That is called anchoring, where someone gets you focused on something unbelievably terrible, so that they can later walk it back slightly, to something that is not quite as terrible, and you are more likely to accept this new terrible thing than if they had just offered that to you, because you are psychologically comparing it to the worse thing.
It would not surprise me, in the slightest, if WotC had leaked this version of the OGL themselves, so that they could then walk back some of it like you outlined. I mean, the fact that, according to the poll attached to this post, over 6% of users could not care if third-party developers all burned to the ground, these changes will be met with open arms.
That is called anchoring, where someone gets you focused on something unbelievably terrible, so that they can later walk it back slightly, to something that is not quite as terrible, and you are more likely to accept this new terrible thing than if they had just offered that to you, because you are psychologically comparing it to the worse thing.
It would not surprise me, in the slightest, if WotC had leaked this version of the OGL themselves, so that they could then walk back some of it like you outlined. I mean, the fact that, according to the poll attached to this post, over 6% of users could not care if third-party developers all burned to the ground, these changes will be met with open arms.
I suppose it could be true, but the hardest thing for be to believe is the fact that they have a lawyer that told them they could legally revoke OGL 1.0a after viewing the OGL 1.0a text and all the public statements made by WotC officials and the millions of dollars worth of content that was created by 3PP with the promise that this could never happen.
Either WotC / Hasbro lawyers are Corporate Yes-Men, they complete morons, or WotC / Hasbro brass is ignoring them and trying to do this anyway.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Info, Inflow, Overload. Knowledge Black Hole Imminent!
If they continue down this path, I just don't see how I stick with them, at least in buying newer product. I am not interested in being charged overmuch to use MY imagination. I don't think Hasbro has a clue how the "old ways"* they want to return to cut into big spender participation. I skipped 3rd and 4th edition completely and continued to play AD&D and didn't come back until 5E. I stopped by new product for FOURTEEN YEARS and I can do it again. And, if I lose my subscriptions on DnDBeyond because they make it difficult for me to use as they push changes I may or may not care for, well, I won't repeat the mistake of using their online services in the future. I was reluctant in the first place to spend money on access to "books" that were dependent on me forking over cash to Hasbro year after year anyway. I have a hardback of virtually every 5E book. They can't stop me from using those and they can't force me to move on to the next thing.
* I know the OGL was around for 3rd edition, etc. I'm talking about the hostility to other businesses and I'm pointing out that I have opted out of new D&D material in the past for long periods. I'm not making a connection between 3E business practices and my skipping out. I just didn't like 3E & 4E rules.
That is called anchoring, where someone gets you focused on something unbelievably terrible, so that they can later walk it back slightly, to something that is not quite as terrible, and you are more likely to accept this new terrible thing than if they had just offered that to you, because you are psychologically comparing it to the worse thing.
It would not surprise me, in the slightest, if WotC had leaked this version of the OGL themselves, so that they could then walk back some of it like you outlined. I mean, the fact that, according to the poll attached to this post, over 6% of users could not care if third-party developers all burned to the ground, these changes will be met with open arms.
I suppose it could be true, but the hardest thing for be to believe is the fact that they have a lawyer that told them they could legally revoke OGL 1.0a after viewing the OGL 1.0a text and all the public statements made by WotC officials and the millions of dollars worth of content that was created by 3PP with the promise that this could never happen.
Either WotC / Hasbro lawyers are Corporate Yes-Men, they complete morons, or WotC / Hasbro brass is ignoring them and trying to do this anyway.
Large companies try this tactic all the time, though not often so plainly. The general gambit is that they'll claim to revoke it. Now you have to either comply or call their bluff and continue publishing under ogl 1.0. If you do, they'll sue, and financially ruin you in court. Unless you can bankroll a huge case, you only have one option. Comply.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
This will probably be an unpopular opinion, but...
The only part of the leaked/rumored OGL I think is truly bad is the part about WotC owning 3rd-party content. The rest of it, though... it's certainly a HUGE change from where we've been before, but it's not like it's totally unfair. I mean, D&D is the ONLY game system I know of (disclaimer, I'm not well-versed in games -- Besides D&D I've only played: Shadowrun, the World of Darkness and it's various incarnations, Palladium's Robotech and TMNT, and Elfquest) that allows 3rd-party content sold for profit by the creator of said content.
Yes, this may be different from how it was done in the past, but it is by no means draconian or unfair.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
C. Foster Payne
"If you get to thinkin' you're a person of some influence, try orderin' somebody else's dog around."
This will probably be an unpopular opinion, but...
