My group and I are coming up with some combat plans for an arena based game where the kobold is thrown high into the air, casts a spell at the enemies then caught by the Aarakocra in mid air. Whilst we know this will have to be a prepared move taking the entire round what we are unsure of is what stats will be used at which point as throwing another player isn't used too often. If someone can shed some light on this that would be great
There's probably a couple ways you could do it. I'd go with the thrower making a ranged attack roll, since they're basically trying to hit the flyer in mid air. No proficiency bonus since I'm assuming he doesn't have a proficiency in thrown kobold, so basically a straight str check. The DC is up to the DM on how hard they want it to be. Even a light kobold weighs 25 pounds (plus gear), which is not an easy amount of weight to throw, made harder by it being unevenly distributed, and hard to get a grip on. Have you ever played with a kid in a pool and thrown them into the water? My str score isn't too impressive, but it's a struggle to get them more than a foot or so in the air. So I'd make it pretty hard. As far as catching, I'd go with maybe an athletics check, since catching is generally an athletic thing to do. Again, the DC is going to be up to how easy your DM wants it to be. Again, pretty hard. The bird is about to try and catch something that weighs at least one-quarter of its body weight while flying. In this case, it could be the kobold would want to help, by trying to grab onto the bird, but since they used their action casting the spell, I'd say they probably can't really do much more. And the whole thing would really depend on your initiatives all matching up just right, or a lot of readied actions, I guess. And of course, if you miss on the catch, the kobold is taking fall damage from however high it went. And it would take the action of both thrower and catcher, so there's the bigger question of whether or not, from a tactical standpoint, it's worth three actions in one round just to get off a single spell.
But it is a fun idea, and rule of cool and all that. If I was DMing I'd make it difficult, but find ways to make it easier if its something you plan to do regularly, Like allow you to craft handles and a harness onto the Kobold's armor, or to let you practice it (with some kind of consequence, like your rests aren't as restful) to maybe bring down the DC.
Thank you, a lot of things we haven't thought of there. The whole purpose of this manoeuvre is to complete a challenge as the fights are getting pretty boring. I shall post this on the discord so the DM can look over it and agree it etc, thank you
On their turn, the thrower readies their action Str(Athletics) and waits for the Kobold to signal.
The catcher on their turn readies their action Str(Athletics) to catch the Kobold.
On the Kobold's turn, they signal 'go', the thrower uses their reaction for the readied action, the Kobold casts the spell, then the catcher uses their reaction to catch the Kobold, the Kobold's turn ends.
I like the idea of using an attack roll to target the Aarakocra, mostly because I'm currently playing a STR-based characte with Tavern Brawler, and I'm always looking for an excuse to use my improvised weapon skills.
You shouldn’t actually throw players, someone could get hurt.
We have tossed the dwarf many times in my games.
Personally I would go with Str+ath check for the throw then for the spell itself I would give disadvantage if targeting an individual but not if an area spell like fireball or faerie fire. Followed by a Dex+ath for the catch.
You shouldn’t actually throw players, someone could get hurt.
We have tossed the dwarf many times in my games.
Personally I would go with Str+ath check for the throw then for the spell itself I would give disadvantage if targeting an individual but not if an area spell like fireball or faerie fire. Followed by a Dex+ath for the catch.
Throw their characters all you want. But throwing actual people like the players can be dangerous. And if one of your players has dwarfism, you really shouldn’t pick on that individual.
I like the idea of using an attack roll to target the Aarakocra, [...]
I like this too. Simple and to the point. Though I would set the target AC at 10 (or maybe 11). There's no reason to have the defensive bonuses given to the "target" character from DEX and Armor be detrimental considering both the "attacker" and the "target" want the same thing.
I think too many compromises need to be made with the attack roll (disregarding catcher's armor, treating their Dexterity as a negative to a base AC 10 instead of a bonus to AC, etc.), so cooperative Athletics (Strength or Dexterity) choices would be my preference.
Say... both players' combined checks must total.... [a base amount for the throwability of the object, probably 10 for a small character or 15 for a medium character, but something like 0 for a ball or 5 for a weapon]+[Distance thrown].
Throw a ball 30 feet? Total DC 30 needs to be met for the Athletics (Str or Dex) Character 1 + Athletics (Str or Dex) Character 2. That would require a ~15 from each, or higher from one and lower for another. Probably a little high for your typical game of backyard catch, but about right for doing it under stress in the heat of battle? If not under stress, could take 5 or 10 off of it on the fly?
Throw a kobold 30 feet? Total DC 40, pretty darn hard! Throw that kobold 10 feet? Total DC 20, not that hard!
It still requires funky home rules, but I think its less novel than doing a friendly attack roll against AC 10-target's Dex.
I'm having a similar problem figuring out how to run an arena sports game.
I like using athletics for throwing and distance discrepancy. But catching has a lot more to do with dexterity than strength. Now, when Randy Moss catches a ball with one hand that can be acrobatics and/or sleight of hand. Which to use?
How about when Barry Sanders ran untouched through opponents? Stealth/deception with the opponent making an insight tackle?
As DM, I can do whatever but in this particular case it really isn't fun unless the rules are written and known to all players. They need to know what to expect and that it all played out according to the dice... because that's how the ball bounces.
IMO, catching a ball could be an Athletics or Acrobatics check. Sleight of hand is more for hiding something or misdirection.
As for running past opponents, isn't that basically opponents getting opportunity attacks? Perhaps give them a +2 on their attack rolls since they just need to touch, assuming this is more like flag football played in the US.
As an action, i'd probably you throw a grappled kobold into the air a number of feet equal to 8 + your Strength modifier and catch it back with an easy Strength (Athletics) check where a failure result in it landing prone. For the kobold to attack while being thrown this way it would have to take the Ready action.
