Hi all. Something I came up with when I did this build. I took Barbarian for RecklessAttack but Fighter etc. might work as well. You just need to reliably hit your target.
I think this tactic below is better than placing the Echo 5ft next to a target and (i) fishing for Echo opportunity attacks or (ii) making the target loose one attack or more to hit the Echo.
Ping-Pong attack: We basically play ping-pong with the target but this tactic should be discussed with the DM. DamagePerRound calculations in this postshow that it is outstanding but not game breaking.
Attack with Echo first (preferred):
The target is 10 or 15ft away from the Knight.
The Echo (DnD2014) attacks and pushes the target into the Knight's reach through the Push-WeaponMastery (see rule check below) and uses both regular attacks for it. If the Echo missed with both attacks, we try again with UnleashIncarnation.
If the Echo missed with both attacks and UnleashIncarnation, ping-pong is not possible and we terminate the maneuver. The target is out of the Knight‘s reach. In order to use the PoleStrike-BonusAction attack, we (i) either attack another target in the Knight's reach or (ii) the Knight moves towards the target, attacks at range with the PoleStrike-BonusAction attack and moves back such that the target is out of reach. That should be compatible with the word ‘immediately‘ in PoleStrike description.
The target has now entered the Knight'sreach.
The Knight attacks with a Reaction using ReactiveStrike from PolearmMaster (see rule check below) because the target enters the Knight's reach via the forced movement from the Echo. This works because ReactiveStrike is not an OpportunityAttack in DnD 2024 anymore. It was in DnD 2014 but they explicitly changed the wording. In DnD 2014, the trick doesn't work because forced movement does not provoke an OpportunityAttack.
The Knight attacks with the Polestrike-BonusAction attack.
If the first attack from the Echo hit, the Knight attacks with the second regular attack.
It would be best to end the turn with Echo at a save spot and the target 10ft out of Knight’s reach. This way we avoid to manifest the Echo as a BonusAction again (loosing one attack) and we stay out of close combat but lure the target to attack us entering our reach.
Start the new round with the Echo (preferred) or the Knight and try to ping-pong again.
Attack with Knight first:
The Echo (DnD2014) has been manifested already before combat. If it is not manifested because it was destroyed in the last round of combat, create the Echo with BonusAction. Since the PoleStrike-BonusAction attack is lost, the maneuver below is a bit risky to fail but it might gives us 3 attacks which is more than the 2 regular attacks and we have the setup for the next round. We might decide to not create the Echo, terminate this maneuver and safely have 3 attacks.
The Knight is in close combat with the target and cannot leave without provoking an OpportunityAttack. Otherwise, we attack with the Echo instead (see above).
The Knight attacks and pushes the target 10ft away through the Push-WeaponMastery (see rule check below) and uses one attack and the PoleStrike-BonusAction attack. If the first attack hits already, push the target and use BonusAction attack later this turn. If both attacks miss, ping-pong is not possible anymore, the Barbarian attacks with its second attack and ends the turn. If we did UnleashIncarnation next to the Barbarian, the next step would be too risky and it would waste a use of UnleashIncarnation.
The target has now left the Knight'sreach of the pike.
Place the Echo next to the target via ManifestEcho without consuming resources or actions and without provoking an opportunity attack.
The Echo attacks and pushes the target 5ft back into the Knight's reach using the second attack (see rule check below). If the Echo misses, we use UnleashIncarnation that grants the Echo an extra attack. Preferrably there is 5ft distance between the Knight and the target to avoid close combat.
The Knight attacks with a Reaction using ReactiveStrike from PolearmMaster (see rule check below) because the target enters the Knight's reach via the forced movement from the Echo.
If the first attack hit, we use the BonusAction attack now.
It would be best to end the turn with Echo at a save spot and the target 10ft out of Knight’s reach.
Start the new round with the Echo (preferred) or the Knight and try to ping-pong again.
Rule check "Echo and Push":
Mastery Properties: Each weapon has a mastery property, which is usable only by a character who has a feature, such as Weapon Mastery, that unlocks the property for the character. The properties are defined below.
Manifest Echo: When you take the Attack action on your turn, any attack you make with that action can originate from your space or the echo's space. You make this choice for each attack.
Push: If you hit a creature with this weapon, you can push the creature up to 10 feet straight away from yourself if it is Large or smaller.
