Prerequisite: 6th-level artificer Item: A shield (requires attunement)
A creature gains a +1 bonus to Armor Class while wielding this shield.
The shield has 4 charges. While holding it, the wielder can use a reaction immediately after being hit by a melee attack to expend 1 of the shield’s charges and push the attacker up to 15 feet away. The shield regains 1d4 expended charges daily at dawn.
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Does the push happen after damage is taken or does the push supersede the strike?
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"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
I took the position before that absent more specific language saying you can interupt before damage is dealt, by default damage is dealt at the time of a hit, meaning the repulsion would happen after taking damage. I'm not really sure that's right, though.
Round up of other things which interupt after a hit or attack roll or damage, for comparison and contrast:
"the wielder can use a reaction immediately after being hit"
If you've been hit you've been damaged (edit: unless something explicitly says otherwise) - and it happens after you've been hit. So after you've been damaged.
Lucky : after the attack roll but before the attack hitting result
Defensive Duelist : after the attack roll and result. But before the damage roll.
Barbarian (Ancestral Guardian) level 6 Spirit Shield : after damage roll
Fighter (Cavalier) level 7 Warding Maneuver : after the attack roll and result. But before the damage roll.
In the Repulsion Shield's text, it is "it, the wielder can use a reaction immediately after being hit by a melee attack to expend 1 of the shield’s charges and push the attacker up to 15 feet away. The shield regains 1d4 expended charges daily at dawn."
I think it is "after the attack roll and result, but before the damage roll". Otherwise, it should say "takes damage" somewhere in the sentence. (I am not sure that I am correct.)
"the wielder can use a reaction immediately after being hit"
If you've been hit you've been damaged - and it happens after you've been hit. So after you've been damaged.
100% agree that that's the RAW and RAI answer. But CC brings up a really good point with Absorb Elements.
The other spells/features they linked have language that makes everything very clear; they specifically manipulate the damage of the attack, or they say they can turn a hit into a miss. And the "flavor text" of absorb elements makes it clear that the intent is that the resistance apply to the triggering attack, but the actual text doesn't say that, and I'm leaning toward Absorb Elements not reducing the triggering damage by RAW (though the intent is extremely clear and I would never rule this way during play).
I think it is "after the attack roll and result, but before the damage roll". Otherwise, it should say "takes damage" somewhere in the sentence. (I am not sure that I am correct.)
Compare it with the Defensive Duelist which explicitly says "potentially causing the attack to miss" - which the Repulsion Shield infusion does not say. It would if it meant that.
I think it is "after the attack roll and result, but before the damage roll". Otherwise, it should say "takes damage" somewhere in the sentence. (I am not sure that I am correct.)
Compare it with the Defensive Duelist which explicitly says "potentially causing the attack to miss" - which the Repulsion Shield infusion does not say. It would if it meant that.
True, it does not use the wording of the Shield spell even though Shield could be used after a hit was scored or explicitly say causes a miss.
Also, the reach attribute of a weapon controls the range at which you can "make" an attack. You "make" an attack when you roll to hit. Although logically related, I can't find any language anywhere suggesting that you need to be within reach to deal damage with your weapon after the attack is made?
Either hitting and damaging are the same step (in which case there's no room to interrupt with the Repulsion Shield absent specific language saying you can), or hitting and damaging are different steps (in which case reach was only relevant to the making an attack/hitting step, and isn't needed to do damage after confirming a hit, so repulsing the enemy before damage doesn't accomplish anything to interrupt the damage?).
I dunno, that feels hair splitty, and maybe I'm not describing it well...
If the artificer shield worked like the Shield spell, the effect would be to push somebody back 15 feet before their blow landed and have the attack miss because they would be too far away.
Repulsion Shield
Prerequisite: 6th-level artificer
Item: A shield (requires attunement)
A creature gains a +1 bonus to Armor Class while wielding this shield.
The shield has 4 charges. While holding it, the wielder can use a reaction immediately after being hit by a melee attack to expend 1 of the shield’s charges and push the attacker up to 15 feet away. The shield regains 1d4 expended charges daily at dawn.
-----
Does the push happen after damage is taken or does the push supersede the strike?
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
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I took the position before that absent more specific language saying you can interupt before damage is dealt, by default damage is dealt at the time of a hit, meaning the repulsion would happen after taking damage. I'm not really sure that's right, though.
Round up of other things which interupt after a hit or attack roll or damage, for comparison and contrast:
dndbeyond.com forum tags
I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
If you've been hit you've been damaged (edit: unless something explicitly says otherwise) - and it happens after you've been hit. So after you've been damaged.
Mega Yahtzee Thread:
Highest 41: brocker2001 (#11,285).
Yahtzee of 2's: Emmber (#36,161).
Lowest 9: JoeltheWalrus (#312), Emmber (#12,505) and Dertinus (#20,953).
I am not sure if I am correct but from the wording:
In the Repulsion Shield's text, it is "it, the wielder can use a reaction immediately after being hit by a melee attack to expend 1 of the shield’s charges and push the attacker up to 15 feet away. The shield regains 1d4 expended charges daily at dawn."
I think it is "after the attack roll and result, but before the damage roll". Otherwise, it should say "takes damage" somewhere in the sentence. (I am not sure that I am correct.)
100% agree that that's the RAW and RAI answer. But CC brings up a really good point with Absorb Elements.
The other spells/features they linked have language that makes everything very clear; they specifically manipulate the damage of the attack, or they say they can turn a hit into a miss. And the "flavor text" of absorb elements makes it clear that the intent is that the resistance apply to the triggering attack, but the actual text doesn't say that, and I'm leaning toward Absorb Elements not reducing the triggering damage by RAW (though the intent is extremely clear and I would never rule this way during play).
Compare it with the Defensive Duelist which explicitly says "potentially causing the attack to miss" - which the Repulsion Shield infusion does not say. It would if it meant that.
Mega Yahtzee Thread:
Highest 41: brocker2001 (#11,285).
Yahtzee of 2's: Emmber (#36,161).
Lowest 9: JoeltheWalrus (#312), Emmber (#12,505) and Dertinus (#20,953).
True, it does not use the wording of the Shield spell even though Shield could be used after a hit was scored or explicitly say causes a miss.
Thanks Folks!
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Also, the reach attribute of a weapon controls the range at which you can "make" an attack. You "make" an attack when you roll to hit. Although logically related, I can't find any language anywhere suggesting that you need to be within reach to deal damage with your weapon after the attack is made?
Either hitting and damaging are the same step (in which case there's no room to interrupt with the Repulsion Shield absent specific language saying you can), or hitting and damaging are different steps (in which case reach was only relevant to the making an attack/hitting step, and isn't needed to do damage after confirming a hit, so repulsing the enemy before damage doesn't accomplish anything to interrupt the damage?).
I dunno, that feels hair splitty, and maybe I'm not describing it well...
dndbeyond.com forum tags
I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
If the artificer shield worked like the Shield spell, the effect would be to push somebody back 15 feet before their blow landed and have the attack miss because they would be too far away.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale