So I have been thinking about something like a loophole in the "Find Familiar" spell.
There is a line which says that when your familiar is tucked in it's pocket domension "As an action while it is temporarily dismissed, you can cause it to reappear in any unoccupied space within 30 feet of you." .
What I find worth noting is that it doesn't specify "any unoccupied space you can see.". So, by RAW I could, say, have my familiar appear on the other side of a locked and warded door. Particularly of the familiar is a Pact of The Chain variety with a bit more strength and ability to operate handles, this could get me through a LOT of hidden doors.
The obvious risk is the word "unoccupied". Presumably, if a DM allowed this at all, then there would be a chance for the familiar to try and manifest inside something solid. Presumably this would either cause the manifsetation to fail ( generous DM) or do damage to the familiar and likely kill it.
Given that this is part of the effects of the Find Familiar spell, I'd say the usual restriction about spell targeting behind total cover is in effect (namely, you can't target things behind total cover, such as behind walls - see Player's Handbook, page 204, or here and here).
That's the general rule, in any way. That's why spells like Dimension Door or Clairvoyance are so specific about their targeting - they're carefully defining an exception. And that's why Cloudkill (which mentions "point you choose", not "point you can see") isn't much, much more dangerous than it already is. :p
Hmm. I hear you, and I do see that this is a general rule that may apply BUT is this legitimately "targeting" a spell? It seems more like commanding a summoned creature that has specific traits.
I think that there are similar teleportation effects that say things like a destination "30 feet straight up". So it would seem " appear 3 feet past the front of this door." Would be reasonable.
But I hear you. At a table you GM this would be a no go usage.
That’s been discussed before and the consensus was that it will work and at the very least give the Wizard or Warlock the ability to see what’s on the other side of the door.
I agree that this is part of the general targeting of spells in that it requires a lack of total cover. However, a player in my game could try it, but fail that arcana check and the familiar ends up fatally spliced into a piece of unseen furniture or the floor.
No problem. I'd still recommend talking to your DM before trying to exploit a corner case in the rules. I really doubt this was intended functionality and your DM is within their rights to forbid it. It's also bad form to interrupt the game with a rules debate if you can help it.
There's a practical risk involved in this too. If it's an empty hallway of room, then you're probably fine, but any creature that sees a familiar suddenly poof into existence is probably going to go right after it (or run away?)
First, part of the point of a familiar is that you are always 1 hour and 10gp worth of incense away from a replacement familiar. They are totally sacrificial. One of my favorite wizard moves is to have a familiar land on a magic item and then cast identify through the familiar. Not foolproof but good at avoiding cursed items. But I digress. The point is if someone sees it, big deal. You can bampf it back into it's pocket dimension or make a new one.
The other thing is that most warlock pact familiars can be invisible. Some debate possibly about whether they can appear already being invisible or not, but still.
First, part of the point of a familiar is that you are always 1 hour and 10gp worth of incense away from a replacement familiar. They are totally sacrificial. One of my favorite wizard moves is to have a familiar land on a magic item and then cast identify through the familiar. Not foolproof but good at avoiding cursed items. But I digress. The point is if someone sees it, big deal. You can bampf it back into it's pocket dimension or make a new one.
Identify doesn't identify curses on magic items unless explicitly stated otherwise in the item description. This is pointed out on DMG p. 138-139, under "Cursed Items":
Some magic items bear curses that bedevil their users, sometimes long after a user has stopped using an item. A magic item’s description specifies whether the item is cursed. Most methods of identifying items, including the identify spell, fail to reveal such a curse, although lore might hint at it. A curse should be a surprise to the item’s user when the curse’s effects are revealed.
It's worth noting that if you are a warlock, an imp can turn into a spider and a quasit into a centipede, so that gets you through most doors anyway, without the risk of them materializing inside an object.
It's worth noting that if you are a warlock, an imp can turn into a spider and a quasit into a centipede, so that gets you through most doors anyway, without the risk of them materializing inside an object.
That is a much more straightforward solution for most doors.
