The Feudal system DnD kinda is in....is very different from modern life we hardly can grasp. It is intersting now as a noble claim Sera. It is a fantasy setting with magic and gods ofc. And the harshness of that feudal setting is very much toned down in DnD.
Reasons peasants could not avoid service
Feudal obligations:
The feudal system tied peasants to the land they worked. They owed their lord labor, a portion of their crops, and other services, such as building and assisting during hunts.
Legally bound:
Most peasants were serfs, a status that legally bound them to a specific estate and prohibited them from leaving without their lord's permission. They were also not allowed to marry without the lord's consent.
Lack of rights:
Peasantry was a low social class with very few rights, making it difficult to challenge the obligations placed upon them by their lord.
Reciprocal relationship:
While a peasant's service was a burden, the system was structured as a reciprocal relationship. The peasant received land to cultivate and protection from the lord in return for their labor and payments.
Potential (but limited) ways around service
Freemen:
Some peasants were "freemen" or "free tenants" who held their land through a contract that required rent but little to no other service to the lord.
Charters:
In some areas, peasants were granted rights and protections through charters from the king, similar to those given to towns.
Escaping:
Fleeing their lord was a possibility but carried significant risks. If caught, a peasant could face harsh punishment.
As playing a Lawful character I really find this interesting dilemma.
INDENTURED service....I had to look it up and i am familiar with some of the medevial ages social norms. ( played vampire the dark ages and that is very historical and interesting )
Now such a topic as borderland slavery in a way is well left out of DnD rulebooks. But we have nobles. And nobles do not get power unless it is over someone. Nobles own land. Owning land is a great way to have power. Indentured service is one way to manage that land.
BUT same time the offical rules state that Slavery is outlawed in Solamnia. But having no choice and obeying the law is not "slavery"
How is it handled in Solamnia? My initial thought is it is rather common. Solamnia with it order of knight needs lots of workers to maintain such thing. Knights are incredible expensive to keep and the taxing must be hard. Equipment, strongholds, horses, squires etc etc...it cost.
Details left out in a fantasy setting describing more a 5 headed dragon godess than that part.
But I like to know how it is in Solamnia? How long Indurence service is it? is it tied to a land? ( and therefore a noble land owner) Even Solamnia is split in several provinces having its own ruler / rules to some part. And to have a character with a mindset that match in some way and not a democratic, enlightnend modern superhero mindset.
I'm using American logic here, which is... detestable. But here it is:
While slavery is technically illegal in America, we have many legal forms of it. Prison labor, small business loopholes (which can lower the minimum wage to $0, if a certain percentage of your workers are related and working within the same location, and allows for unpaid child labor), debted labor (like indentured servitude or labor-for-housing laws), government shutdowns (which force some or all government workers to work for free), "Golden Handcuffs" which charges you for your labor if you work less than the agreed-upon time (and frequently employees with Golden Handcuffs are terminated at the zero hour, so the company gets the wages partially or fully returned for them), and if you squint there's minimum wage (which pays significantly less than the median cost of living in our country (which by the legal definition of slavery, counts because it declares inadequate renumeration for survival as also slavery).
Since your story arc contains a noble, it's reasonable to believe he owns your land in Solamnia, and your family worked it to have a place to live... like a feifdom. That's something we have here too. You don't get paid to work the land. Instead, you earn credits towards buying the land for yourself by working the land and/or selling the product you make on that land (provided the noble or landlord gets their cut of the sale first, disregarding profit value). So, if you sell a pig for 10 Stl, but the noble declared its value at 50 Stl, the noble would collect the 10 Stl, and add the remaining 40 Stl to your debt.
Since the noble in question sets the prices... a corrupt noble could have you working the land he owns for the rest of your life and leave your descendents in hundreds of thousands of Stl in debt unchallenged. Their option would be to continue to work the land for free, or go to debtors prison, where you'll either die in a hole or work for free in a prison camp. Sure you can fight it in court. But the word of a lowly pig farmer doesn't carry as much weight in the court as the word of a noble. Even if the king was just, and the courts fair. A king risks civil war defending a pig farmer. A king only risks the death of another impoverished commoner by defending the noble. So... often the king will bend to the will of a noble rather than risk the deaths of hundreds in a petty war.