The only part of the leaked/rumored OGL I think is truly bad is the part about WotC owning 3rd-party content. The rest of it, though... it's certainly a HUGE change from where we've been before, but it's not like it's totally unfair. I mean, D&D is the ONLY game system I know of (disclaimer, I'm not well-versed in games -- Besides D&D I've only played: Shadowrun, the World of Darkness and it's various incarnations, Palladium's Robotech and TMNT, and Elfquest) that allows 3rd-party content sold for profit by the creator of said content.
Yes, this may be different from how it was done in the past, but it is by no means draconian or unfair.
That's certainly the most egregious part, but not the only one.
The attempt to revoke the OGL1.0 is also unacceptable. OGL1.0 was published in perpetuity. They can't revoke it. If they wanna publish 6e under OGL1.1 that's their right. But they cannot unpublish the established 3.5 and 5.0 published works "under the OGL1.0 in perpetuity". It is supposed to be forever. It was written to always be the OGL and if they even can revoke it is legally dubious at best. But they're certainly going to give it a good ol college try.
The other big ticket issue is that it isn't Open. This is a limited license that they can freely deny people from. And can change it at any time given only 30 day notice. That's NOT open.. Maybe its a gaming license, but not an open one that's for sure. They cannot and should not even call it an OGL. It is limited. Thus a LGL. Or whatever. Let them publish LGL1.1 for 6e. See how well it goes for them.
But that's not good enough because they know it won't turn out how they want unless they strongarm everyone into playing nice and to do that they must legally own everything anyone ever publishes and be able force out dissidents and crush any holdouts who prefer old 3.5 or 5e content.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Its one thing if you start a business knowing ahead of time that you will have to pay a certain percentage of your income, it's another thing entirely to suddenly have 25% taken away with very little forewarning. For most content creators, that isn't a hit they can take and they are either going to need to fire a lot of their staff, significantly raise their prices, or just go out of business.
Also out of all the problems in the document the biggest is the fact that they can change anything anytime they want and only need to give a 30 day advanced warning. So even if you think the document is mostly ok now, they basically included a section that says they have the right to make the OGL even worse when every they want.
A good interpretation of this doesn't exist. This is so draconian and in bad faith it only makes sense if it's designed to see others fail. They could have added language to make it sensible and address specific issues like NFT's, etc. But that's just a smokescreen.
At this point it almost doesn't matter what WOTC does. They demonstrated their head space, and all 3rd party creators must flee for their own livelihood.
The only way to preserve the community is to 1) Hasbro sells WOTC ASAP 2) release OGL 1.0B as close to the original as possible and include the word irrevocable.
In perpetuity and irrevocable are not th e same thing. OGL 1.0a is silent on revocable or irrevocable. That said, in court, any ambiguity is generally ruled in favor of the party who did not draft the contract or license. However, that means court. If you sign OGL 1.1 you give up your right to sue WOTC. Hence, the planned 9 days to decide.
Given that the official response after this long was a lack of a response. I have gone ahead and canceled my subscription. I'll see if they can earn it back, but it would take extreme course correction.
As a dungeon master of 44 years' experience (yes I'm old), I've always been loyal to D&D from the Blue Box all the way through 5e (except 4e, it was unplayable garbage). But I'm no fanboy, and hold fanboys in equal contempt as click-baiting alarmists.
I will reserve final judgement until I see the actual OGL 1.1.
That said, IF the new OGL attempts to assert ownership of content that I make for myself, or release under 1.0a, THEN I will take steps forcing WotC/Hasbro to attempt to cease-and-desist me or assert ownership of my work... which I will refuse and ignore... THEN IF they attempt any legal action against me THEN I will seek relief under anti-SLAPP law and attempt to establish precedent on that basis and under anti-competitive trade practice basis. Regardless, I will take steps to ensure they have to spend a lot of money in court, and do so in a manner that will prevent them from recovering legal fees.
And yes, I can afford legal representation if need be, and know how to build the "corporate veil" for about 150 bucks... far, far less than I've spent on WotC materials. It will cost me less to make an LLC than I would have spent on 5.5e books. It is cheaper for me to play the corporate-shell game than to support factually anti-competitive behavior. Bring it on, WotC, no matter what you attempt in court, no matter the outcome, you lose money and further drag your own name through a septic tank and I therefore win.
You control corporate B/S by harming their reputation with their own behavior, eviscerating their wallets and getting their own legal staff to bleed them dry (especially a publicly-traded company that has a Board of Directors that will fire executives and fire legal firms whose shortsighted behavior interrupts the flow of precious, precioussss monnnneeyyyy drool). Every time a company sues or takes other legal action, they're paying their own lawyers a LOT and hurting their own bottom line. I guarantee you, whatever "genius" thought of this is a lawyer seeking to line their own pockets at Hasbro's stockholders' expense.
No bottom-feeding otyugh of a tort lawyer can force me to not abandon D&D and all of its products, or force me to be silent about why.
