This had been made somewhat more relevant ( and complicated ) these days with the introduction of the Artificer class, which is kind of built around crafting, while trying to not introduce an entire crafting layer to 5e.
Disclaimer: This signature is a badge of membership in the Forum Loudmouth Club. We are all friends. We are not attacking each other. We are engaging in spirited, friendly debate with one another. We may get snarky, but these are not attacks. Thank you for not reporting us.
Since my last post my group has had some time with the crafting system and I did a massive overhaul. I took some ideas from this thread, then researched several others, then rebuilt crafting from the ground up. Here are the things I learned along the way, and the current "final" changes.
My players didn't understand my crafting system and even I found it too complicated to explain every time someone wanted to craft.
Crafting should be treated like a mini-game that enhances a D&D campaign. It shouldn't take more time than necessary and nobody will craft items if they take years to make.
Having different rarities of crafting materials unnecessarily over complicated everything further, and required too much bookkeeping.
So I went back to the drawing board, deep dove into old Reddit posts, referenced Xanathar's Guide, and came up with this system.
Craft Skill: 25gp x your Proficiency bonus (e.g. +5 smithing skill = 125gp/day worth of materials).
Craft Time: 1/2 the cost of an item's value, divided by the Craft Skill (e.g. 1/2 cost of a Dagger of Venom is 750 gp, divided by 125/day as above = 6 days).
Materials: Using your own crafting materials reduces end costs (50 ore reduces the player cost of a Rare item by 20%, bringing the dagger cost down to 600 gp, or 100gp/day).
Skill Checks: Every day of crafting, the Player rolls vs a DC15 for Rare item, and costs the player 100gp/day of materials until its complete. Normal failures produce no results, and only cost the player time. Materials destroyed on a Nat01, and Nat20 count as 2 days worth of work reducing time and cost by 1 day.
Optional: The DM may require a poison gland from a dangerous enemy (CR 9-12 for Rare items) to complete the weapon.
Magic Item Crafting (daily activity)
Skill Check DC
Item Rarity
# Craft Materials
CR of Special
Special Notes
5
Common
5
1-3
The Player Cost is ½ an item’s value. Check price columns for full costs.
10
Uncommon
20
4-8
Every "# Craft Materials" reduces the final Player Cost by 20%, up to 80%.
15
Rare
50
9-12
Nat20 produces 2x days of work or 2x consumables (potions, scrolls, ammo).
20
Very Rare
200
13-18
Nat01 means the days materials are lost.
25
Legendary
1000
19+
CR is for monsters of rare ingredient quests (e.g. Yeti horn, elemental fire, etc)
Gathering Materials
Gather Roll
Materials Found
Special Ingredient CR
Example Complementary Skills:
1-9
0
1-3 (common)
Herbalism & Nature (ID herbs, poisons, etc)
10-14
1d6
4-8 (uncommon)
Smithing & Athletics (mining ore & gems)
15-19
2d6
9-12 (rare)
Alchemy & Medicine (extract venom or acid)
20-24
3d6
13-18 (very rare)
Leather Working & Survival (hide & bones)
25+
4d6
19+ (Legendary)
Navigation & Survival (find landmarks)
Gather Chance:
During travel, players can stop to gather materials over the course of 2 hours in-game.
Each map hex has 1d4+1 chances to gather materials per week. Map hexes are 6 miles.
Gather chances are divided up by the PCs who want to search for crafting materials (e.g. if 3 is rolled, one PC may search twice for herbs, and one PC may search for ore).
PCs can also roll 1x per day of downtime to search a hex immediately outside the town for materials instead of crafting, gambling, working, etc.
Gather Roll & Materials Found:
Materials Found is based on how high the player rolled using their crafting skill.
Natural 20 grants 2x materials found or something special like gems while mining for ore, or a rare healing root, etc.
Natural 01 means the source is destroyed for that specific craft (caused a fire, trampled, contaminated, broken, etc).
Complementary Skills grant advantage on the roll, provided the player is proficient in them, or another PC is helping with that skill proficiency.
