Assuming a person has the requirements to make a running long jump of 20 feet, I don't see why they couldn't run and jump across a 40 foot gap and cast misty step somewhere along the way to cover the rest of the distance. It is established that you can break your movement up with an action and I don't see a conflict between the rules for jumping and the rules for falling. After all, if your character has the strength (boosted by magic or whatnot) to jump up more than 10 vertical feet, no DM in their right mind is going to penalize them with falling damage upon landing from their own jump since they are two different things. I don't believe any of this runs afoul of the rules as written either.
You can absolutely do that. It's just a difference between saying "I want to jump out as far as I can and then Misty Step the rest of the way" and saying "I want to try to jump the gap, but if I don't make it I want to Misty Step the rest of the way."
The former is casting the spell actively. The latter is potentially casting the spell reactively, which isn't possible with a bonus action spell. If Misty Step took an action to cast, you could absolutely Ready it in case you fell... though Readying a spell uses up the spell slot anyway, so really you may as well just go with option 1 if you're ever unsure if you can make a jump or whatever.
Ah, ok. I guess in my mind this is a decision that would have been made before the feet leave the ground. Either I can make the jump without the spell or I need to use the spell. Then I proceed as required.
something else to consider is that falling damage caps at 20d6 which is an average of 70 hp... 35 hp for a raging barbarian
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"A rightful place awaits you in the Realms Above, in the Land of the Great Light. Come in peace, and live beneath the sun again, where trees and flowers grow."
— The message of Eilistraee to all decent drow.
"Run thy sword across my chains, Silver Lady, that I may join your dance.”
Well if it's a reaction spell you can do it as soon as you start falling. It's not like you can only cast Feather Fallafter the fall; that would be totally pointless. You do it as soon as the fall starts.
To reiterate, those holding that the “immediate” fall requires a logically incoherent ruling that isn’t fun (you can cast a spell mid-jump, but the INSTANT you reach the end of that distance, you plummet 500 feet with no time for anything while falling) are not pointing to any RAW language that the “immediate” fall can’t be concurrent with other actions. It may be a reasonable reading of the word “immediate,” but it’s an unreasonable reading of the rule as a whole, and is a choice that you are making.
This is an ambiguous section, if you’re not happy with not being able to cast during a fall, just.... don’t use that interpretation, you’ve got to make a RAI interpretation either way, so why insist on the one that causes problems???
Would you all allow a player to jump upward to attack a creature that would otherwise be out of its reach? Fighter has 5ft reach, needs to jump 10ft high to momentarily attack a harpy 20ft above the fighter.
if the fighter is indeed allowed to make that attack in midair, would there be any real difference between this scenario and casting misty step?
or would the fighter immediately fall back down?
“You can extend your arms half your height above yourself during the jump. Thus, you can reach above you a distance equal to the height of the jump plus 1 1/2 times your height.”
funnily enough raw seems to say you can reach but not actually grab anything. Makes me picture PCs attempting to leap at ledges in a way similar to salmon migrating upstream.
I personally allow pretty much every action while in the air. I just let it happen potentially at the very end of the movement. Falling is immediate, but only immediately after your move is gone.
i got a champion build that uses the mobile feat and jumping rules to vault over medium size creatures while making attacks through the air. Slips away without getting opportunity attacked.
Would you all allow a player to jump upward to attack a creature that would otherwise be out of its reach? Fighter has 5ft reach, needs to jump 10ft high to momentarily attack a harpy 20ft above the fighter.
if the fighter is indeed allowed to make that attack in midair, would there be any real difference between this scenario and casting misty step?
You can jump and cast misty step (you can also jump and attack). What you cannot do is jump, roll, realize you're not going to make it, and cast misty step to cancel out your failure.
Not only is there no such thing as momentum, "a fall" is not defined in the rules. Sure, there's some things we'd clearly recognize as "a fall"... fall off a 30 foot ledge and land on the ground 30 feet below, "a fall!" But...
A 30 foot-high jump that you initiated.... "a fall" when you land?
(Related to above) Grappled by an enemy, they jump or flyl while dragging you against your will.... "a fall" when you land?
Falling for 30 feet, but you teleport to a point on the ground that you can see before hitting the ground?
