I reject The notion that the Warlock took "the easy way." Working on a contract that your boss sets the primary rules for and only gets you advancement based on that relationship isn't "easy." It's very direct and straightforward, but nothing to me says easy, particularly if the DM formalizes the contract terms and makes you roleplay them.
It is "easy" in the sense that nearly anyone can become a warlock with less work. To be a wizard, you need years of studying. To be a Sorcerer, you have to be born with magic, or physically changed by magic. To be a cleric, you have to be devoted to a deity. To be a Druid, you have to form a spiritual connection with nature. To be a bard, you have to be musical, I guess?
Warlocks take a shortcut. They don't have to worship their patron. They don't have to form an oath that they have to maintain. They don't have to study, or any other thing. They make a pact. They normally have quirks, like having to inscribe your patrons name somewhere, but the pact can be anything. You could've just given your soul to them in order to get power. Maybe you once had to go kill a particular squirrel that the archfey patron didn't like. It is easy, relative to the other ways of getting magic.
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Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
It is "easy" in the sense that nearly anyone can become a warlock with less work. To be a wizard, you need years of studying. To be a Sorcerer, you have to be born with magic, or physically changed by magic. To be a cleric, you have to be devoted to a deity. To be a Druid, you have to form a spiritual connection with nature. To be a bard, you have to be musical, I guess?
Warlocks take a shortcut. They don't have to worship their patron. They don't have to form an oath that they have to maintain. They don't have to study, or any other thing. They make a pact. They normally have quirks, like having to inscribe your patrons name somewhere, but the pact can be anything. You could've just given your soul to them in order to get power. Maybe you once had to go kill a particular squirrel that the archfey patron didn't like. It is easy, relative to the other ways of getting magic.
Maybe at the start of their career, yes. But as it's written: "Warlocks are driven by an insatiable need for knowledge and power, which compels them into their pacts and shapes their lives. This thirst drives warlocks into their pacts and shapes their later careers as well...Once a pact is made, a warlock’s thirst for knowledge and power can’t be slaked with mere study and research. No one makes a pact with such a mighty patron if he or she doesn’t intend to use the power thus gained. Rather, the vast majority of warlocks spend their days in active pursuit of their goals, which typically means some kind of adventuring."
Literally all their advanced power comes through hard work, research and adventuring, rather than from study. Oh sure, they may have started off differently, but it sounds like they have the harder path.
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May the gentle moonlinght guide you to greater wisdom
The only arcane spell casters in 2e were wizards. There were no sorcerers or warlocks. For warlocks, the closest you could get was the witch kit from the Complete Wizard's handbook. My copy is long lost so I can't recall the details, but it was certainly a wizard.
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Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Only i believe that warlocks should be INT based like 2e?
There were no Warlocks in 2e.
They was a Wizard "kit". Literally the first paragraph of the thread " Witch on 2e(book : The Complete Wizard's Handbook) and male Witches got called warlocks. "
The only arcane spell casters in 2e were wizards. There were no sorcerers or warlocks. For warlocks, the closest you could get was the witch kit from the Complete Wizard's handbook. My copy is long lost so I can't recall the details, but it was certainly a wizard.
Kits on 2e changes a lot how classes works. I quoted the complete wizard's handbook literally in my first post.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
I started in 2e. I have the Wizards Handbook in my mancave with pretty much every player’s supplement they ever printed for 2e (and 3/3.5), even Gnomes and Halflings, Demihumans, and Complete Psionics Handbook. And all three of the “Player’s Options” volumes, all four volumes of the Encyclopedia Magica.
I started in 2e. I have the Wizards Handbook in my mancave with pretty much every player’s supplement they ever printed for 2e (and 3/3.5), even Gnomes and Halflings, Demihumans, and Complete Psionics Handbook. And all three of the “Player’s Options” volumes, all four volumes of the Encyclopedia Magica.
I suppose there's a point in here.
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Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
I started in 2e. I have the Wizards Handbook in my mancave with pretty much every player’s supplement they ever printed for 2e (and 3/3.5), even Gnomes and Halflings, Demihumans, and Complete Psionics Handbook. And all three of the “Player’s Options” volumes, all four volumes of the Encyclopedia Magica.
I suppose there's a point in here.
Not really, that’s why I hid it in a spoiler. Just demonstrating my familiarity with the material and agreeing with you.
