As a player - simply say to the other player, "Your character stealing from party members is not cool, please stop."
PVP is a player issue, not a character issue, and therefore easier to resolve out-of-game.
THIS
PVP needs to have buy-in from all parties at the table. If you're ok with this type of shenanigans, then sure take whatever revenge you want. But if you don't want to deal with this kind of thing, you need to address it with the player. Better yet, with the group.
I have a question about protecting my coins from a team mate. They're a Drow Rogue and they've been caught stealing from us before. I retaliated and stole almost half of her gold as payback, but I'm concerned about her wanting her stuff back.
Is there any known system for booby trapping or protecting my own gold pouch and back pack?
Maybe a mousetrap or something that explodes with blue ink?
Kill them in their sleep. Stop traveling with them. Have them arrested. Plenty of solutions. But most people wouldn’t trust their lives to someone whom you don’t even trust your money with.
Walk next to a cliff, and shove them off, or thunderwave them off, or gust, or gust of wind, plenty of spell options. Rogues aren't good at Strength or Constitution saving throws (normally). Use Hold Person or Suggestion to get them there.
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Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
As a player - simply say to the other player, "Your character stealing from party members is not cool, please stop."
PVP is a player issue, not a character issue, and therefore easier to resolve out-of-game.
THIS
PVP needs to have buy-in from all parties at the table. If you're ok with this type of shenanigans, then sure take whatever revenge you want. But if you don't want to deal with this kind of thing, you need to address it with the player. Better yet, with the group.
I know, try to avoid PVP, but that isn't an option if they're immature. I had a fellow player who ran around town ripping off baby and women arms, so I had to "dispose" of him off a cliff. I was an illusionist wizard, so I had my ways of making it look like an accident.
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Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
My silly answer is just have like 10 different coin pouches. One is the real one, while the others are trapped. Maybe one is filled with angry bees, and another angry snakes. Maybe one is even filled with angry snake bees!
My serious answer is to tell them to stop. Like as a player. Its really rude to do that stuff, especially if they don't have your permission OOC. If they don't stop, talk to the DM about it. The DM can make them comply. Or boot them. If a player is gonna be a jerk, just don't have them in the party.
In regards to speaking with the DM, I agree. It's always best to try that first. The example I gave above was in an "open" game where the DM allowed pretty much anyone to play, so we occasionally had a problem player at the table. He didn't want to exclude them or confront them, so it had to be dealt with in other ways.
My silly answer is just have like 10 different coin pouches. One is the real one, while the others are trapped. Maybe one is filled with angry bees, and another angry snakes. Maybe one is even filled with angry snake bees!
My serious answer is to tell them to stop. Like as a player. Its really rude to do that stuff, especially if they don't have your permission OOC. If they don't stop, talk to the DM about it. The DM can make them comply. Or boot them. If a player is gonna be a jerk, just don't have them in the party.
As much fun as the silly one is...
the problem with animals in coin pouches... is unless the animal is asleep... there’s typically a movement.. (passive perceptions scores). And if there’s no jingle a thief typically moves on... (more perception).
its implied from OP this happens during sleep. Since he also mentioned the backpack. It’s hard(er) to steal from someone’s back while they are awake. Lots of things to make noises in a backpack. Lots of ways to feel weight shifting.
so, when people steal while sleeping... they have the time to be careful, stealthy, look through things, so... animal traps and such are less likely to work.
i maintain the talk with DM, or just have the character “dealt” with. Nobody would trust their lives to someone they can’t even trust their belongings or stuff with. Closest example I can think of.... for a real life...
would anyone trust their brother, a heroin junkie, to watch over their new baby? While they go out of town overnight for business.
As usual, Matt Colville has the best and most well-explained advice for this situation. It's a short 10 minute video and it addresses this exact issue of the thief pick-pocketing the rest of the party: https://youtu.be/JoYR3eCFqoA
He calls this business of one player pick-pocketing the rest of the party as a "miserable, toxic way to play." Anyway... it's worth the 10 minutes of the video, because he has a lot of wisdom in there, as usual. Maybe have your DM watch this video also.
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WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
As usual, Matt Colville has the best and most well-explained advice for this situation. It's a short 10 minute video and it addresses this exact issue of the thief pick-pocketing the rest of the party: https://youtu.be/JoYR3eCFqoA
He calls this business of one player pick-pocketing the rest of the party as a "miserable, toxic way to play." Anyway... it's worth the 10 minutes of the video, because he has a lot of wisdom in there, as usual. Maybe have your DM watch this video also.
Matt Colville strikes again! I love his videos, I watched all of his Running the Game series when I started DMing.