Thrown horizontally or vertically (up) against a surface?
Reasonable minds could differ on these.
My rulings on the above:
1) if you can jump up a distance, I believe you can land safely from that distance. That’s only for planned jumps up though; unplanned falls over 10 feet still cause damage, and a jump down (distance up to your maximum vertical) would require a DEX acrobatics check to avoid damage and prone
2) a fall only if you or they end the grapple condition, or if they decide to fall too while still grappling you
3) teleporting resets fall speed (you start at 0 FPS/MPH) unless you fall through a portal or gate where it would be reasonable to conserve momentum (like in “Portal”, as opposed to “Nightcrawler” style teleporting)
4) damage only if the ability used to throw/move you says you take damage if you strike a surface, unless you also fall down as part of the throw
concerning momentum, having some time to think it over...
physics belongs in our world magic is what rules in most, if not all, fantasy worlds (spelljammer mentions crystal spheres that you travel to and from... this doesn't exist in our world)
so given that, when you cast misty step and move 30 feet from one location to another you don't accrue that momentum, which seems to suggest teleportation negates momentum,,, even though you are not moving to begin with in that example and you are in the other, this is not a conclusive argument but it lends itself to the idea that teleportation negates momentum, this also simplifies the way the rules work.
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"A rightful place awaits you in the Realms Above, in the Land of the Great Light. Come in peace, and live beneath the sun again, where trees and flowers grow."
— The message of Eilistraee to all decent drow.
"Run thy sword across my chains, Silver Lady, that I may join your dance.”
You can jump and cast misty step (you can also jump and attack). What you cannot do is jump, roll, realize you're not going to make it, and cast misty step to cancel out your failure.
So you're saying I cannot cast a bonus action spell as a reaction...
You can jump and cast misty step (you can also jump and attack). What you cannot do is jump, roll, realize you're not going to make it, and cast misty step to cancel out your failure.
So you're saying I cannot cast a bonus action spell as a reaction...
That seems to be the consensus. I know I've asked something similar and the response was you are Reacting to the fall so neither Action nor Bonus Action is allowed. I'm not sure in the falling case there is any RAW where it defines these non-action actions, at least anywhere I could find, saying this is accurate but I'm not against the reasoning applied to the situation.
If you want more discussion outside of the limits of the rules, I suggest you post in a forum other than Rules and Game Mechanics and mention you are interested in opinions. I would let someone use Ready Action to use for a Bonus Action ability but, that's still a house ruling. As far as jumping and using an action is concerned, it could be well within the rights of the DM to say that making an Athletics(or other check) for the success of your jump IS your action. Alternatively, the could allow your Passive Athletics to make a jump. So many options.
If you want more discussion outside of the limits of the rules, I suggest you post in a forum other than Rules and Game Mechanics and mention you are interested in opinions. I would let someone use Ready Action to use for a Bonus Action ability but, that's still a house ruling. As far as jumping and using an action is concerned, it could be well within the rights of the DM to say that making an Athletics(or other check) for the success of your jump IS your action. Alternatively, the could allow your Passive Athletics to make a jump. So many options.
I’m not sure anyone is saying the rules are wrong what’s going on in THIS thread has been a healthy discussion of the spell. All be it far from the original post of window jumping.
Making an Active Skill check can require an action. Look to specific examples like Hiding and Searching by using ability checks, they require an action. Depending on the situation, other ability checks reasonably could as well, that was all I was saying. I wasn't talking about DM fiat specifically.
Why wouldn’t you be able to cast the spell after you realize you aren’t going to make it a cross the gap when you jump? Just because you as a player are “reacting” to that new information doesn’t mean it requires a reaction to get out of it.
thats like saying you can’t use the two weapon fighting bonus action attack if a creature lives through your attack action, and ruling that a reaction based attack is necessary.
besides, who says you don’t realize you’re not gonna make the jump until after you’re falling? There have been plenty of times in my life where I’ve attempted to do something athletic and realized it’s not going to work the moment I’ve started the maneuver. You can be confident enough to try it, but the out come is still uncertain.
