I am looking for clarification here on an idea I recently had.
Could the Spell Magic Mouth be able to cast a verbal-only spell?
Example: Cast Magic Mouth on a suit of armor that has a trigger of touch by anything other then you. Upon said touch, cast Sword Burst (Or Vicious Mockery, or whatever spell you feel like).
Example 2: Cast Magic Mouth on your staff with the trigger being "Knock Knock". Upon doing this, when you knock on a door with your staff and say the Magic Words, it casts the Knock Spell.
I would assume there would be a level cap to the spell as you only have 25 words (Maybe 1st or 2nd level?) Maybe only Cantrips can be done this way (at their lowest level).
From the Player's Handbook about Verbal Spells and Cantrips specifically:
Verbal (V)
Most spells require the chanting of mystic words. The words themselves aren’t the source of the spell’s power; rather, the particular combination of sounds, with specific pitch and resonance, sets the threads of magic in motion. Thus, a character who is gagged or in an area of silence, such as one created by the silence spell, can’t cast a spell with a verbal component.
Cantrips
A cantrip is a spell that can be cast at will, without using a spell slot and without being prepared in advance. Repeated practice has fixed the spell in the caster’s mind and infused the caster with the magic needed to produce the effect over and over. A cantrip’s spell level is 0.
Is there any limitations that could be seen or prevent this?
Nope. Cannot work. Magic Mouth does not have any spell slots. Nothing happens, anymore than if a kenku duplicated the words from your mouth as you cast.
You need the 3rd level spell Glyph of Warding to do what you desire.
I'd say no. Magic mouth is not capable of holding a spell until triggered, because the spell description does not say it can. Beyond that, there is glyph of warding. Glyph is a 3rd level spell and can't be moved more than 10 feet. So, letting a lower-level spell be a better version of it seems like the answer must be no.
I understand the mechanics of Glyph of Warding. However that spell is a "One and Done" of pretty much anything you put into it.
Magic Mouth could conceivably be a lesser powered version that is permanent (Hence my later comment of this being limited to a Verbal Only Cantrip). What would be more powerful? A Glyph ar Warding with a 6th level Fireball on it or the Sword Burst Armor idea? Consider the negatives to trying this combo also:
If you are in an area that is silenced, the Magic Mouth won't work. (I assume a vacuum, high winds, or underwater would effect it also)
If the creature is deaf or can't hear you the effects would not work (for Vicious Mockery)
A simple Dispell would remove the ability (Magic Mouth is not totally Permanent)
Overall this combo is pretty beefy, but nothing compared to the new Strix spells that are out there IHMO
Are you stating, then, that Kenku CAN NOT be magic users since they can only mimic a voice (assuming with tone, pace, and inflection)?
Do we need to consider languages known verses the language the spell is in to cast it? Does an Elvish Magic Missile behaive differently from a Human's or a Gnome's?
You're looking to gain something from a standard 2nd-level spell that's more akin to a Spell Storing Item or Ring of Spell Storing, which are a 11th-level Artificer class ability and a rare magic item, respectively.
I mean, go ahead and homebrew/houserule it if you like, but it's not RAW.
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Helpful rewriter of Japanese->English translation and delver into software codebases (she/e/they)
Are you stating, then, that Kenku CAN NOT be magic users since they can only mimic a voice (assuming with tone, pace, and inflection)?
Do we need to consider languages known verses the language the spell is in to cast it? Does an Elvish Magic Missile behaive differently from a Human's or a Gnome's?
No. I am saying that you need to have a spell slot to cast a spell. The magic mouth does not have one and neither does the kenku. Unless of course he takes a level.
SPELL SLOT
Without, it doesn't matter what you say or do. No spell gets cast.
As for thinking it uses your slots, nope. Only a familiar can do that with spells you cast.
I understand the mechanics of Glyph of Warding. However that spell is a "One and Done" of pretty much anything you put into it.
Magic Mouth could conceivably be a lesser powered version that is permanent (Hence my later comment of this being limited to a Verbal Only Cantrip). What would be more powerful? A Glyph ar Warding with a 6th level Fireball on it or the Sword Burst Armor idea? Consider the negatives to trying this combo also:
If you are in an area that is silenced, the Magic Mouth won't work. (I assume a vacuum, high winds, or underwater would effect it also)
If the creature is deaf or can't hear you the effects would not work (for Vicious Mockery)
A simple Dispell would remove the ability (Magic Mouth is not totally Permanent)
Overall this combo is pretty beefy, but nothing compared to the new Strix spells that are out there IHMO
Are you saying something that is permanent and can be used a theoretically infinite number of times, and can be moved, is somehow lesser powered than something one-off and immobile?
