conversational inquire: as per TcoE (tasha's) an artifice can replicate magic item any common magic item as long as it is not a potion or a spell scroll. Rules as written.
and no i do not think rules as implied applies here.
does not say anything about consumables in general. otherwise Bead of Nourishment from XgtE would not apply. the magic item Spellwrought Tattoo has a common version. does not require attunement. and it is not a potion and/or a scroll. the way this tattoo is written it is not clear how a artificer can replicate this item AND it's effects.
Spellwrought Tattoo
Source: Tasha's Cauldron of Everything
Wondrous item (tattoo), rarity varies
Produced by a special needle, this magic tattoo contains a single spell of up to 5th level, wrought on your skin by a magic needle. To use the tattoo, you must hold the needle against your skin and speak the command word. The needle turns into ink that becomes the tattoo, which appears on the skin in whatever design you like. Once the tattoo is there, you can cast its spell, requiring no material components. The tattoo glows faintly while you cast the spell and for the spell's duration. Once the spell ends, the tattoo vanishes from your skin.
The level of the spell in the tattoo determines the spell's saving throw DC, attack bonus, spellcasting ability modifier, and the tattoo's rarity, as shown in the Spellwrought Tattoo table.
i have looked on the internet for this topic and have not found an answer. i can assume but that leaves a lot of room to play with. such as allowing an artificer to turn any mundane tattoo needle into any spell that an artificer can cast to get an extra spell the next day. i could also assume the spell would be random... for that matter once the needle is a tattoo is it still an infusion? if not that would mean an artificer can replicate Spellwrought Tattoo once everyday, by using a tattoo needle as the mundane item, to stack up on first level tattoo spells. without needing a spell slot to cast them later.
without and hard rulings i do agree it would have to be DM dependent. i am trying to get hard rulings first though.
While it is a kind of grey area... i think 2 things should probably be kept in mind.
While not explicitely stated, you may run into issues with the fact that the Spellwrought Tattoo is effectively a different kind of scroll. it's just not blatantly called out as such. potions and scrolls are also the largest bulk of single use or limited use magical items with only a few exceptions (such as this tattoo) so that may be grounds for treating them similarly even if you keep them totally seperate and distinct from spell scrolls.
The other i will touch on a question you ask. Whether as the needle or as the tattoo they are still the same magical item. Removing attunement on the tattoo actually reverts it back to the needle. So even if you could bypass the issue of scrolls because of lack of explicit statement, it would still be an infusion that is active until it is used. you wouldn't be able to create the needle, turn it into a tattoo, and then simply be able to create another without destroying the tattoo because of the inherent nature of that particular kind of magical item.
While it is a kind of grey area... i think 2 things should probably be kept in mind.
While not explicitly stated, you may run into issues with the fact that the Spellwrought Tattoo is effectively a different kind of scroll. it's just not blatantly called out as such. potions and scrolls are also the largest bulk of single use or limited use magical items with only a few exceptions (such as this tattoo) so that may be grounds for treating them similarly even if you keep them totally separate and distinct from spell scrolls.
The other i will touch on a question you ask. Whether as the needle or as the tattoo they are still the same magical item. Removing attunement on the tattoo actually reverts it back to the needle. So even if you could bypass the issue of scrolls because of lack of explicit statement, it would still be an infusion that is active until it is used. you wouldn't be able to create the needle, turn it into a tattoo, and then simply be able to create another without destroying the tattoo because of the inherent nature of that particular kind of magical item.
gray area - agreed - hence the post in the first place still not a scroll, hence the gray area also it does not require attunement as well as the fact it is the only tattoo that CAN'T be reverted back into a needle
the next question is - was this intentionally left this way or was it an oversight missed by WotC?
practical ruling - it's a scroll and should be treated as such
intentional? I doubt it. Common items are generally quite weak and not exploitable, and a cursory search to check for issues might have missed 'rarity varies' items, especially new ones.
As long as it is limited to a single familiar total created by the tattoo it's not that bad of an infusion.
Technically that's a houserule. Find Familiar has an Instantaneous duration, meaning a summoned familiar is permanent until it dies or is dismissed, then the Artificer would be free to recreate the infusion the next day and give another person the tattoo to use. So a level 2 Artificer can equip as many people as they want with a familiar each, once per long rest.
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Canto alla vita alla sua bellezza ad ogni sua ferita ogni sua carezza!
I sing to life and to its tragic beauty To pain and to strife, but all that dances through me The rise and the fall, I've lived through it all!
As long as it is limited to a single familiar total created by the tattoo it's not that bad of an infusion.
Technically that's a houserule. Find Familiar has an Instantaneous duration, meaning a summoned familiar is permanent until it dies or is dismissed, then the Artificer would be free to recreate the infusion the next day and give another person the tattoo to use. So a level 2 Artificer can equip as many people as they want with a familiar each, once per long rest.
