I can't find any official source material for 5th edition that shows how much damage the Blackrazor does. The Dungeon Masters guide states that its a Greatsword, and I know that Greatswords do 2d6 damage.
But, its supposed to be one of the most powerul weapons in D&D, it can't just be 2d6+3, right? Why does it heal 1d10 to undead if it does 2d6+3 to everything else? Is there a way to contact the writers of the books to get a better answer?
I can't find any official source material for 5th edition that shows how much damage the Blackrazor does. The Dungeon Masters guide states that its a Greatsword, and I know that Greatswords do 2d6 damage.
But, its supposed to be one of the most powerul weapons in D&D, it can't just be 2d6+3, right? Why does it heal 1d10 to undead if it does 2d6+3 to everything else? Is there a way to contact the writers of the books to get a better answer?
Yes, it's a greatsword; yes, it deals 2d6+3 damage (plus your Strength modifier, of course). If it was meant to do more damage, it would say so in the description of the item.
Why does it not do more damage? It has several other very powerful features that offset this, such as killing enemies in a way that makes them nearly impossible to resurrect and grants you a potentially very large number of temporary HP when it happens, the ability for the sword itself to cast Haste on you itself whenever it wants, and the fact that it grants you Blindsight as well as immunity to being Charmed or Frightened.
Why does it heal undead when you hit them with it? Because it's a sentient weapon that doesn't like hurting undead.
Thanks for the clarification. And also, I was not asking why it heals undead, I was asking why it heals them for 1d10? Its a completely arbitrary number.
Most of the numbers associated with weapons in D&D are completely arbitrary, or at least they're only the way they are for game balance purposes. Sorry, I know that's not a very satisfying answer, but it is what it is.
It's worth remembering that it's not just +3 to damage, but +3 to attacks as well. It's not just boosting your damage on a hit, but also how often you hit. Let's say the normal AC is 20 (happy to be corrected on that), normally you'd be attacking with +11, or hitting 55% of the time, with an average damage of 12, so on average, you're dealing about 7 damage each time you make an attack. With Blackrazor, you'd be getting a +14 or hitting 70% of the time and dealing an average of 15 damage each time, so averaging about 11 damage each time you make an attack - about 50% increase. That's why that feature alone is normally enough to qualify it for the highest rarity and aimed for L17+.
Add on to that the immunities, blindsight, temp HP, Haste and other features... it's no wimp.
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If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
That said, I am pretty sure there are swords in lore which are stronger, like the Silver Sword of Gith, but that disappeared with the Kalach-Cha. The DMG is just the strongest weapons a DM might reward while still keeping things somewhat controlled, Artifact level weapons are end game, epic gear. To maintain bounded accuracy they remain at +3 and offer other bonuses instead. Then again it is also end game...
Thanks for the info! I guess I'm just spoiled by 1st edition weapons that could go up to +6 and could have damage numbers from 3d10 all the way to 10d10! Thor's hammer could attack 3 times per round for 10d10 damage, it was insane!
Thanks for the info! I guess I'm just spoiled by 1st edition weapons that could go up to +6 and could have damage numbers from 3d10 all the way to 10d10! Thor's hammer could attack 3 times per round for 10d10 damage, it was insane!
5th edition simplified a lot of things and the numbers no longer scale as they did in previous editions, instead preferring bounded accuracy and bounded accuracy means the numbers can not scale as they did in previous editions.
Also, Blackrazor's in-universe reputation is also in part because most of its wielders are bloodthirsty serial killers who happily massacre entire villages. Compare that most other Legendary weapons, which will generally have wielders who are probably a lot more discerning.
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Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Thanks for the info! I guess I'm just spoiled by 1st edition weapons that could go up to +6 and could have damage numbers from 3d10 all the way to 10d10! Thor's hammer could attack 3 times per round for 10d10 damage, it was insane!
This is one of those things that's cool to read about and fun to use for a session, but actually putting it into a campaign just breaks everything. A fighter dealing 30d10+stats (and quite a bit more with crits/Action Surge) is going to mow through everything and completely outshine everyone else in the party. How do you balance that? How do you keep it fun for everyone else at the table? How do you keep it challenging so that wins feel earned and satisfying?
5e solves those kinds of issues by bounding all damage pretty tightly, and trying to grant other types of benefits that are less disruptive to the workings of combat encounters.
Also, Blackrazor's in-universe reputation is also in part because most of its wielders are bloodthirsty serial killers who happily massacre entire villages. Compare that most other Legendary weapons, which will generally have wielders who are probably a lot more discerning.
It is also worth noting that when slaughtering a village, that is a lot of temp hp's. The slain does not have to be powerful at all. When there is enough prey, the wielder is almost certainly building up temp HP's faster than any local peasant resistance is capable of removing and since they last 24 hours, that is long enough to still have a very nice buffer for when actual trained soldiers show up.
