So one person gets a bad car from the factory that blows up and injures them but literally no one else with that model has the fault. In your mind, that's not a legitimate complaint, because it's not a widespread opinion/issue? I really hope you don't manage people or work in customer services, or I pity those around you.
A complaint is a complaint. Regardless of how big or how small and whether or not it fits with your world view. If someone is aggrieved by something, then it's valid. If someone feels or thinks something, it's valid.
Your analogy doesn't really feel comparable, honestly. For your analogy to work, most consumers would have to enjoy blowing up or are indifferent to the possibility.
I am not saying that feelings are not valid. I was not even the person who raised the issue of legitimacy. You were. I am just saying that a handful of users should not be catered to at the expense of everyone else. Feel your feelings, friend.
As I have already said, Beyond will not promise that. There will be changes.
They have already promised not to do the specific thing they are doing. I linked it in my original post.
I do not know how else to put it, but what you classify as changes is not what Beyond classify as changes.
Changing citations is not signficant. Changing a few words that has no impact on gameplay is not signficant. Adding a passage about weapon mastery is not signficant. You may see these as significant changes, but not Beyond and most users. Beyond will always try to reflect the latest version of the game.
Here is the changelog with the question and part of the answer you left out: https://www.dndbeyond.com/changelog#FrequentlyAskedQuestion " Will my previous character sheets be affected? The game mechanics for your 2014 characters will not be impacted, and all spells, abilities, items, and conditions will display information in line with 2014 rules. Your previous character sheets will receive some updated terminology, as explained in “Changes in Terminology” below. ... Other Changes in Terminology In the Character Builder and elsewhere on D&D Beyond, you will see updates to other game terminology. "
To most users and my understanding, if an item is mechanically the same, while it may have updated wording, it will still be in line with the 2014 rules. I do not care if it is cosmetically different as long as the mechanics are the same, and most users feel the same way. If a person want a digital tool set that never changes anything, Beyond is not the right toolset for that person.
For someone who states they have an issue with mis-information, you certainly have no problem spreading it. As you posted, the 2014 mechanics for your 2014 will be unaffected, meaning that the very exact wording in the 2014 core rules for 2014 characters will remain unchanged. That’s a lie, as the 2014 rules are being overwritten by 2024 rules that have small but significant impact on gameplay, which is a change of mechanics that is a direct contradiction to the stated unaffecting of 2014 characters and their respective mechanics.
If Wizbro didn’t want an edition war, then they shouldn’t have made a sorry excuse for a “revision” that is typical of the quality of content that has been produced in the last 4 years, and attempting to cling onto the previous 5e success. We the community have been told one thing, and while some believe Wizbro can do no wrong, have shown and proven time and again that talk is cheap and actions prove intent.
Wizbro and this site have repeatedly proven that they will say one thing, and under-handedly do what they say they would not do despite the general community’s concerns, and yet some still think it’s ok for a company and site to just constantly disrupt their communities.
Changes to terminology are vastly different than changes to the very core mechanics we were told would not be changed. Another example of Wizbro and it’s simps attempting to once again blindside the community and hope everyone will just simply “ignore” it.
Please be specific and show which core mechanics were changed. The only significant changes people have pointed out were the damage dice of lance and trident. That is literally it.
Everything else that people have pointed out are changes in citation, changes in wording that have no mechanical impact, or additition of weapon mastery that has no bearing on 2014 classes. All the rewording were inline with 2014 rules and do not impact the game mechanically.
Show me the changes that actually impact the game mechanically.
As I have already said, Beyond will not promise that. There will be changes.
They have already promised not to do the specific thing they are doing. I linked it in my original post.
I do not know how else to put it, but what you classify as changes is not what Beyond classify as changes.
Changing citations is not signficant. Changing a few words that has no impact on gameplay is not signficant. Adding a passage about weapon mastery is not signficant. You may see these as significant changes, but not Beyond and most users. Beyond will always try to reflect the latest version of the game.
Here is the changelog with the question and part of the answer you left out: https://www.dndbeyond.com/changelog#FrequentlyAskedQuestion " Will my previous character sheets be affected? The game mechanics for your 2014 characters will not be impacted, and all spells, abilities, items, and conditions will display information in line with 2014 rules. Your previous character sheets will receive some updated terminology, as explained in “Changes in Terminology” below. ... Other Changes in Terminology In the Character Builder and elsewhere on D&D Beyond, you will see updates to other game terminology. "
To most users and my understanding, if an item is mechanically the same, while it may have updated wording, it will still be in line with the 2014 rules. I do not care if it is cosmetically different as long as the mechanics are the same, and most users feel the same way. If a person want a digital tool set that never changes anything, Beyond is not the right toolset for that person.
I didn't leave anything out, that's the specific citation I'm talking about: all spells, abilities, items, and conditions will display information in line with 2014 rules.
I highlighted the relevant part in red. Character builder and character sheet will see updates in terminology. There will be changes in wording. There are not any changes in mechanics.
Lance and trident are issues that need to be addressed. Outside of that, there is not anything else.
It is. You may not like it, but it is what it is. I know you have seen exactly what I am talking about. You were in the same thread I was when everyone thought they were losing their purchases and it was pandemonium. That, I would say was most users who cared to speak an opinion one way or another. Where is that same energy now? We know that is what is required to facilitate change. If most users are currently unhappy, as you define it, where the heck are they?
I highlighted the relevant part in red. Character builder and character sheet will see updates in terminology. There will be changes in wording. There are not any changes in mechanics.
Lance and trident are issues that need to be addressed. Outside of that, there is not anything else.
So there are not any changes in mechanics, except for the changes in mechanics that you keep dismissing.
How do you know there isn't anything else? Have you checked? Will you check again when the next splatbook comes out? Because I'm going to have to. Which is the point you keep ignoring.
Please be specific and show which core mechanics were changed. The only significant changes people have pointed out were the damage dice of lance and trident. That is literally it.
Everything else that people have pointed out are changes in citation, changes in wording that have no mechanical impact, or additition of weapon mastery that has no bearing on 2014 classes. All the rewording were inline with 2014 rules and do not impact the game mechanically.
Show me the changes that actually impact the game mechanically.
I will not do the work you should be doing in comparing the differences between 2014 and 2024 rules mechanics and verbal word context usage. Obviously, you are just now starting to notice changes to existing mechanics and elements that will affect the mechanics of play, and it’s something that has been going on since they quit ALC service.
If you haven’t been keeping up with the changes, how can you express your claim that the majority of users are content with the new rules? And if you have been keeping up with the differences, you full well know they are going back on their word. Words that mean nothing to them.
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" Darkvision doesn’t work in Magical darkness, and if something is magical, Never Trust it acts the same way as a non-magical version of that same thing!”- Discotech Mage over a cup of joe.
It is. You may not like it, but it is what it is. I know you have seen exactly what I am talking about. You were in the same thread I was when everyone thought they were losing their purchases and it was pandemonium. That, I would say was most users who cared to speak an opinion one way or another. Where is that same energy now? We know that is what is required to facilitate change. If most users are currently unhappy, as you define it, where the heck are they?
It is not a definition it is a generalization used to push a narrative. They have gone to other ways to play D&D, or other systems. We were both here for that, how many dissenting member are as active now after the change? They are done with DDB and wizbro's censorship and false marketing. Where do you think they are just happily using the site?
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CENSORSHIP IS THE TOOL OF COWARDS and WANNA BE TYRANTS.
It is not a definition it is a generalization used to push a narrative. They have gone to other ways to play D&D, or other systems. We were both here for that, how many dissenting member are as active now after the change? They are done with DDB and wizbro's censorship and false marketing. Where do you think they are just happily using the site?
So you are not done with DDB/WotC? If your absence of evidence is evidence that they left for other sites and systems, why can't I use that same absence as evidence that no one cares? Regardless, two or three 2014 hardliners are hardly representative of a majority of anything, and certainly not noise enough to make major changes to the site.
It is not a definition it is a generalization used to push a narrative. They have gone to other ways to play D&D, or other systems. We were both here for that, how many dissenting member are as active now after the change? They are done with DDB and wizbro's censorship and false marketing. Where do you think they are just happily using the site?
So you are not done with DDB/WotC? If your absence of evidence is evidence that they left for other sites and systems, why can't I use that same absence as evidence that no one cares? Regardless, two or three 2014 hardliners are hardly representative of a majority of anything, and certainly not noise enough to make major changes to the site.
Not sure what point you are trying to make, but how can you quantify those that have left? Only 2 or 3, what a laugh many have given up on this site, ddb is a poor investment of time and money. Between censorship and dismissing peoples legitimate complaints people are leaving ddb. You still haven't defined "most users".
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
CENSORSHIP IS THE TOOL OF COWARDS and WANNA BE TYRANTS.
Not sure what point you are trying to make, but how can you quantify those that have left? Only 2 or 3, what a laugh many have given up on this site, ddb is a poor investment of time and money. Between censorship and dismissing peoples legitimate complaints people are leaving ddb. You still haven't defined "most users".
How can you quantify those that care beyond those who share an opinion here? Since there are so few, what conclusions can be safely drawn other than only a few people care enough to even post on the topic? Because so few are posting on the subject, it makes no sense to make major changes to the site to cater to a few squeaky wheels, as the lack of complaining can be seen as general contentment.
