I Must know if WOTC plan on doing Dark Sun 5e... so many homebrew options out there and ive created a few of my own campaigns in the world of Athas, but i'm curious if we will ever see it get an official update to 5e. 4e is a nightmare to me, and it would be fun to see how Wizards take the update. Faerun is cool and all, don't get me wrong... sometimes you need some apocalyptic madness in your life.
We might, but I don't expect it any time soon. WotC is already working on a number of classic settings and my guess is Athas/Dark Sun won't be one of them, and at some point the return on adding more and more full settings just goes down. Doesn't mean it can't/won't happen, only that it's a remote possibility.
Also, keep in mind that if we do get a 5E Dark Sun implementation it may not be to everyone's/your liking. People still love '80s movies, but remakes and sequels made today are usually quite different. A Dark Sun update might have that issue too.
It's possible. Given the way Psionics have thus far been done, anyone who liked Dark Sun will probably have conniptions over what they do for a 5th edition version. They would probably have to take all references to eating other sentient beings out too, and all reference to the culture the Elves that Dark Sun had. Also, Slavery, was a main theme in Athas. This might not be all that popular in today's society. Even the Mul are possibly a problem. Crossbreeding races to make superior slaves isn't exactly PC.
So, expect the standard races again, maybe totally new ones. Same old classes. Probably no proper Psion class, just maybe a few new sub-classes. Not all player characters would have psi powers. Hard to tell about the monsters. Gritty Realism rules for Athas might not be popular and so the setting might get toned down. The first release of Dark Sun you were told to make 3 characters because it was certain that some would die. If they want to appeal to a new audience, and they probably will, you might not recognize Athas when you got it.
The themes aren't the problem. Slavery exists in 5E D&D, it's explicitly mentioned in reference to drow and - on an even spectacularly creepier level - mind flayers, for instance. It's the normalization that makes it problematic. You could easily fit any and all of these horrific practices in a 5E campaign, as long as it's crystal clear that they are evil and not to be condoned by heroes. That's not the Athas outlook on them though.
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With the Homebrews ive made, its a quest to end the tyrannical powers of the Sorcerer-Kings and aid in restoring Athas in some way. F@&% slavery in D&D, Kill Your Masters. thats how i roll with it. something that exists, a pure evil that needs to be taken down. i love the Idea of the wasteland, and the beasts are far beyond terrifying. if you have any suggestions or more info on the wastes the lay in the far east of Faerun that would be amazing, havent seen too much on the lore of that land. i guess all in all im in search of more source material on how to play out desert waste survival.
Maybe in 2023. Hasbro not only wants to sell RPG sourcebooks but also to promote their own IPs to these become multimedia franchises.
DS needs more work because here the psionic powers are very important, the arcane magic is almost taboo, and the primal-punk look needs good artistic designers.
We can think we are going to see a DS 5th Ed because some creatures from Athas have appeared, for example the nightmare beast.
Also, I have good memories of Athas because in 3.5 I homebrewed a Dark Sun game (my first campaign ever) based on the 2e boxed set. However, my version was substantially different from the official one, and I would probably keep at least some of my homebrew changes if a 5e version came out. That being said, I’m curious to see what a more progressive WOTC would do with Dark Sun and I’d probably buy it unless it looks terrible.
The possibility of a return to Athas is part of the reason that I even considered getting back in to D&D. I share the concerns of the above posters though - sometimes getting a reboot is much worse than not getting a reboot as many, many, many current attempts have proven across all forms of media. In favour of appealing to the current zeitgiest is that Athas is explicitly and canonically multi-cultural with each of the city states representing an IRL ancient culture. It is also about fighting environmental damage, restoring damaged ecosystems and fighting slavery. I also think that the Prism Pentad novels make it pretty clear that slavery is bad - 'Good' slave owner Agis of Asticles is blind sided when one of his slaves betrays him for even a hint at freedom despite how well Agis has treated him. Plus, Brom Darksun art is hands down the best fantasy art even to be produced for D&D.
