The optional rule in XGtE says 500 feet per round - but it does say you fall that distance instantly. So if you fluff a jump and start falling - bye bye - you're not going to get off Misty Step in time.
If you said 'I'm going to jump - and at the height of my jump I'm going to Misty Step' then sure I'd allow it - but if you say you're going to try the jump - fluff it - and then say you're going to Misty Step - no can do - well - you can - but you're already up to 500 feet down.
That makes sense. So just tell the DM what I'd like to try, and ask what they'd allow...you know, before I crater!
So now the real question; if you're using the XGtE 500 ft/round rule, and you fall from a 530' height... can you Misty Step to safety after your round of falling, or do you maintain your momentum?
Alas, we may never know.
Technically in 5e there's no such thing as momentum. If you Misty Stepped in that situation you'd be totally fine.
Yeah, misty step is a bonus action to cast so you can't pull it off as reaction when you start to fall.
But as you suggested in the above post, you could jump as far as you could and then misty step 30 feet to finish the distance. (quite clever)
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"A rightful place awaits you in the Realms Above, in the Land of the Great Light. Come in peace, and live beneath the sun again, where trees and flowers grow."
— The message of Eilistraee to all decent drow.
"Run thy sword across my chains, Silver Lady, that I may join your dance.”
Maybe the ruling could depend on if you got surprised. I wouldn't think misty step would apply if my character unexpectedly fell into a pit trap. However, if my character was climbing something precarious, or attempting an extra big jump, and said, "If this starts going south, I'm ready to misty step myself to safety," I think it might be reasonable.
I thought about using it to clear a 40' jump, if I ran and jumped as far as I could (10 feet), then misty stepped the rest of the way. Probably with a weird shoulder roll landing at the end--so disorienting!
When you only get a few spells, you start really thinking about options!
Per the rules, the first thing - saying if you start to fall you'll Misty Step - wouldn't be possible as it would technically be Readying the Misty Step, which - since it's a bonus action, not an action - you cannot do.
The second thing - jumping 10 feet out and teleporting the remaining 30' - would definitely be doable, so long as you specify it's what you're doing, like Emmber said.
Personally I don't like that bonus actions can't be Readied, so I would allow it. But it's not doable per RAW.
I'm not following this line of thought can you elaborate a little more detail.
So now the real question; if you're using the XGtE 500 ft/round rule, and you fall from a 530' height... can you Misty Step to safety after your round of falling, or do you maintain your momentum?
Alas, we may never know.
Technically in 5e there's no such thing as momentum. If you Misty Stepped in that situation you'd be totally fine.
There may be no such thing as momentum, but there’s also nothing about Misty Step to suggest casting it ends a fall. That is to say, when you cast Misty Step and end up 30 feet higher, you’re not falling again. You’re still falling.
So now the real question; if you're using the XGtE 500 ft/round rule, and you fall from a 530' height... can you Misty Step to safety after your round of falling, or do you maintain your momentum?
Alas, we may never know.
Technically in 5e there's no such thing as momentum. If you Misty Stepped in that situation you'd be totally fine.
There may be no such thing as momentum, but there’s also nothing about Misty Step to suggest casting it ends a fall. That is to say, when you cast Misty Step and end up 30 feet higher, you’re not falling again. You’re still falling.
If you Misty Step up into the air that is. Jaysburn suggested a 530ft fall. You instantly fall 500 ft and Misty Step the remaining 30 ft to the ground - so you're not falling any more.
Now - whether Misty Stepping up would add 30 ft to your fall or reset the fall height is anybody's guess.
So now the real question; if you're using the XGtE 500 ft/round rule, and you fall from a 530' height... can you Misty Step to safety after your round of falling, or do you maintain your momentum?
Alas, we may never know.
Technically in 5e there's no such thing as momentum. If you Misty Stepped in that situation you'd be totally fine.
There may be no such thing as momentum, but there’s also nothing about Misty Step to suggest casting it ends a fall. That is to say, when you cast Misty Step and end up 30 feet higher, you’re not falling again. You’re still falling.
If you Misty Step up into the air that is. Jaysburn suggested a 530ft fall. You instantly fall 500 ft and Misty Step the remaining 30 ft to the ground - so you're not falling any more.
Now - whether Misty Stepping up would add 30 ft to your fall or reset the fall height is anybody's guess.
