Hello I need your help. Actually, I just want to know if I'm overreacting or if my displeasure is justified. I started playing DnD with my group about 2 years ago. We are 4 players and I am the DM. We are currently playing Tomb of Annihilation. Last week 2 of my players died and unfortunately they have no option to be revived. They are currently in the middle of the jungle. In short order, the two players had to create a new character. Player B is moving and has a lot to do. I understand that too. Player A, on the other hand, was on vacation and we made an appointment to create the character. After half an hour he had to leave and so far we only have the raw character, no background story, nothing. I repeat they are in the middle of the jungle and I have no story on the character. We play once a week and I think I'll just skip the next round because I can't keep playing with two players. I understand that there are people who have more time and some who have less time, but I think I can expect to be given a suggestion and see how the new character fits into the campaign or not. Is it too much to expect me to be given a character introduction? How do you deal with it when a new character joins the ongoing campaign?
First of all, consider whether your players still have time to play the game. D&D takes time, and sometimes you discover that you don't have the time, but still want to try to play the game to be polite. In this case, you should take initiative and ask your players if they are still up to play the game. If they aren't, be understanding that it's nothing personal.
If one or both of your players feels like continuing and has sufficient time to do so, introducing new characters isn't nearly as hard as it may seem. You can flesh out complex backstories and personality later; right now, a simple backstory and some basic traits is all you need. Since you're in a wilderness setting, teaming up with other travelers for safety in numbers is a good enough in-game reason to add the new characters in. In the end of the day, playing the game is more important than introducing new characters in a way that makes perfect narrative sense.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Panda-wat (I hate my username) is somehow convinced that he is objectively right about everything D&D related even though he obviously is not. Considering that, he'd probably make a great D&D youtuber.
"If I die, I can live with that." ~Luke Hart, the DM lair
I think you've done as much as you can: you should've explained the kind of game you're running and it's one that requires a backstory and a means of the player joining in at a time of their choosing. Maybe they're so burnt out by their character dying they'd rather not play this campaign again. Ask them if they want to play, and let them explain themselves fully because they may want to say 'no' without causing offence or upset. Make it clear this isn't a diplomatic attempt to remove them from the table: it's a genuine question, that you want them at the table but they need to work with you because that's what the game is required to run things. And if they can't talk with you about a character that fits your game, and there's not enough room for compromise, they've got to be the adult, acknowledge their time is valuable, and find somewhere else to spend it.
I'm a backstory-minimal player but I don't expect every game to be backstory-minimal. If I join a game where I'm expected to do the Xanathar's Guide to Everything origins tables, I would treat that with respect and either leave, thanking the DM for their time but this isn't for me, or going ahead with it. What I don't do is stonewall them by refusing to come up with a reason to be a part of their game. If I have no desire to do what is agreed upon by everyone else to be a sound idea, why would I remain in that group?
It's not nice to say or be told "maybe this isn't the table for you," but it is a necessity at times. It saves everyone time, and when you're at the point that player might open up about what the problem is.
I hope that helps. I wish you luck!
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Zero is the most important number in D&D: Session Zero sets the boundaries and the tone; Rule Zero dictates the Dungeon Master (DM) is the final arbiter; and Zero D&D is better than Bad D&D.
"Let us speak plainly now, and in earnest, for words mean little without the weight of conviction."
Thank you for your answers. I think the two still want to play. Mainly because player A has made it clear that he wants to become a better player (take notes and pay more attention). Maybe I'm expecting too much? My problem is that I can't plan and prepare any further. But maybe I should just let it be and start our round as usual? For me personally the story is very important but maybe Panda_wat is right and it's more important to play the game at the moment.
If you have a player that wants to get better and is trying to improve their play style by listening more intently and taking notes, you would have to be bonkers to let that go because their backstory is not fleshed out yet. The player wants to play so the PC will fit the story once they get around to dressing it up. Plan another appointment to wrap up the character creation then play.
I personally love a good backstory but I have also more recently fallen in love with a fairly empty backstory. They allow a lot of room to fill in those gaps during play. I encourage you to review this thread. Full backstories are not necessary to play full games.
I only require the barest minimum of information from my players regarding their characters’ backstories. If they can tell me 1) any one thing about their character’s home life; 2) any one event in their character’s past; and 3) how/why they became an adventurer; that’s all I require. If they can sum that up in a few sentences that’s good enough for me. If they are starting g at a slightly higher level (5+) I may ask for another couple sentences about their early adventuring career, but that’s all. If your player can give you at least a little bit about their character that should be enough to at least get you started.
Back in 2e when I started, it was generally considered to be up to the DM to come up with plausible reasons for the PCs to all be together in the same place. (That’s why so many adventuring groups all started out in a tavern.) If your player can give you a little info, I’m sure you can come up with some excuse for them to be in that jungle, even if it’s just that their previous party all died in that same jungle somehow while they were on an adventure of their own.