The Thing is that the familiar is weak and fairly useless for most other than out of combat flavor so they are unlikely to come under major threat and be replaced. That being said, it would also mean they have almost no affect at all on game balance since they do die so easily if a group were try to use them for much in combat.
The Thing is that the familiar is weak and fairly useless for most other than out of combat flavor so they are unlikely to come under major threat and be replaced. That being said, it would also mean they have almost no affect at all on game balance since they do die so easily if a group were try to use them for much in combat.
This hasn't been my experience. I find that wizards using their familiars effectively in combat either have an owl do a flyby Help action and then retreat to a safer position, or they have their familiar perch on a shoulder and Ready a Help action for when they get within melee range, giving a nice little Advantage attack to the PC they are mounted on. I have found that most enemies tend not to prioritize a familiar because they cannot attack, but even if they do, having a familiar take one attack is one more attack not aimed at a PC so they are useful even in their death. Area spells are their bane, of course.
And out of combat yes, they are even more useful. Scouting and infiltration using the "dismiss to pocket realm and resummon in a locked room as long as you can get within 30 feet" trick are very handy.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Canto alla vita alla sua bellezza ad ogni sua ferita ogni sua carezza!
I sing to life and to its tragic beauty To pain and to strife, but all that dances through me The rise and the fall, I've lived through it all!
If most enemies in your games do not Prioritize Familiars you should thank your DM. In my games they are easy targets and are often taken out as such. Or get nailed incidentally when the AoE's start flying. Even Flyby cannot necessarily always get them out of the danger range of some of those spells.
I'd also thank your DM for making all of those locked rooms you conveniently need to spy into so easily accessable as well.
Mileage is going to certainly vary when it comes to these experiences and not all players should expect them to work so readily or so easily.
Also Help Command and Readied Actions doesn't necessarily work with things like flyby because the Familiar tends to be either acting on your turn or their own turn and thus holding that action needs them to be in the right position when the time comes to be able to make those affects which causes them to have to linger around a spot quite a bit.
If most enemies in your games do not Prioritize Familiars you should thank your DM.
My DM will not hesitate to take them out when they're scouting, because they're alone, but in the middle of combat the PC's pose a much bigger threat and the enemies will turn their attacks and controlling moves on us first. I think it's perfectly logical.
Also Help Command and Readied Actions doesn't necessarily work with things like flyby because the Familiar tends to be either acting on your turn or their own turn and thus holding that action needs them to be in the right position when the time comes to be able to make those affects which causes them to have to linger around a spot quite a bit.
Sitting on the shoulders of a PC and Readying an action to Help when they get within melee range works perfectly fine because they are being moved by their self controlled mount, the PC. This gives that PC Advantage on the first attack against the first enemy they approach within melee range of basically every round.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Canto alla vita alla sua bellezza ad ogni sua ferita ogni sua carezza!
I sing to life and to its tragic beauty To pain and to strife, but all that dances through me The rise and the fall, I've lived through it all!
You may have just been giving an example, but I had assumed it would be restricted by what spells an Artificer would know. But this conversation make me think perhaps it could be open to any spell.
Of course DM discretion...but access to any spell from any class?? (Giddy at the prospect)
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conversational inquire:
as per TcoE (tasha's) an artifice can replicate magic item any common magic item as long as it is not a potion or a spell scroll. Rules as written.
and no i do not think rules as implied applies here.
does not say anything about consumables in general. otherwise Bead of Nourishment from XgtE would not apply.
the magic item Spellwrought Tattoo has a common version. does not require attunement. and it is not a potion and/or a scroll.
the way this tattoo is written it is not clear how a artificer can replicate this item AND it's effects.
Spellwrought Tattoo
Source: Tasha's Cauldron of Everything
Wondrous item (tattoo), rarity varies
Produced by a special needle, this magic tattoo contains a single spell of up to 5th level, wrought on your skin by a magic needle. To use the tattoo, you must hold the needle against your skin and speak the command word. The needle turns into ink that becomes the tattoo, which appears on the skin in whatever design you like. Once the tattoo is there, you can cast its spell, requiring no material components. The tattoo glows faintly while you cast the spell and for the spell's duration. Once the spell ends, the tattoo vanishes from your skin.
The level of the spell in the tattoo determines the spell's saving throw DC, attack bonus, spellcasting ability modifier, and the tattoo's rarity, as shown in the Spellwrought Tattoo table.
i have looked on the internet for this topic and have not found an answer.
i can assume but that leaves a lot of room to play with. such as allowing an artificer to turn any mundane tattoo needle into any spell that an artificer can cast to get an extra spell the next day.
i could also assume the spell would be random...
for that matter once the needle is a tattoo is it still an infusion? if not that would mean an artificer can replicate Spellwrought Tattoo once everyday, by using a tattoo needle as the mundane item, to stack up on first level tattoo spells. without needing a spell slot to cast them later.
without and hard rulings i do agree it would have to be DM dependent. i am trying to get hard rulings first though.
this is hurting my head.
