So, i want to build a character that is rogue like but uses more magic than dexterity to accomplish things. Is the arcane trickster capable enough to handle that or should i just build a wizard oriented to that style?
Or maybe some sort of multiclass instead?
My main fear for building a purely wizard style is that it won't have much of a damage output. So, whilst i have a character idea in mind that revolves around arcane based trickery, i still want it to be useful to the party for damage purposes.
Rogues tend to be skilled at a lot of things and do their damage with weapons. Wizards tend to rely on their magic, both in and out of combat.
If you want to mostly use your magic to be tricky, go with rogue, if you want to be able to use magic to be tricky, but in combat use it to do damage, go with wizard.
Having said all that, take a look at shadow sorceror, glamour bard, and archfey warlock.
You might also think about taking 1 level of Roge, transition to War Mage for 2 levels, then going with Arcane Trickster the rest of the way. That way, you start off with more skills and weapons options, pick up useful cantrips and spells, and better initiative than most of your party (assuming you invest in INT) and then you get the sneak attack damage.
There is also the Bladesinger. There's a high damage melee wizard for you. If you pick High Elf or Gnome (assuming your DM lets you get a non-Elf Bladesinger), you can get a bonus cantrip for the tricksy side of your character's personality and maintain lots of combat effectiveness with the spells and features of the Bladesinger.
As for other options, you could considder 2 levels of warlock to ensure you will never lack damage (eldritch blast+agonizing blast), then as mentioned above go bard for good skills+trickery spells.
Bard 18/Warlock2 should make for a highly effective do-everything character.
Via your background you could pick up thieves tools and stealth proficiency.
Look at Bards maybe. They are very much half way between Rogues and Wizards in many ways, and if done right can be what you seem to be after. Alternative you might look at Warlocks. They can very much be a halfwayish point between Wizards and Rogues if built to be.
YES!
Or maybe you could multiclass rogue with illusion wizard/shadow sorcerer/bard.
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This sounds pretty much exactly what the College of Whispers bard is for.
I would go swashbuckler 3/whispers 17 as a variant half elf (high elf for booming blade cantrip). This gets you extra expertise, more damage on attacks, a free disengage, bonus to initiative rolls and the ability to use either weapons or spells.
Consider Banishing Smite as a magical secret at lvl10. Sneak attack+booming blade+psychic blades+banishing smite is a pretty potent chunk of damage and a good chance of banishing the target (if it doesnt die outright).
This sounds pretty much exactly what the College of Whispers bard is for.
I would go swashbuckler 3/whispers 17 as a variant half elf (high elf for booming blade cantrip). This gets you extra expertise, more damage on attacks, a free disengage, bonus to initiative rolls and the ability to use either weapons or spells.
Consider Banishing Smite as a magical secret at lvl10. Sneak attack+booming blade+psychic blades+banishing smite is a pretty potent chunk of damage and a good chance of banishing the target (if it doesnt die outright).
That’s what I was thinking (I’m playing a whispers bard and loving it).
I'd personally either go bard or wizard with the criminal background if you want to be magic focused. Bard works the best thematically, wizard is the best for spell flexibility. In your OP, you say you want to be a caster, so be a caster, not a half-caster. Bladesinger fits well as a wizard archetype, and as a wizard, you'll have zero problems in the damage department if you so desire.
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Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
I was initially against a bard because i've played one recently, but i just finished reading up a bunch on the college of whispers and that is amazing. And has some serious potential.
I guess now i have to decide if i want to have that magical illusion trickery to hide actions and stab someone from a brick wall, or be a bit more openly insidious by whispering in someone's ear to convince them to stab someone in the back for me.
Ok, so, in this new game i'm starting at level 3, i'm thinking either start with a whispers bard at 3, or an assassin rogue at 3, and then work towards the other. Because i'd like more magic skills, i'm thinking whispers bard first, then the next 3 levels in rogue with the assassin choice.