You are obviously angry, and that is valid, but you do not amount to enough to justify changing things when others seem perfectly happy with the current status quo. That costs time, money, and possibly users who are happy with how things are. Why should DDB trade those users for a few who are constantly complaining no matter what is done? It seems to me that the mostly content users are potential customers and you have made your feelings on spending very clear.
I'm going to lock this thread as it has derailed into personal debates and I'm not sure what could be said that has not been said in 7 pages, besides users debating each other with increasingly hostile language. This feedback has been noted and expressed elsewhere.
Your analogy doesn't really feel comparable, honestly. For your analogy to work, most consumers would have to enjoy blowing up or are indifferent to the possibility.
I am not saying that feelings are not valid. I was not even the person who raised the issue of legitimacy. You were. I am just saying that a handful of users should not be catered to at the expense of everyone else. Feel your feelings, friend.
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Where it concerns sweeping changes to the site that will impact users? Enough for DDB to make the change.
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Please be specific and show which core mechanics were changed. The only significant changes people have pointed out were the damage dice of lance and trident. That is literally it.
Everything else that people have pointed out are changes in citation, changes in wording that have no mechanical impact, or additition of weapon mastery that has no bearing on 2014 classes. All the rewording were inline with 2014 rules and do not impact the game mechanically.
Show me the changes that actually impact the game mechanically.
I highlighted the relevant part in red. Character builder and character sheet will see updates in terminology. There will be changes in wording. There are not any changes in mechanics.
Lance and trident are issues that need to be addressed. Outside of that, there is not anything else.
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That is not a definition.
CENSORSHIP IS THE TOOL OF COWARDS and WANNA BE TYRANTS.
It is. You may not like it, but it is what it is. I know you have seen exactly what I am talking about. You were in the same thread I was when everyone thought they were losing their purchases and it was pandemonium. That, I would say was most users who cared to speak an opinion one way or another. Where is that same energy now? We know that is what is required to facilitate change. If most users are currently unhappy, as you define it, where the heck are they?
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So there are not any changes in mechanics, except for the changes in mechanics that you keep dismissing.
How do you know there isn't anything else? Have you checked? Will you check again when the next splatbook comes out? Because I'm going to have to. Which is the point you keep ignoring.
I will not do the work you should be doing in comparing the differences between 2014 and 2024 rules mechanics and verbal word context usage. Obviously, you are just now starting to notice changes to existing mechanics and elements that will affect the mechanics of play, and it’s something that has been going on since they quit ALC service.
If you haven’t been keeping up with the changes, how can you express your claim that the majority of users are content with the new rules? And if you have been keeping up with the differences, you full well know they are going back on their word. Words that mean nothing to them.
" Darkvision doesn’t work in Magical darkness, and if something is magical, Never Trust it acts the same way as a non-magical version of that same thing!”- Discotech Mage over a cup of joe.
It is not a definition it is a generalization used to push a narrative. They have gone to other ways to play D&D, or other systems. We were both here for that, how many dissenting member are as active now after the change? They are done with DDB and wizbro's censorship and false marketing. Where do you think they are just happily using the site?
CENSORSHIP IS THE TOOL OF COWARDS and WANNA BE TYRANTS.
So you are not done with DDB/WotC? If your absence of evidence is evidence that they left for other sites and systems, why can't I use that same absence as evidence that no one cares? Regardless, two or three 2014 hardliners are hardly representative of a majority of anything, and certainly not noise enough to make major changes to the site.
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Not sure what point you are trying to make, but how can you quantify those that have left? Only 2 or 3, what a laugh many have given up on this site, ddb is a poor investment of time and money. Between censorship and dismissing peoples legitimate complaints people are leaving ddb. You still haven't defined "most users".
CENSORSHIP IS THE TOOL OF COWARDS and WANNA BE TYRANTS.
How can you quantify those that care beyond those who share an opinion here? Since there are so few, what conclusions can be safely drawn other than only a few people care enough to even post on the topic? Because so few are posting on the subject, it makes no sense to make major changes to the site to cater to a few squeaky wheels, as the lack of complaining can be seen as general contentment.
You are obviously angry, and that is valid, but you do not amount to enough to justify changing things when others seem perfectly happy with the current status quo. That costs time, money, and possibly users who are happy with how things are. Why should DDB trade those users for a few who are constantly complaining no matter what is done? It seems to me that the mostly content users are potential customers and you have made your feelings on spending very clear.
DM mostly, Player occasionally | Session 0 form | He/Him/They/Them
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ModeratorI'm going to lock this thread as it has derailed into personal debates and I'm not sure what could be said that has not been said in 7 pages, besides users debating each other with increasingly hostile language. This feedback has been noted and expressed elsewhere.
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