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My group and I are coming up with some combat plans for an arena based game where the kobold is thrown high into the air, casts a spell at the enemies then caught by the Aarakocra in mid air. Whilst we know this will have to be a prepared move taking the entire round what we are unsure of is what stats will be used at which point as throwing another player isn't used too often. If someone can shed some light on this that would be great
There's probably a couple ways you could do it. I'd go with the thrower making a ranged attack roll, since they're basically trying to hit the flyer in mid air. No proficiency bonus since I'm assuming he doesn't have a proficiency in thrown kobold, so basically a straight str check. The DC is up to the DM on how hard they want it to be. Even a light kobold weighs 25 pounds (plus gear), which is not an easy amount of weight to throw, made harder by it being unevenly distributed, and hard to get a grip on. Have you ever played with a kid in a pool and thrown them into the water? My str score isn't too impressive, but it's a struggle to get them more than a foot or so in the air. So I'd make it pretty hard. As far as catching, I'd go with maybe an athletics check, since catching is generally an athletic thing to do. Again, the DC is going to be up to how easy your DM wants it to be. Again, pretty hard. The bird is about to try and catch something that weighs at least one-quarter of its body weight while flying. In this case, it could be the kobold would want to help, by trying to grab onto the bird, but since they used their action casting the spell, I'd say they probably can't really do much more. And the whole thing would really depend on your initiatives all matching up just right, or a lot of readied actions, I guess. And of course, if you miss on the catch, the kobold is taking fall damage from however high it went. And it would take the action of both thrower and catcher, so there's the bigger question of whether or not, from a tactical standpoint, it's worth three actions in one round just to get off a single spell.
But it is a fun idea, and rule of cool and all that. If I was DMing I'd make it difficult, but find ways to make it easier if its something you plan to do regularly, Like allow you to craft handles and a harness onto the Kobold's armor, or to let you practice it (with some kind of consequence, like your rests aren't as restful) to maybe bring down the DC.
You shouldn’t actually throw players, someone could get hurt.
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But as a DM, sometimes I want to!
As a player, sometimes I want to. As a DM, I frequently want to.
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Thank you, a lot of things we haven't thought of there. The whole purpose of this manoeuvre is to complete a challenge as the fights are getting pretty boring. I shall post this on the discord so the DM can look over it and agree it etc, thank you
I'd suggest this:
On their turn, the thrower readies their action Str(Athletics) and waits for the Kobold to signal.
The catcher on their turn readies their action Str(Athletics) to catch the Kobold.
On the Kobold's turn, they signal 'go', the thrower uses their reaction for the readied action, the Kobold casts the spell, then the catcher uses their reaction to catch the Kobold, the Kobold's turn ends.
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I like the idea of using an attack roll to target the Aarakocra, mostly because I'm currently playing a STR-based characte with Tavern Brawler, and I'm always looking for an excuse to use my improvised weapon skills.
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so??
Well I can kill the dragon, but I don't want to. -my friends last words as he gets burnt to a crisp by an adult red dragon
We have tossed the dwarf many times in my games.
Personally I would go with Str+ath check for the throw then for the spell itself I would give disadvantage if targeting an individual but not if an area spell like fireball or faerie fire. Followed by a Dex+ath for the catch.
Throw their characters all you want. But throwing actual people like the players can be dangerous. And if one of your players has dwarfism, you really shouldn’t pick on that individual.
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I like this too. Simple and to the point. Though I would set the target AC at 10 (or maybe 11). There's no reason to have the defensive bonuses given to the "target" character from DEX and Armor be detrimental considering both the "attacker" and the "target" want the same thing.
...cryptographic randomness!
I think too many compromises need to be made with the attack roll (disregarding catcher's armor, treating their Dexterity as a negative to a base AC 10 instead of a bonus to AC, etc.), so cooperative Athletics (Strength or Dexterity) choices would be my preference.
Say... both players' combined checks must total.... [a base amount for the throwability of the object, probably 10 for a small character or 15 for a medium character, but something like 0 for a ball or 5 for a weapon]+[Distance thrown].
Throw a ball 30 feet? Total DC 30 needs to be met for the Athletics (Str or Dex) Character 1 + Athletics (Str or Dex) Character 2. That would require a ~15 from each, or higher from one and lower for another. Probably a little high for your typical game of backyard catch, but about right for doing it under stress in the heat of battle? If not under stress, could take 5 or 10 off of it on the fly?
Throw a kobold 30 feet? Total DC 40, pretty darn hard! Throw that kobold 10 feet? Total DC 20, not that hard!
It still requires funky home rules, but I think its less novel than doing a friendly attack roll against AC 10-target's Dex.
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I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
I'm having a similar problem figuring out how to run an arena sports game.
I like using athletics for throwing and distance discrepancy. But catching has a lot more to do with dexterity than strength. Now, when Randy Moss catches a ball with one hand that can be acrobatics and/or sleight of hand. Which to use?
How about when Barry Sanders ran untouched through opponents? Stealth/deception with the opponent making an insight tackle?
As DM, I can do whatever but in this particular case it really isn't fun unless the rules are written and known to all players. They need to know what to expect and that it all played out according to the dice... because that's how the ball bounces.
IMO, catching a ball could be an Athletics or Acrobatics check. Sleight of hand is more for hiding something or misdirection.
As for running past opponents, isn't that basically opponents getting opportunity attacks? Perhaps give them a +2 on their attack rolls since they just need to touch, assuming this is more like flag football played in the US.
As an action, i'd probably you throw a grappled kobold into the air a number of feet equal to 8 + your Strength modifier and catch it back with an easy Strength (Athletics) check where a failure result in it landing prone. For the kobold to attack while being thrown this way it would have to take the Ready action.