Quote from InkedBee >>

(@DM, The effect of Sanctuary is still active. Perhaps, you can ban that spell for future games?)

 

 

 

Or maybe I should just keep notes.  My issue in this format is I'm never in one place, so unless I see something here, switch to a note app then come back here, or lose the info.  This is not a real hurdle, it just requires some discipline that I have not exercised at all.  

 

In person, I always have paper, I'm sitting down, the book stays with the dice, the paper and rhe dice are the game.  On my oh8 e in pbp, it's just like a conversation with dice, but with the extra laziness motivator - in theory I can go hack and look up anything - there's even a search function.  However, with no indexing, it's really more or a theoretical matter generally speaking.  The thing about a conditional like Sanctuary is that I don't actively see I have to look for it, it's just on.  With a map I csn add a color ring, thst tells me to look for something.  In TotM I lose that.  

 

There are many spells thet generally make the game worse in terms of play, but are thematically potent, so they actually have value.  The trouble kind of creeps up with the fact that magic in 5e is free cast.  In 3.5 you would never be a le to spam Sanctuary, because you would have had to prepare each instance of it in the morning, and you only get so many it wouldn't make sense.  In 5e you kind of always have the option once levels grow because you never commit to instances of spells cast in a day but rather just the list of spells.  This issue is somewhat amplified by the fact that most classes can cast in some form now and cantrips are free.  So when just the squishy mage gets doused in Sanctuary, he has to choose to be glass or cannon - but he can certainly still play support or control roles, ir just adds a layer of texture and tactics rhat seems thematically appropriate.  Also good if you wanted to protect an NPC with 9 hp so she can craft the epic magic item without dying.  Now if you have people cast it and then they csn still serve their primary function that makes it well suited to them, like a cleric on self, then they can still do support - or cast on a rogue to allow them to sneak to point Z to do something skillful.  There are plenty of good reasons for the spell to exist, but... if its just a "NOPE!" that deteriorates fun. Counterapell same thing, it's too gamey for me, like Magic - a set kf interlocking overlapping convoluted rules.  The point if dice in DnD in theory is to determine the outcome of an uncertain event.  So if I'm attacking you and there is uncertainty there, the dice determine if that attack succeeds or fails.  "But wait... first roll these other dice to see if you get to roll those dice" breaks the pattern.  It's why 4e combat never really worked.  3.5 was complex, but consistent in the general instance of modifiers which 5e rejects outright, by design, under the banner of "bounded accuracy" meaning where modifiers do exist they either do a lot or a little based on where the base number sat, when jts in the middle 70%, it makes almost no difference.  The concept of advantage disadvantage was supposed to simplify things as a choice, but spells like Sanctuary and silvery Barbs aren't just more complicated, theyre pattern breaking but also readily available.  Something that breaks the pattern of game play should not be first level.  If it was me writing the thing, I'd have made Sanctuary a DA to hit and a buff to AC.  The person buffed is responsible for their own AC, takes that off the DM, and if the DM rolls an attack and forgets its up, rolling the DA dice isn't much fuss.  The bit where they get to keep the attack if they fail the DC check is the convoluted and complicated part.  I think it's there so the spell isn't "too good" - someone in the part probably will still get hit unless you tactically use it and that's game value so enjoyable- but it just means that a failure to observe it means a retcon and that breaks up the flow of combat and means the DM should really try not to mess it up.  So basically, it's worse than most spells I'm terms of what it does to the game play, but IFF the attacker screws up.  I also think it would be a lame move for the DM to use it in general.  The balance is such that the challenge in theory is x number if PCs vs whatever monsters are in the battle, but if there's just 1 monster and its got Sanctuary on it, somehow, then a significant portion of the acrion economy of the party is lost since there are no other targets for them to attack.  If the monster csn summon minions as an s run, that's really bad since that won't break Sanctuary, but now it's dealing damage, controlling the battlefield, and forcibly enameling the while party by orienting them from tactically focusing attacks on a single optimal target- it would both dilute agency and efficacy.  So I guess ultimately I have sort if soft banned it and some other spells from DM use- but that s easy because u csn always just instantly change my mind about it.  Like when I just declared a ban in Mirror and linked Glyph wall of force that extends probably only to this battle, but It will effectively be in firce since whenever I decide ro use either again, I'll be thinking about whether or not I should, more or less reexamining the existing ban and possibly deciding to overturn it.