Ah, I misunderstood the original idea, yeah. But I'm still not sure it matters. The point remains that Misty Step doesn't stop your fall. What stops your fall is that you're on the ground; i.e. you've landed. Even without momentum, the RAW can be swung to simulate it (albeit with a 30-foot shorter fall). Definitely a DM call, but if it ever come up in my game, I'd probably rule in favor of realism, such as it is.
yeah there is nothing to say you keep momentum or lose it
it would be up to each DM but that 30 feet you teleport is not distance traveled... once again teleport is instantly disappearing from one spot and appearing in another, you do not travel the distance in between... you can fall 500 feet and then misty step the last 30 on a 530 foot fall and you would only have fallen 500 feet, but it is within reason to quite easily rule that the momentum is lost once you teleport.
for another example how about falling 510 feet and after falling 500 feet you teleport 30 feet to the side, you can choose the direction in which you teleport... if you rule momentum is kept does it get redirected to the sideways motion you teleported?... what is redirecting it?
since this is a magical world with magic... I would just rule teleport ends the fall, it makes answering questions easier... how does that work? magic
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"A rightful place awaits you in the Realms Above, in the Land of the Great Light. Come in peace, and live beneath the sun again, where trees and flowers grow."
— The message of Eilistraee to all decent drow.
"Run thy sword across my chains, Silver Lady, that I may join your dance.”
also if you decide to keep momentum what happens if you fall 530 feet and after 500 feet you misty step upward 30 feet... never mind falling that 30 feet, the 500 feet momentum just got redirected upward instead of downward... it would be like a trampoline effect, how high would you fall upward after falling 500 feet and then redirecting your direction upward?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"A rightful place awaits you in the Realms Above, in the Land of the Great Light. Come in peace, and live beneath the sun again, where trees and flowers grow."
— The message of Eilistraee to all decent drow.
"Run thy sword across my chains, Silver Lady, that I may join your dance.”
Well as I said - momentum in 5e doesn't exist. So the only thing you would be concerned with is - are you still falling or not - and if you are - how far have you actually fallen. This is why a DM would need to rule whether teleporting resets the fall height (momentum not conserved) or not (momentum conserved).
All that said - I think this is getting a little off-topic from the OP.
Not only is there no such thing as momentum, "a fall" is not defined in the rules. Sure, there's some things we'd clearly recognize as "a fall"... fall off a 30 foot ledge and land on the ground 30 feet below, "a fall!" But...
A 30 foot-high jump that you initiated.... "a fall" when you land?
(Related to above) Grappled by an enemy, they jump or flyl while dragging you against your will.... "a fall" when you land?
Falling for 30 feet, but you teleport to a point on the ground that you can see before hitting the ground?
Thrown horizontally or vertically (up) against a surface?
As far as fall speed goes, 500' in a single round (6s) is perfectly realistic (ignoring air resistance, fall distance in that time is 579') and you could probably say 1000'/round for additional rounds, but we have zero information about how long any specific action takes; if a bonus action takes 1s there's plenty of time to misty step yourself (only 16' fall), if it takes 2s there isn't (you fall 64'). Given that Feather Fall is capable of saving you from taking damage from a 10' fall, it can't require more than 0.75s (9' fall) for that particular reaction, but that doesn't help in general.
As far as fall speed goes, 500' in a single round (6s) is perfectly realistic (ignoring air resistance, fall distance in that time is 579') and you could probably say 1000'/round for additional rounds, but we have zero information about how long any specific action takes; if a bonus action takes 1s there's plenty of time to misty step yourself (only 16' fall), if it takes 2s there isn't (you fall 64'). Given that Feather Fall is capable of saving you from taking damage from a 10' fall, it can't require more than 0.75s (9' fall) for that particular reaction, but that doesn't help in general.
The thing is the XGtE rules are very clear - you fall that 500 feet instantly the instant you start falling. So either you cast it before you fall or after. There's no in-between.
As far as fall speed goes, 500' in a single round (6s) is perfectly realistic (ignoring air resistance, fall distance in that time is 579') and you could probably say 1000'/round for additional rounds, but we have zero information about how long any specific action takes; if a bonus action takes 1s there's plenty of time to misty step yourself (only 16' fall), if it takes 2s there isn't (you fall 64'). Given that Feather Fall is capable of saving you from taking damage from a 10' fall, it can't require more than 0.75s (9' fall) for that particular reaction, but that doesn't help in general.
