Now, that rule has been split between the Attack Action and the Combat chapter:
Attack [Action]
When you take the Attack action, you can make one attack roll with a weapon or an Unarmed Strike.
Equipping and Unequipping Weapons. You can either equip or unequip one weapon when you make an attack as part of this action. You do so either before or after the attack. If you equip a weapon before an attack, you don’t need to use it for that attack. Equipping a weapon includes drawing it from a sheath or picking it up. Unequipping a weapon includes sheathing, stowing, or dropping it.
Moving between Attacks. If you move on your turn and have a feature, such as Extra Attack, that gives you more than one attack as part of the Attack action, you can use some or all of that movement to move between those attacks.
In the Combat chapter, we have the following text under "Movement and Position" section:
You can break up your move, using some of its movement before and after any action, Bonus Action, or Reaction you take on the same turn. For example, if you have a Speed of 30 feet, you could go 10 feet, take an action, and then go 20 feet.
I believe this means you can't move anymore between attacks that are part of a Bonus Action. But you can still move before and after.
It also means now NPC monsters can't move between attacks during Multiattack action.
We won't know that until we have the DMG, or maybe the MM.
I don't think so since we can already ee the rules glossary for how to read a stat block. So far no exception exist regarding Multiattack action specifically with those already published.
I think that you guys are correct about this, and this does feel like a decently big change, and one that will likely confuse a lot of people. It's unclear if this change was intentional or not, but I think that it might be. It means that it's going to become important to make a note of which attacks are part of an Attack action and which aren't.
For example, this change probably allows the Cleave attack to function as intended. The Cleave attack is an attack that is provided by a special rule or feature, and it is not actually an attack that is part of an Attack Action. So, you would not be able to decide whether or not you want to reposition yourself after your first attack but before you make your Cleave attack based on the result of that first attack.
Actually, now that I'm rereading all of this, what I've just said about the Cleave attack might not technically be true, since you could consider movement between these attacks as just being movement "after" your Attack action attack and "before" some other future action, Bonus action or Reaction. If within the Cleave attack rule it allowed you to make more than one Cleave attack then you definitely wouldn't be able to move between those attacks -- I'm struggling to come up with a rule or feature that works like this but I'm sure that there might be some class Features or Feats that provide such attacks and in those cases we will need to be mindful of the above movement rules (this might not even be true either for the same reason).
As a side note, if you can move just before your Cleave attack, I feel like that was not intended -- the concept of a cleave is a throwback to earlier D&D versions that allowed a Fighter to "sweep" multiple creatures and so on -- the idea is that your weapon cleaves straight through one monster and the arc of the swing of your weapon continues onward and hits another creature. But as written, it might not actually be that restricted unfortunately.
I may be being daft here, but I'm not seeing how this prevents moving between flurry of blows or multiattack. Unless are we saying that since its not clearly spelled out that its also allowed in these cases we should assume you can't? Like multi attack isn't the same as extra attack because it isn't an attack "action"?
I guess I would rule that they're similar enough and there isn't language that spells out it being prevented that I would rule they operate in the same way. I'd allow a monster to move between multi attacks and a monk to move between flurry of blows.
Since Cleaveis not an extra attack made as part of the Attack action, then it means you can't use some or all of your movement to move between it and instead can make this extra from the same position.
I may be being daft here, but I'm not seeing how this prevents moving between flurry of blows or multiattack.
In the case of multiattack -- which is a particular type of action that is defined in a monster stat block that the monster can take by using their action -- these attacks are occurring during the same action and this action is not an Attack action. The rule states that you can move before or after any action, Bonus Action or Reaction and that you can move during an Attack action, but that's it.
Since Cleaveis not an extra attack made as part of the Attack action, then it means you can't use some or all of your movement to move between it and instead can make this extra from the same position.
That was my first thought as well, but after rereading all of this I think that I am changing my mind on it.
My current thinking is that the Cleave attack is actually technically NOT part of ANY action at all. It's just an extra attack that is granted by a Feature or rule. You don't have to expend any sort of action to do it -- instead, it is triggers on a melee attack hit, which itself may or may not exist as part of an action of some sort.
Since the Cleave attack is actually not part of any action, it exists between the various Actions, Bonus Actions and Reactions that you might be taking, and therefore you should be able to move before and after (and during if that were possible) this Cleave attack.
I think that the restriction is only for multiple attacks that somehow exist during a Bonus Action or during a Reaction or during an action that is not an Attack action.
Since the Cleave attack is actually not part of any action, it exists between the various Actions, Bonus Actions and Reactions that you might be taking, and therefore you should be able to move before and after (and during if that were possible) this Cleave attack.
Since you can break up your move, using some of its movement before and after any action, Bonus Action, or Reaction and that Cleave's extra attack is not made as a action, Bonus Action, or Reaction, you would be only able to move after the action, Bonus Action or Reaction which triggers it. So if for exemple you have ways to make multiple attacks as part of the Attack action (Extra Attack, Nicks etc) you would need to complete the action before you can move.
