Hey y'all - just wanted clarification on the mechanics of this situation.
I play a Monk of Long Death (level 8 LD monk / Level 3 bear totem barbarian).
Last session our party faced off against these snake enemies. One of them used hypnotic gaze on me and I failed the save.
I was curious if my Stillness of Mind class ability would work on this specific Charm. My party said no because if a charm makes you incapacitated - you can't take an action.
I was just curious because I thought I wasn't "taking" an action (Attack, Dodge, Hide, etc) - I was "using" my action to dispel the charm.
Just wanted clarification for future situations like this we might encounter. Thanks.
If incapacitated is part of the effect, then you can't take actions. Most charmed and frightened don't have such a stipulation, so Stillness of Mind works as advertised.
Thanks for the insight! I briefly brought up my argument - but to prevent any further delay during battle I just accepted it (our Bard would later "slap" me out of the daze during the fight).
I imagined Stillness of Mind being an internal mental process; sacrificing your action to clear your mind. I thought this was different than actually taking a physical action (attack, dodge, hide, grapple, etc).
I asked if being incapacitated prevents you from any internal processes linked to monk training, like focusing the mind. Didn't get a clear answer from the party.
Being incapacitated prevents you from doing anything that requires an action or reaction. That includes Stillness of Mind as written. But as stated, most charm effects don't apply this condition, so it's not very common that you'll run into this issue unless you're incapacitated and charmed by separate effects. The only other things I can think of that does both off the top of my head is Hypnotic Pattern or Dominate Person (albeit via total control, rather than incapacitation). But if you reach Monk 14, you'll be able to fight off those effects more easily due to Diamond Soul.
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Hey y'all - just wanted clarification on the mechanics of this situation.
I play a Monk of Long Death (level 8 LD monk / Level 3 bear totem barbarian).
Last session our party faced off against these snake enemies. One of them used hypnotic gaze on me and I failed the save.
I was curious if my Stillness of Mind class ability would work on this specific Charm. My party said no because if a charm makes you incapacitated - you can't take an action.
I was just curious because I thought I wasn't "taking" an action (Attack, Dodge, Hide, etc) - I was "using" my action to dispel the charm.
Just wanted clarification for future situations like this we might encounter. Thanks.
Ultra-strict RAW prevents Stillness of Mind from ever working as (apparently) intended, because (as is explicitly covered in Xanathar's, if there was any doubt), in the general case you don't know in-character when you're Charmed. However, as an extension of the rule of thumb that rules that require you to have meta-knowledge to work automatically grant that knowledge (e.g. if you have an ability that triggers on someone nearby failing a save, it grants you the ability to know when nearby creatures fail saves), most DMs will have Stillness of Mind grant you knowledge of when you're charmed. The exact specifics of how many such additional abilities your actual RAW ability grants are intrinsically homebrew and hence up to DM fiat. Here's how messy it gets in general, in terms of spells, in ascending order of how much additional oomph the DM needs to give Stillness of Mind for it to work:
All charm spells: you need to know you're charmed.
Charm spells where the Charm effect explicitly makes you no longer hostile, so it's metagaming to use Stillness of Mind since you don't think of the enemy as an enemy: Calm Emotions
Charm spells which let the caster specifically ask you not to cure yourself of being charmed and/or ask you to do something which renders you too busy due to action economy to use Stillness of Mind (i.e. you're violating the spell by using Stillness of Mind since you know when you use it that you're bucking a request the spell compels you to follow): Dominate X when you're not being puppeted, Fast Friends
Charm spells which explicitly dictate/rob you of your action: Dominate X when you're being puppeted, Crown of Madness, Incite Greed
Charm spells which incapacitate you, robbing you of your action: Hypnotic Pattern, Modify Memory
So you need to ask your DM where they want to draw the exact line.
You need to know your character is charmed, your character doesn't need to know they are charmed. The rules use "you" terminology in place of "your character" terminology, but absolutely the player should know mechanics that the character does not. I don’t know if it is useful to over analyze a rule to the point of absurdity.
No one actually thinks that players need to put armor on at the table even though the Armor Class rules use "you" in them, right?
Hey y'all - just wanted clarification on the mechanics of this situation.
I play a Monk of Long Death (level 8 LD monk / Level 3 bear totem barbarian).
Last session our party faced off against these snake enemies. One of them used hypnotic gaze on me and I failed the save.
I was curious if my Stillness of Mind class ability would work on this specific Charm. My party said no because if a charm makes you incapacitated - you can't take an action.
I was just curious because I thought I wasn't "taking" an action (Attack, Dodge, Hide, etc) - I was "using" my action to dispel the charm.
Just wanted clarification for future situations like this we might encounter. Thanks.
If incapacitated is part of the effect, then you can't take actions. Most charmed and frightened don't have such a stipulation, so Stillness of Mind works as advertised.
It should work but Stillness of Mind was written poorly. I would argue and try to negotiate with your DM.
Thanks for the insight! I briefly brought up my argument - but to prevent any further delay during battle I just accepted it (our Bard would later "slap" me out of the daze during the fight).
I imagined Stillness of Mind being an internal mental process; sacrificing your action to clear your mind. I thought this was different than actually taking a physical action (attack, dodge, hide, grapple, etc).
I asked if being incapacitated prevents you from any internal processes linked to monk training, like focusing the mind. Didn't get a clear answer from the party.
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ModeratorBeing incapacitated prevents you from doing anything that requires an action or reaction. That includes Stillness of Mind as written. But as stated, most charm effects don't apply this condition, so it's not very common that you'll run into this issue unless you're incapacitated and charmed by separate effects. The only other things I can think of that does both off the top of my head is Hypnotic Pattern or Dominate Person (albeit via total control, rather than incapacitation). But if you reach Monk 14, you'll be able to fight off those effects more easily due to Diamond Soul.
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Thanks for all the clarification!
I'm not going to repeat any of the answers already given, just that taking an action and using an action are the same thing.
Ultra-strict RAW prevents Stillness of Mind from ever working as (apparently) intended, because (as is explicitly covered in Xanathar's, if there was any doubt), in the general case you don't know in-character when you're Charmed. However, as an extension of the rule of thumb that rules that require you to have meta-knowledge to work automatically grant that knowledge (e.g. if you have an ability that triggers on someone nearby failing a save, it grants you the ability to know when nearby creatures fail saves), most DMs will have Stillness of Mind grant you knowledge of when you're charmed. The exact specifics of how many such additional abilities your actual RAW ability grants are intrinsically homebrew and hence up to DM fiat. Here's how messy it gets in general, in terms of spells, in ascending order of how much additional oomph the DM needs to give Stillness of Mind for it to work:
So you need to ask your DM where they want to draw the exact line.
You need to know your character is charmed, your character doesn't need to know they are charmed. The rules use "you" terminology in place of "your character" terminology, but absolutely the player should know mechanics that the character does not. I don’t know if it is useful to over analyze a rule to the point of absurdity.
No one actually thinks that players need to put armor on at the table even though the Armor Class rules use "you" in them, right?