No, a "Swarm" is a singular creature according to the rules. The swarm makes a single bite attack, ergo, a single source. Each magic missile dart would have a separate attack roll, were it not for the peculiarity of Magic Missile as a spell.
what rule? the description says its tiny beasts. i'd say your third sentence is backward.... magic missile would have one attack role and one hit roll if it were not for the peculiarity of the spell. you wouldn't get 3 attacks.
so if a mage gets hit by a swarm of insects....is that 10 concentration checks? each insect in the swarm is a source of damage.
No, because the entire swarm only does 1 hit.
imo, conceptually its the same as magic missile...in one you have several bugs doing damage to you simultaneously, the other you have several darts doing damage to you simultaneously.
Ah, but the difference is in one you have several bugs accumulating into one hit, in the other you have several darts all hitting at the same time.
If the swarm did 4d4 attacks each at +3 to hit and 1 piercing damage each, then every hit would trigger the concentration check. But it doesn’t, the entire swarm make one attach at +3 to hit that does 4d4 damage. One hit, one check.
The darts from Magic Missile all hit simultaneously, but they each hit.
Jeremy Crawford is the Lead Rules Designer for Wizards of the Coast. If you consider his words with respect to the core content he produced "opinion", then the books themselves may as well be published "opinion".
No, a "Swarm" is a singular creature according to the rules. The swarm makes a single bite attack, ergo, a single source. Each magic missile dart would have a separate attack roll, were it not for the peculiarity of Magic Missile as a spell.
what rule? the description says its tiny beasts. i'd say your third sentence is backward.... magic missile would have one attack role and one hit roll if it were not for the peculiarity of the spell. you wouldn't get 3 attacks.
You would have to get three attacks because they could all target different creatures, or the same creature, just like Eldritch Blast. But, because of the aforementioned peculiarities of the spell, they automatically hit.
Jeremy Crawford is the Lead Rules Designer for Wizards of the Coast. If you consider his words with respect to the core content he produced "opinion", then the books themselves may as well be published "opinion".
To be fair, I disagree with a number of his rulings myself as well. And no, his rulings are not actually rules. I’m not even saying that I personally agree with this one either, but technically speaking, RAW, you roll once and all darts do the same damage, and each hit triggers a Concentration check.
Sure, "SageAdvice" is not RAW, but it's vastly more than opinion. It is literal RAI.
I just don’t play with anyone who even knows what sage advice is- or cares. If it’s not in the core books and easily referenceable, then it’s all opinion and jeremy’s is no more valuable than my players. We talk through it and agree on an approach. As with spoons, there is no RAI.
Sure, "SageAdvice" is not RAW, but it's vastly more than opinion. It is literal RAI.
I just don’t play with anyone who even knows what sage advice is- or cares. If it’s not in the core books and easily referenceable, then it’s all opinion and jeremy’s is no more valuable than my players. We talk through it and agree on an approach. As with spoons, there is no RAI.
Well, there is an easily referenced RAW in the Basic Rules and the PHB can be found in the Damage and Healing section of chapter 9, Combat.
The wording from Magic Missile of "A dart deals 1d4 + 1 force damage to its target" seems to imply each missile does its own damage.
I see that JC says RAI is "it doesn't matter, you choose".
Page 196 of PHB doesn't say "is capable of doing damage to more than one target", it only says "deals damage to more than one target".
But JC expressing his opinion on RAW will most likely win.
If it aid “each dart deals...” I would say it definitely implies rolling separately. But “A dart deals...” could certainly imply that you roll 1d4+1, and “that’s what a dart does.”
The spell wording you mentioned is not the important part, only the inclusion of the word “simultaneously” in a spell capable of damaging multiple creatures is the relevant part. All darts technically do the same damage because of this section in the “Damage and Healing” section of the rules:
If a spell or other effect deals damage to more than one target at the same time, roll the damage once for all of them. For example, when a wizard casts fireball or a cleric casts flame strike, the spell's damage is rolled once for all creatures caught in the blast.
I concede that I did not consider that at the time. That is applicable.
Your opinion is not RAW. D&D is not a physics simulator, so some things don't line up with reality.
what rule? the description says its tiny beasts. i'd say your third sentence is backward.... magic missile would have one attack role and one hit roll if it were not for the peculiarity of the spell. you wouldn't get 3 attacks.
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correct. nor is what the majority of people are quoting. we're firmly in the land of opinion.
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Ah, but the difference is in one you have several bugs accumulating into one hit, in the other you have several darts all hitting at the same time.
If the swarm did 4d4 attacks each at +3 to hit and 1 piercing damage each, then every hit would trigger the concentration check. But it doesn’t, the entire swarm make one attach at +3 to hit that does 4d4 damage. One hit, one check.
The darts from Magic Missile all hit simultaneously, but they each hit.
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Jeremy Crawford is the Lead Rules Designer for Wizards of the Coast. If you consider his words with respect to the core content he produced "opinion", then the books themselves may as well be published "opinion".
You would have to get three attacks because they could all target different creatures, or the same creature, just like Eldritch Blast. But, because of the aforementioned peculiarities of the spell, they automatically hit.
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fair enough
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To be fair, I disagree with a number of his rulings myself as well. And no, his rulings are not actually rules. I’m not even saying that I personally agree with this one either, but technically speaking, RAW, you roll once and all darts do the same damage, and each hit triggers a Concentration check.
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Sure, "SageAdvice" is not RAW, but it's vastly more than opinion. It is literal RAI.
I just don’t play with anyone who even knows what sage advice is- or cares. If it’s not in the core books and easily referenceable, then it’s all opinion and jeremy’s is no more valuable than my players. We talk through it and agree on an approach. As with spoons, there is no RAI.
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Well, if you would like to make it more easily referenceable, the Sage Advice Compendium is published on the official Dungeons & Dragons website:
https://dnd.wizards.com/articles/sage-advice/sage-advice-compendium
The wording from Magic Missile of "A dart deals 1d4 + 1 force damage to its target" seems to imply each missile does its own damage.
I see that JC says RAI is "it doesn't matter, you choose".
Page 196 of PHB doesn't say "is capable of doing damage to more than one target", it only says "deals damage to more than one target".
But JC expressing his opinion on RAW will most likely win.
Well, there is an easily referenced RAW in the Basic Rules and the PHB can be found in the Damage and Healing section of chapter 9, Combat.
https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/basic-rules/combat#DamageandHealing
But even Crawford says it doesn’t matter which way you do it as long as you are consistent.
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If it aid “each dart deals...” I would say it definitely implies rolling separately. But “A dart deals...” could certainly imply that you roll 1d4+1, and “that’s what a dart does.”
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You roll once for fireball, you roll one concentration
You roll once for magic missile, you roll one concentration.
Same same right?
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"real life is a super high CR."
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"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
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No. A character is only hit once with Fireball. A character hit multiple times by magic missile rolls multiple times.
I concede that I did not consider that at the time. That is applicable.
This^^^
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Well that was fun. What other dumb ideas can I come up with?
What about Bones of the Earth?
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
What about it?