so... i have a character that is a rune knight and sorcerer. he can use giants might and cast enlarge. would me melee attack range increase to 10ft or 15ft depending if i'm large or huge? it seems strange if my PC is huge and only has a reach of 5ft. i couldn't find anything about this through my own research, so hopefully i'll get an answear here :)
hmh, it sounds so wierd. i would at least expect you to get a 10ft range on melee attacks if you were a huge PC. longer arms longer reach if we think logicaly about it. i also find it wierd that it hasn't been adressed in any of the expansion books yet. but allas, nothing much i can do about it unless DM rules otherwise. ty for the reply though :)
so... i have a character that is a rune knight and sorcerer. he can use giants might and cast enlarge. would me melee attack range increase to 10ft or 15ft depending if i'm large or huge? it seems strange if my PC is huge and only has a reach of 5ft. i couldn't find anything about this through my own research, so hopefully i'll get an answear here :)
Your native reach won't increase at all, but by the same token, monsters don't have a well-defined native reach; your DM has to make a house rule for most of them when they engage in unarmed strikes (e.g. due to a Moon Druid/Monk wild shaping into them and wanting to do it). When a large or huge weapon wielder has more than 5 feet of reach with a melee weapon, it's anyone's guess (i.e. your DM's decision) how much of that is due to the weapon and how much is due to the monster.
So if you're huge and you pick up a fire giant's greatsword, what's your reach with it? Now, here I picked a very specific example, because fire giant dreadnoughts definitely only have 5 feet of reach, which may or may not persuade your DM that the fire giant greatsword itself grants 10-foot reach.
so... i have a character that is a rune knight and sorcerer. he can use giants might and cast enlarge. would me melee attack range increase to 10ft or 15ft depending if i'm large or huge? it seems strange if my PC is huge and only has a reach of 5ft. i couldn't find anything about this through my own research, so hopefully i'll get an answear here :)
There is no default rule about a creature's default melee reach being more than 5' at certain Sizes. There are plenty of specific monster stat blocks for big creatures that have >5' reach, but only when explicitly stated. So if neither Giant's Might nor Englarge state that your reach increases(they don't), then it doesn't. You'd have to wait until you're an 18th-level Rune Knight, where Runic Juggernaut increases your reach if you choose to go up to size Huge with that ability(going Large then casting Englarge does NOT trigger this increase).
hmh, it sounds so wierd. i would at least expect you to get a 10ft range on melee attacks if you were a huge PC. longer arms longer reach if we think logicaly about it. i also find it wierd that it hasn't been adressed in any of the expansion books yet. but allas, nothing much i can do about it unless DM rules otherwise. ty for the reply though :)
It still does in a certain way if you think about it. By increasing size, you increase spaces you threaten and in which you can attack. In squares or 5 feet increment spaces you can reach into, you have;
Size M : 8 squares
Size L: 12 squares
Size H: 16 squares
Given that perspective, a Size M creature being enlarge to size H can attack some space up to 15 feet away from the space he occupied as size M. It's just that these spaces must still be adjacent to the spaces he occupies. If you count spaces you occupy, the number of squares or 5 feet spaces you can reach into to attack is 9/16/24 and this is significant in itself.
hmh, it sounds so wierd. i would at least expect you to get a 10ft range on melee attacks if you were a huge PC. longer arms longer reach if we think logicaly about it. i also find it wierd that it hasn't been adressed in any of the expansion books yet. but allas, nothing much i can do about it unless DM rules otherwise. ty for the reply though :)
It kind of is addressed in the Rune Knight's level 18 ability which does specifically state your reach increases. It sets a precedent that size and reach are decoupled and something doesn't increase your reach unless it says so. I believe there are probably other examples outside of monster design, but you really only need one to kill any idea of some kind of unspoken rule that PC size increases automatically grant reach increases.
Personally, I like to think that the reason a huge Runic Juggernaut has reach and a huge lower-level Rune Knight with Enlarge doesn't is because stacking two different enlarge effects doesn't work perfectly and transforms you into some weird disproportionate aberration. But that's just me.
Increasing size doesn't inherently increase your reach unless noted otherwise. You have a larger ammount of spaces you threaten though.
Right. On a square grid a medium creature with 5' reach occupies 1 square and can reach 8 others. A large creature occupies 4 square and can reach the adjacent 12. A huge creature occupies 9 and reaches 16.
On a hex grid, medium occupies 1 hex and reaches 6. Large occupies 3 hexes and reaches 9. Huge occupies 7 and reaches 12.
I think the increase in the size of your arms factors into the number of squares you occupy, not your reach beyond those. A large humanoid creature's stance still only spans maybe 6 feet. His armspan could be 10 feet, and by shifting his weight he can reach just outside this.
I might house rule that if their weapon is also enlarged by the effect, they can get 5' extra reach, depending on the weapon. A doubled dagger doesn't have 10' reach, but a doubled longsword might. A naturally 10' reach weapon like a lance or whip goes to 15', not doubled all the way to 20'. That would be excessive.
Zee bashew on YouTube has a video on this subject and a large creatures melee range 12 squares equals 5 feet it gets worse if you have a large glaive another 12 squares plus reach another 12 and if it was a battle Master with lunging attack When you make a melee weapon attack on your turn, you can expend one superiority die to increase your reach for that attack by 5 feet. Another 12 squares If you hit, you add the superiority die to the attack's damage roll this is a ****ed thing to think about also large weapons do a die more of damage im not even getting into battle masters pushing attack 15 feet but since your large 12×3 thus you can't be hit and you hit people like a golf ball with your 2d10 glaive
Well, you can't be both a Battle Master and a Rune Knight, since they're both Fighter subclasses; though you can certainly take the Superior Technique fighting style to gain one (1) Battle Master maneuver.