Since you’re playing ToA background is fairly easy really. You have a brief background from the L1 creation that just has to explain how you got started in your class and chose to adventure. Then everything else is similar to what the party did except their old team got hit by wandering monsters while trying to recover from something and they were the sole survivor(s). Have the 2 characters know each other a bit as they were in the same party and it’s easy to fit them in/add them to the others.
If you're running a module campaign, does backstory *really* matter? In my experience, working character backstories into pre-made modules requires a huge amount of time and hassle that may not be merited. You can play in a module with no more than, "My dude is an explorer/adventurer and he stumbled across this creepy place." Maybe see if your players even really care about backstory.
Trust me...if I'm running my own campaign, I want backstories and I will work hard to bring those in where possible. And some people don't need to be involved deeply to enjoy playing. And those folks can just play along and if they eventually get inspired, we'll start working with that.
Thank you for your answers. I think the two still want to play. Mainly because player A has made it clear that he wants to become a better player (take notes and pay more attention). Maybe I'm expecting too much? My problem is that I can't plan and prepare any further. But maybe I should just let it be and start our round as usual? For me personally the story is very important but maybe Panda_wat is right and it's more important to play the game at the moment.
I agree with most of the comments of the other posters in the thread. You don't actually need any background at all to slot in a couple of new characters. From a DM perspective, you actually don't need to know anything at all about the two new characters to plan and prepare further, especially with an adventure like ToA. ToA is a sandbox. Anyone joining this quest will likely be motivated to end the death curse for some reason.
The party might encounter someone else in the jungle by happenstance but there is little to no chance that random strangers are going to join a couple of randomly encountered adventurers on a quest to "save the world" unless that is also their motivation.
If you want a backstory that accounts for it and integrates into your ongoing plot - all you need to do is have the two new characters be survivors of another party perhaps defeated by the same opponent who killed the two members of the party. They were stuck in the jungle without a guide and were either hiding or trying to make their way back to civilization. They encounter the surviving members of the party and the players can role play that however they choose. However, when the characters discover that they have the same ultimate goal that provides a foundation to bind the party together and they can move forward to the objective together.
Losing characters in the tomb might be more challenging except the module actually includes instructions on likely places where the new characters could be added to a party exploring the tomb. (Depending on the players and respective characters the tomb can be far more deadly than any other part of the module).
Finally, incorporating adventure tie-ins to character backgrounds can be a fun and enjoyable addition to a game but they aren't the point of the game unless the DM has designed the plot line entirely around the character background (which can often be a bad idea since depending on how it is done, one character can become the focus for a large part of the campaign as it goes through some long and involved background arc, leaving the rest of the players feeling ignored and out of the spotlight). A campaign with some cool background tie-ins but an overall plot independent of character background often works out better all around.
----
Anyway, in this case, real life is an important consideration. One player is moving, the other on vacation. Both or either may have work, spouse, children and other commitments to deal with so they have limited time to invest in creating a detailed character that honestly is nice but not required especially for a hardcover module like ToA. I'd suggest getting them to rough out the class/race/level/interests of the character and if you need more background details latter you can work together with the players to fill it in as you go along. Focus on having fun playing and don't sweat too many details.
I try to prioritize keeping the players playing over anything else. A 70% solution on time is far better than a 100% solution, 10 minutes too late.
If you have a base PC, you can always sort out the specifics of backstory and lore via text, email, chat, whatever. If nothing else, they can pick something from the Personality, Ideals, Bonds and Flaws on their PC sheet and build from there. There are plenty of opportunities around a campfire, at a pub, or traveling the roads for the player to figure out the final form that their PC will take. In the meantime, you get the glorious task for planning for the new PC to join the group. As has been mentioned, the adventure you're running has some already identified locations that might suit this task.
As a side note, I might suggest that everyone make a 2nd (or even 3rd) PC, and have it prepped. The Tomb has a tendency to require some PC roster changes from time to time.
Working with player absence is as unique as the table that is trying to sort it out. My table has a standing rule that if you can't make the game, all you need do is say so. The only questions asked are: Can we continue without you? If yes, who do you want to run your PC? I won't require my players to justify their absence because of illness, injury or other life challenge that has jumped up infront of them, regardless of severity. As the DM, I have obligations that sometimes prohibit me from attending, in which case, I remind the group (one of whom is a DM themselves) that they can still get together and play without me. Lastly, there are times where the story beat is important enough to have everyone present, like the ending encounter of the adventure. I won't hesitate to ask the group for their consensus about holding back until we are all available. Long story short-er, you shouldn't hesitate to call the session off.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime.” - Mark Twain - Innocents Abroad
Hello and thanks again for the replies :) I realized that I didn't express myself properly. By background I don't mean I want to know what the character likes to eat and what size boots they have. It would be important to me where the character comes from and what makes him special. Like "This is Gimli, he's a dwarven warrior and loves his axe. He has a dislike for orcs (maybe why he doesn't like orcs). He was setting up camp in the forest when he heard the fight and was helping the group " In addition, a rough description of his appearance or just a picture. But what I have at the moment with player a is: "This is __________ he is a Lizardfolk and Cleric" I don't even have the spells or anything. I need it because I have to create the character in a program.
I've now left it open to players without characters to take characters I created, which they can swap out after this round until their characters are complete. Or if we postpone the round.
Hello and thanks again for the replies :) I realized that I didn't express myself properly. By background I don't mean I want to know what the character likes to eat and what size boots they have. It would be important to me where the character comes from and what makes him special. Like "This is Gimli, he's a dwarven warrior and loves his axe. He has a dislike for orcs (maybe why he doesn't like orcs). He was setting up camp in the forest when he heard the fight and was helping the group " In addition, a rough description of his appearance or just a picture. But what I have at the moment with player a is: "This is __________ he is a Lizardfolk and Cleric" I don't even have the spells or anything. I need it because I have to create the character in a program.
I've now left it open to players without characters to take characters I created, which they can swap out after this round until their characters are complete. Or if we postpone the round.
I'm a bit confused and I don't want this to sound negative but ..
You got together with player A to create a character and spent 30 minutes on it and all you have is "He is a Lizardfolk Cleric"? 30 minutes should be more than enough time to have a much more fleshed out character than that. In addition, with a module like ToA, there are some very obvious backstory elements that would tie all characters trying to overcome the death curse that are very obvious choices for a plot element to introduce new characters.
What ideas did player A have coming to the character creation session? Was the Lizardfolk Cleric their choice?
"It would be important to me where the character comes from and what makes him special."
Why is the above information important to you? How would it impact running a module like ToA? I've played ToA with some DMsGuild content added to flesh it out and although it could be flavored with character background elements, it isn't essential. Where the character comes from, why they are there (other than defeating the death curse), or even what made them become an adventurer or what makes them "special" are details that can be sorted out later if ever. They generally aren't essential. I've had players with detailed backgrounds and others with one sentence backgrounds "I was an urchin, grew up in a big city, turned to thievery to survive, became a rogue". However, a DM can successfully run a module without even that.
Also, I was wondering what program you have to use to create the character sheet? In most games I have played or run, the players take care of managing and maintaining their own character sheet whether it is on paper, on D&D Beyond or Roll20, even the fillable pdf character sheets. I'm not sure what your set up might be but if possible you could just let the player create the new character they want to play and send you the details.
Hello and thanks again for the replies :) I realized that I didn't express myself properly. By background I don't mean I want to know what the character likes to eat and what size boots they have. It would be important to me where the character comes from and what makes him special. Like "This is Gimli, he's a dwarven warrior and loves his axe. He has a dislike for orcs (maybe why he doesn't like orcs). He was setting up camp in the forest when he heard the fight and was helping the group " In addition, a rough description of his appearance or just a picture. But what I have at the moment with player a is: "This is __________ he is a Lizardfolk and Cleric" I don't even have the spells or anything. I need it because I have to create the character in a program.
"It would be important to me where the character comes from and what makes him special."
Why is the above information important to you? How would it impact running a module like ToA? I've played ToA with some DMsGuild content added to flesh it out and although it could be flavored with character background elements, it isn't essential. Where the character comes from, why they are there (other than defeating the death curse), or even what made them become an adventurer or what makes them "special" are details that can be sorted out later if ever. They generally aren't essential. I've had players with detailed backgrounds and others with one sentence backgrounds "I was an urchin, grew up in a big city, turned to thievery to survive, became a rogue". However, a DM can successfully run a module without even that.
For some people, backstory elements are a campaign necessity! This person may be running a more social-heavy version of ToA, in which case needing complex character could be completely reasonable. Also, creating a character together can help ensure that the backstory properly fits into the campaign setting.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Panda-wat (I hate my username) is somehow convinced that he is objectively right about everything D&D related even though he obviously is not. Considering that, he'd probably make a great D&D youtuber.
"If I die, I can live with that." ~Luke Hart, the DM lair
One option is to establish a standard that players need to have a short description of their character's backstory that answers certain questions, and if they don't provide one, the character appears with total amnesia.
Alternatively, there are charts that you can roll on to build an entire character's backstory, and you could have the player randomly generate a backstory at the table.
So, there's been some great suggestions here there are some less good suggestions I might say, however.
So, 5e (or D&D in general) while incredibly popular and a system I love, is really badly constructed for learning how to DM. One of the really great joys can actually be when you discover things during play at a TTRPG. So, take FATE for example. In that system you're able as a player to discover skills and even some abilities during play. An obstacle comes up and a player has to on the fly come up with a narrative reason that their character might have that skill to add to their character. For telling of stories FATE just trounces D&D in this respect because everything is hinged on narrative. More than that GMs can actually compel players to do certain things essentially using the character's traits against them or encouraging them to utilise the character flaws to overcome a situation. Likewise, in Blades in the Dark's system you can have flashbacks that players can utilise to explain something their character had done earlier to prepare for this particular obstacle. Systems like these means that compared to a complete D&D character sheet you're going in with only the bare skeleton and the majority of the storytelling happens in play. I feel like a lot of players and GMs could really benefit from branching out to explore other systems. I genuinely believe it's made me a better collaborative storyteller.
