So my party has a "get rich quick scheme" and we're failing to see any flaws in it. I'm sure there's something so I'm opening this thread to find out lol.
ATTENTION: We are mainly doing this to mess with our DM. The whole table has been friends for a VERY long time (outside of DnD) and we all understand that at the end of the day, if the DM says he really doesn't want us to do it, we'll all say "ok" and move on, no questions asked. BUT: We do wanna see what he comes up with to catch us lol.
This scam involves 3 party members: the Artificer (A), the Changling Bard/Rouge (CB) and the Wizard (W)
Step 1: W makes silver rings from Silver pieces using the Fabricate Spell
Step 2: A Infuses rings with Water Walking
Step 3: CB Pawns off items to magic shop (our world is high magic with multiple magic shops in major cities)
Step 4: Wait until out of sight, CB changes forms. A drops infusion
Step 5: Repeat at different shop
Step 6: Stop once rumors of "Water-Walk ring scam" spreads
We keep looking for reasons the DM could use to stop us and all we can come up with are reeeeeeally convenient BS reasons such as "The shopkeeper just so happens to have passive truesight and see's the changling and gets suspicious and uses locate creature to hunt them down" Which is pretty much just a DM saying "No"
Once again, if our DM really doesn't want us to do this, We'll gladly retcon it away and pretend it didn't happen. This is mainly a "without DM-intervention, could we get away with this" lol
One thing that could go wrong: If the shopkeeper realises the ring isn't a permanent magic item. If the keeper is proficient in stuff like this he might look through this.
Second thing: the Artificer can only infuse one ring of water walking at the same time (can't have more than one of the same infusion - you could do different stuff) . This also can only be done after finishing a long rest, so one scam a day.
Lastly: If your lvl 9 + (asuming since the wizard can cast fabricate) there might be better scams to pull off. But hey go for it!
Well for one, Fabricate specifies raw materials, giving examples of: a clump of trees, a patch of hemp, and flax or wool. Silver pieces not raw materials; you'd need raw ore or potentially ingots if your DM is feeling generous. Also, the caster must have proficiency in jeweler's tools if they want to create jewelry.
And as the others have said, in a high magic world where Artificer is a known thing, people who deal in magic items would likely be able to spot an infusion from a mile away.
That being said, I could see a DM willing to go along with this. Just be prepared for consequences - nothing is ever truly free.
As Sutlo says - you can only infuse one of each infusion at a time. So you can only ever sell one ring to each shop. Secondly - you can't willingly drop an infusion. The only way to drop them is to die or infuse more items than you can have infused - so your oldest infusion fades - and this can only be done at the end of a long rest.
And I agree with the others that an identify spell will likely show that the item is an infusion rather than a true enchanted magical item - especially in a high magic setting.
This is totally acceptable for a chaotic evil party. Chaotic because it's a law-breaking scam, evil because you're intentionally harming another creature (or at the least, their livelihood) for nothing but your own gain. I guess you could argue that it's only Chaotic Neutral if you're scamming a huge business that won't even notice the loss, or Chaotic Good if somehow you're damaging an evil institution. I know many DMs don't use alignment for players anymore, but I still do (there are some items like Talisman of Pure Good that require them).
Here is what I would do if I were your DM:
All alignments in the party forcibly change to Chaotic Neutral/Evil as described above. This may or may not have any effect on your campaign.
The scammed victim is going to be mad. Depending on who they are, and how much you are selling the Rings for, they will enlist:
The local law enforcement, if there is any
Local thieves guild or other underworld types, if they are more aligned that way
I would then run reasonable NPCs tracking you down, based on the above, as though they are on a quest of their own. The law enforcers/thieves would have to be appropriate for the region they're coming from - in a high level campaign, this could involve a party of rival adventurers, in a low level campaign they might set a group of wererat assassins on you etc.
If your faces and names are known, you're outlawed from the city and your descriptions spread to all prominent magic item sellers.
Magic item sellers in the area begin using True Sight giving magical items and begin to set traps for the scammers, accepting the ring and then giving you a magically tracked gold coin. The coin leads powerful bounty hunters to you.
That's basically how I'd run it anyway. I don't think that there's anything to criticise about running a scam provided that you're happy playing the bad guys, and your DM can enjoy adding in some new challenges for you to face as a result.
Thanks all! All valid claims! I figured there was something that my party just couldn't quite think of! I fully agree that in a world where there's multiple magic shops in a town, and artificers are a thing, there HAS to be safeguards against this exact thing.
Now its just a matter of "will my DM figure it out" lol
In all honesty, I don't think we'll actually do it. We just like making the DM sweat, but ultimately, we don't want the campaign broken any more than he does xD
artificers can create bags of holding, you could hold an auction for it and anything inside, later (1/2 days) dropping the infusion (and if your DM lets you) make another bag of holding and get anything they put in the bag. (obviously using disguise self or disguise kit)
artificers can create bags of holding, you could hold an auction for it and anything inside, later (1/2 days) dropping the infusion (and if your DM lets you) make another bag of holding and get anything they put in the bag. (obviously using disguise self or disguise kit)
EDIT: a scam idea, not a flaw with your scam.
Shame about the line in the Artificer class that says "If an infusion ends on an item that contains other things, like a bag of holding, its contents harmlessly appear in and around its space."
artificers can create bags of holding, you could hold an auction for it and anything inside, later (1/2 days) dropping the infusion (and if your DM lets you) make another bag of holding and get anything they put in the bag. (obviously using disguise self or disguise kit)
EDIT: a scam idea, not a flaw with your scam.