When Enlarged/Giantified, your damage with your "large" weapons isn't doubled; Enlarge only gives you an extra 1d4 damage, while Giant's Might gives you an extra 1d6 damage to one attack (increasing to 1d8 and then 1d10 at level 18). So sure, you can deal 2d10 damage with your Glaive... once per turn, at level 18.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Helpful rewriter of Japanese->English translation and delver into software codebases (she/e/they)
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
so... i have a character that is a rune knight and sorcerer. he can use giants might and cast enlarge. would me melee attack range increase to 10ft or 15ft depending if i'm large or huge? it seems strange if my PC is huge and only has a reach of 5ft. i couldn't find anything about this through my own research, so hopefully i'll get an answear here :)
Increasing size doesn't inherently increase your reach unless noted otherwise. You have a larger ammount of spaces you threaten though.
hmh, it sounds so wierd. i would at least expect you to get a 10ft range on melee attacks if you were a huge PC. longer arms longer reach if we think logicaly about it. i also find it wierd that it hasn't been adressed in any of the expansion books yet. but allas, nothing much i can do about it unless DM rules otherwise. ty for the reply though :)
Your native reach won't increase at all, but by the same token, monsters don't have a well-defined native reach; your DM has to make a house rule for most of them when they engage in unarmed strikes (e.g. due to a Moon Druid/Monk wild shaping into them and wanting to do it). When a large or huge weapon wielder has more than 5 feet of reach with a melee weapon, it's anyone's guess (i.e. your DM's decision) how much of that is due to the weapon and how much is due to the monster.
So if you're huge and you pick up a fire giant's greatsword, what's your reach with it? Now, here I picked a very specific example, because fire giant dreadnoughts definitely only have 5 feet of reach, which may or may not persuade your DM that the fire giant greatsword itself grants 10-foot reach.
fair enough. main thing was reach without any weapons, but i see what you mean
It's one of those things where there are tons of examples of it, but it is not a rule.
There is no default rule about a creature's default melee reach being more than 5' at certain Sizes. There are plenty of specific monster stat blocks for big creatures that have >5' reach, but only when explicitly stated. So if neither Giant's Might nor Englarge state that your reach increases(they don't), then it doesn't. You'd have to wait until you're an 18th-level Rune Knight, where Runic Juggernaut increases your reach if you choose to go up to size Huge with that ability(going Large then casting Englarge does NOT trigger this increase).
It still does in a certain way if you think about it. By increasing size, you increase spaces you threaten and in which you can attack. In squares or 5 feet increment spaces you can reach into, you have;
Size M : 8 squares
Size L: 12 squares
Size H: 16 squares
Given that perspective, a Size M creature being enlarge to size H can attack some space up to 15 feet away from the space he occupied as size M. It's just that these spaces must still be adjacent to the spaces he occupies. If you count spaces you occupy, the number of squares or 5 feet spaces you can reach into to attack is 9/16/24 and this is significant in itself.
It kind of is addressed in the Rune Knight's level 18 ability which does specifically state your reach increases. It sets a precedent that size and reach are decoupled and something doesn't increase your reach unless it says so. I believe there are probably other examples outside of monster design, but you really only need one to kill any idea of some kind of unspoken rule that PC size increases automatically grant reach increases.
Personally, I like to think that the reason a huge Runic Juggernaut has reach and a huge lower-level Rune Knight with Enlarge doesn't is because stacking two different enlarge effects doesn't work perfectly and transforms you into some weird disproportionate aberration. But that's just me.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm
Right. On a square grid a medium creature with 5' reach occupies 1 square and can reach 8 others. A large creature occupies 4 square and can reach the adjacent 12. A huge creature occupies 9 and reaches 16.
On a hex grid, medium occupies 1 hex and reaches 6. Large occupies 3 hexes and reaches 9. Huge occupies 7 and reaches 12.
I think the increase in the size of your arms factors into the number of squares you occupy, not your reach beyond those. A large humanoid creature's stance still only spans maybe 6 feet. His armspan could be 10 feet, and by shifting his weight he can reach just outside this.
I might house rule that if their weapon is also enlarged by the effect, they can get 5' extra reach, depending on the weapon. A doubled dagger doesn't have 10' reach, but a doubled longsword might. A naturally 10' reach weapon like a lance or whip goes to 15', not doubled all the way to 20'. That would be excessive.
Zee bashew on YouTube has a video on this subject and a large creatures melee range 12 squares equals 5 feet it gets worse if you have a large glaive another 12 squares plus reach another 12 and if it was a battle Master with lunging attack When you make a melee weapon attack on your turn, you can expend one superiority die to increase your reach for that attack by 5 feet. Another 12 squares If you hit, you add the superiority die to the attack's damage roll this is a ****ed thing to think about also large weapons do a die more of damage im not even getting into battle masters pushing attack 15 feet but since your large 12×3 thus you can't be hit and you hit people like a golf ball with your 2d10 glaive
Well, you can't be both a Battle Master and a Rune Knight, since they're both Fighter subclasses; though you can certainly take the Superior Technique fighting style to gain one (1) Battle Master maneuver.
When Enlarged/Giantified, your damage with your "large" weapons isn't doubled; Enlarge only gives you an extra 1d4 damage, while Giant's Might gives you an extra 1d6 damage to one attack (increasing to 1d8 and then 1d10 at level 18). So sure, you can deal 2d10 damage with your Glaive... once per turn, at level 18.
Helpful rewriter of Japanese->English translation and delver into software codebases (she/e/they)