A similar problem happened during the housing crises of 2002, 2006, and 2008. Banks were seizing homes from people who had on-time payments, because hedge funds had bought up housing debts left and right. So the payments weren't going to the lender. So the lender, unable to collect the payments, declared the houses foreclosed. That happened to me in 2008. I lost a 2 story, 3 bedroom home even though my payments were on time, because my payments were disappearing into the hedge fund ether, rather than going to the bank.
The attempt is to make Goldenspear as much of a detestable prick as I can without making him a criminal. Finding legal loopholes through slavery sounds like a perfectly threaded needle to me. I'm assuming his alignment would be LN. And since he has a legal right to have you killed for evading your "responsibilities" to the farm he techinically owns, Sera's in a bit of danger.
This situation reminds me, did we divvy up the spoils from the last mission or did it go into a guild account? I just don’t know how much currency I actually have on me. Lol!
Also, can I assume that I’ve attuned to my gear give. The amount of down time we’ve had?
That is a very good question for the party. As a rank 4 member, you technically have access to a guild treasury if there is one. But one of you should be the bank. I trust the honor system in this. Buckeran is your financial patron, but I really don't want to keep track of guild funds, which is why I handwave Hireling fees, etc. Besides, in the Bastion rules, Hirelings pay themselves automatically through guild funds from missions and tasks they perform, and the Bastion is presumed to make enough money to cover those fees just by virtue of existing.
However, the loot you find is yours as a clean gain, as well as the passive income your NPCs earn through bounties and through selling stuff during downtime and Bastion Orders. It makes sense to put that into a trust that doesn't go against your encumbrance.
The real question is: who wants to be the guild bookkeeper for those funds? Since coins count against encumberance (there's a reason for that and you're going to find out soon), the money and equipment waiting to be sold in the guild should be logged seperately. Because it won't weigh you down if it's in the Bastion. As I'm typing this, I realize it makes more sense for me to keep it in Campaign Notes, where anyone can reference it. So I'm willing to do that if no one else is. But to start, I'll need a complete list of what is going to be stored in the Guild Hall, because I'm way behind in Campaign Notes. I haven't even finished updating the dossier with the new members. All I've added is Orr the Unseen, and dayumn. They are sexy.
Sera, you’re tiny little brother is here to back you up, don’t worry only some of his spells go wild sometimes and he’s really good with his daggers.
Simplified Initiative it is. Even without SunDial's vote, that's a clear majority, and is why I didn't present Warning weapons as an option, since it's biggest aid is that you get advantage on Initiative, which doesn't really matter with this mechanic.
It’d be history to find out if Merkas would know anything about Goldenspear? Or maybe would have fone a collection job for them at some point? If so rolled 13 history
Now I will not take the story-line to Solamnia if the rest of the party is not interested. I play Sera as a knight wannabe and take honor and rules a bit serious.
We can still do the Dragon cave quest first. The snobby servant can wait untill we return or tag along.
Or we travel to Solamnia....and return.. Hopefully.
Now the DM too put down lots of work to make Santech alive. So much background. Same time he seems to give a mission taking us away from all of that. What the DM think?
I can have Sera ignore the servants "arrest" and face the consequenses.
1: It takes time for the messenger to get to and from Santekh, so if it takes a couple more days for him to get back who’d know the difference. Tell him he just has to come along while we fetch your things…..
2:Dragon hoard will give an exorbitant amount of cash and treasure to pay off any debt the nobleman requests of you. If not you have Dawnbound to back you up if things go sour
3: We’re not in Solamnia, therefore they have no authority to arrest you, and you will have the town to back you up if needed. Goldenspear will need to send an emissary to the council to get their permission to arrest a citizen of their city, if they care to do things properly anyway.
So yeah I figure we go do the dragon hoard, if we survive we go pay out Sera’s debts, maybe kill Hastos former Commander, Find Nares mouse a mate, and then search a few magic towers for a fancy wheel, if we aren’t high enough level by then to just have Merkas GPS system built straight out.
It’d be history to find out if Merkas would know anything about Goldenspear? Or maybe would have fone a collection job for them at some point? If so rolled 13 history
Seems unlikely Merkas would know him. He's a lord from Solamnia, which is pretty far away.