Sword burst has a range of self. Which, first of all, means that you can only cast it on yourself. You can't target an object with it like a suit of armor. Nor can you target the mouth, since it is not you. But let's just say that you could target an object. So you cast it on a piece of armor and then what, you give the armor to someone else so they have a free cantrip? Or wear it yourself so you can permanently get the effects of the spell without having to spend an action?
But, to answer the question you asked: "are there limitation preventing this," I'll say again. Spells only do what they say they can do. Magic Mouth does not say it can be used to store a spell, so it can't.
If simply saying magic words was all it took to make magic happen, spellcasting wouldn't require class levels and/or spell slots.
At best, I can see a DM allowing magic mouth to perform the verbal component of a spell you cast. Could be a fun/creative way to get around being gagged. But it would not function as if the mouth was casting the spell, because that is not magic mouth's effect.
Spell slots don't matter, because cantrips don't consume them.
Simply speaking isn't enough to cast, given how all spellcasting has a requirement beyond language (feat & feature for ex.).
As to the Magic Mouth producing the Verbal component for a spell in place of the caster: I would not allow that, as there must be something more from the caster than just the mechanically listed components; we can call it will, or intent, but what matters is that something is needed beyond simple utterance of pitch & resonance (or motions in the case of somatic), otherwise there would be non-living constructs made to simply produce said mechanically listed components (which even Eberron fails to have).
The magic mouth has no magical abilities other than making sound.
Then tell me why this would work? If it did then would that mean that a barbarian could just cast magic? No, that would be crazy. A spell needs to be cast using more than just sound.
This is random but what would happen if you tried to feed a magic mouth?
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Hollow unbreakable arrows are the most OP common magic item, and my current method of coming up with insane combat shenanigans.
if you make a steel pipe with one end closed and a nozzle on the other, you can enlarge it, fill with any liquid, and then drop concentration, creating a high pressure squirt gun. (or a pipe bomb, depending if it holds)
Components are not the source of a spell's power, they only focus it. I have to move my body in certain ways to drive a car, but I don't go anywhere if I make the same motions when sitting on the couch.
People have made the RAW case, so I'll add the RAI from the PHB: " In casting a spell, a character carefully plucks at the invisible strands of raw magic suffusing the world, pins them in place in a particular pattern, sets them vibrating in a specific way, and then releases them to unleash the desired effect — in most cases, all in the span of seconds." And RE: cantrips: "Repeated practice has fixed the spell in the caster’s mind and infused the caster with the magic needed to produce the effect over and over." This isn't stuff an inanimate object can do.
I am looking for clarification here on an idea I recently had.
Could the Spell Magic Mouth be able to cast a verbal-only spell?
Example: Cast Magic Mouth on a suit of armor that has a trigger of touch by anything other then you. Upon said touch, cast Sword Burst (Or Vicious Mockery, or whatever spell you feel like).
Example 2: Cast Magic Mouth on your staff with the trigger being "Knock Knock". Upon doing this, when you knock on a door with your staff and say the Magic Words, it casts the Knock Spell.
I would assume there would be a level cap to the spell as you only have 25 words (Maybe 1st or 2nd level?) Maybe only Cantrips can be done this way (at their lowest level).
From the Player's Handbook about Verbal Spells and Cantrips specifically:
Verbal (V)
Most spells require the chanting of mystic words. The words themselves aren’t the source of the spell’s power; rather, the particular combination of sounds, with specific pitch and resonance, sets the threads of magic in motion. Thus, a character who is gagged or in an area of silence, such as one created by the silence spell, can’t cast a spell with a verbal component.
Cantrips
A cantrip is a spell that can be cast at will, without using a spell slot and without being prepared in advance. Repeated practice has fixed the spell in the caster’s mind and infused the caster with the magic needed to produce the effect over and over. A cantrip’s spell level is 0.
Is there any limitations that could be seen or prevent this?
Nope. Cannot work. Magic Mouth does not have any spell slots. Nothing happens, anymore than if a kenku duplicated the words from your mouth as you cast.
You need the 3rd level spell Glyph of Warding to do what you desire.