First thing let's do, acknowledge that Shakespeare had it right.
The reason for the lack of a response is clear, Wotc released a statement on their position with regards to whatever the OGl v1.1[ or whatever it will be deemed ] in the DDBeyond article https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1410-ogls-srds-one-d-d
The fact that an internal initial draft of the supposed OGL 1.1 leaked, with the aforementioned statement, means that Wotc had anticipated this measure of backlash.
Will there be enough pressure from the community to force Hasbro/Wotc to reconsider? The pressure behind this wall of unity and the cracks and leaks that will only continue to grow with time looks like it's taking its toll on the company's PR dam.
Till an official game license is released 3rdPP may be held back by an NDA, but strain is showing.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
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well, 'ya know, they wouldn't want to rush into anything they might regret ;-)
#OpenDND - opendnd.games
That is called anchoring, where someone gets you focused on something unbelievably terrible, so that they can later walk it back slightly, to something that is not quite as terrible, and you are more likely to accept this new terrible thing than if they had just offered that to you, because you are psychologically comparing it to the worse thing.
It would not surprise me, in the slightest, if WotC had leaked this version of the OGL themselves, so that they could then walk back some of it like you outlined. I mean, the fact that, according to the poll attached to this post, over 6% of users could not care if third-party developers all burned to the ground, these changes will be met with open arms.
It’s not rumor. It was a leaked internal document.
I suppose it could be true, but the hardest thing for be to believe is the fact that they have a lawyer that told them they could legally revoke OGL 1.0a after viewing the OGL 1.0a text and all the public statements made by WotC officials and the millions of dollars worth of content that was created by 3PP with the promise that this could never happen.
Either WotC / Hasbro lawyers are Corporate Yes-Men, they complete morons, or WotC / Hasbro brass is ignoring them and trying to do this anyway.
Info, Inflow, Overload. Knowledge Black Hole Imminent!
Where is their official statement on this? Their house is burning but...."this is fine".
If they continue down this path, I just don't see how I stick with them, at least in buying newer product. I am not interested in being charged overmuch to use MY imagination. I don't think Hasbro has a clue how the "old ways"* they want to return to cut into big spender participation. I skipped 3rd and 4th edition completely and continued to play AD&D and didn't come back until 5E. I stopped by new product for FOURTEEN YEARS and I can do it again. And, if I lose my subscriptions on DnDBeyond because they make it difficult for me to use as they push changes I may or may not care for, well, I won't repeat the mistake of using their online services in the future. I was reluctant in the first place to spend money on access to "books" that were dependent on me forking over cash to Hasbro year after year anyway. I have a hardback of virtually every 5E book. They can't stop me from using those and they can't force me to move on to the next thing.
* I know the OGL was around for 3rd edition, etc. I'm talking about the hostility to other businesses and I'm pointing out that I have opted out of new D&D material in the past for long periods. I'm not making a connection between 3E business practices and my skipping out. I just didn't like 3E & 4E rules.
My renewal is in the fall, so I can't even make that decision right now.
I can say this: if the OGL 1.1 isn't a draft but the actual final terms, I'm done buying official WOTC content.
Large companies try this tactic all the time, though not often so plainly. The general gambit is that they'll claim to revoke it. Now you have to either comply or call their bluff and continue publishing under ogl 1.0. If you do, they'll sue, and financially ruin you in court. Unless you can bankroll a huge case, you only have one option. Comply.
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
This will probably be an unpopular opinion, but...
The only part of the leaked/rumored OGL I think is truly bad is the part about WotC owning 3rd-party content. The rest of it, though... it's certainly a HUGE change from where we've been before, but it's not like it's totally unfair. I mean, D&D is the ONLY game system I know of (disclaimer, I'm not well-versed in games -- Besides D&D I've only played: Shadowrun, the World of Darkness and it's various incarnations, Palladium's Robotech and TMNT, and Elfquest) that allows 3rd-party content sold for profit by the creator of said content.
Yes, this may be different from how it was done in the past, but it is by no means draconian or unfair.
C. Foster Payne
"If you get to thinkin' you're a person of some influence, try orderin' somebody else's dog around."
That's certainly the most egregious part, but not the only one.
The attempt to revoke the OGL1.0 is also unacceptable. OGL1.0 was published in perpetuity. They can't revoke it. If they wanna publish 6e under OGL1.1 that's their right. But they cannot unpublish the established 3.5 and 5.0 published works "under the OGL1.0 in perpetuity". It is supposed to be forever. It was written to always be the OGL and if they even can revoke it is legally dubious at best. But they're certainly going to give it a good ol college try.
The other big ticket issue is that it isn't Open. This is a limited license that they can freely deny people from. And can change it at any time given only 30 day notice. That's NOT open.. Maybe its a gaming license, but not an open one that's for sure. They cannot and should not even call it an OGL. It is limited. Thus a LGL. Or whatever. Let them publish LGL1.1 for 6e. See how well it goes for them.
But that's not good enough because they know it won't turn out how they want unless they strongarm everyone into playing nice and to do that they must legally own everything anyone ever publishes and be able force out dissidents and crush any holdouts who prefer old 3.5 or 5e content.
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Its one thing if you start a business knowing ahead of time that you will have to pay a certain percentage of your income, it's another thing entirely to suddenly have 25% taken away with very little forewarning. For most content creators, that isn't a hit they can take and they are either going to need to fire a lot of their staff, significantly raise their prices, or just go out of business.
Also out of all the problems in the document the biggest is the fact that they can change anything anytime they want and only need to give a 30 day advanced warning. So even if you think the document is mostly ok now, they basically included a section that says they have the right to make the OGL even worse when every they want.
A good interpretation of this doesn't exist. This is so draconian and in bad faith it only makes sense if it's designed to see others fail. They could have added language to make it sensible and address specific issues like NFT's, etc. But that's just a smokescreen.
At this point it almost doesn't matter what WOTC does. They demonstrated their head space, and all 3rd party creators must flee for their own livelihood.
The only way to preserve the community is to 1) Hasbro sells WOTC ASAP 2) release OGL 1.0B as close to the original as possible and include the word irrevocable.
In perpetuity and irrevocable are not th e same thing. OGL 1.0a is silent on revocable or irrevocable. That said, in court, any ambiguity is generally ruled in favor of the party who did not draft the contract or license. However, that means court. If you sign OGL 1.1 you give up your right to sue WOTC. Hence, the planned 9 days to decide.
It's time to EnDnD.
Given that the official response after this long was a lack of a response. I have gone ahead and canceled my subscription. I'll see if they can earn it back, but it would take extreme course correction.
I was actually ready to make the change to D&D One, but with out OGL I'm out. There are plenty of other games that I'd be just as happy playing.
That's a great idea I'll do the same.
As a dungeon master of 44 years' experience (yes I'm old), I've always been loyal to D&D from the Blue Box all the way through 5e (except 4e, it was unplayable garbage). But I'm no fanboy, and hold fanboys in equal contempt as click-baiting alarmists.
I will reserve final judgement until I see the actual OGL 1.1.
That said, IF the new OGL attempts to assert ownership of content that I make for myself, or release under 1.0a, THEN I will take steps forcing WotC/Hasbro to attempt to cease-and-desist me or assert ownership of my work... which I will refuse and ignore... THEN IF they attempt any legal action against me THEN I will seek relief under anti-SLAPP law and attempt to establish precedent on that basis and under anti-competitive trade practice basis. Regardless, I will take steps to ensure they have to spend a lot of money in court, and do so in a manner that will prevent them from recovering legal fees.
And yes, I can afford legal representation if need be, and know how to build the "corporate veil" for about 150 bucks... far, far less than I've spent on WotC materials. It will cost me less to make an LLC than I would have spent on 5.5e books. It is cheaper for me to play the corporate-shell game than to support factually anti-competitive behavior. Bring it on, WotC, no matter what you attempt in court, no matter the outcome, you lose money and further drag your own name through a septic tank and I therefore win.
You control corporate B/S by harming their reputation with their own behavior, eviscerating their wallets and getting their own legal staff to bleed them dry (especially a publicly-traded company that has a Board of Directors that will fire executives and fire legal firms whose shortsighted behavior interrupts the flow of precious, precioussss monnnneeyyyy drool). Every time a company sues or takes other legal action, they're paying their own lawyers a LOT and hurting their own bottom line. I guarantee you, whatever "genius" thought of this is a lawyer seeking to line their own pockets at Hasbro's stockholders' expense.
No bottom-feeding otyugh of a tort lawyer can force me to not abandon D&D and all of its products, or force me to be silent about why.
First thing let's do, acknowledge that Shakespeare had it right.
The reason for the lack of a response is clear, Wotc released a statement on their position with regards to whatever the OGl v1.1[ or whatever it will be deemed ] in the DDBeyond article https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1410-ogls-srds-one-d-d
The fact that an internal initial draft of the supposed OGL 1.1 leaked, with the aforementioned statement, means that Wotc had anticipated this measure of backlash.
Will there be enough pressure from the community to force Hasbro/Wotc to reconsider? The pressure behind this wall of unity and the cracks and leaks that will only continue to grow with time looks like it's taking its toll on the company's PR dam.
Till an official game license is released 3rdPP may be held back by an NDA, but strain is showing.