Ah. I miss my old 2e books. They were lost when I moved to the east coast from Washington State in 2000 :(. I've replaced some of my favorite titles, mostly stuff dealing with lore, but I miss some of my handbooks too.
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Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
I'm an elf guy, so probably the complete book of elves. I remember I had the wizard handbook and the ranger handbook (I played mostly Rangers back in the day). The crusades book was pretty awesome too. Drow of the Underdark was probably my very favorite, but that was the first one I replaced lol.
I wanted to play a mage, but that whole start with 1d4 hp and only have one spell to cast kept me away. I never had the guts to try one.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
2e is IMO the best edition for martial rules, 3.5e for magical rules and 5e is just the most streamlined edition. I liked warlock on 5e, it combines invocations from 3.5e with spell slots from 2e. And please, don't believe that nwn2 warlocks has anything in common with 3.5e warlocks. NWN2 destroyed the warlock on his adaptation. If you wanna play a video game with a more faithful adaptation from the P&P, i suggest the warlock reworked mod to nwn2 and PRC for NWN1.
But back on 3.5e times, i don't know any DM which allowed 3.5e warlocks. Now on 5e seems like DMs are encouraging warlock play over wizard play;
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
such a shame that warlocks did not end up as int casters in 5e, it would be so neat, maybe something to be introduced in the class feature variants alongside features that are more to do with fixing major problems of the classes. Having paladins and warlocks who cast spells using the variant honor ability score in the dungeon master's guide would also be delightful, as an mechanic that represents your devotion to your pact / oath.
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i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
I will point out kits could seriously alter things. Sha'Ir for example. Still a "wizard". Except no spellbook, just a tiny Genie familiar that you sent to get spells. And all you had to do was know the spell existed and have time.
I don't recall the witch in detail, but there's a chance it wasn't just a wizard.
such a shame that warlocks did not end up as int casters in 5e, it would be so neat, maybe something to be introduced in the class feature variants alongside features that are more to do with fixing major problems of the classes. Having paladins and warlocks who cast spells using the variant honor ability score in the dungeon master's guide would also be delightful, as an mechanic that represents your devotion to your pact / oath.
Yep. Was changed due player feedback.
On 3.5e warolocks din't had spell slots, only invocations which act like spell-like abilities, and was far more deadly than 5e. Warlocks back on 3.5e are flying teleporting invisible eldritch cannon which can throw deadly tentacles that has full bab to grapple enemies, transform then into toads, devour magic of enemy spellcasters, create a endless army of the undead with the dead walk and i din't even mentioned all of powerful warlock invocations. And Eldritch Glaive. On 3.5e all spell like abilities was CHA based...
IMO warlocks should be a INT class with a "herald" subclass which uses CHA and draws the power from the patron, doesn't just learns from him.
I will point out kits could seriously alter things. Sha'Ir for example. Still a "wizard". Except no spellbook, just a tiny Genie familiar that you sent to get spells. And all you had to do was know the spell existed and have time.
It is "easy" in the sense that nearly anyone can become a warlock with less work. To be a wizard, you need years of studying. To be a Sorcerer, you have to be born with magic, or physically changed by magic. To be a cleric, you have to be devoted to a deity. To be a Druid, you have to form a spiritual connection with nature. To be a bard, you have to be musical, I guess?
Warlocks take a shortcut. They don't have to worship their patron. They don't have to form an oath that they have to maintain. They don't have to study, or any other thing. They make a pact. They normally have quirks, like having to inscribe your patrons name somewhere, but the pact can be anything. You could've just given your soul to them in order to get power. Maybe you once had to go kill a particular squirrel that the archfey patron didn't like. It is easy, relative to the other ways of getting magic.
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
Spells, Monsters, Subclasses, Races, Arcknight Class, Occultist Class, World, Enigmatic Esoterica forms
Maybe at the start of their career, yes. But as it's written: "Warlocks are driven by an insatiable need for knowledge and power, which compels them into their pacts and shapes their lives. This thirst drives warlocks into their pacts and shapes their later careers as well...Once a pact is made, a warlock’s thirst for knowledge and power can’t be slaked with mere study and research. No one makes a pact with such a mighty patron if he or she doesn’t intend to use the power thus gained. Rather, the vast majority of warlocks spend their days in active pursuit of their goals, which typically means some kind of adventuring."
