I really like the Telekinetic feat and the Telepathic feat, I think that opens up a lot of cool opportunities for even non-psion classes, much like Ritual Caster or Magic Initiate do for non casters.
I wasn't sure about a other wizard subclass, but with the new spells I think it works thematically.
I'm not disappointed about the lack of a psionic-only class a la mystic, but maybe that's just because I never played it in past editions so I don't miss it. I think it works well here though. Cool UA!
Ok so going through the things. I do like parts of it.
i think there is room in 5th for subclasses that splash some flavor of another class or mechanics into a strong chassis and build something cool. I think the soul knife and psychic warrior are good, assuming the Psion/Psionicists is a class in its own right. If that is the case having a Wizard subclass that uses psychic magic, is cool and I’m all for it. BUT this article frames Psionics as just another magic which in my mind breaks what psionics has been. Since 5th edition is the edition for all editions, this seems to counter that design philosophy.
using the Sorcerer as a base fro psionicists seem like a much better option, as for Intelligence being the Psionics casting stat, in second edition the casting stat was mostly based on the discipline of the science or devotion, either Con, Wis or Int. I can see Cha (force of personality) be a better explanation of this. I also am loathe at classes that change the fundamental core of a class at levels later than 1st. It breaks some of the verisimilitude, here you have a person who is studious and then at 2nd level they fundamentally change how the cast spells, this is also my problem with the artificer as the subclasses 5ere are core to the character’s identity. For rogues or fighters these seem like good layers buildinging on top of an established identity. Long winded but that is why I feel sorcerer is a better fit.
Here is my thought on class features fro a sorcerer psionicist.
1st level
Psionics focus (as is)
psionic devotion (mostly the same but with the following): you are forced to learn the following spells at the indicated level as your first spell known for that level, you may not exchange this spell as you gain levels. based on the cantrips chosen see list below.
friends: 1st. Charm Person. 3rd. Suggestion. 5th. Fear. 7th. Charm Monster. 9th. Dominate Person. 11th. mass Suggestion. 13th.??? Power word pain. 15th. Dominate Monster. 17th. ??? Power word kill
DireWolfReich, I'd recommend going and taking a look at the Aberrant Mind Sorcerer over in the Warlock/Sorcerer UA.
I know at first they seem really slimy and alien, and perhaps psionic should be alien, but most of that stuff can be reskinned as just a pure psionic without any alien aspects.
Invasive Thoughts is just telepathy
Psionic spells are obvious
Warped Being has a descriptor of it being a Psionic barrier.
Psionic Sorcery and Defenses are just passive.
Revelation in Flesh would take a bit of reskinning, the mechanics are fine but borrow the 'Thought Form' from the Psionic wizard and you're basically good to go.
The way the wizard is now allows for a two level dip that could enhance an Arcane Trickster greatly. First off mage hand without components and to cast as a bonus action is huge. Second the friends cantrip without the downfall of the person it cast on realizing they had been charmed.
Looking at the Thought Form for the Wizard, I was caught by something. You can cast spells in Thought Form without any components (barring those with gold costs.)
I don't know what to make of that. Silent casting with hands full? Yep, you can do that. I don't know if that's too good or not. Heck, can you even counterspell in this case? Part of the trigger for counterspell is that you can see someone attempting to cast a spell, and in this case . . . the spell just happens.
I don't know, I'm not good at gauging these things.
Overall I like the ideas here, every class having a splash of psionics would be great for a Dark Sun setting so every class feels useful. I still hope we get the mystic, I would really love another Int based class, it feels too under-represented.
The thing that I really don't like is that the psionic spells are spells, so they're affected by anti-magic. I get why they did it, it is a much more elegant solution and helps the DM manage the chaos, but the more I think about it the more it bothers me. To me at least the best part of psionics are that they aren't magic, so they aren't affected by anti-magic and other effects of the sort. Particularly with the Dark Sun setting having psionics just be spells feels wrong.
Might just be me and it may end up something that Crawford posts on Twitter as "Just homebrew it that way." but it feels really off the themes of psionics. Just my 2 cents at least.
I would love to see unique spells lists and spell mechanics with really crunchy details for the various casters, so Wizards, Bards, Sorcerers, Warlocks and Psions can each feel completely unique in their spell casting.