 

Quote from Wile_E_Coyote >>

Quote from InkedBee >>

(@DM, The effect of Sanctuary is still active. Perhaps, you can ban that spell for future games?)

 

 

 

Or maybe I should just keep notes.  My issue in this format is I'm never in one place, so unless I see something here, switch to a note app then come back here, or lose the info.  This is not a real hurdle, it just requires some discipline that I have not exercised at all.  

 

In person, I always have paper, I'm sitting down, the book stays with the dice, the paper and rhe dice are the game.  On my oh8 e in pbp, it's just like a conversation with dice, but with the extra laziness motivator - in theory I can go hack and look up anything - there's even a search function.  However, with no indexing, it's really more or a theoretical matter generally speaking.  The thing about a conditional like Sanctuary is that I don't actively see I have to look for it, it's just on.  With a map I csn add a color ring, thst tells me to look for something.  In TotM I lose that.  

 

There are many spells thet generally make the game worse in terms of play, but are thematically potent, so they actually have value.  The trouble kind of creeps up with the fact that magic in 5e is free cast.  In 3.5 you would never be a le to spam Sanctuary, because you would have had to prepare each instance of it in the morning, and you only get so many it wouldn't make sense.  In 5e you kind of always have the option once levels grow because you never commit to instances of spells cast in a day but rather just the list of spells.  This issue is somewhat amplified by the fact that most classes can cast in some form now and cantrips are free.  So when just the squishy mage gets doused in Sanctuary, he has to choose to be glass or cannon - but he can certainly still play support or control roles, ir just adds a layer of texture and tactics rhat seems thematically appropriate.  Also good if you wanted to protect an NPC with 9 hp so she can craft the epic magic item without dying.  Now if you have people cast it and then they csn still serve their primary function that makes it well suited to them, like a cleric on self, then they can still do support - or cast on a rogue to allow them to sneak to point Z to do something skillful.  There are plenty of good reasons for the spell to exist, but... if its just a "NOPE!" that deteriorates fun. Counterapell same thing, it's too gamey for me, like Magic - a set kf interlocking overlapping convoluted rules.  The point if dice in DnD in theory is to determine the outcome of an uncertain event.  So if I'm attacking you and there is uncertainty there, the dice determine if that attack succeeds or fails.  "But wait... first roll these other dice to see if you get to roll those dice" breaks the pattern.  It's why 4e combat never really worked.  3.5 was complex, but consistent in the general instance of modifiers which 5e rejects outright, by design, under the banner of "bounded accuracy" meaning where modifiers do exist they either do a lot or a little based on where the base number sat, when jts in the middle 70%, it makes almost no difference.  The concept of advantage disadvantage was supposed to simplify things as a choice, but spells like Sanctuary and silvery Barbs aren't just more complicated, theyre pattern breaking but also readily available.  Something that breaks the pattern of game play should not be first level.  If it was me writing the thing, I'd have made Sanctuary a DA to hit and a buff to AC.  The person buffed is responsible for their own AC, takes that off the DM, and if the DM rolls an attack and forgets its up, rolling the DA dice isn't much fuss.  The bit where they get to keep the attack if they fail the DC check is the convoluted and complicated part.  I think it's there so the spell isn't "too good" - someone in the part probably will still get hit unless you tactically use it and that's game value so enjoyable- but it just means that a failure to observe it means a retcon and that breaks up the flow of combat and means the DM should really try not to mess it up.  So basically, it's worse than most spells I'm terms of what it does to the game play, but IFF the attacker screws up.  I also think it would be a lame move for the DM to use it in general.  The balance is such that the challenge in theory is x number if PCs vs whatever monsters are in the battle, but if there's just 1 monster and its got Sanctuary on it, somehow, then a significant portion of the acrion economy of the party is lost since there are no other targets for them to attack.  If the monster csn summon minions as an s run, that's really bad since that won't break Sanctuary, but now it's dealing damage, controlling the battlefield, and forcibly enameling the while party by orienting them from tactically focusing attacks on a single optimal target- it would both dilute agency and efficacy.  So I guess ultimately I have sort if soft banned it and some other spells from DM use- but that s easy because u csn always just instantly change my mind about it.  Like when I just declared a ban in Mirror and linked Glyph wall of force that extends probably only to this battle, but It will effectively be in firce since whenever I decide ro use either again, I'll be thinking about whether or not I should, more or less reexamining the existing ban and possibly deciding to overturn it.