Now I will not take the story-line to Solamnia if the rest of the party is not interested. I play Sera as a knight wannabe and take honor and rules a bit serious.
We can still do the Dragon cave quest first. The snobby servant can wait untill we return or tag along.
Or we travel to Solamnia....and return.. Hopefully.
Now the DM too put down lots of work to make Santech alive. So much background. Same time he seems to give a mission taking us away from all of that. What the DM think?
I can have Sera ignore the servants "arrest" and face the consequenses.
What the rest of you like to do?
You might be surprised how fleshed out this world is. I have plots on plots. This game was less sandboxy when I started it, but once I realized we weren't going to follow the story, I switched back into sandbox mode. But there was always a multiverse, always portals to other realms. Even a post-mortem campaign if your characters died. Your playground is mostly Dragonlance. But I've been building my game worlds since around 2010. And they all integrate. And I've build spreadsheets that autopopulate regions I didn't already flesh out or had to invent on the fly. There's nowhere you can go in this game where I can't run it. And if I somehow manage to run out of ideas, I can always modify a module to keep things going until my creative juices start flowing again.
1: It takes time for the messenger to get to and from Santekh, so if it takes a couple more days for him to get back who’d know the difference. Tell him he just has to come along while we fetch your things…..
2:Dragon hoard will give an exorbitant amount of cash and treasure to pay off any debt the nobleman requests of you. If not you have Dawnbound to back you up if things go sour
3: We’re not in Solamnia, therefore they have no authority to arrest you, and you will have the town to back you up if needed. Goldenspear will need to send an emissary to the council to get their permission to arrest a citizen of their city, if they care to do things properly anyway.
So yeah I figure we go do the dragon hoard, if we survive we go pay out Sera’s debts, maybe kill Hastos former Commander, Find Nares mouse a mate, and then search a few magic towers for a fancy wheel, if we aren’t high enough level by then to just have Merkas GPS system built straight out.
To get to Solomnia from Santekh, by horse, it would take about 4 months. That discludes oversea travel, magical methods of quick travel, and long distance messaging (magical or mundane). But yeah. You've theoretically got time. Hart Goldenspear is certainly a man of means. But he's hardly all-powerful. He still has to do most things the mundane way.
Seems unlikely Merkas would know him. He's a lord from Solamnia, which is pretty far away.
Ok would Merkas know if Solamnia has some sort of authority outside their own country? Some legal ability to arrest people in other countries? Outside of clandestine abductions or overwhelming force that is?
To get to Solomnia from Santekh, by horse, it would take about 4 months. That discludes oversea travel, magical methods of quick travel, and long distance messaging (magical or mundane). But yeah. You've theoretically got time. Hart Goldenspear is certainly a man of means. But he's hardly all-powerful. He still has to do most things the mundane way.
And who knows what could happen along the way?? Dangerous territory this is… shame to see something happen to him… damned shame.
Seems unlikely Merkas would know him. He's a lord from Solamnia, which is pretty far away.
Ok would Merkas know if Solamnia has some sort of authority outside their own country? Some legal ability to arrest people in other countries? Outside of clandestine abductions or overwhelming force that is?
Yes. And you are correct. Santekh is part of no nation. And doesn't honor rules of extradition, especially since everyone there is kind of a criminal (hence the Chaotic alignment). Rebelling against the Dragon Army Empire is treason, and punishable by death. Simply being a recognized citizen of Santekh is enough to make you a traitor. However, under Solamnic law, Sera is almost property. Lord Goldenspear has a legal right to hunt her down and bring her back... within certain limits. Solamnia opposes the Dragon Armies, and therefore would technically honor Santekh's claim to protect Sera's right to freedom. But out in the wilds... where no one can see, or there are no laws to protect her...
It's already been dropped that assassins are hunting her down. It's presumable that bounty hunters are after her too. Outside the walls of Santekh, she doesn't enjoy the same protections that she has in town. Which is why the servant is trying to get Sera to come willingly. That includes accepting the handcuffs, which you could imagine is mostly for his safety. A fierce cleric with formidable weapons and magic is not a very safe travelling companion... especially if that warrior is an enemy.