I'd say no. Magic mouth is not capable of holding a spell until triggered, because the spell description does not say it can. Beyond that, there is glyph of warding. Glyph is a 3rd level spell and can't be moved more than 10 feet. So, letting a lower-level spell be a better version of it seems like the answer must be no.
I understand the mechanics of Glyph of Warding. However that spell is a "One and Done" of pretty much anything you put into it.
Magic Mouth could conceivably be a lesser powered version that is permanent (Hence my later comment of this being limited to a Verbal Only Cantrip). What would be more powerful? A Glyph ar Warding with a 6th level Fireball on it or the Sword Burst Armor idea? Consider the negatives to trying this combo also:
Overall this combo is pretty beefy, but nothing compared to the new Strix spells that are out there IHMO
Are you stating, then, that Kenku CAN NOT be magic users since they can only mimic a voice (assuming with tone, pace, and inflection)?
Do we need to consider languages known verses the language the spell is in to cast it? Does an Elvish Magic Missile behaive differently from a Human's or a Gnome's?
You're looking to gain something from a standard 2nd-level spell that's more akin to a Spell Storing Item or Ring of Spell Storing, which are a 11th-level Artificer class ability and a rare magic item, respectively.
I mean, go ahead and homebrew/houserule it if you like, but it's not RAW.
Helpful rewriter of Japanese->English translation and delver into software codebases (she/e/they)
No. I am saying that you need to have a spell slot to cast a spell. The magic mouth does not have one and neither does the kenku. Unless of course he takes a level.
SPELL SLOT
Without, it doesn't matter what you say or do. No spell gets cast.
As for thinking it uses your slots, nope. Only a familiar can do that with spells you cast.
Are you saying something that is permanent and can be used a theoretically infinite number of times, and can be moved, is somehow lesser powered than something one-off and immobile?
Sword burst has a range of self. Which, first of all, means that you can only cast it on yourself. You can't target an object with it like a suit of armor. Nor can you target the mouth, since it is not you. But let's just say that you could target an object. So you cast it on a piece of armor and then what, you give the armor to someone else so they have a free cantrip? Or wear it yourself so you can permanently get the effects of the spell without having to spend an action?
But, to answer the question you asked: "are there limitation preventing this," I'll say again. Spells only do what they say they can do. Magic Mouth does not say it can be used to store a spell, so it can't.
If simply saying magic words was all it took to make magic happen, spellcasting wouldn't require class levels and/or spell slots.
At best, I can see a DM allowing magic mouth to perform the verbal component of a spell you cast. Could be a fun/creative way to get around being gagged. But it would not function as if the mouth was casting the spell, because that is not magic mouth's effect.
DxJxC is the only one here answering correctly.
Spell slots don't matter, because cantrips don't consume them.
Simply speaking isn't enough to cast, given how all spellcasting has a requirement beyond language (feat & feature for ex.).
As to the Magic Mouth producing the Verbal component for a spell in place of the caster: I would not allow that, as there must be something more from the caster than just the mechanically listed components; we can call it will, or intent, but what matters is that something is needed beyond simple utterance of pitch & resonance (or motions in the case of somatic), otherwise there would be non-living constructs made to simply produce said mechanically listed components (which even Eberron fails to have).
The magic mouth has no magical abilities other than making sound.
Then tell me why this would work? If it did then would that mean that a barbarian could just cast magic? No, that would be crazy. A spell needs to be cast using more than just sound.
This is random but what would happen if you tried to feed a magic mouth?
Hollow unbreakable arrows are the most OP common magic item, and my current method of coming up with insane combat shenanigans.
if you make a steel pipe with one end closed and a nozzle on the other, you can enlarge it, fill with any liquid, and then drop concentration, creating a high pressure squirt gun. (or a pipe bomb, depending if it holds)
Components are not the source of a spell's power, they only focus it. I have to move my body in certain ways to drive a car, but I don't go anywhere if I make the same motions when sitting on the couch.
People have made the RAW case, so I'll add the RAI from the PHB: " In casting a spell, a character carefully plucks at the invisible strands of raw magic suffusing the world, pins them in place in a particular pattern, sets them vibrating in a specific way, and then releases them to unleash the desired effect — in most cases, all in the span of seconds." And RE: cantrips: "Repeated practice has fixed the spell in the caster’s mind and infused the caster with the magic needed to produce the effect over and over." This isn't stuff an inanimate object can do.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm