I dunno, I wouldn't want to do major work to build new features into a system if those features were most likely to have major overhauls in the near future. But then, I don't really know what the backend looks like.
If it's the same as the homebrew tools but with a "Publish for general use" button that links them to class pages and stuff, it's not that bad, it's largely a lot of cut and paste. I could do all of them in a weekend. If the back end's more complex, then....well maybe I can see it.
But Strixhaven isn't coming out for nearly six months. That's half a year in which the UA could be active and usable on the site.
I think if it was just cut and paste we wouldn't have had an announcement saying they won't work on them. As somebody with a modicum of coding experience, the worst part of any dev cycle is when the client comes back and changes what they wanted. It very well could ruin a deliberately built system or turn it into a semi-functional pile of errors. With the uniqueness of this UA, I would hazard to guess that it will take a few iterations to get right, and that those iterations could be drastically different from the rest. They could very well scrap the cross-class idea if feedback is negative.
I think this was a smart move from a risk analysis standpoint for dndbeyond. It's not one that will satisfy players.
If it's the same as the homebrew tools but with a "Publish for general use" button that links them to class pages and stuff, it's not that bad, it's largely a lot of cut and paste. I could do all of them in a weekend. If the back end's more complex, then....well maybe I can see it.
But Strixhaven isn't coming out for nearly six months. That's half a year in which the UA could be active and usable on the site.
They have stated their tools are the same ones we use with slightly more stuff. Which is why this is all the more disappointing and I agree with you. Unfortunately they don't see it as worth their time to do the work they are asking each of us to do for a temporary solution. With the pace of their development to begin with I don't understand how not one of their people can find a few hours in the next few months. To be clear I do NOT expect them to create a fully functional new tool to create this new type of subclass while they are UA.
I think that if these classes presented here are at least generally balanced (And they just bite the bullet and give the Bard all of the features bc yes bards only get new sub features at 3 levels but they also often get two features at 3rd level sometimes a third or a second 6th level for a total of five anyway) they could be interesting. This whole format is kind of cool, but no matter what i think this gimmick will only ever work ONE time, so they kinda need to do a good job.
Yeah this one is a bit odd because it seems that it would be within their power to make the subclasses....
Also the book is only 6 months out....are they really going to make radical changes to the approach in that time? I would think it would need to be at the printers at least 2-3 months before which is not a lot of turnaround for fixes.
Yeah this one is a bit odd because it seems that it would be within their power to make the subclasses....
Also the book is only 6 months out....are they really going to make radical changes to the approach in that time? I would think it would need to be at the printers at least 2-3 months before which is not a lot of turnaround for fixes.
This also bothers me. They must already have what they think is a "print ready" version and/or they don't actually care about the feedback on this UA because this is kind of cutting it close.
Yeah this one is a bit odd because it seems that it would be within their power to make the subclasses....
Also the book is only 6 months out....are they really going to make radical changes to the approach in that time? I would think it would need to be at the printers at least 2-3 months before which is not a lot of turnaround for fixes.
This also bothers me. They must already have what they think is a "print ready" version and/or they don't actually care about the feedback on this UA because this is kind of cutting it close.
Yeah seems like the UA is more a marketing thing now with minimal changes made....but I could be wrong.
UA really just feels like marketing these days -- it's only up for about a month before the survey comes out, which isn't a lot of time for people to actually playtest, and then it seems to be a given that they ignore the text responses in the survey.
I'm hoping that if they're not bothering to build the UA subclasses themselves they're putting that extra employee time into working on the general system to get the systems ready to be able to handle whatever the published version ends up being. Feels like they lean a whole damn lot on users acting as support in the bug and homebrew forums, and it'll either work and let them get away with minimal support or crumble on them eventually.
Yeah this one is a bit odd because it seems that it would be within their power to make the subclasses....
Also the book is only 6 months out....are they really going to make radical changes to the approach in that time? I would think it would need to be at the printers at least 2-3 months before which is not a lot of turnaround for fixes.
This also bothers me. They must already have what they think is a "print ready" version and/or they don't actually care about the feedback on this UA because this is kind of cutting it close.
Like the Dhampir, Hexblood, and Reborn races for the Ravenloft book that was less time then this one.
I do not understand why so many people seem upset about Clerics, half-casters and martials being "left out." The subclass UA that ended up in Ravenloft was a Bard and a Warlock. The draconic subclass UA is a Monk and a Ranger. Subclasses Revisited from last June was a Rogue, a Warlock, and a Wizard. I genuinely cannot think of a single UA I've read in the last year or two that touched on every class, or even every category of class. This is normal.