None of you have had that feeling where you try something and instantly know it’s not going to work out well? If only we could misty step.
it comes down to... if only misty step were a reaction to cast instead of a bonus action... may as well dream, if only my 30 foot of movement was flying movement
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"A rightful place awaits you in the Realms Above, in the Land of the Great Light. Come in peace, and live beneath the sun again, where trees and flowers grow."
— The message of Eilistraee to all decent drow.
"Run thy sword across my chains, Silver Lady, that I may join your dance.”
There are written rules that tell you that your 30 foot of movement isn't flying movement. There are no written rules that say a Bonus Action cannot be made while falling.
I haven't looked into all the rules concerning action, bonus actions, and reactions on your own turn... different combinations of what could be possible with the jumping or falling probably exist.
But when it's not your turn you only have reactions available.
Some of the posts on here suggest that Xanathar's is where the falling rules have been changed to say immediate but I can't help wonder how it would be handled if they weren't... I never thought of doing anything when I was told a fall was taking place, I always thought you couldn't do anything except maybe cast feather fall if you had the spell.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"A rightful place awaits you in the Realms Above, in the Land of the Great Light. Come in peace, and live beneath the sun again, where trees and flowers grow."
— The message of Eilistraee to all decent drow.
"Run thy sword across my chains, Silver Lady, that I may join your dance.”
— A basic prayer.
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Assuming a person has the requirements to make a running long jump of 20 feet, I don't see why they couldn't run and jump across a 40 foot gap and cast misty step somewhere along the way to cover the rest of the distance. It is established that you can break your movement up with an action and I don't see a conflict between the rules for jumping and the rules for falling. After all, if your character has the strength (boosted by magic or whatnot) to jump up more than 10 vertical feet, no DM in their right mind is going to penalize them with falling damage upon landing from their own jump since they are two different things. I don't believe any of this runs afoul of the rules as written either.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
You can absolutely do that. It's just a difference between saying "I want to jump out as far as I can and then Misty Step the rest of the way" and saying "I want to try to jump the gap, but if I don't make it I want to Misty Step the rest of the way."
The former is casting the spell actively. The latter is potentially casting the spell reactively, which isn't possible with a bonus action spell. If Misty Step took an action to cast, you could absolutely Ready it in case you fell... though Readying a spell uses up the spell slot anyway, so really you may as well just go with option 1 if you're ever unsure if you can make a jump or whatever.
Ah, ok. I guess in my mind this is a decision that would have been made before the feet leave the ground. Either I can make the jump without the spell or I need to use the spell. Then I proceed as required.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
something else to consider is that falling damage caps at 20d6 which is an average of 70 hp... 35 hp for a raging barbarian
This whole conversation just makes me want to make a 3rd level spell that lets you teleport as a reaction to falling. Feather Step? Misty Fall? Pllbt.
Well if it's a reaction spell you can do it as soon as you start falling. It's not like you can only cast Feather Fall after the fall; that would be totally pointless. You do it as soon as the fall starts.
To reiterate, those holding that the “immediate” fall requires a logically incoherent ruling that isn’t fun (you can cast a spell mid-jump, but the INSTANT you reach the end of that distance, you plummet 500 feet with no time for anything while falling) are not pointing to any RAW language that the “immediate” fall can’t be concurrent with other actions. It may be a reasonable reading of the word “immediate,” but it’s an unreasonable reading of the rule as a whole, and is a choice that you are making.
This is an ambiguous section, if you’re not happy with not being able to cast during a fall, just.... don’t use that interpretation, you’ve got to make a RAI interpretation either way, so why insist on the one that causes problems???
dndbeyond.com forum tags
I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
Would you all allow a player to jump upward to attack a creature that would otherwise be out of its reach? Fighter has 5ft reach, needs to jump 10ft high to momentarily attack a harpy 20ft above the fighter.
if the fighter is indeed allowed to make that attack in midair, would there be any real difference between this scenario and casting misty step?
or would the fighter immediately fall back down?
“You can extend your arms half your height above yourself during the jump. Thus, you can reach above you a distance equal to the height of the jump plus 1 1/2 times your height.”
funnily enough raw seems to say you can reach but not actually grab anything. Makes me picture PCs attempting to leap at ledges in a way similar to salmon migrating upstream.