But the level of complexity to do that is just beyond what can really be sustained on a large scale. And Complexity is a barrier to entry. And niche products like Fantasy Tabletop RPG games just cant afford to have barriers to entry and expect to survive.
So I can see why one would want Psionics to be vastly different from a thematic or even story reason, but I can also see why it doesn't really make a lot of business sense.
@guytza, Yup, that’s what I used as my telepath psionicist.
This was a quick thing I typed up using just this UA as a source.
i have 4 sorcerer subclasses set up for my dark sun game one for each Telepath, Telekineticist, Metabloist and Seer.
Thanks for the feedback.
I get you now. Sorry I think I misunderstood your intention.
That being said, I think I might understand why they stuck Psion on the Wizard Chasis and not the Sorcerer. Pulling off a proper Psion takes a LOT of spells (event the abhorrent mind adds an always known spell list). I have a Bard who is a Psion in all but name (not intended, the character just sort of grew that way) but with this new spell list I find myself utterly perplexed on which spells to learn. Sure I can fill up the spells known with these clearly flavorful spells, but then how do i fit in equally thematic spells such as Detect Thoughts, Sending, Phantasmal Force/Killer, Calm Emotions, etc? I feel like in order to really get to the level I'd want to be to really feel like a Psionic I would need to have Wizard level casting capacity.
You sound like you've worked those same thoughts through, so I'm curious about your conclusions.
I think it would not be that hard to build the Psion if you use a "frame" like Warlock. Start out with a selection of Psionic Abilities to choose from like Evocations. Create a small number of thematic "cantrip" like abilities that can be used repeatedly and scale up as you level. Then a selection of more powerful "Spells" that can be used between Rests.
The subclasses kind of build themselves from there with a Melee Psion, a Ranged Psion and a Healing Psion.
I really hope that we do not have our psion be a wizard subclass. I am fine with a psionic wizard subclass. I am not fine with psion being a wizard subclass.
I really hope that we do not have our psion be a wizard subclass. I am fine with a psionic wizard subclass. I am not fine with psion being a wizard subclass.
There is also the Aberrant Mind Sorcerer, from the interview my guess is every class is getting their psionic subclass
Id Insinuation: I think this one may be too powerful. Hideous Laughter is it's closest cousin and considered a spell that punches way above it's weight class due to the condition and the lack of target restrictions. Id Insinuation has a comparable condition (does damage rather than inflicting prone) but has NO target restriction and does not suffer for being used on a creature while it is being attacked. Recommendation: remove the concentration and ongoing effect for a spell that does 1d12 psychic damage and incapacitates until the end of the targets next turn.
Mental Barrier: is a bit like Shield and Absorb Elements, but given the nature of the spells it defends against, having it be a level 2 spell is a good tradeoff. No changes needed.
Mind Thrust: This one is pretty amazing. Bonus Action, Intelligence save, 3d6 damage and a control effect. The only downside is that you cannot pump the damage, but you can pump the number of targets (downside at least from my Bard perspective). But the Bonus Action control without concentration and the interplay with Mind Sliver is going to have this on my spell list forever. The nearest spell to it is Dissonant Whispers, which is like a sister spell to Mind Thrust in a fashion, with each playing a slightly different use case for similar results. My best use of this is as a 'Second Crowd Control' Option. ID Insintuation can use your concentration to lock down a target, and Mind sliver + Mind Thrust can all but incapacitate a second one. Especially if a big strong muscle guy decides to grapple the thrust target.
Thought Shield is a fascinating counter spell to several psionic effect spells and could be a hard counter to things like Mind Thrust, Id insertion, and Ego Whip depending on DM interpretation (the descriptors say they insert thoughts, this ostensibly blocks that)
Psionic Blast: Bard:"Do I have this? Am I allowed to have this?!" But in all seriousness it's a very interesting spell for a class that has very few options in the Dex save AOE realm, but might not look as tasty to anyone with a fireball at their disposal.