Special Notes:
For every session of gathering, DM rolls for an encounter chance (possible discovery, event, enemies, etc).
Special Ingredient CR is for hard to find recipe ingredients like a fire elemental heart for a fire sword. Usually a boss at the end of a quest.
Deconstructing items grants materials equal to the weight of the item (e.g. plate armor provides 65 materials, while chainmail would provide 30 materials).
Wheelercub, I'd love for you to publish a pamphlet on your system once you have play tested it more. I think crafting has a place in D&D for players to get a specific item that is difficult to acquire. As a matter of fact, I think the very idea of acquiring and making an item can be the theme of a campaign.
I played as a kid in the AD&D days. I remember having to find ingredients. I remember having to purify and distill ingredients. I remember having to craft base weapons worthy of being enchanted. All these things can be used to create a campaign of say The City Lost the Special Jeweled Orb with a Purify Water Blessing and the only way to reestablish this thriving trade center is to find (make) a new one, because pure water is almost impossible to get in this strategic locale.
The party can go find the right jewels, an alchemist, a cleric for purifying rituals, a wizard for whizzing tools or stuff, a master blacksmith, a pile of platinum, ingredients, … And maybe the craftsmen won't relocate so they have to get the blacksmith to make a thing, and then they have to take the thing to the Wizard before taking it to the Cleric.
I just think it has great potential. And I think there are a ton of ideas in Skyrim to develop a base system.
Since my last post my group has had some time with the crafting system and I did a massive overhaul. I took some ideas from this thread, then researched several others, then rebuilt crafting from the ground up. Here are the things I learned along the way, and the current "final" changes.
My players didn't understand my crafting system and even I found it too complicated to explain every time someone wanted to craft.
Crafting should be treated like a mini-game that enhances a D&D campaign. It shouldn't take more time than necessary and nobody will craft items if they take years to make.
Having different rarities of crafting materials unnecessarily over complicated everything further, and required too much bookkeeping.
So I went back to the drawing board, deep dove into old Reddit posts, referenced Xanathar's Guide, and came up with this system.
Craft Skill: 25gp x your Proficiency bonus (e.g. +5 smithing skill = 125gp/day worth of materials).
Craft Time: 1/2 the cost of an item's value, divided by the Craft Skill (e.g. 1/2 cost of a Dagger of Venom is 750 gp, divided by 125/day as above = 6 days).
Materials: Using your own crafting materials reduces end costs (50 ore reduces the player cost of a Rare item by 20%, bringing the dagger cost down to 600 gp, or 100gp/day).
Skill Checks: Every day of crafting, the Player rolls vs a DC15 for Rare item, and costs the player 100gp/day of materials until its complete. Normal failures produce no results, and only cost the player time. Materials destroyed on a Nat01, and Nat20 count as 2 days worth of work reducing time and cost by 1 day.
Optional: The DM may require a poison gland from a dangerous enemy (CR 9-12 for Rare items) to complete the weapon.
Magic Item Crafting (daily activity)
Skill Check DC
Item Rarity
# Craft Materials
CR of Special
Special Notes
5
Common
5
1-3
The Player Cost is ½ an item’s value. Check price columns for full costs.
10
Uncommon
20
4-8
Every "# Craft Materials" reduces the final Player Cost by 20%, up to 80%.
15
Rare
50
9-12
Nat20 produces 2x days of work or 2x consumables (potions, scrolls, ammo).
20
Very Rare
200
13-18
Nat01 means the days materials are lost.
25
Legendary
1000
19+
CR is for monsters of rare ingredient quests (e.g. Yeti horn, elemental fire, etc)
Gathering Materials
Gather Roll
Materials Found
Special Ingredient CR
Example Complementary Skills:
1-9
0
1-3 (common)
Herbalism & Nature (ID herbs, poisons, etc)
10-14
1d6
4-8 (uncommon)
Smithing & Athletics (mining ore & gems)
15-19
2d6
9-12 (rare)
Alchemy & Medicine (extract venom or acid)
20-24
3d6
13-18 (very rare)
Leather Working & Survival (hide & bones)
25+
4d6
19+ (Legendary)
Navigation & Survival (find landmarks)
Gather Chance:
During travel, players can stop to gather materials over the course of 2 hours in-game.