We place the Echo next to a target and out of the Knight's reach. We attack with the Knight who is eligible to the WeaponMastery Push from a pike and this unlocks the property. ManifiestEcho states the attacks "originate from your space or the Echo's space". That means, the Knight attacks but the attack is delivered through the Echo to the target. So upon a hit with the weapon, the mastery effect happens at the target and the creature is pushed "10 feet straight away from yourself". That can also be just 5ft or 0ft. Since the attack originates from the Echo's space, the target's movement follows the direction of the attack blow through the Echo. That is how billiard works. Push follows this principle by stating "straight away“. Therefore, the target is pushed straight away from the Echo and not from the Knight.
ManifiestEcho clarifies that the Knight can only use the attack action for the Echo. Hence, neither PoleStrike-BonusAction nor ReactiveStrike-Reaction work on the Echo. Some more rules for the Echo in this post.
Rule check "Push triggers ReactiveStrike":
Polearm Master - Reactive Strike: While you're holding a Quarterstaff, a Spear, or a weapon that has the Heavy and Reach properties, you can take a Reaction to make one melee attack against a creature that enters the reach you have with that weapon.
Avoiding Opportunity Attacks: ... You also don’t provoke an Opportunity Attack when you teleport or when you are moved without using your movement, action, Bonus Action, or Reaction. For example, you don’t provoke an Opportunity Attack if an explosion hurls you out of a foe’s reach or if you fall past an enemy.
If a target is moved without using its movement (called forced movement), it avoids opportunity attacks. This is identical to D&D2014. However, in D&D2024 ReactiveStrike defines that the Reaction attack is not an opportunity attack which is different to D&D2014. Therefore, forced movement can trigger ReactiveStrike. Note this is nowhere forbidden. When the Echo pushes the target to the Knight and into the polearm reach, the Knight attacks the target with its Reaction.
I think they changed this wording to nerf the PAM+Sentinel combo that in DnD2014 stops anything that approaches the Knight.
Hi all. Something I came up with when I did this build. I took Barbarian for RecklessAttack but Fighter etc. might work as well. You just need to reliably hit your target.
I think this tactic below is better than placing the Echo 5ft next to a target and (i) fishing for Echo opportunity attacks or (ii) making the target loose one attack or more to hit the Echo.
Ping-Pong attack: We basically play ping-pong with the target but this tactic should be discussed with the DM. DamagePerRound calculations in this post show that it is outstanding but not game breaking.
Attack with Echo first (preferred):
Attack with Knight first:
Rule check "Echo and Push":
Mastery Properties: Each weapon has a mastery property, which is usable only by a character who has a feature, such as Weapon Mastery, that unlocks the property for the character. The properties are defined below.
Manifest Echo: When you take the Attack action on your turn, any attack you make with that action can originate from your space or the echo's space. You make this choice for each attack.
Push: If you hit a creature with this weapon, you can push the creature up to 10 feet straight away from yourself if it is Large or smaller.
We place the Echo next to a target and out of the Knight's reach. We attack with the Knight who is eligible to the WeaponMastery Push from a pike and this unlocks the property. ManifiestEcho states the attacks "originate from your space or the Echo's space". That means, the Knight attacks but the attack is delivered through the Echo to the target. So upon a hit with the weapon, the mastery effect happens at the target and the creature is pushed "10 feet straight away from yourself". That can also be just 5ft or 0ft. Since the attack originates from the Echo's space, the target's movement follows the direction of the attack blow through the Echo. That is how billiard works. Push follows this principle by stating "straight away“. Therefore, the target is pushed straight away from the Echo and not from the Knight.
ManifiestEcho clarifies that the Knight can only use the attack action for the Echo. Hence, neither PoleStrike-BonusAction nor ReactiveStrike-Reaction work on the Echo. Some more rules for the Echo in this post.
Rule check "Push triggers ReactiveStrike":
Polearm Master - Reactive Strike: While you're holding a Quarterstaff, a Spear, or a weapon that has the Heavy and Reach properties, you can take a Reaction to make one melee attack against a creature that enters the reach you have with that weapon.
Avoiding Opportunity Attacks: ... You also don’t provoke an Opportunity Attack when you teleport or when you are moved without using your movement, action, Bonus Action, or Reaction. For example, you don’t provoke an Opportunity Attack if an explosion hurls you out of a foe’s reach or if you fall past an enemy.
If a target is moved without using its movement (called forced movement), it avoids opportunity attacks. This is identical to D&D2014. However, in D&D2024 ReactiveStrike defines that the Reaction attack is not an opportunity attack which is different to D&D2014. Therefore, forced movement can trigger ReactiveStrike. Note this is nowhere forbidden. When the Echo pushes the target to the Knight and into the polearm reach, the Knight attacks the target with its Reaction.
I think they changed this wording to nerf the PAM+Sentinel combo that in DnD2014 stops anything that approaches the Knight.