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Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
Alarm via ritual on your money pack or backpack is rather useful. As is elsewhere baggage, set inside a backpack.-Tied to the inside of the backpack in some method
I had a rogue kept doing this so I came up with a plan.
I talked to the DM between sessions and roleplayed this out.
Step 1: Hire a thief to steal something very important. In this case I had the thief steal important magic gems from the local noble. It was expensive and took all my funds but worth it.
Step 2: Make sure the rogue in question notices the gems in some way but try to make it secret. I tried to hide it during a session and everyone at the table got to roll a perception check. I told the DM I was going to auto fail it so everyone gets to see.
Step 3: Allow said rogue to steal the gems.
Step 4: Notify the local noble that the rogue stole the gems from him by note.
It played out like I expected it to where the rogue was captured by the guards who found the gems in his pouch. The party had a choice. To either try to rescue the rogue and become criminals ourselves or to do nothing. Everyone voted to do nothing and we watched him Hang in the town square.
The rogue kept saying it was what his character would do. Well my character would not stand by and allow someone to steal from him.
for an in game method use his behavior against him. You may not know when he steals from you but he is more than likely stealing indiscriminately throughout the campaign just keep notes and when the opportunity to work with the proper authorities turn him in. Wait till he is asleep and sabotage his gear especially cutting the bottom of his bag(s), cut bow strings, blunt his daggers just be 10x more of a jerk than he is until he gets the point
honestly the best way to deal with this is leave the group since the DM isn't dealing with the issue so its not worth the hassle
I had a rogue kept doing this so I came up with a plan.
I talked to the DM between sessions and roleplayed this out.
Step 1: Hire a thief to steal something very important. In this case I had the thief steal important magic gems from the local noble. It was expensive and took all my funds but worth it.
Step 2: Make sure the rogue in question notices the gems in some way but try to make it secret. I tried to hide it during a session and everyone at the table got to roll a perception check. I told the DM I was going to auto fail it so everyone gets to see.
Step 3: Allow said rogue to steal the gems.
Step 4: Notify the local noble that the rogue stole the gems from him by note.
It played out like I expected it to where the rogue was captured by the guards who found the gems in his pouch. The party had a choice. To either try to rescue the rogue and become criminals ourselves or to do nothing. Everyone voted to do nothing and we watched him Hang in the town square.
The rogue kept saying it was what his character would do. Well my character would not stand by and allow someone to steal from him.
Seriously, I have these players all the time. I don't care if you're a jerk in real life, why in your wildest fantasy, where you can literally be anything you want, would you want to play as a jerk that steals from everyone just because you can?!?!
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Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
The rogue kept saying it was what his character would do. Well my character would not stand by and allow someone to steal from him.
Yeah we had a CN halfling thief back in the day whose player kept stealing from the party and saying "it's what my character would do." Including stealing from my LE assassin.
That's right, from an assassin.
I said to him several times, "How would you like it if my character assassinated you -- because it's what he would do?"
For some reason the thief player kept insisting that it wasn't the same thing. I wonder why....
I really don't get the "my character would steal from his own friends" mentality. I played assassins 3 times over the years, twice in D&D and once in Rolemaster (well, Nightblade but same thing). I never had them start out trying to assassinate party members. The only time I ever did it was when one of them kept harassing her and casting actual spells against her to annoy her. After a while, yeah, she tried to gut him. But this was like months of RP before I finally snapped.
But the way these thiefly players want to do it, if I did it as an assassin a party member would die every single night.
I think they take advantage of the fact that stealing is non-lethal, and the only way for the party to impose consequences on the thief is to basically break the party up (i.e., kick him out, take him to the authorities, etc) and the player is using his OOC knowledge that the other players wouldn't want to break up the party (or lose the rogue's skills) to exploit the situation.
I never play characters that steal or permanently hurt friends, I do, however, enjoy playing a wizard or other intelligent character that outsmarts the other party members. I don't do permanent damage, just pretend to have a giant cult in the world to a fake god, Sevrin, that was rising, trying to come to the planet to destroy everyone and reboot the world as he sees fit. I was an illusionist wizard who started this plot from the beginning of the campaign, and collected as much money as possible and would disappear for weeks at a time to go somewhere that he would never tell anyone else, and I used the money to cast glyph of warding on multiple different locations in the same location, with illusion spells to create a god-like avatar that could fight the party.
I only do minor pranks like that.
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so what i have done in the past is something like this
step one make an Adamantine lockbox (youll need to work with your gm on the dc but if its available for an npc dungeon i see no reason you cant get a 15-20).
step two make sure it is built with aLock of Trickerybuilt into it (external may be fine but build it out of Adamantine)
step three cast or have cast Arcane Lockon the box
step four line the inside with lead to protect from scrying
now you have a box that is near impossible to destroy with a very high dc to pick, disadvantage AND a password. and yes it may be expensive but you got to invest in your future. make it large enough to carry a bag of holding and you got yourself a great way to ensure the party doesn't lose valuables to theft and destruction
the enigma box (TM) would run you (100gp [ for lock of trickery ] 250gp+ Xgp [ for arcane lock as a scroll and cost of paying a caster for services] 500gp for [Adamantine])
and yes he could just take the lock box like some sort of ronko portable safe but he would be the hard pressed to get it open with-ought help. i envision he retires with it as a door stop never really able to open it messing with it a a hobby
I was going to simply recommend purchasing a special coin pouch that could be poisoned with a contact poison that would be deadly. You would have to wear gloves to retrieve your own coins or spill them out and then replace the coins you didn't need to spend on each occasion, but that just leads to a big burden on you, and other expenses as you detox your coins when you spend them.
The better solution is to ask the player to cut it out. The second step is to ask the DM if they would allow you seek real retribution for the theft, like kill the PC. If not that, then just quit the group. Why would anyone think that it was OK to steal from their friends? Why would anyone think that the other player should be cool with it if they steal from them? If the player and the DM lack the wisdom to address this, you are wasting precious time with fools.
This is essentially why I couldn't allow an evil character to be part of my game.
There's no avoiding it, because the rogue's player has already initiated PVP.
well if peace was never an option then it really comes down to how involved the others are. if hes been stealing party gold and they know in game then there is no reason they cant simply give him the old straiten up your act or we will leave you behind ultimatum. if its well beyond that point then just ditch him at the next in without saying a word. as it stands nothing from a party perspective can reasonably argue why you would keep a man you cant trust around even if hes useful. at the end of the day if they party knows they are being robbed and know its him ether kill him while he sleeps or ditch him while he sleeps. ether way the player will need a new character and perhaps this will give him perspective for next time.
There's no avoiding it, because the rogue's player has already initiated PVP.
well if peace was never an option then it really comes down to how involved the others are. if hes been stealing party gold and they know in game then there is no reason they cant simply give him the old straiten up your act or we will leave you behind ultimatum. if its well beyond that point then just ditch him at the next in without saying a word. as it stands nothing from a party perspective can reasonably argue why you would keep a man you cant trust around even if hes useful. at the end of the day if they party knows they are being robbed and know its him ether kill him while he sleeps or ditch him while he sleeps. ether way the player will need a new character and perhaps this will give him perspective for next time.
I disagree there is no reason to play with people like this. People who exhibit these types of selfish play can seldom be changed. It will only get worse as time goes on killing their character will only escalate their poor behavior. They need to be kicked from the group and honestly these problems are the DM's fault. Any DM with any ability would know stealing from your fellow players in a game that at its core is supposed to be cooperative is not going to end well.
There's no avoiding it, because the rogue's player has already initiated PVP.
well if peace was never an option then it really comes down to how involved the others are. if hes been stealing party gold and they know in game then there is no reason they cant simply give him the old straiten up your act or we will leave you behind ultimatum. if its well beyond that point then just ditch him at the next in without saying a word. as it stands nothing from a party perspective can reasonably argue why you would keep a man you cant trust around even if hes useful. at the end of the day if they party knows they are being robbed and know its him ether kill him while he sleeps or ditch him while he sleeps. ether way the player will need a new character and perhaps this will give him perspective for next time.
I disagree there is no reason to play with people like this. People who exhibit these types of selfish play can seldom be changed. It will only get worse as time goes on killing their character will only escalate their poor behavior. They need to be kicked from the group and honestly these problems are the DM's fault. Any DM with any ability would know stealing from your fellow players in a game that at its core is supposed to be cooperative is not going to end well.
Some DMs do this/allow this by design, in homebrews.
just going to throw that out there for why immediately gets bing your pitchfork to kick them out of the group was never even considered by me or some others as an option.
if they do it multiple characters in a row. Yes. Now it’s not a specific character instance or isolated incident, but a pattern behavior of being a tool. And you can kick them from the group. But the first go. Deal with the Character not the player. As maybe it’s intentional for reasons you cannot fathom, and not they are just a prick.
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THIS
PVP needs to have buy-in from all parties at the table. If you're ok with this type of shenanigans, then sure take whatever revenge you want. But if you don't want to deal with this kind of thing, you need to address it with the player. Better yet, with the group.
Walk next to a cliff, and shove them off, or thunderwave them off, or gust, or gust of wind, plenty of spell options. Rogues aren't good at Strength or Constitution saving throws (normally). Use Hold Person or Suggestion to get them there.
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
Spells, Monsters, Subclasses, Races, Arcknight Class, Occultist Class, World, Enigmatic Esoterica forms
I know, try to avoid PVP, but that isn't an option if they're immature. I had a fellow player who ran around town ripping off baby and women arms, so I had to "dispose" of him off a cliff. I was an illusionist wizard, so I had my ways of making it look like an accident.
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
Spells, Monsters, Subclasses, Races, Arcknight Class, Occultist Class, World, Enigmatic Esoterica forms
My silly answer is just have like 10 different coin pouches. One is the real one, while the others are trapped. Maybe one is filled with angry bees, and another angry snakes. Maybe one is even filled with angry snake bees!
My serious answer is to tell them to stop. Like as a player. Its really rude to do that stuff, especially if they don't have your permission OOC. If they don't stop, talk to the DM about it. The DM can make them comply. Or boot them. If a player is gonna be a jerk, just don't have them in the party.
In regards to speaking with the DM, I agree. It's always best to try that first. The example I gave above was in an "open" game where the DM allowed pretty much anyone to play, so we occasionally had a problem player at the table. He didn't want to exclude them or confront them, so it had to be dealt with in other ways.
DICE FALL, EVERYONE ROCKS!
As much fun as the silly one is...
the problem with animals in coin pouches... is unless the animal is asleep... there’s typically a movement.. (passive perceptions scores). And if there’s no jingle a thief typically moves on... (more perception).
its implied from OP this happens during sleep. Since he also mentioned the backpack. It’s hard(er) to steal from someone’s back while they are awake. Lots of things to make noises in a backpack. Lots of ways to feel weight shifting.
so, when people steal while sleeping... they have the time to be careful, stealthy, look through things, so... animal traps and such are less likely to work.
i maintain the talk with DM, or just have the character “dealt” with. Nobody would trust their lives to someone they can’t even trust their belongings or stuff with. Closest example I can think of.... for a real life...
would anyone trust their brother, a heroin junkie, to watch over their new baby? While they go out of town overnight for business.
As usual, Matt Colville has the best and most well-explained advice for this situation. It's a short 10 minute video and it addresses this exact issue of the thief pick-pocketing the rest of the party: https://youtu.be/JoYR3eCFqoA
He calls this business of one player pick-pocketing the rest of the party as a "miserable, toxic way to play." Anyway... it's worth the 10 minutes of the video, because he has a lot of wisdom in there, as usual. Maybe have your DM watch this video also.
WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
Matt Colville strikes again! I love his videos, I watched all of his Running the Game series when I started DMing.
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
Spells, Monsters, Subclasses, Races, Arcknight Class, Occultist Class, World, Enigmatic Esoterica forms
Alarm via ritual on your money pack or backpack is rather useful. As is elsewhere baggage, set inside a backpack.-Tied to the inside of the backpack in some method
I had a rogue kept doing this so I came up with a plan.
I talked to the DM between sessions and roleplayed this out.
Step 1: Hire a thief to steal something very important. In this case I had the thief steal important magic gems from the local noble. It was expensive and took all my funds but worth it.
Step 2: Make sure the rogue in question notices the gems in some way but try to make it secret. I tried to hide it during a session and everyone at the table got to roll a perception check. I told the DM I was going to auto fail it so everyone gets to see.
Step 3: Allow said rogue to steal the gems.
Step 4: Notify the local noble that the rogue stole the gems from him by note.
It played out like I expected it to where the rogue was captured by the guards who found the gems in his pouch. The party had a choice. To either try to rescue the rogue and become criminals ourselves or to do nothing. Everyone voted to do nothing and we watched him Hang in the town square.
The rogue kept saying it was what his character would do. Well my character would not stand by and allow someone to steal from him.
for an in game method use his behavior against him. You may not know when he steals from you but he is more than likely stealing indiscriminately throughout the campaign just keep notes and when the opportunity to work with the proper authorities turn him in. Wait till he is asleep and sabotage his gear especially cutting the bottom of his bag(s), cut bow strings, blunt his daggers just be 10x more of a jerk than he is until he gets the point
honestly the best way to deal with this is leave the group since the DM isn't dealing with the issue so its not worth the hassle
Seriously, I have these players all the time. I don't care if you're a jerk in real life, why in your wildest fantasy, where you can literally be anything you want, would you want to play as a jerk that steals from everyone just because you can?!?!
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
Spells, Monsters, Subclasses, Races, Arcknight Class, Occultist Class, World, Enigmatic Esoterica forms
Yeah we had a CN halfling thief back in the day whose player kept stealing from the party and saying "it's what my character would do." Including stealing from my LE assassin.
That's right, from an assassin.
I said to him several times, "How would you like it if my character assassinated you -- because it's what he would do?"
For some reason the thief player kept insisting that it wasn't the same thing. I wonder why....
I really don't get the "my character would steal from his own friends" mentality. I played assassins 3 times over the years, twice in D&D and once in Rolemaster (well, Nightblade but same thing). I never had them start out trying to assassinate party members. The only time I ever did it was when one of them kept harassing her and casting actual spells against her to annoy her. After a while, yeah, she tried to gut him. But this was like months of RP before I finally snapped.
But the way these thiefly players want to do it, if I did it as an assassin a party member would die every single night.
I think they take advantage of the fact that stealing is non-lethal, and the only way for the party to impose consequences on the thief is to basically break the party up (i.e., kick him out, take him to the authorities, etc) and the player is using his OOC knowledge that the other players wouldn't want to break up the party (or lose the rogue's skills) to exploit the situation.
WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
I never play characters that steal or permanently hurt friends, I do, however, enjoy playing a wizard or other intelligent character that outsmarts the other party members. I don't do permanent damage, just pretend to have a giant cult in the world to a fake god, Sevrin, that was rising, trying to come to the planet to destroy everyone and reboot the world as he sees fit. I was an illusionist wizard who started this plot from the beginning of the campaign, and collected as much money as possible and would disappear for weeks at a time to go somewhere that he would never tell anyone else, and I used the money to cast glyph of warding on multiple different locations in the same location, with illusion spells to create a god-like avatar that could fight the party.
I only do minor pranks like that.
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
Spells, Monsters, Subclasses, Races, Arcknight Class, Occultist Class, World, Enigmatic Esoterica forms
so what i have done in the past is something like this
now you have a box that is near impossible to destroy with a very high dc to pick, disadvantage AND a password. and yes it may be expensive but you got to invest in your future. make it large enough to carry a bag of holding and you got yourself a great way to ensure the party doesn't lose valuables to theft and destruction
the enigma box (TM) would run you (100gp [ for lock of trickery ] 250gp+ Xgp [ for arcane lock as a scroll and cost of paying a caster for services] 500gp for [Adamantine])
and yes he could just take the lock box like some sort of ronko portable safe but he would be the hard pressed to get it open with-ought help. i envision he retires with it as a door stop never really able to open it messing with it a a hobby
I was going to simply recommend purchasing a special coin pouch that could be poisoned with a contact poison that would be deadly. You would have to wear gloves to retrieve your own coins or spill them out and then replace the coins you didn't need to spend on each occasion, but that just leads to a big burden on you, and other expenses as you detox your coins when you spend them.
The better solution is to ask the player to cut it out. The second step is to ask the DM if they would allow you seek real retribution for the theft, like kill the PC. If not that, then just quit the group. Why would anyone think that it was OK to steal from their friends? Why would anyone think that the other player should be cool with it if they steal from them? If the player and the DM lack the wisdom to address this, you are wasting precious time with fools.
This is essentially why I couldn't allow an evil character to be part of my game.
There's no avoiding it, because the rogue's player has already initiated PVP.
well if peace was never an option then it really comes down to how involved the others are. if hes been stealing party gold and they know in game then there is no reason they cant simply give him the old straiten up your act or we will leave you behind ultimatum. if its well beyond that point then just ditch him at the next in without saying a word. as it stands nothing from a party perspective can reasonably argue why you would keep a man you cant trust around even if hes useful. at the end of the day if they party knows they are being robbed and know its him ether kill him while he sleeps or ditch him while he sleeps. ether way the player will need a new character and perhaps this will give him perspective for next time.
I disagree there is no reason to play with people like this. People who exhibit these types of selfish play can seldom be changed. It will only get worse as time goes on killing their character will only escalate their poor behavior. They need to be kicked from the group and honestly these problems are the DM's fault. Any DM with any ability would know stealing from your fellow players in a game that at its core is supposed to be cooperative is not going to end well.
Some DMs do this/allow this by design, in homebrews.
just going to throw that out there for why immediately gets bing your pitchfork to kick them out of the group was never even considered by me or some others as an option.
if they do it multiple characters in a row. Yes. Now it’s not a specific character instance or isolated incident, but a pattern behavior of being a tool. And you can kick them from the group. But the first go. Deal with the Character not the player. As maybe it’s intentional for reasons you cannot fathom, and not they are just a prick.