When it comes to backstory then, I would lean into the idea that maybe you're used to overpreparing. I would see this as a great opportunity to improvise or practice your improv skills. It feels a little like you've gotten used to knowing 100% what players are going to choose when it comes to level up time. This is actually counterproductive. If you continue as a DM into the future you may at some point get that unpredictable player. If you don't get used to improvisation now, you would never be able to integrate that player into your group. More than that though, you can sometimes rob yourself of the most fun moments you can have as a DM. I no longer track or ask for the list of spells that have been prepared by prepared casters because I genuinely like being surprised. One session of mine went totally off the rails that I was 100% reacting and improvising the entire scenario on the fly because the players hadn't thought to tell me that they actually wanted a shopping session. When I gave them that opportunity, they ran with an extraordinary small detail I'd thrown in and the whole planned session was thrown out in favour of a collaborative session where we were all creating something brilliant. I love when that happens because it stretches and helps me develop as a DM in just the same way that I think I've prepared an obstacle that's going to stretch my prepared caster, but they've brought a different loadout of spells than I expected when I came to the table.
In the specific circumstance you mention I would be thinking about maybe there is a trap of some kind that the new player characters have been caught up in. Maybe your remaining two players saved them. This immediately gives the PCs reason to trust each other and a reason to work together. If the area has a lot of hidden hunter's traps, then working together to get them out of this area would be beneficial for everyone.
Maybe instead the new PCs are lost. They were perhaps hunting a deer or something similar, got turned around and can't find their way out. There are loads of options like that. You can feel free to establish the relationships between those two new PCs.
Finally, I want to speak to BigLizard's comment. It is perhaps the worst suggestion I've ever heard. Yes, PCs have some level of plot armour, but death can and should be acted upon. A world without consequences makes players reckless. If they know they can't die, you end up with no stakes. No reason to care about just mindlessly running solo at a dragon to punch it. No reason to avoid the mindflayer. Legitimately, I would (and I apologise BigLizard, I can't think of a more polite way to phrase this) entirely disregard their comment. It's bad advice whatever way you consider it. Let's say that your party's Paladin is the lynchpin of the entire campaign, and they die. The quest had maybe been to restore said paladin to his rightful place on the throne, or the corrupt usurper will continue to run the kingdom into the ground (i.e., what if Simba died in the Lion King before defeating Scar?). There are still viable options. Yes, it substantially changes the campaign, but a good DM can and should be able to have planned for that. There are several options there. The Paladin maybe has sibling (the result of an affair maybe) the players can seek out to take up the quest. This allows the perfect mechanism for the new player characters to enter. Maybe, the Paladin left a written proclamation that they intended to establish a ruling council and give the kingdom democracy. The main quest still stands...defeat the usurper. And the remaining PCs are able to rally in the name of their fallen comrade. It would truly take an unprepared and inflexible DM to consider the irreversible death of a PC to derail a campaign for the worse.
Context note - I have played many other TTRPG systems than D&D and I was a professional theatre maker for over a decade on top of being a teacher. Improv these days comes fairly easily to me. For that reason, I feel hamstrung and bored by the modules and adventures that other people create. I like to develop my world around my players. It's been over a decade since I last DM'd an 'official' adventure. It is possible that my views are as a result of that and as such don't apply to the adventure, you're preparing...but I kinda doubt it as we're discussing something fundamentally that all DMs deal with. Though I have cast doubt on one person's comment, I do genuinely mean no disrespect.
You really have to be explicate with expectations with new players, but experienced players as well since they might be use to something different.
But TBH, some people are just not a good fit for this game. Some people don't get it, or don't want, or aren't able, to participate in cooperative story telling. Some people are so use to passively consuming media, video games etc, that they can't get out of that mindset and contribute the way that you are wanting them to.
If you are getting frustrated, and aren't having fun, and these are your actual friends, you should consider setting out what the game you want to run entails. In my opinion you should also be prepared to stop the game, rather than let a fictional world be a constant source of frustration between you and your real life friends.
If you’re running ToA you could consider creating a few short backstories that connect to NPC’s and they got lost in the jungle. That module has plenty of NPC’s to choose from so there should be plenty of inspiration. Plus tying backstories to the NPC’s gives you a chance to tie the new characters to the party and content they may not have discovered, win-win!
Hello I need your help. Actually, I just want to know if I'm overreacting or if my displeasure is justified. I started playing DnD with my group about 2 years ago. We are 4 players and I am the DM. We are currently playing Tomb of Annihilation. Last week 2 of my players died and unfortunately they have no option to be revived. They are currently in the middle of the jungle. In short order, the two players had to create a new character. Player B is moving and has a lot to do. I understand that too. Player A, on the other hand, was on vacation and we made an appointment to create the character. After half an hour he had to leave and so far we only have the raw character, no background story, nothing. I repeat they are in the middle of the jungle and I have no story on the character. We play once a week and I think I'll just skip the next round because I can't keep playing with two players. I understand that there are people who have more time and some who have less time, but I think I can expect to be given a suggestion and see how the new character fits into the campaign or not. Is it too much to expect me to be given a character introduction? How do you deal with it when a new character joins the ongoing campaign?
thank you for reading :)
First of all I hope it wasn’t your players that died ;)
but I would say all you need for the character in order to play is the stats, you don’t need a backstory or history for session 1 with a new character, as a DM my own players generally come to sessions 1-5 with no idea of any backstory, that all gets fleshed out over time as the players make stuff up in game.
All you need is an idea as to how they come across the new player and that can be as simple as finding, or him finding them.
If I give an example from a recent session, Cleric died in a random encounter I expected the party to breeze through. I gave the player 2 options, stay dead or the party can take your body to the city they are traveling to and find a cleric to resurrect you and in the meantime I will give you an NPC to run.
He decided to die and rolled up an orc paladin and that was all he did because it’s all he had time for by the next session. He came up with a name, we agreed a magic item he could start with and the starting gold and that was it. There was no history, no backstory nothing. I then came up with a way to introduce him to the party (bandits had him tied up in there camp nearby and the tracks to that camp where easy to find) and the party found him.
3 sessions later in game on being asked about his past the player made up that he was an ex slave gladiator, that was a great bit of back story they he created on the spot mid session.
You said yourself your in the middle of the jungle, it really doesn’t matter what the characters backstory is, right now all you need is a made up reason why he is in the jungle and that can be anything that gets him into the party and can have no relevance on anything in the future ever.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Hello I need your help. Actually, I just want to know if I'm overreacting or if my displeasure is justified.
I started playing DnD with my group about 2 years ago. We are 4 players and I am the DM. We are currently playing Tomb of Annihilation. Last week 2 of my players died and unfortunately they have no option to be revived. They are currently in the middle of the jungle.
In short order, the two players had to create a new character. Player B is moving and has a lot to do. I understand that too. Player A, on the other hand, was on vacation and we made an appointment to create the character. After half an hour he had to leave and so far we only have the raw character, no background story, nothing. I repeat they are in the middle of the jungle and I have no story on the character. We play once a week and I think I'll just skip the next round because I can't keep playing with two players. I understand that there are people who have more time and some who have less time, but I think I can expect to be given a suggestion and see how the new character fits into the campaign or not.
Is it too much to expect me to be given a character introduction? How do you deal with it when a new character joins the ongoing campaign?
thank you for reading :)
First of all, consider whether your players still have time to play the game. D&D takes time, and sometimes you discover that you don't have the time, but still want to try to play the game to be polite. In this case, you should take initiative and ask your players if they are still up to play the game. If they aren't, be understanding that it's nothing personal.
If one or both of your players feels like continuing and has sufficient time to do so, introducing new characters isn't nearly as hard as it may seem. You can flesh out complex backstories and personality later; right now, a simple backstory and some basic traits is all you need. Since you're in a wilderness setting, teaming up with other travelers for safety in numbers is a good enough in-game reason to add the new characters in. In the end of the day, playing the game is more important than introducing new characters in a way that makes perfect narrative sense.
Panda-wat (I hate my username) is somehow convinced that he is objectively right about everything D&D related even though he obviously is not. Considering that, he'd probably make a great D&D youtuber.
"If I die, I can live with that." ~Luke Hart, the DM lair
I think you've done as much as you can: you should've explained the kind of game you're running and it's one that requires a backstory and a means of the player joining in at a time of their choosing. Maybe they're so burnt out by their character dying they'd rather not play this campaign again. Ask them if they want to play, and let them explain themselves fully because they may want to say 'no' without causing offence or upset. Make it clear this isn't a diplomatic attempt to remove them from the table: it's a genuine question, that you want them at the table but they need to work with you because that's what the game is required to run things. And if they can't talk with you about a character that fits your game, and there's not enough room for compromise, they've got to be the adult, acknowledge their time is valuable, and find somewhere else to spend it.
I'm a backstory-minimal player but I don't expect every game to be backstory-minimal. If I join a game where I'm expected to do the Xanathar's Guide to Everything origins tables, I would treat that with respect and either leave, thanking the DM for their time but this isn't for me, or going ahead with it. What I don't do is stonewall them by refusing to come up with a reason to be a part of their game. If I have no desire to do what is agreed upon by everyone else to be a sound idea, why would I remain in that group?
It's not nice to say or be told "maybe this isn't the table for you," but it is a necessity at times. It saves everyone time, and when you're at the point that player might open up about what the problem is.
I hope that helps. I wish you luck!