In short, you can use movement to move between Attack action's attacks, but not between attack from non Attack action one meaning if you intend to move, Cleave 's extra attack has to come after the Attack action and not inserted in between if that make any sense.
Breaking Up Your Move: You can break up your move, using some of its movement before and after any action, Bonus Action, or Reaction you take on the same turn. For example, if you have a Speed of 30 feet, you could go 10 feet, take an action, and then go 20 feet.
The actions of combat don't change between players and monsters.
They do change, while monsters have access to the main Actions, player characters don't have access to monsters action. So monsters can take the Multiattack action if they have one in their statblock; So for example Apes have the following
ACTION
Multiattack. The ape makes two Fist attacks.
Actions. The monster can take these actions in addition to those detailed in this glossary. See also chapter 1 (“Actions”).
I may be being daft here, but I'm not seeing how this prevents moving between flurry of blows or multiattack. Unless are we saying that since its not clearly spelled out that its also allowed in these cases we should assume you can't? Like multi attack isn't the same as extra attack because it isn't an attack "action"?
I guess I would rule that they're similar enough and there isn't language that spells out it being prevented that I would rule they operate in the same way. I'd allow a monster to move between multi attacks and a monk to move between flurry of blows.
In my opinion, movement is no longer allowed during Flurry of Blows (or any other Bonus Action involving multiple attacks) or during a Reaction because the previous rule has been moved from a general section to the Attack Action.
I believe this change is intentional.
So, essentially, you can now move between attacks only when you take the Attack Action, not with other types of actions.
The actions of combat don't change between players and monsters.
They do change, while monsters have access to the main Actions, player characters don't have access to monsters action. So monsters can take the Multiattack action if they have one in their statblock; So for example Apes have the following
ACTION
Multiattack. The ape makes two Fist attacks.
Actions. The monster can take these actions in addition to those detailed in this glossary. See also chapter 1 (“Actions”).
I don't really see any indication that multiartack isn't used in the attack action
Worth noting Flurry of Blows not restricting movement in 2014 was most likely an oversight; it's 3.5e namesake required using all of their attacks for that turn without moving, and the 2014 version still forced you to make the first of the two unarmed strikes immediately after one of the attacks of the Attack action. Also, Monks got major buffs elsewhere so it's not exactly a big loss.
The actions of combat don't change between players and monsters.
They do change, while monsters have access to the main Actions, player characters don't have access to monsters action. So monsters can take the Multiattack action if they have one in their statblock; So for example Apes have the following
ACTION
Multiattack. The ape makes two Fist attacks.
Actions. The monster can take these actions in addition to those detailed in this glossary. See also chapter 1 (“Actions”).
I don't really see any indication that multiartack isn't used in the attack action
Multiattack is the name of an entirely different action that some monsters get access to.
The bold indicates the name of an action in the block.
Multiattack, while a general name used in many blocks, are written in each block in a specific way. The way multiattack is written is often much more limited by its description. for example, some creatures have access to powerful attacks combined in their multiattack but are written in a way to prevent targeting the same creature with both attacks.
I don't really see any indication that multiartack isn't used in the attack action
Its the contrary, there's no indication that when a monster take the Multiattack action, its using the Attack action, so its different actions entirely.
The actions of combat don't change between players and monsters.
They do change, while monsters have access to the main Actions, player characters don't have access to monsters action. So monsters can take the Multiattack action if they have one in their statblock; So for example Apes have the following
ACTION
Multiattack. The ape makes two Fist attacks.
Actions. The monster can take these actions in addition to those detailed in this glossary. See also chapter 1 (“Actions”).
I don't really see any indication that multiartack isn't used in the attack action
Multiattack is the name of an entirely different action that some monsters get access to.
The bold indicates the name of an action in the block.
Multiattack, while a general name used in many blocks, are written in each block in a specific way. The way multiattack is written is often much more limited by its description. for example, some creatures have access to powerful attacks combined in their multiattack but are written in a way to prevent targeting the same creature with both attacks.
I believe the T-rex is written in this way.
It still an attack in the attack action phase. It's no different than a fighters multi attack, unless you are claiming a fighter can't move between their attacks either.
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With the 2014 Movement and Position rules, specifically the section Moving Between Attacks, it was accepted you could move between attacks that were part of a Bonus Actions (e.g. "Flurry of Blows. Looking for a definitive answer")
Now, that rule has been split between the Attack Action and the Combat chapter:
In the Combat chapter, we have the following text under "Movement and Position" section:
I believe this means you can't move anymore between attacks that are part of a Bonus Action. But you can still move before and after.
It also means now NPC monsters can't move between attacks during Multiattack action.
We won't know that until we have the DMG, or maybe the MM.
I don't think so since we can already ee the rules glossary for how to read a stat block. So far no exception exist regarding Multiattack action specifically with those already published.
I think that you guys are correct about this, and this does feel like a decently big change, and one that will likely confuse a lot of people. It's unclear if this change was intentional or not, but I think that it might be. It means that it's going to become important to make a note of which attacks are part of an Attack action and which aren't.