Now granted, there's a possibility that the Strixhaven book will, overall, urge you away from divine casters, half-casters, and martials to really pin down that "Harry Potter with the serial numbers filed off" experience, but nothing they do can keep you from playing an Eldritch Knight or Way of Shadow Monk or Twilight Cleric or whatever else you feel like. It's so bizarre to me that people are taking umbrage that certain classes are being "ignored" or something, despite the fact that UA has never worked like that in 5e.
(and for that matter, the way the cross-class part of these is set up, there is nothing to prevent you from trying to put one of these on a Cleric or a Ranger or Paladin or Artificer, you'd just be doing without Channel Divinities on a Cleric and...I think that's it)
I was actually talking about the book as it listed as a adventure and not a setting book, after seeing this UA what in an adventure that covers a magical school for casters of all types except clerics and half casters have for the ones left alone. I'm liking these subclass options but if my DM is gonna run this adventure I am not gonna play a fighter or cleric in it, what cool magic items will there be in it for them?
Had nothing positive to say about it and I hope that it goes down in flames, but I would be willing to bet that it will go to print with little to no changes.
I had some positive things to say about the UA…chiefly, some excitement with Prismari, Quandrix, and Silverquill features…and some recommendations for balancing certain features, and some thematic suggestions.
That, and some words of caution regarding over-reliance on “shared” subclasses…especially if they inhibit interactions with class-specific features, or are a detriment to theme.
“Cautious optimism” was the key takeaway…but optimism nonetheless.
Lorehold, ah…Lorehold did not get much anticipation from me. Too clunky & all over the place.
Mostly exited for the new setting, but do you think they will have any cleric ones in the finished version?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Helper of Create a World thread/Sedge is Chaotic Neutral/ Mega Yahtzee High: 34, Low: 14/I speak English, je me parle le Francais, agus Labhraim beagan Gaeilge
I put down that w3ith this Adventure/Setting with nothing for martial classes or clerics why would anyone play them, and I believe D&D is about including everyone and that includes folks that like fighters, rogues, paladins, rangers, artificers, clerics did I miss any classes?
I put down that w3ith this Adventure/Setting with nothing for martial classes or clerics why would anyone play them, and I believe D&D is about including everyone and that includes folks that like fighters, rogues, paladins, rangers, artificers, clerics did I miss any classes?
Monks, that's the only one you missed
Also I do like the idea of martial classes going to college to augment their abilities with magic, beyond Arcane Trickster Rogue and Eldritch Knight Fighter, but that will likely be down to homebrew experimentation as I don't see an official ruling for it coming any time soon.
However, it does make sense that the above classes are not included in Strixhaven, because their identities as classes do not primarily revolve around spellcasting as with full casters (or even Warlocks, since their whole shtick is having Pact Magic, a completely unique take on spellcasting). For example, paladins are defined primarily by their SMITE and their tankiness, rather than the spells they can cast, because they are meant to be the token "righteous warrior" - clerics take up the mantle of "righteous mage".
Artificers are mechanically defined by their inventions and rangers are mechanically defined by their exploration features in a game that rarely focuses on exploration.
Clerics probably weren't included in Strixhaven because their magic isn't arcane in nature, it's divine. They don't go to school to learn magic, they go to church, and their gods have already told them how to cast magic in the name of their lord and saviour. Paladins also probably share this reason as their magic is considered divine, despite not explicitly needing to be devoted to a deity to become a paladin.
I dunno, I wouldn't want to do major work to build new features into a system if those features were most likely to have major overhauls in the near future. But then, I don't really know what the backend looks like.
If it's the same as the homebrew tools but with a "Publish for general use" button that links them to class pages and stuff, it's not that bad, it's largely a lot of cut and paste. I could do all of them in a weekend. If the back end's more complex, then....well maybe I can see it.
But Strixhaven isn't coming out for nearly six months. That's half a year in which the UA could be active and usable on the site.
I think if it was just cut and paste we wouldn't have had an announcement saying they won't work on them. As somebody with a modicum of coding experience, the worst part of any dev cycle is when the client comes back and changes what they wanted. It very well could ruin a deliberately built system or turn it into a semi-functional pile of errors. With the uniqueness of this UA, I would hazard to guess that it will take a few iterations to get right, and that those iterations could be drastically different from the rest. They could very well scrap the cross-class idea if feedback is negative.
I think this was a smart move from a risk analysis standpoint for dndbeyond. It's not one that will satisfy players.
They have stated their tools are the same ones we use with slightly more stuff. Which is why this is all the more disappointing and I agree with you. Unfortunately they don't see it as worth their time to do the work they are asking each of us to do for a temporary solution. With the pace of their development to begin with I don't understand how not one of their people can find a few hours in the next few months. To be clear I do NOT expect them to create a fully functional new tool to create this new type of subclass while they are UA.
