Slowly going through the 'preview clips' but noticing that weapon masteries apparently being avoided for the monk (hoping this is not true). Also no mention of unarmed strike. If PHB follows in the vein the UA arcana of nothing said, then unarmed strike (usually via monk) should auto-qualify for any weapon mastery. Making for flurrying monks to be able to do dagger-dagger-dagger-unarmed-unarmed all at MA damage.
In my opinion, weapon mastery, particularly unarmed strike, holds a unique and intriguing place in Dungeons & Dragons (DND). Unlike traditional weapons that rely on steel and craftsmanship, unarmed strikes draw upon a character's innate strength and training.
Someone with weapon mastery is not mastering the quality of their weapon, though. It is a question of skill with that particular classification of weapon. Longsword mastery applies to everything from a wooden practice longsword to the mightiest of artifact level longswords. It is a measure of innate strength and training.
Problem though, if you take Unarmed Fighting Style as your Fighter focus, you are shortchanged with Weapon Mastery. I am playing a Half Orc Fighter with this fighting style and can't find anything about Unarmed Weapon mastery..
Yeah they also need to make sure it gets added to races that have natural weapons like lizardmen bite. Or I guess we just have to homebrew them cause they didn't think of it.
You could talk to your DM about it and give a huge buff to unarmed strikes and the unarmed Monk. It just makes sense that monks always get weapon mastery with their unarmed strikes, but the question remains: what are unarmed strike's property?
Well, if you could rule it as how you wrap/protect your hands contribute to what property they use. The only properties exempt from this would probably be cleave and Graze. But like you use a pair of brass knuckles you could slow your targets. Wrap your hands in bandages and you're hitting with a sap. Thai ropes: Topple, Claws: nick, Pro gloves: push, & Metal Gauntlets/bite: vex. Alternatively, you could be ruling different properties as different fighting forms
I don't quite what you're saying but going down the line of questions. If you're playing a pugilist fighter you have to choose where whether you deal damage, shove, or grapple a target. You can't get a mastery in unarmed strikes (US) RAW
The Crusher feat from Tasha's affects USs like it effects all bludgeon weapons. There's also sentinel but That's more broad for martial attacks.
No I don't believe you can combine masteries and US.
I wish there were a mastery for unarmed strikes which monks got. As I do not like the vibe where you are motivated to go monk weapon with a 1 level dip stuff.
I don't quite what you're saying but going down the line of questions. If you're playing a pugilist fighter you have to choose where whether you deal damage, shove, or grapple a target. You can't get a mastery in unarmed strikes (US) RAW
The Crusher feat from Tasha's affects USs like it effects all bludgeon weapons. There's also sentinel but That's more broad for martial attacks.
No I don't believe you can combine masteries and US.
Not usually, monk's martial arts do though
The point being that Monks get abilities with martial arts that other classes do not get. Previous posters are complaining about a lack of weapon mastery when there are abilities already baked into martial arts that make Monk unarmed attacks better than everybody else, hence the lack of an additional mastery for unarmed strikes.
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"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
I don't quite what you're saying but going down the line of questions. If you're playing a pugilist fighter you have to choose where whether you deal damage, shove, or grapple a target. You can't get a mastery in unarmed strikes (US) RAW
The Crusher feat from Tasha's affects USs like it effects all bludgeon weapons. There's also sentinel but That's more broad for martial attacks.
No I don't believe you can combine masteries and US.
Not usually, monk's martial arts do though
The point being that Monks get abilities with martial arts that other classes do not get. Previous posters are complaining about a lack of weapon mastery when there are abilities already baked into martial arts that make Monk unarmed attacks better than everybody else, hence the lack of an additional mastery for unarmed strikes.
The problem with them not getting one around unarmed combat is that it motivates dips into classes that give them which they will apply to monk weapons, just making them flat out better. If its for a kensai concept I get it, but if you just end up being a better striker by dipping fighter and using monk weapons with a weapon mastery it feels off.
Ability to choose STR or DEX for attack/damage modifier.
Choosing to do force damage instead of bludgeoning damage.
Monk martial arts do all of the above. Last time I checked, masteries only did one thing and didn't scale with levels. Dipping into another class to improve something is nothing new for any class not just Monks.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
You could even argue that Flurry of Blows *is* an unarmed weapon mastery, no other class gets to hit that often in a single turn. Adding anything on top of that would also be over powered because of how many times per round you're applying it. Say for instance you apply Vex, that's four attacks at level 5 and three of them are with advantage and suddenly you never miss ever. Cleave and Graze are for big weapons so don't make much sense on unarmed strikes but for argument you're suddenly either guarenteeing a hit four times a go or killing an entire crowd each turn, NIck would cause a real headache trying to figure out which hit happens when but could conceivably give you even more attacks, Push would be silly as you'd just be chasing someone all over the map, Slow would freeze someone in place by the time you've applied it four times, and Topple would do the same as Vex and give every attack at advantage. They're all way too over powered at just level 5
Ability to choose STR or DEX for attack/damage modifier.