The thing is the XGtE rules are very clear - you fall that 500 feet instantly the instant you start falling. So either you cast it before you fall or after. There's no in-between.
I would not say that they are "very clear" in that respect, there certainly is an in-between... it's just that that in-between is the turns after your own and your second turn before it ends, which is awkward.
The section in Xanathar's points out that "immediately dropping the entire distance" is precisely what it is attempting to avoid, and that "realistically, a fall from such a height can take more than a few seconds."
Rate of Falling
The rule for falling assumes that a creature immediately drops the entire distance when it falls. But what if a creature is at a high altitude when it falls, perhaps on the back of a griffon or on board an airship? Realistically, a fall from such a height can take more than a few seconds, extending past the end of the turn when the fall occurred. If you’d like high-altitude falls to be properly time-consuming, use the following optional rule.
When you fall from a great height, you instantly descend up to 500 feet. If you’re still falling on your next turn, you descend up to 500 feet at the end of that turn. This process continues until the fall ends, either because you hit the ground or the fall is otherwise halted.
I agree that they then went on to poorly describe "instantly" descending up to 500 feet, putting us right back in the situation they claimed to be trying to avoid. However then, you remain hovering at that height in mid-air through everyone else's turn, and the rest of your next turn, before instantly falling another 500 feet at the end of your second turn.
That sucks, and considering its an optional rule which was attempting to more "realistically" simulate a fall taking more than a few seconds... I think that treating falling as a mandatory and unmodifiable 500 foot movement straight down on your turn is probably a better solution. It would accomplish the same thing (you drop 500 feet during your turn), but open up cool stuff like taking actions during the fall at different heights.
Not gonna claim its RAW, but if we're throwing around optional rules from XGtE, you might as well consider a reasonable houserule instead.
Now, Feather Fall has a trigger of "you or creature within 60' falls", and because it only lasts for 1 minute at 60'/round, if you cast at the instant you fall and the fall is more than 600', it expires before you land, and even if it's a shorter fall, you might not want to be floating down at 60'/round for multiple rounds if there's flying critters that might use the opportunity to harass you. So, can you cast feather fall in the middle of a fall? (because D&D needs HALO jumps...).
That makes sense. So just tell the DM what I'd like to try, and ask what they'd allow...you know, before I crater!
Alas, we may know immediately.
Yeah, misty step is a bonus action to cast so you can't pull it off as reaction when you start to fall.
But as you suggested in the above post, you could jump as far as you could and then misty step 30 feet to finish the distance. (quite clever)
I'm not following this line of thought can you elaborate a little more detail.
I'm not following this line of thought can you elaborate a little more detail.
There may be no such thing as momentum, but there’s also nothing about Misty Step to suggest casting it ends a fall. That is to say, when you cast Misty Step and end up 30 feet higher, you’re not falling again. You’re still falling.
If you Misty Step up into the air that is. Jaysburn suggested a 530ft fall. You instantly fall 500 ft and Misty Step the remaining 30 ft to the ground - so you're not falling any more.
Now - whether Misty Stepping up would add 30 ft to your fall or reset the fall height is anybody's guess.
Mega Yahtzee Thread:
Highest 41: brocker2001 (#11,285).
Yahtzee of 2's: Emmber (#36,161).
Lowest 9: JoeltheWalrus (#312), Emmber (#12,505) and Dertinus (#20,953).
Ah, I misunderstood the original idea, yeah. But I'm still not sure it matters. The point remains that Misty Step doesn't stop your fall. What stops your fall is that you're on the ground; i.e. you've landed. Even without momentum, the RAW can be swung to simulate it (albeit with a 30-foot shorter fall). Definitely a DM call, but if it ever come up in my game, I'd probably rule in favor of realism, such as it is.
I honestly don't think realism can ever enter into a discussion about the conservation of momentum with regard to teleporting! ; )
I think we call all agree it's a blank spot in the rules and up to the whim of the DM.
Mega Yahtzee Thread:
Highest 41: brocker2001 (#11,285).
Yahtzee of 2's: Emmber (#36,161).
Lowest 9: JoeltheWalrus (#312), Emmber (#12,505) and Dertinus (#20,953).
yeah there is nothing to say you keep momentum or lose it
it would be up to each DM but that 30 feet you teleport is not distance traveled... once again teleport is instantly disappearing from one spot and appearing in another, you do not travel the distance in between... you can fall 500 feet and then misty step the last 30 on a 530 foot fall and you would only have fallen 500 feet, but it is within reason to quite easily rule that the momentum is lost once you teleport.
for another example how about falling 510 feet and after falling 500 feet you teleport 30 feet to the side, you can choose the direction in which you teleport... if you rule momentum is kept does it get redirected to the sideways motion you teleported?... what is redirecting it?
since this is a magical world with magic... I would just rule teleport ends the fall, it makes answering questions easier... how does that work? magic
also if you decide to keep momentum what happens if you fall 530 feet and after 500 feet you misty step upward 30 feet... never mind falling that 30 feet, the 500 feet momentum just got redirected upward instead of downward... it would be like a trampoline effect, how high would you fall upward after falling 500 feet and then redirecting your direction upward?
Well as I said - momentum in 5e doesn't exist. So the only thing you would be concerned with is - are you still falling or not - and if you are - how far have you actually fallen. This is why a DM would need to rule whether teleporting resets the fall height (momentum not conserved) or not (momentum conserved).
All that said - I think this is getting a little off-topic from the OP.
Mega Yahtzee Thread:
Highest 41: brocker2001 (#11,285).
Yahtzee of 2's: Emmber (#36,161).
Lowest 9: JoeltheWalrus (#312), Emmber (#12,505) and Dertinus (#20,953).
Not only is there no such thing as momentum, "a fall" is not defined in the rules. Sure, there's some things we'd clearly recognize as "a fall"... fall off a 30 foot ledge and land on the ground 30 feet below, "a fall!" But...
Reasonable minds could differ on these.
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I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
As far as fall speed goes, 500' in a single round (6s) is perfectly realistic (ignoring air resistance, fall distance in that time is 579') and you could probably say 1000'/round for additional rounds, but we have zero information about how long any specific action takes; if a bonus action takes 1s there's plenty of time to misty step yourself (only 16' fall), if it takes 2s there isn't (you fall 64'). Given that Feather Fall is capable of saving you from taking damage from a 10' fall, it can't require more than 0.75s (9' fall) for that particular reaction, but that doesn't help in general.
The thing is the XGtE rules are very clear - you fall that 500 feet instantly the instant you start falling. So either you cast it before you fall or after. There's no in-between.
Mega Yahtzee Thread:
Highest 41: brocker2001 (#11,285).
Yahtzee of 2's: Emmber (#36,161).
Lowest 9: JoeltheWalrus (#312), Emmber (#12,505) and Dertinus (#20,953).
I would not say that they are "very clear" in that respect, there certainly is an in-between... it's just that that in-between is the turns after your own and your second turn before it ends, which is awkward.
The section in Xanathar's points out that "immediately dropping the entire distance" is precisely what it is attempting to avoid, and that "realistically, a fall from such a height can take more than a few seconds."
I agree that they then went on to poorly describe "instantly" descending up to 500 feet, putting us right back in the situation they claimed to be trying to avoid. However then, you remain hovering at that height in mid-air through everyone else's turn, and the rest of your next turn, before instantly falling another 500 feet at the end of your second turn.
That sucks, and considering its an optional rule which was attempting to more "realistically" simulate a fall taking more than a few seconds... I think that treating falling as a mandatory and unmodifiable 500 foot movement straight down on your turn is probably a better solution. It would accomplish the same thing (you drop 500 feet during your turn), but open up cool stuff like taking actions during the fall at different heights.
Not gonna claim its RAW, but if we're throwing around optional rules from XGtE, you might as well consider a reasonable houserule instead.
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I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
Now, Feather Fall has a trigger of "you or creature within 60' falls", and because it only lasts for 1 minute at 60'/round, if you cast at the instant you fall and the fall is more than 600', it expires before you land, and even if it's a shorter fall, you might not want to be floating down at 60'/round for multiple rounds if there's flying critters that might use the opportunity to harass you. So, can you cast feather fall in the middle of a fall? (because D&D needs HALO jumps...).
That's.... that's exactly what the three posts above yours are specifically about, my dude. :/
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I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
No, those were about misty step. I was asking about feather fall.
True, my bad. What I mean was, "can you do something in the middle of your fall instead of before/after it?", that's what the above posts were about.
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I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.