I have a question on the wording of the rule regarding switching spells when leveling up for the Eldritch Knight and Arcane Trickster archetypes. (I'm going off the rules in the Essentials Kit rulebook.)
When you level up, you are allowed to swap out one spell for another, as long as it is limited to the proper school of magic. But the school of magic restriction doesn't apply when you are replacing the spell you learned at 3rd level.
Suppose I choose Arcane Trickster at 3rd level, which mostly restricts spells to the enchantment and illusion schools. I choose magic missile (evocation) as the unrestricted spell. At 4th level I decide to swap magic missile for feather fall (transmutation).
Question: At 5th level, am I allowed to swap feather fall for another unrestricted spell, say longstrider (transmutation), or, since feather fall was not the "spell you gained at 3rd level from any school of magic" (technically feather fall was gained at 4th level), am I now restricted to swapping feather fall only to an enchantment or illusion spell?
In short, are you always allowed to have one spell from any school, or can you swap yourself to a point where you can't get this unrestricted spell back? Would it make a difference if at 4th level I swapped magic missile to an enchantment or illusion spell (say, disguise self)? Could I later swap that spell back to one of the spells from any school?
The wording in the Essentials kit is basically the same as the PHB except it explicitly mentions the level 3 spell while the players handbook only explicitly mentions the ones at 8, 14 and 20th.
As a DM, I would tend to rule that the arcane trickster has one wizard spell that does not come from enchantment/illusion starting at level 3 and that the rogue can replace that spell with any other wizard spell of a level for which they have spell slots and allowed by their level in arcane trickster when they level up. In my opinion, it remains the spell from any school even if you replace it along the way. However, if you read it strictly then the rules could be interpreted to mean that you can only replace the any school spell once with a spell from any school (which doesn't seem to me what was intended). In the end, with things like this, ask your DM how they interpret it.
“Whenever you gain a level in this class, you can replace one of the wizard spells you know with another spell of your choice from the wizard spell list. The new spell must be of a level for which you have spell slots, and it must be an enchantment or illusion spell, unless you're replacing the spell you gained at 8th, 14th, or 20th level.”
RAW: If you replace the non-Illusion/Enchantment spell you learn at 3rd level, the replacement spell you learn must be from ether Illusion or Enchantment. Only the spells you learn at levels 8, 14, or 20 are immune to that requirement.
The PHB not mentioning the level 3 spell for arcane trickster is actually a typo. SAC has mentioned as much, but there hasn't been an errata for it yet.
Question: At 5th level, am I allowed to swap feather fall for another unrestricted spell, say longstrider (transmutation), or, since feather fall was not the "spell you gained at 3rd level from any school of magic" (technically feather fall was gained at 4th level), am I now restricted to swapping feather fall only to an enchantment or illusion spell?
In short, are you always allowed to have one spell from any school, or can you swap yourself to a point where you can't get this unrestricted spell back? Would it make a difference if at 4th level I swapped magic missile to an enchantment or illusion spell (say, disguise self)? Could I later swap that spell back to one of the spells from any school?
You are correct. You can always have 1 non-school restricted spell, and it increases at level 8, 14, and 20.
The unrestricted spells you learn at 3/8/14/20, and the spells you may have already replaced them with while leveling, always remain unrestricted for the purposes of swapping spells at level-up.
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You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
Additional question: do spells obtained from any school of magic (at certain levels of these subclassess EK and AT, of course) use Intelligence as their spellcasting ability or the ability they are usually associated with? For instance, say, I chose Entangle, does it then use the Arcane Tricksters Intelligence spellcasting ability for the DC or Wisdom?
Additional question: do spells obtained from any school of magic (at certain levels of these subclassess EK and AT, of course) use Intelligence as their spellcasting ability or the ability they are usually associated with? For instance, say, I chose Entangle, does it then use the Arcane Tricksters Intelligence spellcasting ability for the DC or Wisdom?
It uses Intelligence
Spellcasting Ability: Intelligence is your spellcasting ability for your wizard spells, since you learn your spells through dedicated study and memorization.