Choosing to do force damage instead of bludgeoning damage.
Monk martial arts do all of the above. Last time I checked, masteries only did one thing and didn't scale with levels. Dipping into another class to improve something is nothing new for any class not just Monks.
Dipping being nothing new and for other classes as well does not make it a good thing for the game.
Ability to choose STR or DEX for attack/damage modifier.
Choosing to do force damage instead of bludgeoning damage.
Monk martial arts do all of the above. Last time I checked, masteries only did one thing and didn't scale with levels. Dipping into another class to improve something is nothing new for any class not just Monks.
It just seems like a weird choice, every other martial class gets weapon mastery, even Rogues. If there were one class I'd expect to not have the feature it be Rogues rather than monks. I usually tended towards using a weapon as a monk anyways just cause it's less likely to bite back if you roll a 1.
It's not even the monk not getting a weapon mastery that I'm taking issue with here. It's the unarmed strike not having a mastery property; being a fighter or barbarian that uses their fist sounds really cool. Being able to kick evil in the face with the power of the gods and Paladins just sounds divine.
Let's see Tavern brawler w/Crusher Feats gets you a pushing punch of 10 feet rerolling 1's on damage rolls (it be cool if you got to reroll 1s on unarmed atk rolls to with the tavern brawler)and a Vex on a Critical hit?
You know this feels more like what I was talking about, before. With the DM making different gauntlets, Brawling weapons, and wraps to grant weapon mastery properties.
Monks have a lot of other things in their toybox, there's not really a pressing need for them to get a rider effect the way the other martials do. Plus I'm partly expecting they're keeping Weapon Masteries in the back pocket as a Kensei specific feature when that gets upgraded to '24.
Monks don't need weapon mastery because 3 out of 4 subclasses upgrade the unarmed strike.
Mercy makes your strikes heal or harm
Elements gives you crazy reach and elemental damage
Open Hand gives you your choice of addle, push, or topple
Shadow doesn't upgrade because it's more of a caster-focused monk
So not only do monks not need unarmed weapon mastery, giving it to the base class would open up a can of synergy worms with them combining those benefits with the subclass benefits they already get. (Elements + Grappler for instance is already crazy good)
This design also helps the monk subclasses feel like different martial arts styles, instead of every subclass getting the same mastery benefit. Personally, I think this is even more important than balance (fortunately, balance has not been sacrificed either in this case) because monk is a class that only exists to be a martial that feels different from a fighter or rogue. Those classes should not be able to take unarmed mastery and fight like a monk, because the way a monk fights needs to be unique.
Now yes, this leaves the Brawler fighter and the Kensei monk in a bad spot. These subclasses (or whatever they decide to call them) will likely have subclass features that better support the concept of an unarmed fighter and a weapon master monk. But you may need to wait for them; the edition isn't even a year old yet.
Slowly going through the 'preview clips' but noticing that weapon masteries apparently being avoided for the monk (hoping this is not true). Also no mention of unarmed strike. If PHB follows in the vein the UA arcana of nothing said, then unarmed strike (usually via monk) should auto-qualify for any weapon mastery. Making for flurrying monks to be able to do dagger-dagger-dagger-unarmed-unarmed all at MA damage.
Someone with weapon mastery is not mastering the quality of their weapon, though. It is a question of skill with that particular classification of weapon. Longsword mastery applies to everything from a wooden practice longsword to the mightiest of artifact level longswords. It is a measure of innate strength and training.
Problem though, if you take Unarmed Fighting Style as your Fighter focus, you are shortchanged with Weapon Mastery. I am playing a Half Orc Fighter with this fighting style and can't find anything about Unarmed Weapon mastery..
Yeah they also need to make sure it gets added to races that have natural weapons like lizardmen bite. Or I guess we just have to homebrew them cause they didn't think of it.
You could talk to your DM about it and give a huge buff to unarmed strikes and the unarmed Monk. It just makes sense that monks always get weapon mastery with their unarmed strikes, but the question remains: what are unarmed strike's property?
Well, if you could rule it as how you wrap/protect your hands contribute to what property they use. The only properties exempt from this would probably be cleave and Graze. But like you use a pair of brass knuckles you could slow your targets. Wrap your hands in bandages and you're hitting with a sap. Thai ropes: Topple, Claws: nick, Pro gloves: push, & Metal Gauntlets/bite: vex. Alternatively, you could be ruling different properties as different fighting forms
Are you able to do more than just damage with your unarmed strikes?