For example, this change probably allows the Cleave attack to function as intended. The Cleave attack is an attack that is provided by a special rule or feature, and it is not actually an attack that is part of an Attack Action. So, you would not be able to decide whether or not you want to reposition yourself after your first attack but before you make your Cleave attack based on the result of that first attack.
Actually, now that I'm rereading all of this, what I've just said about the Cleave attack might not technically be true, since you could consider movement between these attacks as just being movement "after" your Attack action attack and "before" some other future action, Bonus action or Reaction. If within the Cleave attack rule it allowed you to make more than one Cleave attack then you definitely wouldn't be able to move between those attacks -- I'm struggling to come up with a rule or feature that works like this but I'm sure that there might be some class Features or Feats that provide such attacks and in those cases we will need to be mindful of the above movement rules (this might not even be true either for the same reason).
As a side note, if you can move just before your Cleave attack, I feel like that was not intended -- the concept of a cleave is a throwback to earlier D&D versions that allowed a Fighter to "sweep" multiple creatures and so on -- the idea is that your weapon cleaves straight through one monster and the arc of the swing of your weapon continues onward and hits another creature. But as written, it might not actually be that restricted unfortunately.
I may be being daft here, but I'm not seeing how this prevents moving between flurry of blows or multiattack. Unless are we saying that since its not clearly spelled out that its also allowed in these cases we should assume you can't? Like multi attack isn't the same as extra attack because it isn't an attack "action"?
I guess I would rule that they're similar enough and there isn't language that spells out it being prevented that I would rule they operate in the same way. I'd allow a monster to move between multi attacks and a monk to move between flurry of blows.
Since Cleave is not an extra attack made as part of the Attack action, then it means you can't use some or all of your movement to move between it and instead can make this extra from the same position.
In the case of multiattack -- which is a particular type of action that is defined in a monster stat block that the monster can take by using their action -- these attacks are occurring during the same action and this action is not an Attack action. The rule states that you can move before or after any action, Bonus Action or Reaction and that you can move during an Attack action, but that's it.
That was my first thought as well, but after rereading all of this I think that I am changing my mind on it.
My current thinking is that the Cleave attack is actually technically NOT part of ANY action at all. It's just an extra attack that is granted by a Feature or rule. You don't have to expend any sort of action to do it -- instead, it is triggers on a melee attack hit, which itself may or may not exist as part of an action of some sort.
Since the Cleave attack is actually not part of any action, it exists between the various Actions, Bonus Actions and Reactions that you might be taking, and therefore you should be able to move before and after (and during if that were possible) this Cleave attack.
I think that the restriction is only for multiple attacks that somehow exist during a Bonus Action or during a Reaction or during an action that is not an Attack action.
Since you can break up your move, using some of its movement before and after any action, Bonus Action, or Reaction and that Cleave 's extra attack is not made as a action, Bonus Action, or Reaction, you would be only able to move after the action, Bonus Action or Reaction which triggers it. So if for exemple you have ways to make multiple attacks as part of the Attack action (Extra Attack, Nicks etc) you would need to complete the action before you can move.
In short, you can use movement to move between Attack action's attacks, but not between attack from non Attack action one meaning if you intend to move, Cleave 's extra attack has to come after the Attack action and not inserted in between if that make any sense.
Why would they not? Multiartack actions happen during the attack action.
Where in the rules have you read this? It's not in the the rules glossary for how to read a stat block of NPC Monsters
The actions of combat don't change between players and monsters.
They do change, while monsters have access to the main Actions, player characters don't have access to monsters action. So monsters can take the Multiattack action if they have one in their statblock; So for example Apes have the following
ACTION
Multiattack. The ape makes two Fist attacks.
In my opinion, movement is no longer allowed during Flurry of Blows (or any other Bonus Action involving multiple attacks) or during a Reaction because the previous rule has been moved from a general section to the Attack Action.
I believe this change is intentional.
So, essentially, you can now move between attacks only when you take the Attack Action, not with other types of actions.
I don't really see any indication that multiartack isn't used in the attack action
Worth noting Flurry of Blows not restricting movement in 2014 was most likely an oversight; it's 3.5e namesake required using all of their attacks for that turn without moving, and the 2014 version still forced you to make the first of the two unarmed strikes immediately after one of the attacks of the Attack action. Also, Monks got major buffs elsewhere so it's not exactly a big loss.
The Forum Infestation (TM)
It could be portrayed as this:
Multiattack is the name of an entirely different action that some monsters get access to.
The bold indicates the name of an action in the block.
Multiattack, while a general name used in many blocks, are written in each block in a specific way. The way multiattack is written is often much more limited by its description. for example, some creatures have access to powerful attacks combined in their multiattack but are written in a way to prevent targeting the same creature with both attacks.
I believe the T-rex is written in this way.
Its the contrary, there's no indication that when a monster take the Multiattack action, its using the Attack action, so its different actions entirely.
It still an attack in the attack action phase. It's no different than a fighters multi attack, unless you are claiming a fighter can't move between their attacks either.