I did disengage each one once for self preservation purposes (to avoid the AC23 Paladin and the AC20 Berzerker who were doing massive amounts of damage) and to get into a better position.
I think I see the source of some problems...that's about two points higher than I'd really expect at that level.
Yeah, if the Monsters need to hit ACs that high, then you also need to give the monsters a comparable boost to their Attack Modifiers too.
He’s also authored a book with the same title. So far, he’s given me some useful strategies on how my npcs should approach an encounter. Maybe you’ll find it helpful.
So, given that the party apparently has high stats (the berserker has at least two 16s and I'm guessing has a good strength as well) and over-level gear (a +2 shield is a Very Rare) I'd probably treat them as level 10-11.
Imma say give your baddies a mage of some sort that can play against the martial characters, as I like to do, create encounters that let your characters strengths shine and let their flaws hold them back, I enjoy making a character with decent strength ( I am not a power gamer ), but a crippling weakness ( PTSD, etc. ) and I immensely enjoy playing them, but that's just my opinion, I don't know if anybody feels the same
I have run into this problem and managed to solve it in one session. My answer `traps` and deadly ones at that one party death later they started being more careful. Most intelligent enemies can make traps that are more deadly than they could ever be. Also get creative with your encounters, Army of drow don't bother, 1 drow riding a purple worm digging out the earth out from underneath the players. fall damage every turn baby. They soon learnt that the environment is the real final boss. There are other things you can do with the environment one flame elemental + one forest = players running for their lives as the fire spreads ever closer to them and waiting at the edge of the forest a row of archers lying in wait so they get surprise attack. Get creative remember that the world isn't static like a PC game. No reason you can't have a red dragon stoking a volcano till it erupts and lava hurts. Have a flying creature? don't bother with attacks grapple them and drag them into the sky. Fall damage is a *****. Water creature? give it the intelligence of an Orca so the try and drown their prey. Also make a few enemies using a character sheet. you're party vs a bunch of level 4-5 barbarians is going to hurt. Wizard necromancer hiding behind an army of skeletons. As they try to deal with the skeletons surrounding them the wizard can lay out some pain with a few fireballs. Players climbing a rope? goblin appears at the top of the rope and starts cutting it. Players taking shelter in a house? Giant smashes it in everyone make a dex save or be pinned under the rubble. Look for enemies that you can apply some creativity to. Im my world at the moment Ghouls are vicious mindless predators calling the rest of the pack when they spot a potential meal. For instance you're players see two or three Ghouls feasting on some rotting carcass. you're party attacks one of the Ghouls lets out an ear piercing scream. One turn later 3 more come out of the darkness, next turn another 5, they kill one? the pack screams again and another 10 show up looking for there dinner, they start to surround the party screaming calling more of the pack to them. Also remember status effects, give you party a reason to make themselves exhausted. Then lay the beat down. Stuff with curses are good to specters reduce max HP till the next long rest. A creature that has something like ram or gore that can push people 10 feet. have them smash a player into spikes, walls, trees therefore increasing the damage. Players taking of too much HP in one go? let them face a bunch of regenerating trolls. Basically go through monsters till you find stuff you can play with
Home brew. If they are destroying everything you send against them it's time to create a few monsters that target their weaknesses. High AC, high attack bonuses, resistances or immunities to certain damages. For spell casters put them on flying mounts and make their DCs high when it comes to Wisdom saving throws. Monsters that have advantage on certain saving throws are good and a sorcerer with Heighten can force disadvantage on the Paladin. Home-brew some nasty traps with high DCs so your rogue can't always disable them. Magical traps are harder to disable.
There are a lot of things you can do. I once downed my berserker barbarian with poisoned spores. If all else fails, add hit points on the fly. Waves can be good if your party isn't expecting them. I've had my party fight off groups of critters before sending an aboleth or mind flayer after them when they are down hit points.
Honestly I just don't care if the encounters are challenging. That may be one.way to have fun, but there are other parts of the game that I as a DM and as a Player enjoy way more such as, the Story presented in the module, the characters development, the fantasy of the story, etc. I mean if you want to make.hard encounters balance the action economy so there is at least one monster.action per PC action or.more, and I mean match it.attack for.attack here.bit.this gets in my mind.old fast because the encounters just get to taking really long. If you want challenges go back to 1-2 edition with all the save or die mechanics starting pretty much at 1st level where poison was instant death and remained.through out the game. Personally I don't find that fun, and fully understand the move away from it, but it was by far D and D at the most challenging.
