Hey guys. Had my first full party wipe out last night. Because the opponent they were facing had no desire to do anything but beat them in combat - plotwise, it was specifically a test of combat ability - and because they all got some very lucky death saving throws (Beacon of Hope FTW), they all managed to survive and claw their way back to life. The problem is, they're now a little stuck.
Basically, they're trapped in a dungeon with four chambers, each one with a different theme; a maze of traps, a series of logic puzzles and riddles, a more abstract puzzle, and a combat challenge. They handled the first three fine, the last one wiped them. They can try again, but have no way of getting more powerful, and next session they'll be a player less than they were this session making it even less likely that they'll be able to beat the boss fight (though next time they will at least know that there isn't some special trick, which they wasted a lot of time searching for this time). So I'm not really sure how to handle it.
My current plan is to have the boss refuse to bother with them again, and summon a bunch of enemies for an easier, but hopefully still challenging battle, but that feels like it would be a bit anti-climatic and patronising, so I thought I'd source some other views on the issue.
Hey guys. Had my first full party wipe out last night. Because the opponent they were facing had no desire to do anything but beat them in combat - plotwise, it was specifically a test of combat ability
This is pretty much the answer to your question, at least for me.
Is it patronizing? Sure. Is it something you can use to galvanize your party against a common foe? Of course. Is it bad form to do this type of thing? Not at all.
Heck, you have the most common trope in movies and stories sitting right in front of you and you should jump at it with fervor! Almost every good story has the protagonist(s) gain power, approach the antagonist and fight. The protagonist(s) invariably lose the fight, being set back and realizing they need to do something more. The antagonist realizes that there are forces working against them and they set defensive measures to stop those forces. The protagonists gain more power and come to a point where they fight the antagonist again, this time they are more prepared and succeed in stopping the antagonist's plot, or they vanquish their foe and walk off into the sunset.
First off, we don't know the party size, make up, or level so it's kinda hard to say anything. We also don't know the background of this dungeon (cave, actual dungeon, etc.), so we don't know what the terrain is like. If the chamber is say magical, you can have it where a different opponent every time, or have it where the opponent rotates if it's suppose to be a trial of strength and skill. If it isn't like that, you can just nerf your rolls if you really don't want to TPK them. You hit, say you missed, you crit say it's a normal roll. Your goal is for them to have fun but at the same time make it challenging. Your best bet would be to ask them, because not all players care about "winning" the campaign and are just there for the fun and story. If they want you to still go all out, then go all out. You could have it where all but 1 or 2 die so they can say that they beat him. Remember, you are playing god and can make it go anyway you want. Since you said that they weren't focusing on the fight last time, it tells me that they may have won had they focused on the fight from the beginning, so they may win this time around even being down a player. I hope this was helpful.
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Remember this is a game and it's suppose to be fun for everybody. Let's all have fun and kill monsters.
Hey guys. Had my first full party wipe out last night. Because the opponent they were facing had no desire to do anything but beat them in combat - plotwise, it was specifically a test of combat ability - and because they all got some very lucky death saving throws (Beacon of Hope FTW), they all managed to survive and claw their way back to life. The problem is, they're now a little stuck.
Basically, they're trapped in a dungeon with four chambers, each one with a different theme; a maze of traps, a series of logic puzzles and riddles, a more abstract puzzle, and a combat challenge. They handled the first three fine, the last one wiped them. They can try again, but have no way of getting more powerful, and next session they'll be a player less than they were this session making it even less likely that they'll be able to beat the boss fight (though next time they will at least know that there isn't some special trick, which they wasted a lot of time searching for this time). So I'm not really sure how to handle it.
My current plan is to have the boss refuse to bother with them again, and summon a bunch of enemies for an easier, but hopefully still challenging battle, but that feels like it would be a bit anti-climatic and patronising, so I thought I'd source some other views on the issue.
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patronising is good. gives the players a goal. and they might even hate your bad guy for extra motivation
This is pretty much the answer to your question, at least for me.
Is it patronizing? Sure.
Is it something you can use to galvanize your party against a common foe? Of course.
Is it bad form to do this type of thing? Not at all.
Heck, you have the most common trope in movies and stories sitting right in front of you and you should jump at it with fervor! Almost every good story has the protagonist(s) gain power, approach the antagonist and fight. The protagonist(s) invariably lose the fight, being set back and realizing they need to do something more. The antagonist realizes that there are forces working against them and they set defensive measures to stop those forces. The protagonists gain more power and come to a point where they fight the antagonist again, this time they are more prepared and succeed in stopping the antagonist's plot, or they vanquish their foe and walk off into the sunset.
Embrace it, use it, and enjoy the story!
First off, we don't know the party size, make up, or level so it's kinda hard to say anything. We also don't know the background of this dungeon (cave, actual dungeon, etc.), so we don't know what the terrain is like. If the chamber is say magical, you can have it where a different opponent every time, or have it where the opponent rotates if it's suppose to be a trial of strength and skill. If it isn't like that, you can just nerf your rolls if you really don't want to TPK them. You hit, say you missed, you crit say it's a normal roll. Your goal is for them to have fun but at the same time make it challenging. Your best bet would be to ask them, because not all players care about "winning" the campaign and are just there for the fun and story. If they want you to still go all out, then go all out. You could have it where all but 1 or 2 die so they can say that they beat him. Remember, you are playing god and can make it go anyway you want. Since you said that they weren't focusing on the fight last time, it tells me that they may have won had they focused on the fight from the beginning, so they may win this time around even being down a player. I hope this was helpful.
Remember this is a game and it's suppose to be fun for everybody. Let's all have fun and kill monsters.
"Oh. You people again. Maybe this time I'll defeat you BLINDFOLDED. You have my word I'll only remove it when you're all beaten."
Baddie rolls at disadvantage until he's in real trouble, then breaks his word and rips off the blindfold.
Eh?
Or an NPC makes it through the dungeon behind them, and deus ex machinas them.