Zero is the most important number in D&D: Session Zero sets the boundaries and the tone; Rule Zero dictates the Dungeon Master (DM) is the final arbiter; and Zero D&D is better than Bad D&D.
"Let us speak plainly now, and in earnest, for words mean little without the weight of conviction."
- The Assemblage of Houses, World of Warcraft
Thank you for your answers. I think the two still want to play. Mainly because player A has made it clear that he wants to become a better player (take notes and pay more attention). Maybe I'm expecting too much? My problem is that I can't plan and prepare any further. But maybe I should just let it be and start our round as usual? For me personally the story is very important but maybe Panda_wat is right and it's more important to play the game at the moment.
If you have a player that wants to get better and is trying to improve their play style by listening more intently and taking notes, you would have to be bonkers to let that go because their backstory is not fleshed out yet. The player wants to play so the PC will fit the story once they get around to dressing it up. Plan another appointment to wrap up the character creation then play.
I personally love a good backstory but I have also more recently fallen in love with a fairly empty backstory. They allow a lot of room to fill in those gaps during play. I encourage you to review this thread. Full backstories are not necessary to play full games.
DM mostly, Player occasionally | Session 0 form | He/Him/They/Them
EXTENDED SIGNATURE!
Doctor/Published Scholar/Science and Healthcare Advocate/Critter/Trekkie/Gandalf with a Glock
Try DDB free: Free Rules (2024), premade PCs, adventures, one shots, encounters, SC, homebrew, more
Answers: physical books, purchases, and subbing.
Check out my life-changing
I only require the barest minimum of information from my players regarding their characters’ backstories. If they can tell me 1) any one thing about their character’s home life; 2) any one event in their character’s past; and 3) how/why they became an adventurer; that’s all I require. If they can sum that up in a few sentences that’s good enough for me. If they are starting g at a slightly higher level (5+) I may ask for another couple sentences about their early adventuring career, but that’s all. If your player can give you at least a little bit about their character that should be enough to at least get you started.
Back in 2e when I started, it was generally considered to be up to the DM to come up with plausible reasons for the PCs to all be together in the same place. (That’s why so many adventuring groups all started out in a tavern.) If your player can give you a little info, I’m sure you can come up with some excuse for them to be in that jungle, even if it’s just that their previous party all died in that same jungle somehow while they were on an adventure of their own.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Since you’re playing ToA background is fairly easy really. You have a brief background from the L1 creation that just has to explain how you got started in your class and chose to adventure. Then everything else is similar to what the party did except their old team got hit by wandering monsters while trying to recover from something and they were the sole survivor(s). Have the 2 characters know each other a bit as they were in the same party and it’s easy to fit them in/add them to the others.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
If you're running a module campaign, does backstory *really* matter? In my experience, working character backstories into pre-made modules requires a huge amount of time and hassle that may not be merited. You can play in a module with no more than, "My dude is an explorer/adventurer and he stumbled across this creepy place." Maybe see if your players even really care about backstory.
Trust me...if I'm running my own campaign, I want backstories and I will work hard to bring those in where possible. And some people don't need to be involved deeply to enjoy playing. And those folks can just play along and if they eventually get inspired, we'll start working with that.
I agree with most of the comments of the other posters in the thread. You don't actually need any background at all to slot in a couple of new characters. From a DM perspective, you actually don't need to know anything at all about the two new characters to plan and prepare further, especially with an adventure like ToA. ToA is a sandbox. Anyone joining this quest will likely be motivated to end the death curse for some reason.
The party might encounter someone else in the jungle by happenstance but there is little to no chance that random strangers are going to join a couple of randomly encountered adventurers on a quest to "save the world" unless that is also their motivation.
If you want a backstory that accounts for it and integrates into your ongoing plot - all you need to do is have the two new characters be survivors of another party perhaps defeated by the same opponent who killed the two members of the party. They were stuck in the jungle without a guide and were either hiding or trying to make their way back to civilization. They encounter the surviving members of the party and the players can role play that however they choose. However, when the characters discover that they have the same ultimate goal that provides a foundation to bind the party together and they can move forward to the objective together.
Losing characters in the tomb might be more challenging except the module actually includes instructions on likely places where the new characters could be added to a party exploring the tomb. (Depending on the players and respective characters the tomb can be far more deadly than any other part of the module).
Finally, incorporating adventure tie-ins to character backgrounds can be a fun and enjoyable addition to a game but they aren't the point of the game unless the DM has designed the plot line entirely around the character background (which can often be a bad idea since depending on how it is done, one character can become the focus for a large part of the campaign as it goes through some long and involved background arc, leaving the rest of the players feeling ignored and out of the spotlight). A campaign with some cool background tie-ins but an overall plot independent of character background often works out better all around.