This way i get the fun magical stuff, the super fun gaslighting of multiple NPCs through fear conditioning, and a pretty damn solid ranged sneak attack.
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So, i want to build a character that is rogue like but uses more magic than dexterity to accomplish things. Is the arcane trickster capable enough to handle that or should i just build a wizard oriented to that style?
Or maybe some sort of multiclass instead?
My main fear for building a purely wizard style is that it won't have much of a damage output. So, whilst i have a character idea in mind that revolves around arcane based trickery, i still want it to be useful to the party for damage purposes.
Rogues tend to be skilled at a lot of things and do their damage with weapons. Wizards tend to rely on their magic, both in and out of combat.
If you want to mostly use your magic to be tricky, go with rogue, if you want to be able to use magic to be tricky, but in combat use it to do damage, go with wizard.
Having said all that, take a look at shadow sorceror, glamour bard, and archfey warlock.
You might also think about taking 1 level of Roge, transition to War Mage for 2 levels, then going with Arcane Trickster the rest of the way. That way, you start off with more skills and weapons options, pick up useful cantrips and spells, and better initiative than most of your party (assuming you invest in INT) and then you get the sneak attack damage.
There is also the Bladesinger. There's a high damage melee wizard for you. If you pick High Elf or Gnome (assuming your DM lets you get a non-Elf Bladesinger), you can get a bonus cantrip for the tricksy side of your character's personality and maintain lots of combat effectiveness with the spells and features of the Bladesinger.
Look at Bards maybe. They are very much half way between Rogues and Wizards in many ways, and if done right can be what you seem to be after.
Alternative you might look at Warlocks. They can very much be a halfwayish point between Wizards and Rogues if built to be.
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Sounds like an enchanter.
As for other options, you could considder 2 levels of warlock to ensure you will never lack damage (eldritch blast+agonizing blast), then as mentioned above go bard for good skills+trickery spells.
Bard 18/Warlock2 should make for a highly effective do-everything character.
Via your background you could pick up thieves tools and stealth proficiency.
YES!
Or maybe you could multiclass rogue with illusion wizard/shadow sorcerer/bard.
Please check out my homebrew and give me feedback!
Subclasses | Races | Spells | Magic Items | Monsters | Feats | Backgrounds
This sounds pretty much exactly what the College of Whispers bard is for.
I would go swashbuckler 3/whispers 17 as a variant half elf (high elf for booming blade cantrip). This gets you extra expertise, more damage on attacks, a free disengage, bonus to initiative rolls and the ability to use either weapons or spells.
Consider Banishing Smite as a magical secret at lvl10. Sneak attack+booming blade+psychic blades+banishing smite is a pretty potent chunk of damage and a good chance of banishing the target (if it doesnt die outright).
That’s what I was thinking (I’m playing a whispers bard and loving it).
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
I'd personally either go bard or wizard with the criminal background if you want to be magic focused. Bard works the best thematically, wizard is the best for spell flexibility. In your OP, you say you want to be a caster, so be a caster, not a half-caster. Bladesinger fits well as a wizard archetype, and as a wizard, you'll have zero problems in the damage department if you so desire.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
I was initially against a bard because i've played one recently, but i just finished reading up a bunch on the college of whispers and that is amazing. And has some serious potential.
I guess now i have to decide if i want to have that magical illusion trickery to hide actions and stab someone from a brick wall, or be a bit more openly insidious by whispering in someone's ear to convince them to stab someone in the back for me.
Ok, so, in this new game i'm starting at level 3, i'm thinking either start with a whispers bard at 3, or an assassin rogue at 3, and then work towards the other. Because i'd like more magic skills, i'm thinking whispers bard first, then the next 3 levels in rogue with the assassin choice.
This way i get the fun magical stuff, the super fun gaslighting of multiple NPCs through fear conditioning, and a pretty damn solid ranged sneak attack.