Increasing the hit points of the monsters you fight will make them last longer and give them more time to damage to the party.
The suggested challenge rating system doesn't work well. My party of level five characters slayed a level ten dragon without ever dropping to 0 hp. Feel free to use monsters that are much higher in level than you think they could fight.
Increasing the hit points of the monsters you fight will make them last longer and give them more time to damage to the party.
The suggested challenge rating system doesn't work well. My party of level five characters slayed a level ten dragon without ever dropping to 0 hp. Feel free to use monsters that are much higher in level than you think they could fight.
I always have to ask when I see this, was the dragon just standing there? So many people forget to use a dragon’s movement speeds, in particular flying, but a burrow or swim speed also can really change a fight. Because, if I’m a dragon, first thing I’m going to do, after I breathe on the party, is fly up away from the raging barbarian and smiting paladin, then focus on that wizard in the back who may have earthbind.
Increasing the hit points of the monsters you fight will make them last longer and give them more time to damage to the party.
The suggested challenge rating system doesn't work well. My party of level five characters slayed a level ten dragon without ever dropping to 0 hp. Feel free to use monsters that are much higher in level than you think they could fight.
I always have to ask when I see this, was the dragon just standing there? So many people forget to use a dragon’s movement speeds, in particular flying, but a burrow or swim speed also can really change a fight. Because, if I’m a dragon, first thing I’m going to do, after I breathe on the party, is fly up away from the raging barbarian and smiting paladin, then focus on that wizard in the back who may have earthbind.
Actually, the dragon was just standing there, but it wasn't the DM's fault. Our druid summoned a giant tentacle (that thing shouldn't be a beast) and was able to grapple the dragon with it, holding it in one place. If that dragon was able to fly we would have had a much harder time taking care of it but we were able to lock it down in one place.
Increasing the hit points of the monsters you fight will make them last longer and give them more time to damage to the party.
The suggested challenge rating system doesn't work well. My party of level five characters slayed a level ten dragon without ever dropping to 0 hp. Feel free to use monsters that are much higher in level than you think they could fight.
I always have to ask when I see this, was the dragon just standing there? So many people forget to use a dragon’s movement speeds, in particular flying, but a burrow or swim speed also can really change a fight. Because, if I’m a dragon, first thing I’m going to do, after I breathe on the party, is fly up away from the raging barbarian and smiting paladin, then focus on that wizard in the back who may have earthbind.
Actually, the dragon was just standing there, but it wasn't the DM's fault. Our druid summoned a giant tentacle (that thing shouldn't be a beast) and was able to grapple the dragon with it, holding it in one place. If that dragon was able to fly we would have had a much harder time taking care of it but we were able to lock it down in one place.
Ahhh, that makes sense. But that actually really highlights the big issue with CR. Your party had the right tool for the job. Another party could have had a much harder time. There’s no way, when the designers assign CR to a monster, for them to know who’s going to have what available in the fight.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Yeah, if the Monsters need to hit ACs that high, then you also need to give the monsters a comparable boost to their Attack Modifiers too.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Paladin - Plate (18), fighting style Armoured Bonus, +2 shield = 23AC
Berzerker +2 shield, +3 Dex bonus, +3 unarmed defence = 20AC
The Vamp was CR13
I used to run into a lot of the same problems before I started using this as a resource: https://www.themonstersknow.com
He’s also authored a book with the same title. So far, he’s given me some useful strategies on how my npcs should approach an encounter. Maybe you’ll find it helpful.
So, given that the party apparently has high stats (the berserker has at least two 16s and I'm guessing has a good strength as well) and over-level gear (a +2 shield is a Very Rare) I'd probably treat them as level 10-11.
Imma say give your baddies a mage of some sort that can play against the martial characters, as I like to do, create encounters that let your characters strengths shine and let their flaws hold them back, I enjoy making a character with decent strength ( I am not a power gamer ), but a crippling weakness ( PTSD, etc. ) and I immensely enjoy playing them, but that's just my opinion, I don't know if anybody feels the same
Mystic v3 should be official, nuff said.