Ego Whip: hoo boy. Let's take a second here. if you land this spell (that has no target restrictions) it has disadvantage on damn near everything and can only save against the spell by passing an intelligence save which it takes with disadvantage and possibly a d6 and a D4 subtracted if you use mind Sliver spam on it and a cleric stacks Bane. This is a Dragon killer that turns a fire breathing badass into a walking loot pinata. It also lives in the 4th level spell slot which I've always considered a rather lackluster spell level. But this one is a game changer. I'm inclined to turn this spell down simply because I feel most DMs struggle to put together exciting and memorable encounters and the power creep on this spell is just insane.
Intellect Fortress: Pretty nice Aura type spell that is going to do wonders for keeping your teammates (and yourself) safe against high powered targets. Being a 5th level spell I have to compare it to something like Circle of Power which it seems to line up well with.
Psychic Crush: 12d6, Persistent Stunned condition, Intelligence Save, NON CONCENTRATION. And it's an enchantment spell, so all those Enchantment Wizards that got their ability to double target with enchantment spells at level 10 are in the back giggling like school girls at a Harry Styles concert.
The V3 Mystic was so poorly received as a whole by the community that WotC decided to scrap it and start over. They sifted through for what they could salvage and started two different projects sometime back in (early-mid?) 2018. One of those projects was to develop a new psionic Sub for each PHB Class, that is what has been published recently through UA.
The other project was Mike Mearls starting over basically from scratch with a new “Psion” Class. He was keeping the general idea of the Awakened and the Nomad as Subs but actually giving them each a clearer concept. He was also developing two new additional Subs that would also have clearer character concepts. His new Psion would have switched from Talents and Disciplines to a “more user friendly” Cantrip/Spell mechanic more inline with everything else in D&D, but they would have all been completely unique to the Psion, and Psions would have been able to spend their Spell Slots to actually cast their versions of Cantrips at higher levels. (He was trying to figure out something that would have satisfied us old heads who remember playing Psionicist back in the day, but wouldn’t be too different from the existing magic mechanics so as not to “intimidate” newer players into not buying the product. I’m personally not sure that particular combination is possible since, as everything else in 5e has proven, there is no way to make everyone happy at the same time.)
The most recent thing I saw about it was on YouTube towards the end of last year. Then the whole “Zac fiasco” hit and no one has heard anything since about the Psion, and people have barely heard anything at all from Mearls either since he used his reaction to take a semipermanent Hide action. (Lead game designer class feature I think.) Here is a link to everything he had been working on up until he pulled the proverbial blanket over his head.
I think it would not be that hard to build the Psion if you use a "frame" like Warlock. Start out with a selection of Psionic Abilities to choose from like Evocations. Create a small number of thematic "cantrip" like abilities that can be used repeatedly and scale up as you level. Then a selection of more powerful "Spells" that can be used between Rests.
The subclasses kind of build themselves from there with a Melee Psion, a Ranged Psion and a Healing Psion.
This is exactly what the did with the 2016(?) version of the mystic. Idk if you know about that train wreck but it was the biggest headache in the life of every DM in the world. It had its own “spell” and “cantrips” but they were so ridiculously overpowered AND convoluted that Wizards hasnt even known how to come back to it so this is their solution.
It may not be what you have always dreamed if, but this is better. Trust me
If WotC was to make what everyone here wanted, with a specific list of abilities for this class so that it isnt a spell caster its a unique thing, first of all think about what you are asking its very unrealistic, and second thats the reason the old version was so overpowered. I’ll elaborate
In order to create an entire new class, it has to fit a niche. The Artificer for example is a crafting class, something Thats didn’t exist hardly at all in 5e prior. The idea of a Psionic person, using psychic damage and telepathy is not a niche. It is a flavor of spell casting/character building. SO in order for them to make what is essentially an entirely new list of spells for just one class, said spells cannot be copies of what already exists because it defeats the purpose so qll the spells must be completely unique. Last time they did that almost all of the abilities were extremely overpowered; such as dealing psychic damage with no saving throw or attack roll, or shrinking down to 1 inch tall at will (which was basically a first level spell)
TL;DR/Moral of the story; Y'all are asking for too much, and what you are asking for isn’t actually that probable anyway
In general you are 100% correct. That’s why I would have been happy with using a lot of the same spells if they had just given us an alternative (pretty much any alternative) to the same old boring Spell Slots system. Heck, if they based the entire thing on nothing but Cantrips and Concentration Spells with nothing in between and any mechanic at all besides Spell Slots I would have accepted it so long as the Class Features and lore they had used fit the theme. But WotC is frankly too afraid that if they try anything at all different than Spell Slots that people would find it too different/complicated and not shovel over the shekels to buy it. 😓
As a psion, you gain the following class features:
Hit Points
Hit Dice: 1d8 per Psion level
Hit Points at 1st Level: 8 + your Constitution modifier
Hit Points at Higher Levels: 1d8 (or 4) + your Constitution modifier per psion level after 1st
Proficiencies
Armor: None
Weapons: Simple weapons
Tools: None
Saving Throws: Intelligence, Wisdom
Skills: Choose two from Arcana, Deception, Insight, Investigation, Medicine, Perception, and Persuasion
Psionics
As a Psion, you have spent years conditioning your mind and evolving your natural gifts to use psionic talents and disciplines. Though easily confused by the laymen as magic, psionics is the power of the mind to affect the natural word through force of will.