The possibility of a return to Athas is part of the reason that I even considered getting back in to D&D. I share the concerns of the above posters though - sometimes getting a reboot is much worse than not getting a reboot as many, many, many current attempts have proven across all forms of media. In favour of appealing to the current zeitgiest is that Athas is explicitly and canonically multi-cultural with each of the city states representing an IRL ancient culture. It is also about fighting environmental damage, restoring damaged ecosystems and fighting slavery. I also think that the Prism Pentad novels make it pretty clear that slavery is bad - 'Good' slave owner Agis of Asticles is blind sided when one of his slaves betrays him for even a hint at freedom despite how well Agis has treated him. Plus, Brom Darksun art is hands down the best fantasy art even to be produced for D&D.
You raise some very good points. I never read the Prism Pentad. Can you point out which city-states correspond to which ancient cultures?
I think that Draj is a combination Egypt/Aztec influenced; Raam is often thought of as Indian (Indus valley?) influenced; Urik is almost certainly Babylonian; Gulg is Sub-Saharan African; Balic is almost a one to one Athens; Nibenay is somewhat nebulous in that it seems to be named after Ninevah (Assyrian) but it's descriptions seems to be more influenced by ancient Cambodian cultures (Khmer) especially with the all female templars reminiscent of the images seen on the Khmer temple walls (Aspara?).
I would 100% not trust WOTC to make a good Dark Sun book for 5e, that being said I hope they do release it. That way we have mechanics for a lot of the dark Sun specific stuff like defiling and so on. That way we can just homebrew a better Dark Sun.
Heck, the amount of 3rd party content that it will bring should make it great!
It's an interesting conundrum: hope for a re-release even though it will almost certainly disappoint in some way as companies look to "update" or "reimagine" but be consoled by the fact that a much loved world is being kept alive or hope that world remains untouched except through fan content which can always be written of as not canon for those of us who care about that sort of thing (I do... I really, really do.) As you point out, at least homebrewing is baked in to D&D so no matter if they say that Athas races are the same as their multiverse equivalents or muls end up looking like anime elves we can always just edit it ourselves and paste cut outs of Brom art in to the source book.
I think that Draj is a combination Egypt/Aztec influenced; Raam is often thought of as Indian (Indus valley?) influenced; Urik is almost certainly Babylonian; Gulg is Sub-Saharan African; Balic is almost a one to one Athens; Nibenay is somewhat nebulous in that it seems to be named after Ninevah (Assyrian) but it's descriptions seems to be more influenced by ancient Cambodian cultures (Khmer) especially with the all female templars reminiscent of the images seen on the Khmer temple walls (Aspara?).
I think that Draj is a combination Egypt/Aztec influenced; Raam is often thought of as Indian (Indus valley?) influenced; Urik is almost certainly Babylonian; Gulg is Sub-Saharan African; Balic is almost a one to one Athens; Nibenay is somewhat nebulous in that it seems to be named after Ninevah (Assyrian) but it's descriptions seems to be more influenced by ancient Cambodian cultures (Khmer) especially with the all female templars reminiscent of the images seen on the Khmer temple walls (Aspara?).
I feel like I'm in the minority here, but if WotC is going to bring back Athas, I think it would be best for them to focus on new stories rather than reboot the old. Like fast-forward Athas a thousand years in the future and give us new sorcerer-kings or some city-states with sorcerers as elected officials for a change. I'm not convinced it should be a priority over new settings, though.
I'd really love for them too. Sadly, I wasn't playing when DS was a realy thing, but it's one of the only three specific settings in D&D that's popular (alongside Ravenloft and Eberron).
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but DS has effectively been replaced by Eberron. Sure, the Dune sketon is gone, but the impressions I got from the books is that it's supposed to be a political intrigue Game Of Thrones sort of game... and so is Eberron.
If they pulled a Beyond the Withlight and threw in one feat tree for Psionics, I actually think they could pull it off.
I feel like I'm in the minority here, but if WotC is going to bring back Athas, I think it would be best for them to focus on new stories rather than reboot the old. Like fast-forward Athas a thousand years in the future and give us new sorcerer-kings or some city-states with sorcerers as elected officials for a change. I'm not convinced it should be a priority over new settings, though.
I think they're more likely to pull a Ravenloft - new stories in a reboot fashion, but the old stuff not re-used becomes non-cannon. That being said, it likely won't happen until after the core rules revision in 2024, but I would be very happy for that to happen.