Each map hex has 1d4+1 chances to gather materials per week. Map hexes are 6 miles.
Gather chances are divided up by the PCs who want to search for crafting materials (e.g. if 3 is rolled, one PC may search twice for herbs, and one PC may search for ore).
PCs can also roll 1x per day of downtime to search a hex immediately outside the town for materials instead of crafting, gambling, working, etc.
Gather Roll & Materials Found:
Materials Found is based on how high the player rolled using their crafting skill.
Natural 20 grants 2x materials found or something special like gems while mining for ore, or a rare healing root, etc.
Natural 01 means the source is destroyed for that specific craft (caused a fire, trampled, contaminated, broken, etc).
Complementary Skills grant advantage on the roll, provided the player is proficient in them, or another PC is helping with that skill proficiency.
Special Notes:
For every session of gathering, DM rolls for an encounter chance (possible discovery, event, enemies, etc).
Special Ingredient CR is for hard to find recipe ingredients like a fire elemental heart for a fire sword. Usually a boss at the end of a quest.
Deconstructing items grants materials equal to the weight of the item (e.g. plate armor provides 65 materials, while chainmail would provide 30 materials).
...that's beautiful. Not only does it make way, way, way more sense than the example in Xanthar's, it also doesn't take in-game months to make an item. Just like in real life, it would not take months to forge a sword or shield, or to brew potions or alcoholic drinks. Being new to DnD, I was kind of excited that I had accidentally picked a background that was very beneficial to the party (Hermit gives Herbalism Kit, so Health Pots -- thematically appropriate as well since I'm a Life Cleric). But when I read that it would take at least a week to brew a single potion....
...that's beautiful. Not only does it make way, way, way more sense than the example in Xanthar's, it also doesn't take in-game months to make an item. Just like in real life, it would not take months to forge a sword or shield, or to brew potions or alcoholic drinks. Being new to DnD, I was kind of excited that I had accidentally picked a background that was very beneficial to the party (Hermit gives Herbalism Kit, so Health Pots -- thematically appropriate as well since I'm a Life Cleric). But when I read that it would take at least a week to brew a single potion....
Umm... have you done any of these things?
I've made chain mail.
I'm a home brewer, who makes my own beer - and I know of people who make and age distilled spirits.
These things totally take months; in the case of sprits, sometimes years.
Even in cooking - making sauerkraut takes weeks or months. Fermented pickles take weeks. Making miso takes months. Making soy sauce can take a year. Aging wine can take many years.
A week to brew a single magical potion doesn't seem unreasonable.
Disclaimer: This signature is a badge of membership in the Forum Loudmouth Club. We are all friends. We are not attacking each other. We are engaging in spirited, friendly debate with one another. We may get snarky, but these are not attacks. Thank you for not reporting us.
Right, so my wife and I are actual herbalists who run an actual herbal apothecary and see actual clients. Check it out.
Making a tincture takes about 3 weeks. 15 minutes of that is stuffing the herb into a jar and filling it with alcohol or glycerin. The last 15 minutes of it is straining out the herb and dividing it into different bottles, because we can make a gallon at a time. Depending on the rarity of the herb, it can cost 10 - 50 dollars an ounce. And many times, an ounce is about 30 doses.
Other than the time it takes to find the herb (though you can buy them and grow them), only 30 minutes of that time is spent actually doing anything. The rest is just keeping it out of the sun.
There you go.
I let my druids and alchemists and such gather herbs that they can use to start brews going between adventuring. When they return home, they stock up on what's been decocting in the pantry.
Thank you, Wheelercub for the updated revised item crafting table. It's always seemed strange to me that making holy water actually cost Exactly the same as buying it at a shop. Also, having streamlined crafting rules enables players get creative with helping NPCs. It's not like a small town in the middle of nowhere can expect a band of 4 - 6 adventurers to be around All the time. There should be rules that enable the party to create special forms of common items for the town's protection.
...that's beautiful. Not only does it make way, way, way more sense than the example in Xanthar's, it also doesn't take in-game months to make an item. Just like in real life, it would not take months to forge a sword or shield, or to brew potions or alcoholic drinks. Being new to DnD, I was kind of excited that I had accidentally picked a background that was very beneficial to the party (Hermit gives Herbalism Kit, so Health Pots -- thematically appropriate as well since I'm a Life Cleric). But when I read that it would take at least a week to brew a single potion....
Umm... have you done any of these things?
I've made chain mail.
I'm a home brewer, who makes my own beer - and I know of people who make and age distilled spirits.
These things totally take months; in the case of sprits, sometimes years.
Even in cooking - making sauerkraut takes weeks or months. Fermented pickles take weeks. Making miso takes months. Making soy sauce can take a year. Aging wine can take many years.
A week to brew a single magical potion doesn't seem unreasonable.
And then there's some cooking that takes 5 minutes.
thats where the problem is, the current crafting systeme puts everything on the same standpoint regarding the time it takes, some things are easier to make and are quick, others are long and painfull, even if they would be inb the same "rarity" tier...
Right, so my wife and I are actual herbalists who run an actual herbal apothecary and see actual clients. Check it out.
Making a tincture takes about 3 weeks. 15 minutes of that is stuffing the herb into a jar and filling it with alcohol or glycerin. The last 15 minutes of it is straining out the herb and dividing it into different bottles, because we can make a gallon at a time. Depending on the rarity of the herb, it can cost 10 - 50 dollars an ounce. And many times, an ounce is about 30 doses.
Other than the time it takes to find the herb (though you can buy them and grow them), only 30 minutes of that time is spent actually doing anything. The rest is just keeping it out of the sun.
There you go.
I let my druids and alchemists and such gather herbs that they can use to start brews going between adventuring. When they return home, they stock up on what's been decocting in the pantry.
The end.
If its a pain in the butt to do in real live, i don't see why anyone would want to subject themselfs to this in a game...
I know for a certainty that my group would dismiss anything that takes more than 4 hours to make a minor potion, let alone stuff that would take them weeks...
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Normality is but an Illusion, Whats normal to the Spider, is only madness for the Fly"
I'm just curious if people actually think there is some reason to not make things take time in game. You literally can just say "Three weeks later, you've finished xxx" and move on. The other players can do other downtime activities specifically added in 5e to make downtime more interesting.
Further, it helps with campaigns where the DM may not want you to have something for a particular reason, maybe you can't wait 3 weeks, you only have 1 week until the big bad is doing something, so you enlist help of more people to craft faster, or find an alternate.
I don't understand people's adversity to long down-times. Adventurers need rest too. A demon isn't controlling a king in the area or drake attacking a village every day (at least in my worlds!)
...that's beautiful. Not only does it make way, way, way more sense than the example in Xanthar's, it also doesn't take in-game months to make an item. Just like in real life, it would not take months to forge a sword or shield, or to brew potions or alcoholic drinks. Being new to DnD, I was kind of excited that I had accidentally picked a background that was very beneficial to the party (Hermit gives Herbalism Kit, so Health Pots -- thematically appropriate as well since I'm a Life Cleric). But when I read that it would take at least a week to brew a single potion....
Umm... have you done any of these things?
I've made chain mail.
I'm a home brewer, who makes my own beer - and I know of people who make and age distilled spirits.
These things totally take months; in the case of sprits, sometimes years.
Even in cooking - making sauerkraut takes weeks or months. Fermented pickles take weeks. Making miso takes months. Making soy sauce can take a year. Aging wine can take many years.
A week to brew a single magical potion doesn't seem unreasonable.