To get to Solomnia from Santekh, by horse, it would take about 4 months. That discludes oversea travel, magical methods of quick travel, and long distance messaging (magical or mundane). But yeah. You've theoretically got time. Hart Goldenspear is certainly a man of means. But he's hardly all-powerful. He still has to do most things the mundane way.
And who knows what could happen along the way?? Dangerous territory this is… shame to see something happen to him… damned shame.
A damned shame. The desert is a harsh environment. A guy like him, not used to the winds and sand. He could trip and fall on a stray sword. Arrows could be caught in a dirt devil and plow right into him. His body would never be found. Poor guy.
Larskolstad, your post is blank. I'm not sure if you meant to say something or changed your mind, but I can wait a day to see if you need to fix something.
You take 3 piercing damage and heal 6 points from the cure light wounds spell
lol
Guessimg it’s similar to the monks Hand of Harm, Hand of Healing ability
Loyalty Begets Honour
The Feudal system DnD kinda is in....is very different from modern life we hardly can grasp. It is intersting now as a noble claim Sera. It is a fantasy setting with magic and gods ofc. And the harshness of that feudal setting is very much toned down in DnD.
As playing a Lawful character I really find this interesting dilemma.
Interesting! Thanks for sharing that!
Let’s see how Sera decides the fate of this scumbag.
Character: Hastos, Ibahalii Vriwhulth, the Reaper of Glory v2: IC Thread
I'm using American logic here, which is... detestable. But here it is:
While slavery is technically illegal in America, we have many legal forms of it. Prison labor, small business loopholes (which can lower the minimum wage to $0, if a certain percentage of your workers are related and working within the same location, and allows for unpaid child labor), debted labor (like indentured servitude or labor-for-housing laws), government shutdowns (which force some or all government workers to work for free), "Golden Handcuffs" which charges you for your labor if you work less than the agreed-upon time (and frequently employees with Golden Handcuffs are terminated at the zero hour, so the company gets the wages partially or fully returned for them), and if you squint there's minimum wage (which pays significantly less than the median cost of living in our country (which by the legal definition of slavery, counts because it declares inadequate renumeration for survival as also slavery).
Since your story arc contains a noble, it's reasonable to believe he owns your land in Solamnia, and your family worked it to have a place to live... like a feifdom. That's something we have here too. You don't get paid to work the land. Instead, you earn credits towards buying the land for yourself by working the land and/or selling the product you make on that land (provided the noble or landlord gets their cut of the sale first, disregarding profit value). So, if you sell a pig for 10 Stl, but the noble declared its value at 50 Stl, the noble would collect the 10 Stl, and add the remaining 40 Stl to your debt.
Since the noble in question sets the prices... a corrupt noble could have you working the land he owns for the rest of your life and leave your descendents in hundreds of thousands of Stl in debt unchallenged. Their option would be to continue to work the land for free, or go to debtors prison, where you'll either die in a hole or work for free in a prison camp. Sure you can fight it in court. But the word of a lowly pig farmer doesn't carry as much weight in the court as the word of a noble. Even if the king was just, and the courts fair. A king risks civil war defending a pig farmer. A king only risks the death of another impoverished commoner by defending the noble. So... often the king will bend to the will of a noble rather than risk the deaths of hundreds in a petty war.
A similar problem happened during the housing crises of 2002, 2006, and 2008. Banks were seizing homes from people who had on-time payments, because hedge funds had bought up housing debts left and right. So the payments weren't going to the lender. So the lender, unable to collect the payments, declared the houses foreclosed. That happened to me in 2008. I lost a 2 story, 3 bedroom home even though my payments were on time, because my payments were disappearing into the hedge fund ether, rather than going to the bank.
The attempt is to make Goldenspear as much of a detestable prick as I can without making him a criminal. Finding legal loopholes through slavery sounds like a perfectly threaded needle to me. I'm assuming his alignment would be LN. And since he has a legal right to have you killed for evading your "responsibilities" to the farm he techinically owns, Sera's in a bit of danger.