 

 (Have posted my action on the last page)

(@DM, Gravity will attack in the next round, so let's not worry about the effect of Sanctuary.)

Quote from InkedBee >>

(@DM, Gravity will attack in the next round, so let's not worry about the effect of Sanctuary.)

< I am not concerned with it, just assessing it as a mechanic in an extended ooc.>

The golem let's loose its fury on Sam, gazing ferociously at the reptilian ranger before clawing, pinching and biting at the scaly behemoth.

Gaze DC16 or frightened + paralyzed (additional save attempts at end of subsequent turns)

Claw 15 for 21

Pincer 26 for 19 (would be DC19 grapple if medium or smaller, but Sam is large, so no check)

Bite 23 47 and on a hit, DC18 Wis save or become cursed for 1 minute, causing DA to attack rolls against the golem. Save repeatable at end of subsequent turns.

Quote from Wile_E_Coyote >>

Quote from InkedBee >>

(@DM, Gravity will attack in the next round, so let's not worry about the effect of Sanctuary.)

< I am not concerned with it, just assessing it as a mechanic in an extended ooc.>

The golem let's loose its fury on Sam, gazing ferociously at the reptilian ranger before clawing, pinching and biting at the scaly behemoth.

Gaze DC16 or frightened + paralyzed (additional save attempts at end of subsequent turns)

Claw 15 for 21

Pincer 26 for 19 (would be DC19 grapple if medium or smaller, but Sam is large, so no check)

Bite 23 47 and on a hit, DC18 Wis save or become cursed for 1 minute, causing DA to attack rolls against the golem. Save repeatable at end of subsequent turns.

 

 Sam is down 

Gravity casts Sanctuary on Sam, and moves near the archon to leap upwards and punch him in the face. Then she will kick him in the place where it's supposed to hurt most.

Bonus Action: [Tooltip Not Found]: Sanctuary

Action: Unarmed Strike: Attack:20 Bludgeoning Damage: 2

Attack:8 Bludgeoning Damage: 2

(Oh no! Sam!!). Tetrevess’ manifest mind will again blast the archon with cold 15 dc 19 dex for half damage

tetrevess will attempt to force the prismatic sphere at the archon. 

arcana check 11 

the sphere moves up the shaft towards tetrevess.  (I assume)

The archon shrugs off the strike to the face, while the other strike hits his armor.

Death save 18

Dex save vs cold 18

"That's really pathetic"- Gravity stares at her clenched fist with an expression of disbelief. Suddenly her youthful face lights up and she starts yelling her lungs out: "Tetrevess, I need that spherical object, the one that discharges electricity. Now!"

(Tetrevess can hit the archon with the Annihilation orb, just looking for confirmation since 'prismatic orb' description is also thr name of a spell)

Sorry I meant sphere of annihilation.   

Death save 17

“You can have the storm heart, I just have to get it to you-  what do you plan with it-.” Tetrevess says (with telepathic bond).  He’s up top still- the manifest mind is in the hole.

(Gravity is outside the prison cell too, see post 5384)

"You're kidding, aren't you? It's supposed to enhance the damage of my unarmed strikes"- Gravity replies instantaneously while waiting for the archon to punish her for using him like a puppet. "Do I directly place it inside my thoracic cavity?"

<Yeah, you can just shove it in there.  It's got a pointy bit on one side.  The shiny round portion remains externally protruding from the thorax.  Inserting it does drop one to 0 hp, though.>

“Yes you just stab it in, according to my understanding.  It will knock you down until you can get healed.  It won’t kill you however, I don’t think.”  Tetrevess hands Gravity the device.  

Gravity attempts to catch the small device and shoves it inside the archon's chest, thrusting it with her muscle strength.

Death save 18