Some times I think WotC is preparing a future megaevent to explain the reason because all the D&D multiverse can be rebooted, and even allowing "opened doors" for some possible crossovers, for example Transformers, superheroes from comics or videogames (Fortnite, I am seing you!) and sci-fi franchises, for example the post-apocalypse "Gamma World". Maybe even the multiverses of D&D and Magic: the Gathering could merger.
There is reasons to think WotC is really interested into the revival of Dark Sun and other lines. They know other companies can publish their own generic epic fantasy, and then to conquer the market they have to show something really original and creative.
But Dark Sun needs a lot of work, not only the playtesting of the psionic powers, but also the special primal-punk what mixes Mad Max and Conan the barbarian. The comic failed because the story followed the spirit of the setting, but the look was not enough special and exclusive. You have to offer something what can't be imitated easily.
I definitely know there is a small but significant following of people who want Dark Sun. I think it was #2 after Spelljammer on a poll I saw of most requested settings.
I don't know if 5e as a system can handle that type of gritty game.
I Must know if WOTC plan on doing Dark Sun 5e... so many homebrew options out there and ive created a few of my own campaigns in the world of Athas, but i'm curious if we will ever see it get an official update to 5e. 4e is a nightmare to me, and it would be fun to see how Wizards take the update. Faerun is cool and all, don't get me wrong... sometimes you need some apocalyptic madness in your life.
We might, but I don't expect it any time soon. WotC is already working on a number of classic settings and my guess is Athas/Dark Sun won't be one of them, and at some point the return on adding more and more full settings just goes down. Doesn't mean it can't/won't happen, only that it's a remote possibility.
Also, keep in mind that if we do get a 5E Dark Sun implementation it may not be to everyone's/your liking. People still love '80s movies, but remakes and sequels made today are usually quite different. A Dark Sun update might have that issue too.
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
It's possible. Given the way Psionics have thus far been done, anyone who liked Dark Sun will probably have conniptions over what they do for a 5th edition version. They would probably have to take all references to eating other sentient beings out too, and all reference to the culture the Elves that Dark Sun had. Also, Slavery, was a main theme in Athas. This might not be all that popular in today's society. Even the Mul are possibly a problem. Crossbreeding races to make superior slaves isn't exactly PC.
So, expect the standard races again, maybe totally new ones. Same old classes. Probably no proper Psion class, just maybe a few new sub-classes. Not all player characters would have psi powers. Hard to tell about the monsters. Gritty Realism rules for Athas might not be popular and so the setting might get toned down. The first release of Dark Sun you were told to make 3 characters because it was certain that some would die. If they want to appeal to a new audience, and they probably will, you might not recognize Athas when you got it.
<Insert clever signature here>
The themes aren't the problem. Slavery exists in 5E D&D, it's explicitly mentioned in reference to drow and - on an even spectacularly creepier level - mind flayers, for instance. It's the normalization that makes it problematic. You could easily fit any and all of these horrific practices in a 5E campaign, as long as it's crystal clear that they are evil and not to be condoned by heroes. That's not the Athas outlook on them though.
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
With the Homebrews ive made, its a quest to end the tyrannical powers of the Sorcerer-Kings and aid in restoring Athas in some way. F@&% slavery in D&D, Kill Your Masters. thats how i roll with it. something that exists, a pure evil that needs to be taken down. i love the Idea of the wasteland, and the beasts are far beyond terrifying. if you have any suggestions or more info on the wastes the lay in the far east of Faerun that would be amazing, havent seen too much on the lore of that land. i guess all in all im in search of more source material on how to play out desert waste survival.
thank you for your replies
So Mul is something we have to homebrew?
"I swear, it was on fire when I got there!"
Maybe in 2023. Hasbro not only wants to sell RPG sourcebooks but also to promote their own IPs to these become multimedia franchises.
DS needs more work because here the psionic powers are very important, the arcane magic is almost taboo, and the primal-punk look needs good artistic designers.
We can think we are going to see a DS 5th Ed because some creatures from Athas have appeared, for example the nightmare beast.
Also, I have good memories of Athas because in 3.5 I homebrewed a Dark Sun game (my first campaign ever) based on the 2e boxed set. However, my version was substantially different from the official one, and I would probably keep at least some of my homebrew changes if a 5e version came out. That being said, I’m curious to see what a more progressive WOTC would do with Dark Sun and I’d probably buy it unless it looks terrible.