Psionic Talents (Cantrips)
A psionic talent is a minor psionic ability you have practiced to the point that you can perform it with ease. At 1st level, you know three talents of your choosing from the Talents list. As you level you learn more talents of your choice in accordance with the Psion table.
Psionic Disciplines (Spells)
A psionic discipline is a more complex and powerful ability that is taxing on the mind and body of the psion which limits there use.
The Psion table shows how many Discipline slots you have to use the table also shows the power level of those slots; all of your Discipline slots are the same level. To use one of your Disciplines, you must expend one of these slots. You regain all expended Disciple slots when you finish a short or long rest.
Disciplines Known at 1st Level and Higher
At 1st level, you know two Disciplines of your choice from the Discipline list.
The Discipline known column of the Psion table shows when you learn more Disciplines. You must meet any requirements specified by the Discipline before you can learn it.
Psionic Ability
Intelligence is your Psionic ability for your Talents and Disciplines, so you use your Intelligence whenever an ability from this class refers to your Psionic ability. In addition, you use your Intelligence modifier when setting the saving throw DC for a ability you use and when making an attack roll with one.
Psion save DC = 8 + your proficiency bonus + your Intelligence modifier.
Psion attack modifier = your proficiency bonus + your Intelligence modifier.
Psionic Discoveries (Invocations)
Through the course of training you mind and strengthening your force of will, you have developed abilities and tricks to help amplify and augment your Psionic potential. A level prerequisite refers to your level in this class.
At 2nd level, you gain one Discovery of your choice from the collection of Discoveries detailed at the end of the class description. As you gain levels as a Psion, you may select additional discoveries of your choice, as shown in the Discoveries Known column of the Psion table.
If a Discovery has prerequisites, you must meet them to learn it. You can gain the Discovery when you meet its prerequisites. A level prerequisite refers to your level in this class.
Fire Within - You have an affinity for Pyrokinetics. When ever you use a Talent or Discipline that deals Fire damage, you can augment the damage dealt by adding your adding your Intelligence modifier to the total damaged rolled.
Natural Empath - You are incredibly intuitive to the emotional state of those around you. You gain expertise with the Insight, Persuasion skills.
Telepath - You can communicate telepathically with those you can see within 30 feet. You must share a common language for this ability to be effective.
Empowered Force of Will - Your mind is a powerful weapon. Whenever you use a Discipline or Talent that deals Force damage you may add your Intelligence modifier to the total damaged rolled.
Strength of Will - Your self-control is incredibly potent. You have advantage on saving throws to resist Charm and Fear Effects.
Impenetrable Thoughts - Your mind is like a well-guarded fortress. You have advantage on saving throws to resist abilities that attempt to read your thoughts or target you for scrying.
Touch the Mind - You can sense the presence of others by their mental energies. You can use a bonus action to detect the presence of those you can’t otherwise see within 30 feet, negating disadvantage when attacking in total darkness or against invisible targets within range.
Disrupting Visions - You can disrupt the thought patterns of others with flashes of incoherent or frightening visions. You may use a reaction to force a target to re-roll an attack made against you if you can see the attacker.
Veiled Presence: You can distort the vision of those around you making you more difficult to notice. You have advantage on Stealth checks.
Assail the Mind and Body - You have learned to blend your mental attacks with your physical attacks. When you deal damage with a melee weapon attack, you may deal additional psychic damage equal to your intelligence modifier. You can use this ability only once on each of your turns.