Are there Feats that affect unarmed strikes?
Are you able to combine other weapon masteries and unarmed strikes?
Do your bonus action attacks also add stat bonus?
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
I don't quite what you're saying but going down the line of questions. If you're playing a pugilist fighter you have to choose where whether you deal damage, shove, or grapple a target. You can't get a mastery in unarmed strikes (US) RAW
The Crusher feat from Tasha's affects USs like it effects all bludgeon weapons. There's also sentinel but That's more broad for martial attacks.
No I don't believe you can combine masteries and US.
Not usually, monk's martial arts do though
I wish there were a mastery for unarmed strikes which monks got. As I do not like the vibe where you are motivated to go monk weapon with a 1 level dip stuff.
The point being that Monks get abilities with martial arts that other classes do not get. Previous posters are complaining about a lack of weapon mastery when there are abilities already baked into martial arts that make Monk unarmed attacks better than everybody else, hence the lack of an additional mastery for unarmed strikes.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
The problem with them not getting one around unarmed combat is that it motivates dips into classes that give them which they will apply to monk weapons, just making them flat out better. If its for a kensai concept I get it, but if you just end up being a better striker by dipping fighter and using monk weapons with a weapon mastery it feels off.
Automatic damage scaling.
Damage die applying to Monk weapons.
Bonus action attack.
Ability to choose STR or DEX for attack/damage modifier.
Choosing to do force damage instead of bludgeoning damage.
Monk martial arts do all of the above. Last time I checked, masteries only did one thing and didn't scale with levels. Dipping into another class to improve something is nothing new for any class not just Monks.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
You could even argue that Flurry of Blows *is* an unarmed weapon mastery, no other class gets to hit that often in a single turn. Adding anything on top of that would also be over powered because of how many times per round you're applying it. Say for instance you apply Vex, that's four attacks at level 5 and three of them are with advantage and suddenly you never miss ever. Cleave and Graze are for big weapons so don't make much sense on unarmed strikes but for argument you're suddenly either guarenteeing a hit four times a go or killing an entire crowd each turn, NIck would cause a real headache trying to figure out which hit happens when but could conceivably give you even more attacks, Push would be silly as you'd just be chasing someone all over the map, Slow would freeze someone in place by the time you've applied it four times, and Topple would do the same as Vex and give every attack at advantage. They're all way too over powered at just level 5
Dipping being nothing new and for other classes as well does not make it a good thing for the game.
It just seems like a weird choice, every other martial class gets weapon mastery, even Rogues. If there were one class I'd expect to not have the feature it be Rogues rather than monks. I usually tended towards using a weapon as a monk anyways just cause it's less likely to bite back if you roll a 1.
It's not even the monk not getting a weapon mastery that I'm taking issue with here. It's the unarmed strike not having a mastery property; being a fighter or barbarian that uses their fist sounds really cool. Being able to kick evil in the face with the power of the gods and Paladins just sounds divine.
OH! I get it now, you just want Monks to be OP. I understand.
Or you know, you could take the Unarmed Fighting Style and/or Tavern Brawler feat.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Let's see Tavern brawler w/Crusher Feats gets you a pushing punch of 10 feet rerolling 1's on damage rolls (it be cool if you got to reroll 1s on unarmed atk rolls to with the tavern brawler)and a Vex on a Critical hit?
You know this feels more like what I was talking about, before. With the DM making different gauntlets, Brawling weapons, and wraps to grant weapon mastery properties.
Monks have a lot of other things in their toybox, there's not really a pressing need for them to get a rider effect the way the other martials do. Plus I'm partly expecting they're keeping Weapon Masteries in the back pocket as a Kensei specific feature when that gets upgraded to '24.
Monks don't need weapon mastery because 3 out of 4 subclasses upgrade the unarmed strike.
So not only do monks not need unarmed weapon mastery, giving it to the base class would open up a can of synergy worms with them combining those benefits with the subclass benefits they already get. (Elements + Grappler for instance is already crazy good)
This design also helps the monk subclasses feel like different martial arts styles, instead of every subclass getting the same mastery benefit. Personally, I think this is even more important than balance (fortunately, balance has not been sacrificed either in this case) because monk is a class that only exists to be a martial that feels different from a fighter or rogue. Those classes should not be able to take unarmed mastery and fight like a monk, because the way a monk fights needs to be unique.
Now yes, this leaves the Brawler fighter and the Kensei monk in a bad spot. These subclasses (or whatever they decide to call them) will likely have subclass features that better support the concept of an unarmed fighter and a weapon master monk. But you may need to wait for them; the edition isn't even a year old yet.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm