Arcane Armor when used in the Guardian model, uses its own gauntlets as a melee weapon. Green Flame Blade requires the material component of any melee weapon worth at least 2sp. The armor in this case counts as a melee weapon, and is definitely worth more than 2sp (any armor you're using in this class is going to be worth more than 2sp).
It does seem like this makes it a little OP, but lots of fun! Has any clarification article already taken up whether or not this works together?
I see no reason that it shouldn't work. However, only the main target of GFB will take the rider effect of the Thunder Gauntlets. Nice synergy at low levels, but not particularly problematic.
Arcane Armor when used in the Guardian model, uses its own gauntlets as a melee weapon. Green Flame Blade requires the material component of any melee weapon worth at least 2sp. The armor in this case counts as a melee weapon, and is definitely worth more than 2sp (any armor you're using in this class is going to be worth more than 2sp).
It does seem like this makes it a little OP, but lots of fun! Has any clarification article already taken up whether or not this works together?
No official clarification that i know of. But Arcane Armor's Guardian model count as a simple melee weapon should be usable as a material component for Green Flame Blade, unless your DM says it's not worth 1 sp.
Arcane Armor when used in the Guardian model, uses its own gauntlets as a melee weapon. Green Flame Blade requires the material component of any melee weapon worth at least 2sp. The armor in this case counts as a melee weapon, and is definitely worth more than 2sp (any armor you're using in this class is going to be worth more than 2sp).
It does seem like this makes it a little OP, but lots of fun! Has any clarification article already taken up whether or not this works together?
No, and people keep asking about it. The very short version is that because the gauntlets don't have a worth (and they're not the whole armor, just the gauntlets), your DM is well within the RAW to say that they don't work with the spell, just as magic weapons generally don't because they don't have a worth. Your DM could also rule they have a worth and it's X amount without violating the RAW because the RAW sets no worth. Note that in order to be plausible, your DM would want to set a worth less than the worth of the whole suit, but that's not a rules question.
This violates the current RAW, but your DM could also go back to the pre-Tasha's RAW, where the component was any melee weapon - there was widespread misunderstanding of how [Tooltip Not Found] work leading to what I believe is the reason for the change, which is that people incorrectly believed component pouches actually supply infinite costless components, allowing the pouches to produce actual weapons from nowhere. Pouches don't do this - they replace the component with themselves, same way a focus does, and that would only mean the spell casts using the pouch as an improvised weapon, which is strictly worse than doing it with a real weapon. There shouldn't be any balance concerns going back to the old RAW for the M component.
just as magic weapons generally don't because they don't have a worth
For clarity's sake, this is not considered to be RAW by a great many people, especially those who look in the DMG and are able to find the price chart for magic items
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Active characters:
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock) Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric) Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue) Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
The very short version is that because the gauntlets don't have a worth (and they're not the whole armor, just the gauntlets)
You're gonna need RAW to back this up. I disagree:
"The armor attaches to you and can't be removed against your will. It also expands to cover your entire body.
The only place the gauntlets are referred to as separate pieces has a qualifier:
"That armor now counts as separate items for the purposes of your Infuse Items feature ...those items must be part of your Arcane Armor"
No, you are not punching with your whole armor. You also do not stab with your whole sword. The gauntlets are like the blade of a weapon - they are indivisible from it.
Are armor's gaunthelts worthless? If not what's their worth? They're obviously made with a material such as steel or iron and were forged by an armorer so time and ressources have been spent to made those. The Player's Handbook doesn't list a price for them alone, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're worthless though.
Are armor's gaunthelts worthless? If not what's their worth? They're obviously made with a material such as steel or iron and were forged by an armorer so time and ressources have been spent to made those. The Player's Handbook doesn't list a price for them alone, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're worthless though.
There's a camp that argues if there is not a specific entry for an exact sale price for an item in a core book, RAW says you can't use it as the material component for GFB or BB
I think I'm going to start calling those kinds of arguments RAIL (Rules As Interpreted Literally) instead
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock) Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric) Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue) Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
There's a camp that argues if there is not a specific entry for an exact sale price for an item in a core book, RAW says you can't use it as the material component for GFB or BB
I think I'm going to start calling those kinds of arguments RAIL (Rules As Interpreted Literally) instead
Well, the first thing we should all remember is that the core books don't price everything. The entry for weapons, armors and gear are just the most commonly available stuff the core rules specifically say. In fact, many of the stuff characters find are not even listed, such as art objects, gems, magic weapons, and anything else a DM put in his campaign. But i don't think not appearing on a price list means something is worthless necessarily.
Apparently the reason why the GFB and BB spells were changed to require a weapon worth at least 1sp is because, when they had a material component without a cost (a weapon), players were claiming that by RAW they could pull entire weapons out of a component pouch since:
A component pouch is a small, watertight leather belt pouch that has compartments to hold all the material components and other special items you need to cast your spells, except for those components that have a specific cost (as indicated in a spell's description).
......Yeah. So now players who quite reasonably want to use those spells with Arcane Armor or shadow blade are getting screwed over.
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Arcane Armor when used in the Guardian model, uses its own gauntlets as a melee weapon. Green Flame Blade requires the material component of any melee weapon worth at least 2sp. The armor in this case counts as a melee weapon, and is definitely worth more than 2sp (any armor you're using in this class is going to be worth more than 2sp).
It does seem like this makes it a little OP, but lots of fun! Has any clarification article already taken up whether or not this works together?
I see no reason that it shouldn't work. However, only the main target of GFB will take the rider effect of the Thunder Gauntlets. Nice synergy at low levels, but not particularly problematic.
No official clarification that i know of. But Arcane Armor's Guardian model count as a simple melee weapon should be usable as a material component for Green Flame Blade, unless your DM says it's not worth 1 sp.
No, and people keep asking about it. The very short version is that because the gauntlets don't have a worth (and they're not the whole armor, just the gauntlets), your DM is well within the RAW to say that they don't work with the spell, just as magic weapons generally don't because they don't have a worth. Your DM could also rule they have a worth and it's X amount without violating the RAW because the RAW sets no worth. Note that in order to be plausible, your DM would want to set a worth less than the worth of the whole suit, but that's not a rules question.
This violates the current RAW, but your DM could also go back to the pre-Tasha's RAW, where the component was any melee weapon - there was widespread misunderstanding of how [Tooltip Not Found] work leading to what I believe is the reason for the change, which is that people incorrectly believed component pouches actually supply infinite costless components, allowing the pouches to produce actual weapons from nowhere. Pouches don't do this - they replace the component with themselves, same way a focus does, and that would only mean the spell casts using the pouch as an improvised weapon, which is strictly worse than doing it with a real weapon. There shouldn't be any balance concerns going back to the old RAW for the M component.
For clarity's sake, this is not considered to be RAW by a great many people, especially those who look in the DMG and are able to find the price chart for magic items
Active characters:
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock)
Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric)
Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue)
Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
Does it work RAW? Nope.
Do I love the flavor and would allow it in my game? Absolutely.
You're gonna need RAW to back this up. I disagree:
"The armor attaches to you and can't be removed against your will. It also expands to cover your entire body.
The only place the gauntlets are referred to as separate pieces has a qualifier:
"That armor now counts as separate items for the purposes of your Infuse Items feature ...those items must be part of your Arcane Armor"
No, you are not punching with your whole armor. You also do not stab with your whole sword. The gauntlets are like the blade of a weapon - they are indivisible from it.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm
Are armor's gaunthelts worthless? If not what's their worth? They're obviously made with a material such as steel or iron and were forged by an armorer so time and ressources have been spent to made those. The Player's Handbook doesn't list a price for them alone, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're worthless though.
There's a camp that argues if there is not a specific entry for an exact sale price for an item in a core book, RAW says you can't use it as the material component for GFB or BB
I think I'm going to start calling those kinds of arguments RAIL (Rules As Interpreted Literally) instead
Active characters:
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock)
Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric)
Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue)
Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
RAM (Rules As Malice)
Well, the first thing we should all remember is that the core books don't price everything. The entry for weapons, armors and gear are just the most commonly available stuff the core rules specifically say. In fact, many of the stuff characters find are not even listed, such as art objects, gems, magic weapons, and anything else a DM put in his campaign. But i don't think not appearing on a price list means something is worthless necessarily.
Apparently the reason why the GFB and BB spells were changed to require a weapon worth at least 1sp is because, when they had a material component without a cost (a weapon), players were claiming that by RAW they could pull entire weapons out of a component pouch since:
......Yeah. So now players who quite reasonably want to use those spells with Arcane Armor or shadow blade are getting screwed over.
Helpful rewriter of Japanese->English translation and delver into software codebases (she/e/they)