I would like to point out, as a culinary and management professionally, that distilling and fermenting can take years but that is not the only way it can be made. New age wines and beers are typically sold within the year that they were harvested, and way back when they didnt age for any other reason than because it took a lot more time to ship things before the steam age.
If we decide to look at alchemy from a chemistry stand point, which is what it is the historical precursor of, growing compound solids, and other chemical reactions required to make whatever it is you are trying to make can be done in literal minutes. In the real world science takes a long time because of all the trial and error to make something that didnt previously exist but if you are trying to perform an experiment with results that are already determined because someone has already invented it (i.e. a healing potion) there is no way it would take more than 1 day.
I also fail to see how in a world where we can suppend our belief to the point of casting spells and slaying dragons we choose to keep it as realistic as humanly possible when talking about making a potion
Since an Herbalism Kit can be used to make Health potions, just what is anyone's idea of how fast and how many can be made. I feel this should be about 1 every day if they devote their time to it and less later on, or would it be that if they were not traveling they could make a batch of say 5 potions in one day. I feel this will benefit my players if they can do this. I will be including this to my games, but I want advice as to what rate I should keep it at.
I run it where you need proficiency with a herbalism kit 15-25 gold and about a day
Maybe it's just me, but I think a druid should be able to grab a flower of healing or a seed for free from their grove as a gift before adventuring, take care of it along the way, then plant it. All of it's seeds could be carefully taken and planted, then with the druidcraft cantrip, they would sprout. Then with the plant growth spell, all of them should grow to extremities of full growth. Plenty of seeds and essence could be taken further. Same goes for if there are any other plants going into the potion. Sure, climate would factor in for the lifespan of the plant(s), but the initial growth from the spells should already achieve it's peak growth. Everything cost nothing at some point. It's just a matter of what skills you have & how much time you are willing to spend.
Maybe there is a one time gp cost per tier of the flower's healing potency for a seed from a non-giving druid society: healing: 25gp, greater: 50gp, superior: 250gp, supreme: 2,500gp. Maybe it's just one type of flower and the dc check tiers result in their potency of the healing potion based on what you roll with a nature check while requiring an alchemy kit to make it. (Result 5 - healing, 10 - greater, 15 - superior, 20 - supreme) Also maybe using spell slots to infuse the plant with raw magic during it's natural growth could be a thing. (Past the 0 & 3rd level). That would add in leveling as a requirement, at least. (Spend slot of: 1st-3rd for healing, 4th for greater, 5th-6th for superior, 7th-9th - for supreme) to amplify it's healing benefit. You could also get more specific requiring them to be all healing spell slots instead of raw magic. That would prevent wizards and sorcerers from making them though.
I tried to justify other cost going into it after initial, but I can't imagine people needing to grind up much raw ruby or diamond to go into liquid. Everything should be fairly low cost after acquiring the proper seeds. Perhaps a rare item cost for book recipes. Maybe very rare for the supreme potion recipe. (or travel to a free library or small cost library.) Most of the same goes for poisons. I think the stated crafting cost is often just wrong at a glance, but if you think long enough you can come up with reasons. The economy of it all is based on the rarity of druids. Others have to put in more of a life's work to make farmland, import between climates, waiting for blooming seasons & using brewing skills before selling to a minority of the people. That's probably most of the huge timetable & cost for non-druids.
Other than that, maybe it's missing other things like a troll's regenerative blood, etc. That could up the cost, but being adventurers, you could just go out and find whatever ingredient. For time, I'm not sure. Magic accelerates much like a few rounds to grow the plants & maybe 20 minutes to collect new seeds. Then minutes of grinding petals or hours of draining a small amount of drops per flower. Compared to the common & assumed ways it's much more efficient.
Here’s what I drop into an herbalism kit for my players on their character sheets:
Potions of healing fall into a special category for item crafting, separate from other magic items. A character who has proficiency with the herbalism kit can create these potions. The times and costs for doing so are summarized on the Herbalism Creation table.