----
Anyway, in this case, real life is an important consideration. One player is moving, the other on vacation. Both or either may have work, spouse, children and other commitments to deal with so they have limited time to invest in creating a detailed character that honestly is nice but not required especially for a hardcover module like ToA. I'd suggest getting them to rough out the class/race/level/interests of the character and if you need more background details latter you can work together with the players to fill it in as you go along. Focus on having fun playing and don't sweat too many details.
“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime.” - Mark Twain - Innocents Abroad
Hello and thanks again for the replies :)
I realized that I didn't express myself properly. By background I don't mean I want to know what the character likes to eat and what size boots they have. It would be important to me where the character comes from and what makes him special.
Like "This is Gimli, he's a dwarven warrior and loves his axe. He has a dislike for orcs (maybe why he doesn't like orcs). He was setting up camp in the forest when he heard the fight and was helping the group "
In addition, a rough description of his appearance or just a picture.
But what I have at the moment with player a is:
"This is __________ he is a Lizardfolk and Cleric"
I don't even have the spells or anything. I need it because I have to create the character in a program.
I've now left it open to players without characters to take characters I created, which they can swap out after this round until their characters are complete. Or if we postpone the round.
I'm a bit confused and I don't want this to sound negative but ..
You got together with player A to create a character and spent 30 minutes on it and all you have is "He is a Lizardfolk Cleric"? 30 minutes should be more than enough time to have a much more fleshed out character than that. In addition, with a module like ToA, there are some very obvious backstory elements that would tie all characters trying to overcome the death curse that are very obvious choices for a plot element to introduce new characters.
What ideas did player A have coming to the character creation session? Was the Lizardfolk Cleric their choice?
"It would be important to me where the character comes from and what makes him special."
Why is the above information important to you? How would it impact running a module like ToA? I've played ToA with some DMsGuild content added to flesh it out and although it could be flavored with character background elements, it isn't essential. Where the character comes from, why they are there (other than defeating the death curse), or even what made them become an adventurer or what makes them "special" are details that can be sorted out later if ever. They generally aren't essential. I've had players with detailed backgrounds and others with one sentence backgrounds "I was an urchin, grew up in a big city, turned to thievery to survive, became a rogue". However, a DM can successfully run a module without even that.
Also, I was wondering what program you have to use to create the character sheet? In most games I have played or run, the players take care of managing and maintaining their own character sheet whether it is on paper, on D&D Beyond or Roll20, even the fillable pdf character sheets. I'm not sure what your set up might be but if possible you could just let the player create the new character they want to play and send you the details.
For some people, backstory elements are a campaign necessity! This person may be running a more social-heavy version of ToA, in which case needing complex character could be completely reasonable. Also, creating a character together can help ensure that the backstory properly fits into the campaign setting.
Panda-wat (I hate my username) is somehow convinced that he is objectively right about everything D&D related even though he obviously is not. Considering that, he'd probably make a great D&D youtuber.
"If I die, I can live with that." ~Luke Hart, the DM lair
One option is to establish a standard that players need to have a short description of their character's backstory that answers certain questions, and if they don't provide one, the character appears with total amnesia.
Alternatively, there are charts that you can roll on to build an entire character's backstory, and you could have the player randomly generate a backstory at the table.
So, there's been some great suggestions here there are some less good suggestions I might say, however.
So, 5e (or D&D in general) while incredibly popular and a system I love, is really badly constructed for learning how to DM. One of the really great joys can actually be when you discover things during play at a TTRPG. So, take FATE for example. In that system you're able as a player to discover skills and even some abilities during play. An obstacle comes up and a player has to on the fly come up with a narrative reason that their character might have that skill to add to their character. For telling of stories FATE just trounces D&D in this respect because everything is hinged on narrative. More than that GMs can actually compel players to do certain things essentially using the character's traits against them or encouraging them to utilise the character flaws to overcome a situation. Likewise, in Blades in the Dark's system you can have flashbacks that players can utilise to explain something their character had done earlier to prepare for this particular obstacle. Systems like these means that compared to a complete D&D character sheet you're going in with only the bare skeleton and the majority of the storytelling happens in play. I feel like a lot of players and GMs could really benefit from branching out to explore other systems. I genuinely believe it's made me a better collaborative storyteller.
When it comes to backstory then, I would lean into the idea that maybe you're used to overpreparing. I would see this as a great opportunity to improvise or practice your improv skills. It feels a little like you've gotten used to knowing 100% what players are going to choose when it comes to level up time. This is actually counterproductive. If you continue as a DM into the future you may at some point get that unpredictable player. If you don't get used to improvisation now, you would never be able to integrate that player into your group. More than that though, you can sometimes rob yourself of the most fun moments you can have as a DM. I no longer track or ask for the list of spells that have been prepared by prepared casters because I genuinely like being surprised. One session of mine went totally off the rails that I was 100% reacting and improvising the entire scenario on the fly because the players hadn't thought to tell me that they actually wanted a shopping session. When I gave them that opportunity, they ran with an extraordinary small detail I'd thrown in and the whole planned session was thrown out in favour of a collaborative session where we were all creating something brilliant. I love when that happens because it stretches and helps me develop as a DM in just the same way that I think I've prepared an obstacle that's going to stretch my prepared caster, but they've brought a different loadout of spells than I expected when I came to the table.