That is a very good question for the party. As a rank 4 member, you technically have access to a guild treasury if there is one. But one of you should be the bank. I trust the honor system in this. Buckeran is your financial patron, but I really don't want to keep track of guild funds, which is why I handwave Hireling fees, etc. Besides, in the Bastion rules, Hirelings pay themselves automatically through guild funds from missions and tasks they perform, and the Bastion is presumed to make enough money to cover those fees just by virtue of existing.
However, the loot you find is yours as a clean gain, as well as the passive income your NPCs earn through bounties and through selling stuff during downtime and Bastion Orders. It makes sense to put that into a trust that doesn't go against your encumbrance.
The real question is: who wants to be the guild bookkeeper for those funds? Since coins count against encumberance (there's a reason for that and you're going to find out soon), the money and equipment waiting to be sold in the guild should be logged seperately. Because it won't weigh you down if it's in the Bastion. As I'm typing this, I realize it makes more sense for me to keep it in Campaign Notes, where anyone can reference it. So I'm willing to do that if no one else is. But to start, I'll need a complete list of what is going to be stored in the Guild Hall, because I'm way behind in Campaign Notes. I haven't even finished updating the dossier with the new members. All I've added is Orr the Unseen, and dayumn. They are sexy.
Simplified Initiative it is. Even without SunDial's vote, that's a clear majority, and is why I didn't present Warning weapons as an option, since it's biggest aid is that you get advantage on Initiative, which doesn't really matter with this mechanic.
She/her, DM and Player.
My DM Registry
My Campaigns:
Ibahalii Vriwhulth, the Reaper of Glory v2: IC Thread (PbP); Secrets of the Island (On Discord)
My Characters:
Krik-tul, Thri-kreen monk
LMAO! I mean... if the Doc from Team Fortress 2 could shoot you to life... Think of it as a hyperdermic needle with a bit of heal potion in it.
She/her, DM and Player.
My DM Registry
My Campaigns:
Ibahalii Vriwhulth, the Reaper of Glory v2: IC Thread (PbP); Secrets of the Island (On Discord)
My Characters:
Krik-tul, Thri-kreen monk
Poor Hastos... he just wants to buy a pretty bow in peace. 😅
I've never seen an adventurer have so much trouble going on a shopping spree.
She/her, DM and Player.
My DM Registry
My Campaigns:
Ibahalii Vriwhulth, the Reaper of Glory v2: IC Thread (PbP); Secrets of the Island (On Discord)
My Characters:
Krik-tul, Thri-kreen monk
Daaaamnit!!
I deserve a pretty bow!!
Character: Hastos, Ibahalii Vriwhulth, the Reaper of Glory v2: IC Thread
It’d be history to find out if Merkas would know anything about Goldenspear? Or maybe would have fone a collection job for them at some point?
If so rolled 13 history
Loyalty Begets Honour
Here you are! Google search on "pretty bow" think you should have this.
-give Hastos a pretty bow so he will not be sad....-
https://www.glam.com/1116497/5-perfectly-pretty-ways-to-style-your-favorite-hair-bows/
Now I will not take the story-line to Solamnia if the rest of the party is not interested. I play Sera as a knight wannabe and take honor and rules a bit serious.
We can still do the Dragon cave quest first. The snobby servant can wait untill we return or tag along.
Or we travel to Solamnia....and return.. Hopefully.
Now the DM too put down lots of work to make Santech alive. So much background. Same time he seems to give a mission taking us away from all of that. What the DM think?
I can have Sera ignore the servants "arrest" and face the consequenses.
What the rest of you like to do?
Well we have a couple things
1: It takes time for the messenger to get to and from Santekh, so if it takes a couple more days for him to get back who’d know the difference. Tell him he just has to come along while we fetch your things…..
2:Dragon hoard will give an exorbitant amount of cash and treasure to pay off any debt the nobleman requests of you. If not you have Dawnbound to back you up if things go sour
3: We’re not in Solamnia, therefore they have no authority to arrest you, and you will have the town to back you up if needed. Goldenspear will need to send an emissary to the council to get their permission to arrest a citizen of their city, if they care to do things properly anyway.
So yeah I figure we go do the dragon hoard, if we survive we go pay out Sera’s debts, maybe kill Hastos former Commander, Find Nares mouse a mate, and then search a few magic towers for a fancy wheel, if we aren’t high enough level by then to just have Merkas GPS system built straight out.