Considering the Genie warlock was still never properly implemented for each option im not too surprised about this
I think that if these classes presented here are at least generally balanced (And they just bite the bullet and give the Bard all of the features bc yes bards only get new sub features at 3 levels but they also often get two features at 3rd level sometimes a third or a second 6th level for a total of five anyway) they could be interesting. This whole format is kind of cool, but no matter what i think this gimmick will only ever work ONE time, so they kinda need to do a good job.
Yeah this one is a bit odd because it seems that it would be within their power to make the subclasses....
Also the book is only 6 months out....are they really going to make radical changes to the approach in that time? I would think it would need to be at the printers at least 2-3 months before which is not a lot of turnaround for fixes.
This also bothers me. They must already have what they think is a "print ready" version and/or they don't actually care about the feedback on this UA because this is kind of cutting it close.
She/Her Player and Dungeon Master
Yeah seems like the UA is more a marketing thing now with minimal changes made....but I could be wrong.
UA really just feels like marketing these days -- it's only up for about a month before the survey comes out, which isn't a lot of time for people to actually playtest, and then it seems to be a given that they ignore the text responses in the survey.
I'm hoping that if they're not bothering to build the UA subclasses themselves they're putting that extra employee time into working on the general system to get the systems ready to be able to handle whatever the published version ends up being. Feels like they lean a whole damn lot on users acting as support in the bug and homebrew forums, and it'll either work and let them get away with minimal support or crumble on them eventually.
Birgit | Shifter | Sorcerer | Dragonlords
Shayone | Hobgoblin | Sorcerer | Netherdeep
How do you think the sublass features will be implemented on this site? Drop-Down list seems to be viable which would help Bards and Sorcerers.
Like the Dhampir, Hexblood, and Reborn races for the Ravenloft book that was less time then this one.
I was actually talking about the book as it listed as a adventure and not a setting book, after seeing this UA what in an adventure that covers a magical school for casters of all types except clerics and half casters have for the ones left alone. I'm liking these subclass options but if my DM is gonna run this adventure I am not gonna play a fighter or cleric in it, what cool magic items will there be in it for them?
Filled out the Stryxhaven Survey this morning.
Had nothing positive to say about it and I hope that it goes down in flames, but I would be willing to bet that it will go to print with little to no changes.
She/Her Player and Dungeon Master
I had some positive things to say about the UA…chiefly, some excitement with Prismari, Quandrix, and Silverquill features…and some recommendations for balancing certain features, and some thematic suggestions.
That, and some words of caution regarding over-reliance on “shared” subclasses…especially if they inhibit interactions with class-specific features, or are a detriment to theme.
“Cautious optimism” was the key takeaway…but optimism nonetheless.
Lorehold, ah…Lorehold did not get much anticipation from me. Too clunky & all over the place.
Mostly exited for the new setting, but do you think they will have any cleric ones in the finished version?
Helper of Create a World thread/Sedge is Chaotic Neutral/ Mega Yahtzee High: 34, Low: 14/I speak English, je me parle le Francais, agus Labhraim beagan Gaeilge
Dream of Days Lore Bard 9/Wizard 4 Baulder's Gate: Descent to Avernus (In Person/Over Zoom)
Saleadon Morgul Battle Smith Artificer 11 Tyranny of Dragons (In Person/Over Zoom)
Hurtharn Serpti Ghostslayer Blood Hunter 7 Spelljammer (Over Zoom)
Ex Sig
Nope.
I put down that w3ith this Adventure/Setting with nothing for martial classes or clerics why would anyone play them, and I believe D&D is about including everyone and that includes folks that like fighters, rogues, paladins, rangers, artificers, clerics did I miss any classes?
Monks, that's the only one you missed
Also I do like the idea of martial classes going to college to augment their abilities with magic, beyond Arcane Trickster Rogue and Eldritch Knight Fighter, but that will likely be down to homebrew experimentation as I don't see an official ruling for it coming any time soon.
However, it does make sense that the above classes are not included in Strixhaven, because their identities as classes do not primarily revolve around spellcasting as with full casters (or even Warlocks, since their whole shtick is having Pact Magic, a completely unique take on spellcasting). For example, paladins are defined primarily by their SMITE and their tankiness, rather than the spells they can cast, because they are meant to be the token "righteous warrior" - clerics take up the mantle of "righteous mage".
Artificers are mechanically defined by their inventions and rangers are mechanically defined by their exploration features in a game that rarely focuses on exploration.
Clerics probably weren't included in Strixhaven because their magic isn't arcane in nature, it's divine. They don't go to school to learn magic, they go to church, and their gods have already told them how to cast magic in the name of their lord and saviour. Paladins also probably share this reason as their magic is considered divine, despite not explicitly needing to be devoted to a deity to become a paladin.
Given my Strixhaven Feedback
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