In the specific circumstance you mention I would be thinking about maybe there is a trap of some kind that the new player characters have been caught up in. Maybe your remaining two players saved them. This immediately gives the PCs reason to trust each other and a reason to work together. If the area has a lot of hidden hunter's traps, then working together to get them out of this area would be beneficial for everyone.
Maybe instead the new PCs are lost. They were perhaps hunting a deer or something similar, got turned around and can't find their way out. There are loads of options like that. You can feel free to establish the relationships between those two new PCs.
Finally, I want to speak to BigLizard's comment. It is perhaps the worst suggestion I've ever heard. Yes, PCs have some level of plot armour, but death can and should be acted upon. A world without consequences makes players reckless. If they know they can't die, you end up with no stakes. No reason to care about just mindlessly running solo at a dragon to punch it. No reason to avoid the mindflayer. Legitimately, I would (and I apologise BigLizard, I can't think of a more polite way to phrase this) entirely disregard their comment. It's bad advice whatever way you consider it. Let's say that your party's Paladin is the lynchpin of the entire campaign, and they die. The quest had maybe been to restore said paladin to his rightful place on the throne, or the corrupt usurper will continue to run the kingdom into the ground (i.e., what if Simba died in the Lion King before defeating Scar?). There are still viable options. Yes, it substantially changes the campaign, but a good DM can and should be able to have planned for that. There are several options there. The Paladin maybe has sibling (the result of an affair maybe) the players can seek out to take up the quest. This allows the perfect mechanism for the new player characters to enter. Maybe, the Paladin left a written proclamation that they intended to establish a ruling council and give the kingdom democracy. The main quest still stands...defeat the usurper. And the remaining PCs are able to rally in the name of their fallen comrade. It would truly take an unprepared and inflexible DM to consider the irreversible death of a PC to derail a campaign for the worse.
Context note - I have played many other TTRPG systems than D&D and I was a professional theatre maker for over a decade on top of being a teacher. Improv these days comes fairly easily to me. For that reason, I feel hamstrung and bored by the modules and adventures that other people create. I like to develop my world around my players. It's been over a decade since I last DM'd an 'official' adventure. It is possible that my views are as a result of that and as such don't apply to the adventure, you're preparing...but I kinda doubt it as we're discussing something fundamentally that all DMs deal with. Though I have cast doubt on one person's comment, I do genuinely mean no disrespect.
DM session planning template - My version of maps for 'Lost Mine of Phandelver' - Send your party to The Circus - Other DM Resources - Maps, Tokens, Quests - 'Better' Player Character Injury Tables?
Actor, Writer, Director & Teacher by day - GM/DM in my off hours.
You really have to be explicate with expectations with new players, but experienced players as well since they might be use to something different.
But TBH, some people are just not a good fit for this game.
Some people don't get it, or don't want, or aren't able, to participate in cooperative story telling. Some people are so use to passively consuming media, video games etc, that they can't get out of that mindset and contribute the way that you are wanting them to.
If you are getting frustrated, and aren't having fun, and these are your actual friends, you should consider setting out what the game you want to run entails. In my opinion you should also be prepared to stop the game, rather than let a fictional world be a constant source of frustration between you and your real life friends.
If you’re running ToA you could consider creating a few short backstories that connect to NPC’s and they got lost in the jungle. That module has plenty of NPC’s to choose from so there should be plenty of inspiration. Plus tying backstories to the NPC’s gives you a chance to tie the new characters to the party and content they may not have discovered, win-win!
First of all I hope it wasn’t your players that died ;)
but I would say all you need for the character in order to play is the stats, you don’t need a backstory or history for session 1 with a new character, as a DM my own players generally come to sessions 1-5 with no idea of any backstory, that all gets fleshed out over time as the players make stuff up in game.
All you need is an idea as to how they come across the new player and that can be as simple as finding, or him finding them.
If I give an example from a recent session, Cleric died in a random encounter I expected the party to breeze through. I gave the player 2 options, stay dead or the party can take your body to the city they are traveling to and find a cleric to resurrect you and in the meantime I will give you an NPC to run.
He decided to die and rolled up an orc paladin and that was all he did because it’s all he had time for by the next session. He came up with a name, we agreed a magic item he could start with and the starting gold and that was it. There was no history, no backstory nothing. I then came up with a way to introduce him to the party (bandits had him tied up in there camp nearby and the tracks to that camp where easy to find) and the party found him.
3 sessions later in game on being asked about his past the player made up that he was an ex slave gladiator, that was a great bit of back story they he created on the spot mid session.
You said yourself your in the middle of the jungle, it really doesn’t matter what the characters backstory is, right now all you need is a made up reason why he is in the jungle and that can be anything that gets him into the party and can have no relevance on anything in the future ever.