I have run into this problem and managed to solve it in one session. My answer `traps` and deadly ones at that one party death later they started being more careful. Most intelligent enemies can make traps that are more deadly than they could ever be. Also get creative with your encounters, Army of drow don't bother, 1 drow riding a purple worm digging out the earth out from underneath the players. fall damage every turn baby. They soon learnt that the environment is the real final boss. There are other things you can do with the environment one flame elemental + one forest = players running for their lives as the fire spreads ever closer to them and waiting at the edge of the forest a row of archers lying in wait so they get surprise attack. Get creative remember that the world isn't static like a PC game. No reason you can't have a red dragon stoking a volcano till it erupts and lava hurts. Have a flying creature? don't bother with attacks grapple them and drag them into the sky. Fall damage is a *****. Water creature? give it the intelligence of an Orca so the try and drown their prey. Also make a few enemies using a character sheet. you're party vs a bunch of level 4-5 barbarians is going to hurt. Wizard necromancer hiding behind an army of skeletons. As they try to deal with the skeletons surrounding them the wizard can lay out some pain with a few fireballs. Players climbing a rope? goblin appears at the top of the rope and starts cutting it. Players taking shelter in a house? Giant smashes it in everyone make a dex save or be pinned under the rubble. Look for enemies that you can apply some creativity to. Im my world at the moment Ghouls are vicious mindless predators calling the rest of the pack when they spot a potential meal. For instance you're players see two or three Ghouls feasting on some rotting carcass. you're party attacks one of the Ghouls lets out an ear piercing scream. One turn later 3 more come out of the darkness, next turn another 5, they kill one? the pack screams again and another 10 show up looking for there dinner, they start to surround the party screaming calling more of the pack to them. Also remember status effects, give you party a reason to make themselves exhausted. Then lay the beat down. Stuff with curses are good to specters reduce max HP till the next long rest. A creature that has something like ram or gore that can push people 10 feet. have them smash a player into spikes, walls, trees therefore increasing the damage. Players taking of too much HP in one go? let them face a bunch of regenerating trolls. Basically go through monsters till you find stuff you can play with
Home brew. If they are destroying everything you send against them it's time to create a few monsters that target their weaknesses. High AC, high attack bonuses, resistances or immunities to certain damages. For spell casters put them on flying mounts and make their DCs high when it comes to Wisdom saving throws. Monsters that have advantage on certain saving throws are good and a sorcerer with Heighten can force disadvantage on the Paladin. Home-brew some nasty traps with high DCs so your rogue can't always disable them. Magical traps are harder to disable.
There are a lot of things you can do. I once downed my berserker barbarian with poisoned spores. If all else fails, add hit points on the fly. Waves can be good if your party isn't expecting them. I've had my party fight off groups of critters before sending an aboleth or mind flayer after them when they are down hit points.
Honestly I just don't care if the encounters are challenging. That may be one.way to have fun, but there are other parts of the game that I as a DM and as a Player enjoy way more such as, the Story presented in the module, the characters development, the fantasy of the story, etc. I mean if you want to make.hard encounters balance the action economy so there is at least one monster.action per PC action or.more, and I mean match it.attack for.attack here.bit.this gets in my mind.old fast because the encounters just get to taking really long. If you want challenges go back to 1-2 edition with all the save or die mechanics starting pretty much at 1st level where poison was instant death and remained.through out the game. Personally I don't find that fun, and fully understand the move away from it, but it was by far D and D at the most challenging.
Increasing the hit points of the monsters you fight will make them last longer and give them more time to damage to the party.
The suggested challenge rating system doesn't work well. My party of level five characters slayed a level ten dragon without ever dropping to 0 hp. Feel free to use monsters that are much higher in level than you think they could fight.
I always have to ask when I see this, was the dragon just standing there? So many people forget to use a dragon’s movement speeds, in particular flying, but a burrow or swim speed also can really change a fight.
Because, if I’m a dragon, first thing I’m going to do, after I breathe on the party, is fly up away from the raging barbarian and smiting paladin, then focus on that wizard in the back who may have earthbind.
Actually, the dragon was just standing there, but it wasn't the DM's fault. Our druid summoned a giant tentacle (that thing shouldn't be a beast) and was able to grapple the dragon with it, holding it in one place. If that dragon was able to fly we would have had a much harder time taking care of it but we were able to lock it down in one place.
Ahhh, that makes sense.
But that actually really highlights the big issue with CR. Your party had the right tool for the job. Another party could have had a much harder time. There’s no way, when the designers assign CR to a monster, for them to know who’s going to have what available in the fight.