Thanks for the info! I guess I'm just spoiled by 1st edition weapons that could go up to +6 and could have damage numbers from 3d10 all the way to 10d10! Thor's hammer could attack 3 times per round for 10d10 damage, it was insane!
This is one of those things that's cool to read about and fun to use for a session, but actually putting it into a campaign just breaks everything. A fighter dealing 30d10+stats (and quite a bit more with crits/Action Surge) is going to mow through everything and completely outshine everyone else in the party. How do you balance that? How do you keep it fun for everyone else at the table? How do you keep it challenging so that wins feel earned and satisfying?
5e solves those kinds of issues by bounding all damage pretty tightly, and trying to grant other types of benefits that are less disruptive to the workings of combat encounters.
Ranged opponents who can harm the party without being in reach of the blade.
Various crowd control measures, again to isolate the wielder and keep them from easily doing the mass damage they are capable of
Actual elite enemy troops
Bigger opponents such as greater demons, devils or even beings from beyond beyond. Can homebrew opponents as powerful as they need to be to challenge the party.
Plus the simple fact that by the time the party gets their hands on such a weapon, the casters are almost certainly more than capable of putting out mass damage on their own. The usual complaint is that the melee are the ones who cannot keep up, not the other way around.
It is my understanding that black razor ( and to a lesser extent the 9 lives stealer weapons) are based on the sword Stormbringer from Morcock’s Elric of Melniboné stories. Altho7gh the 5 e powers are somewhat different if you trace the sword back through the editions you get closer and closer to Stormbringer ( which was really more of a greater demon of chaos in sword form. To some extent Stormbringer is the antihero of not just the Elric books but his entire eternal champion series as the sword shows up over and over throughout the stories.
If you came upon the weapon legitimately, then after a while, if you don't return it, the GM can/will/should send bounty hunters after you.
If that was true, why haven't said bounty hunters already recovered it? If you came upon the weapon legitimately, it is because the DM placed it there for you to come upon legitimately. It is their world, after all. Nothing simply spontaneously appears in the world without the DM's knowledge or consent.
Blackrazor originally appears in the adventure White Plume Mountain.
In the adventure the party is hired to recover Blackrazor and two other artifacts. If you do not return them to the people that hored the party, then ther are penalties.
Blackrazor originally appears in the adventure White Plume Mountain.
In the adventure the party is hired to recover Blackrazor and two other artifacts. If you do not return them to the people that hired the party, then there are penalties.
Assuming, of course, the DM is using it by way of that module and is using that module completely as written.... But even if they are, then it is still the DM setting that situation up (even if by way of running the module) and if running it straight up, there would be that warning. However, it would still beg the questions: "If the bounty hunters are more capable than the party, then why aren't they sent directly into the mountain" and "If the bounty hunters are not more capable than the party, then why would they be expected to be successful against the party?"
At any rate, what the DM will or should do is still dependent on their campaign plan and what does actually work best for their campaign
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I can't find any official source material for 5th edition that shows how much damage the Blackrazor does. The Dungeon Masters guide states that its a Greatsword, and I know that Greatswords do 2d6 damage.
But, its supposed to be one of the most powerul weapons in D&D, it can't just be 2d6+3, right? Why does it heal 1d10 to undead if it does 2d6+3 to everything else? Is there a way to contact the writers of the books to get a better answer?
Yes, it's a greatsword; yes, it deals 2d6+3 damage (plus your Strength modifier, of course). If it was meant to do more damage, it would say so in the description of the item.
Why does it not do more damage? It has several other very powerful features that offset this, such as killing enemies in a way that makes them nearly impossible to resurrect and grants you a potentially very large number of temporary HP when it happens, the ability for the sword itself to cast Haste on you itself whenever it wants, and the fact that it grants you Blindsight as well as immunity to being Charmed or Frightened.
Why does it heal undead when you hit them with it? Because it's a sentient weapon that doesn't like hurting undead.
pronouns: he/she/they
Thanks for the clarification. And also, I was not asking why it heals undead, I was asking why it heals them for 1d10? Its a completely arbitrary number.
Most of the numbers associated with weapons in D&D are completely arbitrary, or at least they're only the way they are for game balance purposes. Sorry, I know that's not a very satisfying answer, but it is what it is.
pronouns: he/she/they
I believe the "most powerful weapon in D&D" comes from giving you temp HP equal to the HP max of a creature you kill with it
It's worth remembering that it's not just +3 to damage, but +3 to attacks as well. It's not just boosting your damage on a hit, but also how often you hit. Let's say the normal AC is 20 (happy to be corrected on that), normally you'd be attacking with +11, or hitting 55% of the time, with an average damage of 12, so on average, you're dealing about 7 damage each time you make an attack. With Blackrazor, you'd be getting a +14 or hitting 70% of the time and dealing an average of 15 damage each time, so averaging about 11 damage each time you make an attack - about 50% increase. That's why that feature alone is normally enough to qualify it for the highest rarity and aimed for L17+.
Add on to that the immunities, blindsight, temp HP, Haste and other features... it's no wimp.
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
+3 is literally the highest enchantment any weapon in the game has, it can cast haste on you (extra attacks/actions) and gives you 30 foot blindsight.
There is no other 2d6+3 artifact level weapon, so it does have the highest base damage:
https://www.dndbeyond.com/magic-items?filter-type=9&filter-search=&filter-rarity=7&filter-requires-attunement=&filter-effect-type=&filter-effect-subtype=&filter-has-charges=&filter-partnered-content=f
That said, I am pretty sure there are swords in lore which are stronger, like the Silver Sword of Gith, but that disappeared with the Kalach-Cha. The DMG is just the strongest weapons a DM might reward while still keeping things somewhat controlled, Artifact level weapons are end game, epic gear. To maintain bounded accuracy they remain at +3 and offer other bonuses instead. Then again it is also end game...
Thanks for the info! I guess I'm just spoiled by 1st edition weapons that could go up to +6 and could have damage numbers from 3d10 all the way to 10d10! Thor's hammer could attack 3 times per round for 10d10 damage, it was insane!
5th edition simplified a lot of things and the numbers no longer scale as they did in previous editions, instead preferring bounded accuracy and bounded accuracy means the numbers can not scale as they did in previous editions.
Also, Blackrazor's in-universe reputation is also in part because most of its wielders are bloodthirsty serial killers who happily massacre entire villages. Compare that most other Legendary weapons, which will generally have wielders who are probably a lot more discerning.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
The highest damage weapon that I'm aware of is a Dragon's Wrath Weapon (Ascendant) on a base weapon type of greatsword or maul, which does 5d6+3.
This is one of those things that's cool to read about and fun to use for a session, but actually putting it into a campaign just breaks everything. A fighter dealing 30d10+stats (and quite a bit more with crits/Action Surge) is going to mow through everything and completely outshine everyone else in the party. How do you balance that? How do you keep it fun for everyone else at the table? How do you keep it challenging so that wins feel earned and satisfying?
5e solves those kinds of issues by bounding all damage pretty tightly, and trying to grant other types of benefits that are less disruptive to the workings of combat encounters.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm
It is also worth noting that when slaughtering a village, that is a lot of temp hp's. The slain does not have to be powerful at all. When there is enough prey, the wielder is almost certainly building up temp HP's faster than any local peasant resistance is capable of removing and since they last 24 hours, that is long enough to still have a very nice buffer for when actual trained soldiers show up.
That is very not trivial
Ranged opponents who can harm the party without being in reach of the blade.
Various crowd control measures, again to isolate the wielder and keep them from easily doing the mass damage they are capable of
Actual elite enemy troops
Bigger opponents such as greater demons, devils or even beings from beyond beyond. Can homebrew opponents as powerful as they need to be to challenge the party.
Plus the simple fact that by the time the party gets their hands on such a weapon, the casters are almost certainly more than capable of putting out mass damage on their own. The usual complaint is that the melee are the ones who cannot keep up, not the other way around.
Temporary hit points don’t stack with each other, though, so that’s only one peasant’s worth of them at a time.
pronouns: he/she/they
It is my understanding that black razor ( and to a lesser extent the 9 lives stealer weapons) are based on the sword Stormbringer from Morcock’s Elric of Melniboné stories. Altho7gh the 5 e powers are somewhat different if you trace the sword back through the editions you get closer and closer to Stormbringer ( which was really more of a greater demon of chaos in sword form. To some extent Stormbringer is the antihero of not just the Elric books but his entire eternal champion series as the sword shows up over and over throughout the stories.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
If you came upon the weapon legitimately, then after a while, if you don't return it, the GM can/will/should send bounty hunters after you.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
If that was true, why haven't said bounty hunters already recovered it? If you came upon the weapon legitimately, it is because the DM placed it there for you to come upon legitimately. It is their world, after all. Nothing simply spontaneously appears in the world without the DM's knowledge or consent.
Blackrazor originally appears in the adventure White Plume Mountain.
In the adventure the party is hired to recover Blackrazor and two other artifacts. If you do not return them to the people that hored the party, then ther are penalties.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Assuming, of course, the DM is using it by way of that module and is using that module completely as written.... But even if they are, then it is still the DM setting that situation up (even if by way of running the module) and if running it straight up, there would be that warning. However, it would still beg the questions: "If the bounty hunters are more capable than the party, then why aren't they sent directly into the mountain" and "If the bounty hunters are not more capable than the party, then why would they be expected to be successful against the party?"
At any rate, what the DM will or should do is still dependent on their campaign plan and what does actually work best for their campaign