The possibility of a return to Athas is part of the reason that I even considered getting back in to D&D. I share the concerns of the above posters though - sometimes getting a reboot is much worse than not getting a reboot as many, many, many current attempts have proven across all forms of media. In favour of appealing to the current zeitgiest is that Athas is explicitly and canonically multi-cultural with each of the city states representing an IRL ancient culture. It is also about fighting environmental damage, restoring damaged ecosystems and fighting slavery. I also think that the Prism Pentad novels make it pretty clear that slavery is bad - 'Good' slave owner Agis of Asticles is blind sided when one of his slaves betrays him for even a hint at freedom despite how well Agis has treated him. Plus, Brom Darksun art is hands down the best fantasy art even to be produced for D&D.
You raise some very good points. I never read the Prism Pentad. Can you point out which city-states correspond to which ancient cultures?
I think that Draj is a combination Egypt/Aztec influenced; Raam is often thought of as Indian (Indus valley?) influenced; Urik is almost certainly Babylonian; Gulg is Sub-Saharan African; Balic is almost a one to one Athens; Nibenay is somewhat nebulous in that it seems to be named after Ninevah (Assyrian) but it's descriptions seems to be more influenced by ancient Cambodian cultures (Khmer) especially with the all female templars reminiscent of the images seen on the Khmer temple walls (Aspara?).
I would 100% not trust WOTC to make a good Dark Sun book for 5e, that being said I hope they do release it.
That way we have mechanics for a lot of the dark Sun specific stuff like defiling and so on. That way we can just homebrew a better Dark Sun.
Heck, the amount of 3rd party content that it will bring should make it great!
It's an interesting conundrum: hope for a re-release even though it will almost certainly disappoint in some way as companies look to "update" or "reimagine" but be consoled by the fact that a much loved world is being kept alive or hope that world remains untouched except through fan content which can always be written of as not canon for those of us who care about that sort of thing (I do... I really, really do.) As you point out, at least homebrewing is baked in to D&D so no matter if they say that Athas races are the same as their multiverse equivalents or muls end up looking like anime elves we can always just edit it ourselves and paste cut outs of Brom art in to the source book.
Wow. Cool. Thanks.
What about Tyr?
I feel like I'm in the minority here, but if WotC is going to bring back Athas, I think it would be best for them to focus on new stories rather than reboot the old. Like fast-forward Athas a thousand years in the future and give us new sorcerer-kings or some city-states with sorcerers as elected officials for a change. I'm not convinced it should be a priority over new settings, though.
I'd really love for them too. Sadly, I wasn't playing when DS was a realy thing, but it's one of the only three specific settings in D&D that's popular (alongside Ravenloft and Eberron).
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but DS has effectively been replaced by Eberron. Sure, the Dune sketon is gone, but the impressions I got from the books is that it's supposed to be a political intrigue Game Of Thrones sort of game... and so is Eberron.
If they pulled a Beyond the Withlight and threw in one feat tree for Psionics, I actually think they could pull it off.
I think they're more likely to pull a Ravenloft - new stories in a reboot fashion, but the old stuff not re-used becomes non-cannon. That being said, it likely won't happen until after the core rules revision in 2024, but I would be very happy for that to happen.
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Some times I think WotC is preparing a future megaevent to explain the reason because all the D&D multiverse can be rebooted, and even allowing "opened doors" for some possible crossovers, for example Transformers, superheroes from comics or videogames (Fortnite, I am seing you!) and sci-fi franchises, for example the post-apocalypse "Gamma World". Maybe even the multiverses of D&D and Magic: the Gathering could merger.
There is reasons to think WotC is really interested into the revival of Dark Sun and other lines. They know other companies can publish their own generic epic fantasy, and then to conquer the market they have to show something really original and creative.
But Dark Sun needs a lot of work, not only the playtesting of the psionic powers, but also the special primal-punk what mixes Mad Max and Conan the barbarian. The comic failed because the story followed the spirit of the setting, but the look was not enough special and exclusive. You have to offer something what can't be imitated easily.
I definitely know there is a small but significant following of people who want Dark Sun. I think it was #2 after Spelljammer on a poll I saw of most requested settings.
I don't know if 5e as a system can handle that type of gritty game.
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Well I can see why it has not made a comeback in 5e. It will end up so generic and flavorless that it wouldn't or shouldn't even be DarkSun.