with Sanctuary Vessel, you can gain those benefits far more frequently.
Having said that, rests are overpowered in d&d.
The guidance in the DMG is that A ty0ical adventuring day has 6 to 8 encounters with 2 short rests so thing are balaced along those lines.
This might be appropriate if the party are doing a dungeon crawl, you can set up the dungeon with 6 to 8 places for encounters and a couple of places that see little traffic with a decent chance of not being disturbed for an hour.
In reality it does not make sense to have 6 to 8 encounters in a day. If the party are travelling 20 miles between 2 towns they might come accross some bandits but to also be attacked by wolves, find a bridge over a deep ravine has broken, encounter a Charlemont trying to sell fake goods, get ambushed by some goblins and have the wheel of their cart fall off is stretching things somewhat.
As DM the things to bear in mind are 1) Is it reasonable to expect the party to be able to rest here without disturbance (options yes, no, maybe in the later case roll a dice) and 2) For balancing purposes SR features are meant to be used about 3 times as fast as LR features.
It is perfectly reasonable to add a house rule that you can only gain the benefits of a short rest X times per long rest (the long rest being restricted to once per 24 hour period). You do need to be upfront with your players and work that out with them, as ideally that would have been decided before they picked being warlocks. I think this is actually a common homebrew add, and it is quite possible your party will be receptive to it.
But, also keep in mind warlocks limited spell slot mechanic is meant and designed around having multiple short rests and that is where the class shines. It is OK that they are recharging often. You may want to just not try and fix/nerf that, and let it be.
I would take what Farling was hinting at, and remember the world is a living place and as the party rests ... things happen. Storming the castle clear out the ramparts and guardhouse and board up to take a rest? well the Keep knows your coming, and have prepared ... in fact they had an hour to prepare. That's going to be a harder fight now. Or maybe that hunting patrol came back, and they are now caught between two forced coordinating who otherwise wouldn't. Don't like, punish them for resting, but you know natural consequence. It is a fine line, and exp will help you navigate it. But, hopefully that ramped up tension adds fun and excitement to the game and replaces the lost tension of dwindling resources.
The Escape from Undergarden 3rd party campaign has a mechanic that, if characters rest too many times, they turn into plants.
Dungeon-type locations can contain contexts that may make it difficult to rest undisturbed.
Beyond situations like these, there's nothing in RAW to restrict potentials to rest.
Short rests are something that the party decides to try to take, not the DM. The DM lets the party know the circumstances that the characters are aware of and then based on the circumstances the DM knows and the decision of the party, the DM determines whether the short rest is completed or is interrupted by other events.
The players try to take short rests, the DM simply determines whether the interactions with the game world allow the rests to be successful.
RAW, whenever a PC spends an hour doing nothing strenuous they automatically get a short rest.
So if the PCs do nothing for an hour and you as the DM don’t have anything interrupt that, they get the benefits of a short rest. If they spend an hour in a cart or carriage being trucked along to some destination they just get the benefits of a short rest. That’s the rule. If you decide to alter those rules as the DM, that’s entirely up to you.
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It may be worth distinguishing between short rests and meaningful short rests. If the PCs short rest and then nothing happens for the rest of the day, the fact that they got a short rest doesn't really matter.
Raw might be unlimited but I have yet to be at a Table that hasn't limited short rests to 1 or 2 a day pretty common house rule where I live.
I second the note that the players determine when, not the DM.
If you're using hit dice accurately, the short rest will only benefit a minority of the characters, and pushes time forward. If time is not an element in your campaign, it's worth introducing "The prisoners are being moved tomorrow morning", so multiple short rests are consequential. You can also have short rests get interrupted.
You could also establish a minimum duration short rest required for full effect, say 2 hours.
At the same time, it's a primary feature of warlocks that make them not suck, so if these short rests ONLY benefit warlocks, then its not a terrible thing. If it was only 1 warlock, then it wouldn't be an issue right? But who allowed 2 warlocks at the table? The DM. So I think its fair play on them.
Warlocks aren't meant to cast levelled spells in every round of every fight, that's why they have cantrips, invocations, and access to better weapons (depending on subclass). My groups limit it to 2 short rests per day, otherwise there's always someone who insists on taking a short rest after every encounter, using something like Tenser's FLoating Disk or Leomund's Tiny Hut to block doors to make sure the rest is uninterrupted. That's because they want to be able to blow thru all their spells and abilities in EVERY fight instead of managing their resources the way they should be.
The whole point of 5e's cantrips were that spellcasters no longer needed to cast levelled spells every round.
If left up to players, they'd be taking short or long rests after every fight - it's up to the DM to keep the game moving at the proper pace.
Playing D&D since 1982
Have played every version of the game since Basic (Red Box Set), except that abomination sometimes called 4e.
I don't generally run more than 2-3 encounters per day (though I run them at deadly+ difficulty) so a short rest per encounter isn't really an issue.
ZERO lol i generally run my games with a skirmish and a big encounter each session. Generally speaking the group patches up after the skirmish and goes on to the main event if they want to do more than that they understand we are rolling to see if random mobs interrupt them. Generally speaking I do long rests between sessions so the players understand the cadence of the campaign and this is nothing new or surprising. Letting players understand the cadence of what your doing so they can plan accordingly for usages of spell slots etc I find to be a use full mechanic - as a dm you aren't trying to ***** the players yet you cant have them dumping all their big spells on every fight, its a balance.
My party take short rests when they choose to, and I decide whether their rest is interrupted.
If you are concerned about short rests then make them use at least 1 hit die to make it qualify as a rest and not just a boring downtime. If you use the long rest rules correctly (which seldom people do) then they recover up to half their hit dice on a long rest, so taking multiple short rests every adventuring day will A) wear down their hit dice, and B) get easier as they become more experienced adventurers.
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I let my player's decide when and where they take a short rest. Choose badly and you'll be interrupted. Too often and the dungeon/environment may notice you and adapt.
I go a little strict and say 8 hours of short resting becomes a long rest attempt which is limited per day. This mostly does nothing except avoid shenanigans with sorlock and reminds Players that the difficulty budget has fully reset and they have been wasting time they could have been adventuring or actually resting. As time passes problems escalate. So the most in a day I would allow is 7 before severe consequences.