Herbalism Creation
Type Cost Time Eyebright Ointment 1gp 1 Hour Antitoxin 25gp Long Rest Potion of Healing 25gp 1 day PoH, Greater 100gp 1 workweek PoH, Superior 1,000gp 3 workweeks PoH, Supreme 10,000gp 4 workweeks Healing Potion (My HB) 100gp 1 workweek HP, Improved (My HB) 1,000gp 3 workeeeks HP, Maximum (My HB) 10,000gp 4 workweeks Other Nonmagical Potions- (50% list price) (1 day/25gp + 1 day/100gp) (<25gp- Long Rests or 1hr/gp)
Don't know if anyone pointed this out, but for "consumables" the cost is halved. Potions, scrolls, and other consumable magic items therefore take half the time to craft as say that dagger of venom that someone else mentioned. So, there's already a bit of a nod to making potions quicker to make.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us." - Gandalf Grayhame
Don't know if anyone pointed this out, but for "consumables" the cost is halved. Potions, scrolls, and other consumable magic items therefore take half the time to craft as say that dagger of venom that someone else mentioned. So, there's already a bit of a nod to making potions quicker to make.
That's correct, and basic potions of healing take even less time than other kinds of potions (1 day), if you're using the downtime crafting rules in Xanathar's:
This had been made somewhat more relevant ( and complicated ) these days with the introduction of the Artificer class, which is kind of built around crafting, while trying to not introduce an entire crafting layer to 5e.
My DM Philosophy, as summed up by other people: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rN5w4-azTq3Kbn0Yvk9nfqQhwQ1R5by1/view
Disclaimer: This signature is a badge of membership in the Forum Loudmouth Club. We are all friends. We are not attacking each other. We are engaging in spirited, friendly debate with one another. We may get snarky, but these are not attacks. Thank you for not reporting us.
Since my last post my group has had some time with the crafting system and I did a massive overhaul. I took some ideas from this thread, then researched several others, then rebuilt crafting from the ground up. Here are the things I learned along the way, and the current "final" changes.
So I went back to the drawing board, deep dove into old Reddit posts, referenced Xanathar's Guide, and came up with this system.
- During travel, players can stop to gather materials over the course of 2 hours in-game.
- Each map hex has 1d4+1 chances to gather materials per week. Map hexes are 6 miles.
- Gather chances are divided up by the PCs who want to search for crafting materials (e.g. if 3 is rolled, one PC may search twice for herbs, and one PC may search for ore).
- PCs can also roll 1x per day of downtime to search a hex immediately outside the town for materials instead of crafting, gambling, working, etc.
Gather Roll & Materials Found:- Materials Found is based on how high the player rolled using their crafting skill.
- Natural 20 grants 2x materials found or something special like gems while mining for ore, or a rare healing root, etc.
- Natural 01 means the source is destroyed for that specific craft (caused a fire, trampled, contaminated, broken, etc).
- Complementary Skills grant advantage on the roll, provided the player is proficient in them, or another PC is helping with that skill proficiency.
Special Notes:Wheelercub, I'd love for you to publish a pamphlet on your system once you have play tested it more. I think crafting has a place in D&D for players to get a specific item that is difficult to acquire. As a matter of fact, I think the very idea of acquiring and making an item can be the theme of a campaign.
I played as a kid in the AD&D days. I remember having to find ingredients. I remember having to purify and distill ingredients. I remember having to craft base weapons worthy of being enchanted. All these things can be used to create a campaign of say The City Lost the Special Jeweled Orb with a Purify Water Blessing and the only way to reestablish this thriving trade center is to find (make) a new one, because pure water is almost impossible to get in this strategic locale.
The party can go find the right jewels, an alchemist, a cleric for purifying rituals, a wizard for whizzing tools or stuff, a master blacksmith, a pile of platinum, ingredients, … And maybe the craftsmen won't relocate so they have to get the blacksmith to make a thing, and then they have to take the thing to the Wizard before taking it to the Cleric.
I just think it has great potential. And I think there are a ton of ideas in Skyrim to develop a base system.