Psionic Path
At 3rd level, you begin your travels down a path of Psionic specialization. You gain one of the following features of your choice.
Path of the Mind Killer
You have chosen to master the art of destroying the mind as you attack the body. When you select this path, you may choose to add your Intelligence modifier instead or strength or dexterity to make weapon attack and damage rolls.
Additionally, you can manifest a melee weapon of pure psychic energy. It takes the form and properties of a melee weapon that you are proficient in but instead of the normal damage type for that weapon, you deal Psychic damage instead.
Your Psionic weapon disappears if it is more than 5 feet away from you for 1 minute or more. It also disappears if you use this feature again, if you dismiss the weapon (no action required), or if you die.
Path of the Mentalist
Through your focus and mental training, you have gained greater mastery of your Psionic abilities. You may select one extra Talent and Discipline of your choice to add to those you already know.
Additionally, you gain two extra Discipline slots beyond those that you would normally have. You regain these extra slots just as you would your regular slots.
Path of the Calming Mind
You have mastered the ability to exert your will over the body’s naturally healing and boost its capabilities.
During a short rest you can use your mental abilities to help you and your allies heal. Anyone that uses their Hit Dice may add your Intelligence Modifier on top of the results they would have normally gained from the roll.
As a bonus action on your turn, you can boost the abilities of your allies granting a bonus to either their next attack roll or damage roll equal to your Intelligence modifier. You can use this ability a number of times equal to your Intelligence modifier plus half your level in this class per long rest.
In general you are 100% correct. That’s why I would have been happy with using a lot of the same spells if they had just given us an alternative (pretty much any alternative) to the same old boring Spell Slots system.
You mean like the spell point system in the DMG?
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I really like the Telekinetic feat and the Telepathic feat, I think that opens up a lot of cool opportunities for even non-psion classes, much like Ritual Caster or Magic Initiate do for non casters.
I wasn't sure about a other wizard subclass, but with the new spells I think it works thematically.
I'm not disappointed about the lack of a psionic-only class a la mystic, but maybe that's just because I never played it in past editions so I don't miss it. I think it works well here though. Cool UA!
Ok so going through the things. I do like parts of it.
i think there is room in 5th for subclasses that splash some flavor of another class or mechanics into a strong chassis and build something cool. I think the soul knife and psychic warrior are good, assuming the Psion/Psionicists is a class in its own right. If that is the case having a Wizard subclass that uses psychic magic, is cool and I’m all for it. BUT this article frames Psionics as just another magic which in my mind breaks what psionics has been. Since 5th edition is the edition for all editions, this seems to counter that design philosophy.
using the Sorcerer as a base fro psionicists seem like a much better option, as for Intelligence being the Psionics casting stat, in second edition the casting stat was mostly based on the discipline of the science or devotion, either Con, Wis or Int. I can see Cha (force of personality) be a better explanation of this. I also am loathe at classes that change the fundamental core of a class at levels later than 1st. It breaks some of the verisimilitude, here you have a person who is studious and then at 2nd level they fundamentally change how the cast spells, this is also my problem with the artificer as the subclasses 5ere are core to the character’s identity. For rogues or fighters these seem like good layers buildinging on top of an established identity. Long winded but that is why I feel sorcerer is a better fit.
Here is my thought on class features fro a sorcerer psionicist.
1st level
Psionics focus (as is)
psionic devotion (mostly the same but with the following): you are forced to learn the following spells at the indicated level as your first spell known for that level, you may not exchange this spell as you gain levels. based on the cantrips chosen see list below.
friends: 1st. Charm Person. 3rd. Suggestion. 5th. Fear. 7th. Charm Monster. 9th. Dominate Person. 11th. mass Suggestion. 13th.??? Power word pain. 15th. Dominate Monster. 17th. ??? Power word kill
mage hand: 1st. Catapult. 3rd. Levitate. 5th. Fly 7th. Otiluke’s Resilient Sphere. 9th. Telekinesis. 11th globe of invulnerability 13th. forcecage. 15th. ??? 17th. Invulnerability.
message: 1st. Dissonant whispers. 3rd. Detect thoughts. 5th. Clairvoyance. 7th. Locate creature. 9th. Scrying. 11th. True seeing. 13th. ??? 15th.?.. 17th. Foresight.