Literally all their advanced power comes through hard work, research and adventuring, rather than from study. Oh sure, they may have started off differently, but it sounds like they have the harder path.
May the gentle moonlinght guide you to greater wisdom
Only i believe that warlocks should be INT based like 2e?
Seems like it
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
Spells, Monsters, Subclasses, Races, Arcknight Class, Occultist Class, World, Enigmatic Esoterica forms
There were no Warlocks in 2e.
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The only arcane spell casters in 2e were wizards. There were no sorcerers or warlocks. For warlocks, the closest you could get was the witch kit from the Complete Wizard's handbook. My copy is long lost so I can't recall the details, but it was certainly a wizard.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
They was a Wizard "kit". Literally the first paragraph of the thread " Witch on 2e(book : The Complete Wizard's Handbook) and male Witches got called warlocks. "
Kits on 2e changes a lot how classes works. I quoted the complete wizard's handbook literally in my first post.
They are literally...still wizards.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
Literally.
I started in 2e. I have the Wizards Handbook in my mancave with pretty much every player’s supplement they ever printed for 2e (and 3/3.5), even Gnomes and Halflings, Demihumans, and Complete Psionics Handbook. And all three of the “Player’s Options” volumes, all four volumes of the Encyclopedia Magica.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
I suppose there's a point in here.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
Not really, that’s why I hid it in a spoiler. Just demonstrating my familiarity with the material and agreeing with you.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Ah. I miss my old 2e books. They were lost when I moved to the east coast from Washington State in 2000 :(. I've replaced some of my favorite titles, mostly stuff dealing with lore, but I miss some of my handbooks too.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
Which ones do you miss the most?
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
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Hardcovers, DDB & You
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I'm an elf guy, so probably the complete book of elves. I remember I had the wizard handbook and the ranger handbook (I played mostly Rangers back in the day). The crusades book was pretty awesome too. Drow of the Underdark was probably my very favorite, but that was the first one I replaced lol.
I wanted to play a mage, but that whole start with 1d4 hp and only have one spell to cast kept me away. I never had the guts to try one.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
2e is IMO the best edition for martial rules, 3.5e for magical rules and 5e is just the most streamlined edition. I liked warlock on 5e, it combines invocations from 3.5e with spell slots from 2e. And please, don't believe that nwn2 warlocks has anything in common with 3.5e warlocks. NWN2 destroyed the warlock on his adaptation. If you wanna play a video game with a more faithful adaptation from the P&P, i suggest the warlock reworked mod to nwn2 and PRC for NWN1.
But back on 3.5e times, i don't know any DM which allowed 3.5e warlocks. Now on 5e seems like DMs are encouraging warlock play over wizard play;
It doesn't seem like that to me.
Please check out my homebrew and give me feedback!
Subclasses | Races | Spells | Magic Items | Monsters | Feats | Backgrounds
bleh, never mind
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
such a shame that warlocks did not end up as int casters in 5e, it would be so neat, maybe something to be introduced in the class feature variants alongside features that are more to do with fixing major problems of the classes. Having paladins and warlocks who cast spells using the variant honor ability score in the dungeon master's guide would also be delightful, as an mechanic that represents your devotion to your pact / oath.
i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
I will point out kits could seriously alter things. Sha'Ir for example. Still a "wizard". Except no spellbook, just a tiny Genie familiar that you sent to get spells. And all you had to do was know the spell existed and have time.
I don't recall the witch in detail, but there's a chance it wasn't just a wizard.
Yep. Was changed due player feedback.
On 3.5e warolocks din't had spell slots, only invocations which act like spell-like abilities, and was far more deadly than 5e. Warlocks back on 3.5e are flying teleporting invisible eldritch cannon which can throw deadly tentacles that has full bab to grapple enemies, transform then into toads, devour magic of enemy spellcasters, create a endless army of the undead with the dead walk and i din't even mentioned all of powerful warlock invocations. And Eldritch Glaive. On 3.5e all spell like abilities was CHA based...
IMO warlocks should be a INT class with a "herald" subclass which uses CHA and draws the power from the patron, doesn't just learns from him.
I was reading about her and she looks like a pathfinder 1e witch https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Sha'ir