...that's beautiful. Not only does it make way, way, way more sense than the example in Xanthar's, it also doesn't take in-game months to make an item. Just like in real life, it would not take months to forge a sword or shield, or to brew potions or alcoholic drinks. Being new to DnD, I was kind of excited that I had accidentally picked a background that was very beneficial to the party (Hermit gives Herbalism Kit, so Health Pots -- thematically appropriate as well since I'm a Life Cleric). But when I read that it would take at least a week to brew a single potion....
Umm... have you done any of these things?
I've made chain mail.
I'm a home brewer, who makes my own beer - and I know of people who make and age distilled spirits.
These things totally take months; in the case of sprits, sometimes years.
Even in cooking - making sauerkraut takes weeks or months. Fermented pickles take weeks. Making miso takes months. Making soy sauce can take a year. Aging wine can take many years.
A week to brew a single magical potion doesn't seem unreasonable.
My DM Philosophy, as summed up by other people: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rN5w4-azTq3Kbn0Yvk9nfqQhwQ1R5by1/view
Disclaimer: This signature is a badge of membership in the Forum Loudmouth Club. We are all friends. We are not attacking each other. We are engaging in spirited, friendly debate with one another. We may get snarky, but these are not attacks. Thank you for not reporting us.
Right, so my wife and I are actual herbalists who run an actual herbal apothecary and see actual clients. Check it out.
Making a tincture takes about 3 weeks. 15 minutes of that is stuffing the herb into a jar and filling it with alcohol or glycerin. The last 15 minutes of it is straining out the herb and dividing it into different bottles, because we can make a gallon at a time. Depending on the rarity of the herb, it can cost 10 - 50 dollars an ounce. And many times, an ounce is about 30 doses.
Other than the time it takes to find the herb (though you can buy them and grow them), only 30 minutes of that time is spent actually doing anything. The rest is just keeping it out of the sun.
There you go.
I let my druids and alchemists and such gather herbs that they can use to start brews going between adventuring. When they return home, they stock up on what's been decocting in the pantry.
The end.
Thank you, Wheelercub for the updated revised item crafting table. It's always seemed strange to me that making holy water actually cost Exactly the same as buying it at a shop. Also, having streamlined crafting rules enables players get creative with helping NPCs. It's not like a small town in the middle of nowhere can expect a band of 4 - 6 adventurers to be around All the time. There should be rules that enable the party to create special forms of common items for the town's protection.
And then there's some cooking that takes 5 minutes.
thats where the problem is, the current crafting systeme puts everything on the same standpoint regarding the time it takes, some things are easier to make and are quick, others are long and painfull, even if they would be inb the same "rarity" tier...
If its a pain in the butt to do in real live, i don't see why anyone would want to subject themselfs to this in a game...
I know for a certainty that my group would dismiss anything that takes more than 4 hours to make a minor potion, let alone stuff that would take them weeks...
"Normality is but an Illusion, Whats normal to the Spider, is only madness for the Fly"
Kain de Frostberg- Dark Knight - (Vengeance Pal3/ Hexblade 9), Port Mourn
Kain de Draakberg-Dark Knight lvl8-Avergreen(DitA)
For profit and xp. To enhance the game and maybe their personal enjoyment.
Thanks for the real world examples.
I'm just curious if people actually think there is some reason to not make things take time in game. You literally can just say "Three weeks later, you've finished xxx" and move on.
The other players can do other downtime activities specifically added in 5e to make downtime more interesting.
Further, it helps with campaigns where the DM may not want you to have something for a particular reason, maybe you can't wait 3 weeks, you only have 1 week until the big bad is doing something, so you enlist help of more people to craft faster, or find an alternate.
I don't understand people's adversity to long down-times. Adventurers need rest too. A demon isn't controlling a king in the area or drake attacking a village every day (at least in my worlds!)
But what about staying alive? This is important to!
I would like to point out, as a culinary and management professionally, that distilling and fermenting can take years but that is not the only way it can be made. New age wines and beers are typically sold within the year that they were harvested, and way back when they didnt age for any other reason than because it took a lot more time to ship things before the steam age.