Loyalty Begets Honour
Or you could just go above Goldenspears head. Works for me too
Loyalty Begets Honour
You right the Servant can wait. While I fetch my items.
He have no authority in Khur.
The Dragon hoard will not go to that ******* of a noble.
Seems unlikely Merkas would know him. He's a lord from Solamnia, which is pretty far away.
You might be surprised how fleshed out this world is. I have plots on plots. This game was less sandboxy when I started it, but once I realized we weren't going to follow the story, I switched back into sandbox mode. But there was always a multiverse, always portals to other realms. Even a post-mortem campaign if your characters died. Your playground is mostly Dragonlance. But I've been building my game worlds since around 2010. And they all integrate. And I've build spreadsheets that autopopulate regions I didn't already flesh out or had to invent on the fly. There's nowhere you can go in this game where I can't run it. And if I somehow manage to run out of ideas, I can always modify a module to keep things going until my creative juices start flowing again.
To get to Solomnia from Santekh, by horse, it would take about 4 months. That discludes oversea travel, magical methods of quick travel, and long distance messaging (magical or mundane). But yeah. You've theoretically got time. Hart Goldenspear is certainly a man of means. But he's hardly all-powerful. He still has to do most things the mundane way.
That's the spirit!
She/her, DM and Player.
My DM Registry
My Campaigns:
Ibahalii Vriwhulth, the Reaper of Glory v2: IC Thread (PbP); Secrets of the Island (On Discord)
My Characters:
Krik-tul, Thri-kreen monk
Ok would Merkas know if Solamnia has some sort of authority outside their own country? Some legal ability to arrest people in other countries? Outside of clandestine abductions or overwhelming force that is?
Loyalty Begets Honour
And who knows what could happen along the way?? Dangerous territory this is… shame to see something happen to him… damned shame.
Character: Hastos, Ibahalii Vriwhulth, the Reaper of Glory v2: IC Thread
Yes. And you are correct. Santekh is part of no nation. And doesn't honor rules of extradition, especially since everyone there is kind of a criminal (hence the Chaotic alignment). Rebelling against the Dragon Army Empire is treason, and punishable by death. Simply being a recognized citizen of Santekh is enough to make you a traitor. However, under Solamnic law, Sera is almost property. Lord Goldenspear has a legal right to hunt her down and bring her back... within certain limits. Solamnia opposes the Dragon Armies, and therefore would technically honor Santekh's claim to protect Sera's right to freedom. But out in the wilds... where no one can see, or there are no laws to protect her...
It's already been dropped that assassins are hunting her down. It's presumable that bounty hunters are after her too. Outside the walls of Santekh, she doesn't enjoy the same protections that she has in town. Which is why the servant is trying to get Sera to come willingly. That includes accepting the handcuffs, which you could imagine is mostly for his safety. A fierce cleric with formidable weapons and magic is not a very safe travelling companion... especially if that warrior is an enemy.
A damned shame. The desert is a harsh environment. A guy like him, not used to the winds and sand. He could trip and fall on a stray sword. Arrows could be caught in a dirt devil and plow right into him. His body would never be found. Poor guy.
She/her, DM and Player.
My DM Registry
My Campaigns:
Ibahalii Vriwhulth, the Reaper of Glory v2: IC Thread (PbP); Secrets of the Island (On Discord)
My Characters:
Krik-tul, Thri-kreen monk
Larskolstad, your post is blank. I'm not sure if you meant to say something or changed your mind, but I can wait a day to see if you need to fix something.
She/her, DM and Player.
My DM Registry
My Campaigns:
Ibahalii Vriwhulth, the Reaper of Glory v2: IC Thread (PbP); Secrets of the Island (On Discord)
My Characters:
Krik-tul, Thri-kreen monk
Hope it is there now.
Golden Shower! 😆
Damn it, Hrothbert_Neruca, you almost made me spit my coffee! You get Heroic Inspiration for that. Goofball.
She/her, DM and Player.
My DM Registry
My Campaigns:
Ibahalii Vriwhulth, the Reaper of Glory v2: IC Thread (PbP); Secrets of the Island (On Discord)
My Characters:
Krik-tul, Thri-kreen monk