Additional question: do spells obtained from any school of magic (at certain levels of these subclassess EK and AT, of course) use Intelligence as their spellcasting ability or the ability they are usually associated with? For instance, say, I chose Entangle, does it then use the Arcane Tricksters Intelligence spellcasting ability for the DC or Wisdom?
You need to remember that while the spells learned can be from any school of magic they still have to be from the Wizards spell list.
If you somehow manage to gain access to spells from another spell list then, as @Lunali said, the feature that allows the access should tell you what to use as your spellcasting modifier for those spells.
I have a question on the wording of the rule regarding switching spells when leveling up for the Eldritch Knight and Arcane Trickster archetypes. (I'm going off the rules in the Essentials Kit rulebook.)
When you level up, you are allowed to swap out one spell for another, as long as it is limited to the proper school of magic. But the school of magic restriction doesn't apply when you are replacing the spell you learned at 3rd level.
Suppose I choose Arcane Trickster at 3rd level, which mostly restricts spells to the enchantment and illusion schools. I choose magic missile (evocation) as the unrestricted spell. At 4th level I decide to swap magic missile for feather fall (transmutation).
Question: At 5th level, am I allowed to swap feather fall for another unrestricted spell, say longstrider (transmutation), or, since feather fall was not the "spell you gained at 3rd level from any school of magic" (technically feather fall was gained at 4th level), am I now restricted to swapping feather fall only to an enchantment or illusion spell?
In short, are you always allowed to have one spell from any school, or can you swap yourself to a point where you can't get this unrestricted spell back? Would it make a difference if at 4th level I swapped magic missile to an enchantment or illusion spell (say, disguise self)? Could I later swap that spell back to one of the spells from any school?
The wording in the Essentials kit is basically the same as the PHB except it explicitly mentions the level 3 spell while the players handbook only explicitly mentions the ones at 8, 14 and 20th.
As a DM, I would tend to rule that the arcane trickster has one wizard spell that does not come from enchantment/illusion starting at level 3 and that the rogue can replace that spell with any other wizard spell of a level for which they have spell slots and allowed by their level in arcane trickster when they level up. In my opinion, it remains the spell from any school even if you replace it along the way. However, if you read it strictly then the rules could be interpreted to mean that you can only replace the any school spell once with a spell from any school (which doesn't seem to me what was intended). In the end, with things like this, ask your DM how they interpret it.
“Whenever you gain a level in this class, you can replace one of the wizard spells you know with another spell of your choice from the wizard spell list. The new spell must be of a level for which you have spell slots, and it must be an enchantment or illusion spell, unless you're replacing the spell you gained at 8th, 14th, or 20th level.”
RAW: If you replace the non-Illusion/Enchantment spell you learn at 3rd level, the replacement spell you learn must be from ether Illusion or Enchantment. Only the spells you learn at levels 8, 14, or 20 are immune to that requirement.
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The PHB not mentioning the level 3 spell for arcane trickster is actually a typo. SAC has mentioned as much, but there hasn't been an errata for it yet.
You are correct. You can always have 1 non-school restricted spell, and it increases at level 8, 14, and 20.
Thank you. I was unaware that had been added since there has not been an errata as you pointed out.
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The unrestricted spells you learn at 3/8/14/20, and the spells you may have already replaced them with while leveling, always remain unrestricted for the purposes of swapping spells at level-up.
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
Additional question: do spells obtained from any school of magic (at certain levels of these subclassess EK and AT, of course) use Intelligence as their spellcasting ability or the ability they are usually associated with? For instance, say, I chose Entangle, does it then use the Arcane Tricksters Intelligence spellcasting ability for the DC or Wisdom?
It uses Intelligence
But Entangle is not a wizard spell but rather a druid's spell? Would AT and EK still get to use Intelligence for that one or Wisdom? Thank you
It would depend on how they got access to the spell, they don't get it through their subclass features.
You need to remember that while the spells learned can be from any school of magic they still have to be from the Wizards spell list.
If you somehow manage to gain access to spells from another spell list then, as @Lunali said, the feature that allows the access should tell you what to use as your spellcasting modifier for those spells.
Thanks Thezzaruz, that cleared it up for me. :) I somehow missed that part. :)