I think that most DMs would rule that an arcane lock spell or similar magic sealing a door would pretty consistently prevent insects crawling through. Otherwise any druid would be able to get through. Still a better solution for a mundanely locked door.
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So I have been thinking about something like a loophole in the "Find Familiar" spell.
There is a line which says that when your familiar is tucked in it's pocket domension "As an action while it is temporarily dismissed, you can cause it to reappear in any unoccupied space within 30 feet of you." .
What I find worth noting is that it doesn't specify "any unoccupied space you can see.". So, by RAW I could, say, have my familiar appear on the other side of a locked and warded door. Particularly of the familiar is a Pact of The Chain variety with a bit more strength and ability to operate handles, this could get me through a LOT of hidden doors.
The obvious risk is the word "unoccupied". Presumably, if a DM allowed this at all, then there would be a chance for the familiar to try and manifest inside something solid. Presumably this would either cause the manifsetation to fail ( generous DM) or do damage to the familiar and likely kill it.
Thoughts? Am I missing something?
Given that this is part of the effects of the Find Familiar spell, I'd say the usual restriction about spell targeting behind total cover is in effect (namely, you can't target things behind total cover, such as behind walls - see Player's Handbook, page 204, or here and here).
That's the general rule, in any way. That's why spells like Dimension Door or Clairvoyance are so specific about their targeting - they're carefully defining an exception. And that's why Cloudkill (which mentions "point you choose", not "point you can see") isn't much, much more dangerous than it already is. :p
Hmm. I hear you, and I do see that this is a general rule that may apply BUT is this legitimately "targeting" a spell? It seems more like commanding a summoned creature that has specific traits.
I think that there are similar teleportation effects that say things like a destination "30 feet straight up". So it would seem " appear 3 feet past the front of this door." Would be reasonable.
But I hear you. At a table you GM this would be a no go usage.
That’s been discussed before and the consensus was that it will work and at the very least give the Wizard or Warlock the ability to see what’s on the other side of the door.
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Oh, ok! Any idea where? I am not sure the search terms to find it.
I agree that this is part of the general targeting of spells in that it requires a lack of total cover. However, a player in my game could try it, but fail that arcana check and the familiar ends up fatally spliced into a piece of unseen furniture or the floor.
This came up in the Oct 30 episode of Dragon+ and Jeremy ruled that RAW, you can cause your familiar to reappear through total cover. Skip to 28:35.
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I’ve wondered the same thing myself.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
Thanks!
No problem. I'd still recommend talking to your DM before trying to exploit a corner case in the rules. I really doubt this was intended functionality and your DM is within their rights to forbid it. It's also bad form to interrupt the game with a rules debate if you can help it.
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There's a practical risk involved in this too. If it's an empty hallway of room, then you're probably fine, but any creature that sees a familiar suddenly poof into existence is probably going to go right after it (or run away?)
"Not all those who wander are lost"
Well, there are two things to consider:
First, part of the point of a familiar is that you are always 1 hour and 10gp worth of incense away from a replacement familiar. They are totally sacrificial. One of my favorite wizard moves is to have a familiar land on a magic item and then cast identify through the familiar. Not foolproof but good at avoiding cursed items. But I digress. The point is if someone sees it, big deal. You can bampf it back into it's pocket dimension or make a new one.
The other thing is that most warlock pact familiars can be invisible. Some debate possibly about whether they can appear already being invisible or not, but still.
The o
Identify doesn't identify curses on magic items unless explicitly stated otherwise in the item description. This is pointed out on DMG p. 138-139, under "Cursed Items":
Sure. Not all. Maybe not even most. But it is better than nothing. Depends on the DM.
It's worth noting that if you are a warlock, an imp can turn into a spider and a quasit into a centipede, so that gets you through most doors anyway, without the risk of them materializing inside an object.
Good point!
That is a much more straightforward solution for most doors.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
I think that most DMs would rule that an arcane lock spell or similar magic sealing a door would pretty consistently prevent insects crawling through. Otherwise any druid would be able to get through. Still a better solution for a mundanely locked door.