6th level.
Thought form. As is.
14th level.
Thought travel. As is.
18th level.
something awesome I’d bet???
DireWolfReich, I'd recommend going and taking a look at the Aberrant Mind Sorcerer over in the Warlock/Sorcerer UA.
I know at first they seem really slimy and alien, and perhaps psionic should be alien, but most of that stuff can be reskinned as just a pure psionic without any alien aspects.
Invasive Thoughts is just telepathy
Psionic spells are obvious
Warped Being has a descriptor of it being a Psionic barrier.
Psionic Sorcery and Defenses are just passive.
Revelation in Flesh would take a bit of reskinning, the mechanics are fine but borrow the 'Thought Form' from the Psionic wizard and you're basically good to go.
Warp Reality requires no change.
The way the wizard is now allows for a two level dip that could enhance an Arcane Trickster greatly. First off mage hand without components and to cast as a bonus action is huge. Second the friends cantrip without the downfall of the person it cast on realizing they had been charmed.
Your secret is safe with my indifference - Percy
Shaylic, that is a really good point. Throw the 'Telekinetic feat' into that combo and you've got a very strong package.
And i just realized Id Insinuation and Mind Thrust are Arcane Trickster viable spells.
@guytza, Yup, that’s what I used as my telepath psionicist.
This was a quick thing I typed up using just this UA as a source.
i have 4 sorcerer subclasses set up for my dark sun game one for each Telepath, Telekineticist, Metabloist and Seer.
Thanks for the feedback.
Looking at the Thought Form for the Wizard, I was caught by something. You can cast spells in Thought Form without any components (barring those with gold costs.)
I don't know what to make of that. Silent casting with hands full? Yep, you can do that. I don't know if that's too good or not. Heck, can you even counterspell in this case? Part of the trigger for counterspell is that you can see someone attempting to cast a spell, and in this case . . . the spell just happens.
I don't know, I'm not good at gauging these things.
Overall I like the ideas here, every class having a splash of psionics would be great for a Dark Sun setting so every class feels useful. I still hope we get the mystic, I would really love another Int based class, it feels too under-represented.
The thing that I really don't like is that the psionic spells are spells, so they're affected by anti-magic. I get why they did it, it is a much more elegant solution and helps the DM manage the chaos, but the more I think about it the more it bothers me. To me at least the best part of psionics are that they aren't magic, so they aren't affected by anti-magic and other effects of the sort. Particularly with the Dark Sun setting having psionics just be spells feels wrong.
Might just be me and it may end up something that Crawford posts on Twitter as "Just homebrew it that way." but it feels really off the themes of psionics. Just my 2 cents at least.
I would love to see unique spells lists and spell mechanics with really crunchy details for the various casters, so Wizards, Bards, Sorcerers, Warlocks and Psions can each feel completely unique in their spell casting.
But the level of complexity to do that is just beyond what can really be sustained on a large scale. And Complexity is a barrier to entry. And niche products like Fantasy Tabletop RPG games just cant afford to have barriers to entry and expect to survive.
So I can see why one would want Psionics to be vastly different from a thematic or even story reason, but I can also see why it doesn't really make a lot of business sense.
I get you now. Sorry I think I misunderstood your intention.
That being said, I think I might understand why they stuck Psion on the Wizard Chasis and not the Sorcerer. Pulling off a proper Psion takes a LOT of spells (event the abhorrent mind adds an always known spell list). I have a Bard who is a Psion in all but name (not intended, the character just sort of grew that way) but with this new spell list I find myself utterly perplexed on which spells to learn. Sure I can fill up the spells known with these clearly flavorful spells, but then how do i fit in equally thematic spells such as Detect Thoughts, Sending, Phantasmal Force/Killer, Calm Emotions, etc? I feel like in order to really get to the level I'd want to be to really feel like a Psionic I would need to have Wizard level casting capacity.
You sound like you've worked those same thoughts through, so I'm curious about your conclusions.
I think it would not be that hard to build the Psion if you use a "frame" like Warlock. Start out with a selection of Psionic Abilities to choose from like Evocations. Create a small number of thematic "cantrip" like abilities that can be used repeatedly and scale up as you level. Then a selection of more powerful "Spells" that can be used between Rests.