I personally allow pretty much every action while in the air. I just let it happen potentially at the very end of the movement. Falling is immediate, but only immediately after your move is gone.
i got a champion build that uses the mobile feat and jumping rules to vault over medium size creatures while making attacks through the air. Slips away without getting opportunity attacked.
You can jump and cast misty step (you can also jump and attack). What you cannot do is jump, roll, realize you're not going to make it, and cast misty step to cancel out your failure.
My rulings on the above:
1) if you can jump up a distance, I believe you can land safely from that distance. That’s only for planned jumps up though; unplanned falls over 10 feet still cause damage, and a jump down (distance up to your maximum vertical) would require a DEX acrobatics check to avoid damage and prone
2) a fall only if you or they end the grapple condition, or if they decide to fall too while still grappling you
3) teleporting resets fall speed (you start at 0 FPS/MPH) unless you fall through a portal or gate where it would be reasonable to conserve momentum (like in “Portal”, as opposed to “Nightcrawler” style teleporting)
4) damage only if the ability used to throw/move you says you take damage if you strike a surface, unless you also fall down as part of the throw
concerning momentum, having some time to think it over...
physics belongs in our world
magic is what rules in most, if not all, fantasy worlds (spelljammer mentions crystal spheres that you travel to and from... this doesn't exist in our world)
so given that, when you cast misty step and move 30 feet from one location to another you don't accrue that momentum, which seems to suggest teleportation negates momentum,,, even though you are not moving to begin with in that example and you are in the other, this is not a conclusive argument but it lends itself to the idea that teleportation negates momentum, this also simplifies the way the rules work.
So you're saying I cannot cast a bonus action spell as a reaction...
"Not all those who wander are lost"
That seems to be the consensus. I know I've asked something similar and the response was you are Reacting to the fall so neither Action nor Bonus Action is allowed. I'm not sure in the falling case there is any RAW where it defines these non-action actions, at least anywhere I could find, saying this is accurate but I'm not against the reasoning applied to the situation.
If you want more discussion outside of the limits of the rules, I suggest you post in a forum other than Rules and Game Mechanics and mention you are interested in opinions. I would let someone use Ready Action to use for a Bonus Action ability but, that's still a house ruling. As far as jumping and using an action is concerned, it could be well within the rights of the DM to say that making an Athletics(or other check) for the success of your jump IS your action. Alternatively, the could allow your Passive Athletics to make a jump. So many options.
I’m not sure anyone is saying the rules are wrong what’s going on in THIS thread has been a healthy discussion of the spell. All be it far from the original post of window jumping.
Making an Active Skill check can require an action. Look to specific examples like Hiding and Searching by using ability checks, they require an action. Depending on the situation, other ability checks reasonably could as well, that was all I was saying. I wasn't talking about DM fiat specifically.
Why wouldn’t you be able to cast the spell after you realize you aren’t going to make it a cross the gap when you jump? Just because you as a player are “reacting” to that new information doesn’t mean it requires a reaction to get out of it.
thats like saying you can’t use the two weapon fighting bonus action attack if a creature lives through your attack action, and ruling that a reaction based attack is necessary.
besides, who says you don’t realize you’re not gonna make the jump until after you’re falling? There have been plenty of times in my life where I’ve attempted to do something athletic and realized it’s not going to work the moment I’ve started the maneuver. You can be confident enough to try it, but the out come is still uncertain.
None of you have had that feeling where you try something and instantly know it’s not going to work out well? If only we could misty step.
it comes down to... if only misty step were a reaction to cast instead of a bonus action... may as well dream, if only my 30 foot of movement was flying movement
There are written rules that tell you that your 30 foot of movement isn't flying movement. There are no written rules that say a Bonus Action cannot be made while falling.
dndbeyond.com forum tags
I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
I haven't looked into all the rules concerning action, bonus actions, and reactions on your own turn... different combinations of what could be possible with the jumping or falling probably exist.
But when it's not your turn you only have reactions available.
Some of the posts on here suggest that Xanathar's is where the falling rules have been changed to say immediate but I can't help wonder how it would be handled if they weren't... I never thought of doing anything when I was told a fall was taking place, I always thought you couldn't do anything except maybe cast feather fall if you had the spell.