If we decide to look at alchemy from a chemistry stand point, which is what it is the historical precursor of, growing compound solids, and other chemical reactions required to make whatever it is you are trying to make can be done in literal minutes. In the real world science takes a long time because of all the trial and error to make something that didnt previously exist but if you are trying to perform an experiment with results that are already determined because someone has already invented it (i.e. a healing potion) there is no way it would take more than 1 day.
I also fail to see how in a world where we can suppend our belief to the point of casting spells and slaying dragons we choose to keep it as realistic as humanly possible when talking about making a potion
Per the actual published rules, a single potion of healing (common) takes a single day and a cost of 25 gold pieces in materials.
Potions, and other consumable items, are half price, so 50 gp, which brings it nicely in line with the price in the PHB.
I run it where you need proficiency with a herbalism kit 15-25 gold and about a day
Maybe it's just me, but I think a druid should be able to grab a flower of healing or a seed for free from their grove as a gift before adventuring, take care of it along the way, then plant it. All of it's seeds could be carefully taken and planted, then with the druidcraft cantrip, they would sprout. Then with the plant growth spell, all of them should grow to extremities of full growth. Plenty of seeds and essence could be taken further. Same goes for if there are any other plants going into the potion. Sure, climate would factor in for the lifespan of the plant(s), but the initial growth from the spells should already achieve it's peak growth. Everything cost nothing at some point. It's just a matter of what skills you have & how much time you are willing to spend.
Maybe there is a one time gp cost per tier of the flower's healing potency for a seed from a non-giving druid society: healing: 25gp, greater: 50gp, superior: 250gp, supreme: 2,500gp. Maybe it's just one type of flower and the dc check tiers result in their potency of the healing potion based on what you roll with a nature check while requiring an alchemy kit to make it. (Result 5 - healing, 10 - greater, 15 - superior, 20 - supreme) Also maybe using spell slots to infuse the plant with raw magic during it's natural growth could be a thing. (Past the 0 & 3rd level). That would add in leveling as a requirement, at least. (Spend slot of: 1st-3rd for healing, 4th for greater, 5th-6th for superior, 7th-9th - for supreme) to amplify it's healing benefit. You could also get more specific requiring them to be all healing spell slots instead of raw magic. That would prevent wizards and sorcerers from making them though.
I tried to justify other cost going into it after initial, but I can't imagine people needing to grind up much raw ruby or diamond to go into liquid. Everything should be fairly low cost after acquiring the proper seeds. Perhaps a rare item cost for book recipes. Maybe very rare for the supreme potion recipe. (or travel to a free library or small cost library.) Most of the same goes for poisons. I think the stated crafting cost is often just wrong at a glance, but if you think long enough you can come up with reasons. The economy of it all is based on the rarity of druids. Others have to put in more of a life's work to make farmland, import between climates, waiting for blooming seasons & using brewing skills before selling to a minority of the people. That's probably most of the huge timetable & cost for non-druids.
Other than that, maybe it's missing other things like a troll's regenerative blood, etc. That could up the cost, but being adventurers, you could just go out and find whatever ingredient. For time, I'm not sure. Magic accelerates much like a few rounds to grow the plants & maybe 20 minutes to collect new seeds. Then minutes of grinding petals or hours of draining a small amount of drops per flower. Compared to the common & assumed ways it's much more efficient.
Here’s what I drop into an herbalism kit for my players on their character sheets:
I hope that helps.
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Don't know if anyone pointed this out, but for "consumables" the cost is halved. Potions, scrolls, and other consumable magic items therefore take half the time to craft as say that dagger of venom that someone else mentioned. So, there's already a bit of a nod to making potions quicker to make.
"All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us." - Gandalf Grayhame
That's correct, and basic potions of healing take even less time than other kinds of potions (1 day), if you're using the downtime crafting rules in Xanathar's:
Magic Item Crafting Time and Cost
Potion of Healing Creation
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