While it is a kind of grey area... i think 2 things should probably be kept in mind.
While not explicitely stated, you may run into issues with the fact that the Spellwrought Tattoo is effectively a different kind of scroll. it's just not blatantly called out as such. potions and scrolls are also the largest bulk of single use or limited use magical items with only a few exceptions (such as this tattoo) so that may be grounds for treating them similarly even if you keep them totally seperate and distinct from spell scrolls.
The other i will touch on a question you ask. Whether as the needle or as the tattoo they are still the same magical item. Removing attunement on the tattoo actually reverts it back to the needle. So even if you could bypass the issue of scrolls because of lack of explicit statement, it would still be an infusion that is active until it is used. you wouldn't be able to create the needle, turn it into a tattoo, and then simply be able to create another without destroying the tattoo because of the inherent nature of that particular kind of magical item.
gray area - agreed - hence the post in the first place
still not a scroll, hence the gray area
also it does not require attunement as well as the fact it is the only tattoo that CAN'T be reverted back into a needle
the next question is - was this intentionally left this way or was it an oversight missed by WotC?
hard ruling - it works
practical ruling - it's a scroll and should be treated as such
intentional? I doubt it. Common items are generally quite weak and not exploitable, and a cursory search to check for issues might have missed 'rarity varies' items, especially new ones.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm
RAW it works, but it allows such things as a level 2 Artificer handing out familiars to everyone in the party.
Canto alla vita
alla sua bellezza
ad ogni sua ferita
ogni sua carezza!
I sing to life and to its tragic beauty
To pain and to strife, but all that dances through me
The rise and the fall, I've lived through it all!
Technically that's a houserule. Find Familiar has an Instantaneous duration, meaning a summoned familiar is permanent until it dies or is dismissed, then the Artificer would be free to recreate the infusion the next day and give another person the tattoo to use. So a level 2 Artificer can equip as many people as they want with a familiar each, once per long rest.
Canto alla vita
alla sua bellezza
ad ogni sua ferita
ogni sua carezza!
I sing to life and to its tragic beauty
To pain and to strife, but all that dances through me
The rise and the fall, I've lived through it all!
The Thing is that the familiar is weak and fairly useless for most other than out of combat flavor so they are unlikely to come under major threat and be replaced. That being said, it would also mean they have almost no affect at all on game balance since they do die so easily if a group were try to use them for much in combat.
This hasn't been my experience. I find that wizards using their familiars effectively in combat either have an owl do a flyby Help action and then retreat to a safer position, or they have their familiar perch on a shoulder and Ready a Help action for when they get within melee range, giving a nice little Advantage attack to the PC they are mounted on. I have found that most enemies tend not to prioritize a familiar because they cannot attack, but even if they do, having a familiar take one attack is one more attack not aimed at a PC so they are useful even in their death. Area spells are their bane, of course.
And out of combat yes, they are even more useful. Scouting and infiltration using the "dismiss to pocket realm and resummon in a locked room as long as you can get within 30 feet" trick are very handy.
Canto alla vita
alla sua bellezza
ad ogni sua ferita
ogni sua carezza!
I sing to life and to its tragic beauty
To pain and to strife, but all that dances through me
The rise and the fall, I've lived through it all!
If most enemies in your games do not Prioritize Familiars you should thank your DM. In my games they are easy targets and are often taken out as such. Or get nailed incidentally when the AoE's start flying. Even Flyby cannot necessarily always get them out of the danger range of some of those spells.
I'd also thank your DM for making all of those locked rooms you conveniently need to spy into so easily accessable as well.
Mileage is going to certainly vary when it comes to these experiences and not all players should expect them to work so readily or so easily.
Also Help Command and Readied Actions doesn't necessarily work with things like flyby because the Familiar tends to be either acting on your turn or their own turn and thus holding that action needs them to be in the right position when the time comes to be able to make those affects which causes them to have to linger around a spot quite a bit.
My DM will not hesitate to take them out when they're scouting, because they're alone, but in the middle of combat the PC's pose a much bigger threat and the enemies will turn their attacks and controlling moves on us first. I think it's perfectly logical.
Resummoning the familiar does not say it requires line of sight, but I can see how this could be interpreted differently.
Sitting on the shoulders of a PC and Readying an action to Help when they get within melee range works perfectly fine because they are being moved by their self controlled mount, the PC. This gives that PC Advantage on the first attack against the first enemy they approach within melee range of basically every round.
Canto alla vita
alla sua bellezza
ad ogni sua ferita
ogni sua carezza!
I sing to life and to its tragic beauty
To pain and to strife, but all that dances through me
The rise and the fall, I've lived through it all!
You may have just been giving an example, but I had assumed it would be restricted by what spells an Artificer would know. But this conversation make me think perhaps it could be open to any spell.
Of course DM discretion...but access to any spell from any class?? (Giddy at the prospect)