Shame about the line in the Artificer class that says "If an infusion ends on an item that contains other things, like a bag of holding, its contents harmlessly appear in and around its space."
Shop where magic items are sold, absolutely not. Any respectable shop keeper would either cast identify or dispel magic to see if it's a fake. Now selling to the general populace at the docks as a floatation device for trips while using disguise self, that would be a way to go. Probably won't make as much money, but would be able to do it for a while until some of the boats start returning.
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So my party has a "get rich quick scheme" and we're failing to see any flaws in it. I'm sure there's something so I'm opening this thread to find out lol.
ATTENTION: We are mainly doing this to mess with our DM. The whole table has been friends for a VERY long time (outside of DnD) and we all understand that at the end of the day, if the DM says he really doesn't want us to do it, we'll all say "ok" and move on, no questions asked. BUT: We do wanna see what he comes up with to catch us lol.
This scam involves 3 party members: the Artificer (A), the Changling Bard/Rouge (CB) and the Wizard (W)
Step 1: W makes silver rings from Silver pieces using the Fabricate Spell
Step 2: A Infuses rings with Water Walking
Step 3: CB Pawns off items to magic shop (our world is high magic with multiple magic shops in major cities)
Step 4: Wait until out of sight, CB changes forms. A drops infusion
Step 5: Repeat at different shop
Step 6: Stop once rumors of "Water-Walk ring scam" spreads
We keep looking for reasons the DM could use to stop us and all we can come up with are reeeeeeally convenient BS reasons such as "The shopkeeper just so happens to have passive truesight and see's the changling and gets suspicious and uses locate creature to hunt them down" Which is pretty much just a DM saying "No"
Once again, if our DM really doesn't want us to do this, We'll gladly retcon it away and pretend it didn't happen. This is mainly a "without DM-intervention, could we get away with this" lol
One thing that could go wrong: If the shopkeeper realises the ring isn't a permanent magic item. If the keeper is proficient in stuff like this he might look through this.
Second thing: the Artificer can only infuse one ring of water walking at the same time (can't have more than one of the same infusion - you could do different stuff) . This also can only be done after finishing a long rest, so one scam a day.
Lastly: If your lvl 9 + (asuming since the wizard can cast fabricate) there might be better scams to pull off. But hey go for it!
Yeah I feel like any competent shopkeep in a high magic world would be able to see right through the "fake magic item" trick.
Well for one, Fabricate specifies raw materials, giving examples of: a clump of trees, a patch of hemp, and flax or wool. Silver pieces not raw materials; you'd need raw ore or potentially ingots if your DM is feeling generous. Also, the caster must have proficiency in jeweler's tools if they want to create jewelry.
And as the others have said, in a high magic world where Artificer is a known thing, people who deal in magic items would likely be able to spot an infusion from a mile away.
That being said, I could see a DM willing to go along with this. Just be prepared for consequences - nothing is ever truly free.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm
As Sutlo says - you can only infuse one of each infusion at a time. So you can only ever sell one ring to each shop. Secondly - you can't willingly drop an infusion. The only way to drop them is to die or infuse more items than you can have infused - so your oldest infusion fades - and this can only be done at the end of a long rest.
And I agree with the others that an identify spell will likely show that the item is an infusion rather than a true enchanted magical item - especially in a high magic setting.
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This is totally acceptable for a chaotic evil party. Chaotic because it's a law-breaking scam, evil because you're intentionally harming another creature (or at the least, their livelihood) for nothing but your own gain. I guess you could argue that it's only Chaotic Neutral if you're scamming a huge business that won't even notice the loss, or Chaotic Good if somehow you're damaging an evil institution. I know many DMs don't use alignment for players anymore, but I still do (there are some items like Talisman of Pure Good that require them).
Here is what I would do if I were your DM:
That's basically how I'd run it anyway. I don't think that there's anything to criticise about running a scam provided that you're happy playing the bad guys, and your DM can enjoy adding in some new challenges for you to face as a result.
Thanks all! All valid claims! I figured there was something that my party just couldn't quite think of! I fully agree that in a world where there's multiple magic shops in a town, and artificers are a thing, there HAS to be safeguards against this exact thing.
Now its just a matter of "will my DM figure it out" lol
In all honesty, I don't think we'll actually do it. We just like making the DM sweat, but ultimately, we don't want the campaign broken any more than he does xD
The spell Identify may reveal that the item is infused rather than a magic item. Not necessarily RAW, but I see a point to be made as RAI.
More Interesting Lock Picking Rules
I would say that one of the properties of an infused item is its limited lifespan. So entirely RAW.
artificers can create bags of holding, you could hold an auction for it and anything inside, later (1/2 days) dropping the infusion (and if your DM lets you) make another bag of holding and get anything they put in the bag. (obviously using disguise self or disguise kit)
EDIT: a scam idea, not a flaw with your scam.
Shame about the line in the Artificer class that says "If an infusion ends on an item that contains other things, like a bag of holding, its contents harmlessly appear in and around its space."
ah, that sucks
Shop where magic items are sold, absolutely not. Any respectable shop keeper would either cast identify or dispel magic to see if it's a fake. Now selling to the general populace at the docks as a floatation device for trips while using disguise self, that would be a way to go. Probably won't make as much money, but would be able to do it for a while until some of the boats start returning.