The subclasses kind of build themselves from there with a Melee Psion, a Ranged Psion and a Healing Psion.
She/Her Player and Dungeon Master
I really hope that we do not have our psion be a wizard subclass. I am fine with a psionic wizard subclass. I am not fine with psion being a wizard subclass.
There is also the Aberrant Mind Sorcerer, from the interview my guess is every class is getting their psionic subclass
Some spell reviews:
Id Insinuation: I think this one may be too powerful. Hideous Laughter is it's closest cousin and considered a spell that punches way above it's weight class due to the condition and the lack of target restrictions. Id Insinuation has a comparable condition (does damage rather than inflicting prone) but has NO target restriction and does not suffer for being used on a creature while it is being attacked. Recommendation: remove the concentration and ongoing effect for a spell that does 1d12 psychic damage and incapacitates until the end of the targets next turn.
Mental Barrier: is a bit like Shield and Absorb Elements, but given the nature of the spells it defends against, having it be a level 2 spell is a good tradeoff. No changes needed.
Mind Thrust: This one is pretty amazing. Bonus Action, Intelligence save, 3d6 damage and a control effect. The only downside is that you cannot pump the damage, but you can pump the number of targets (downside at least from my Bard perspective). But the Bonus Action control without concentration and the interplay with Mind Sliver is going to have this on my spell list forever. The nearest spell to it is Dissonant Whispers, which is like a sister spell to Mind Thrust in a fashion, with each playing a slightly different use case for similar results. My best use of this is as a 'Second Crowd Control' Option. ID Insintuation can use your concentration to lock down a target, and Mind sliver + Mind Thrust can all but incapacitate a second one. Especially if a big strong muscle guy decides to grapple the thrust target.
Thought Shield is a fascinating counter spell to several psionic effect spells and could be a hard counter to things like Mind Thrust, Id insertion, and Ego Whip depending on DM interpretation (the descriptors say they insert thoughts, this ostensibly blocks that)
Psionic Blast: Bard:"Do I have this? Am I allowed to have this?!" But in all seriousness it's a very interesting spell for a class that has very few options in the Dex save AOE realm, but might not look as tasty to anyone with a fireball at their disposal.
Ego Whip: hoo boy. Let's take a second here. if you land this spell (that has no target restrictions) it has disadvantage on damn near everything and can only save against the spell by passing an intelligence save which it takes with disadvantage and possibly a d6 and a D4 subtracted if you use mind Sliver spam on it and a cleric stacks Bane. This is a Dragon killer that turns a fire breathing badass into a walking loot pinata. It also lives in the 4th level spell slot which I've always considered a rather lackluster spell level. But this one is a game changer. I'm inclined to turn this spell down simply because I feel most DMs struggle to put together exciting and memorable encounters and the power creep on this spell is just insane.
Intellect Fortress: Pretty nice Aura type spell that is going to do wonders for keeping your teammates (and yourself) safe against high powered targets. Being a 5th level spell I have to compare it to something like Circle of Power which it seems to line up well with.
Psychic Crush: 12d6, Persistent Stunned condition, Intelligence Save, NON CONCENTRATION. And it's an enchantment spell, so all those Enchantment Wizards that got their ability to double target with enchantment spells at level 10 are in the back giggling like school girls at a Harry Styles concert.
The V3 Mystic was so poorly received as a whole by the community that WotC decided to scrap it and start over. They sifted through for what they could salvage and started two different projects sometime back in (early-mid?) 2018. One of those projects was to develop a new psionic Sub for each PHB Class, that is what has been published recently through UA.
The other project was Mike Mearls starting over basically from scratch with a new “Psion” Class. He was keeping the general idea of the Awakened and the Nomad as Subs but actually giving them each a clearer concept. He was also developing two new additional Subs that would also have clearer character concepts. His new Psion would have switched from Talents and Disciplines to a “more user friendly” Cantrip/Spell mechanic more inline with everything else in D&D, but they would have all been completely unique to the Psion, and Psions would have been able to spend their Spell Slots to actually cast their versions of Cantrips at higher levels. (He was trying to figure out something that would have satisfied us old heads who remember playing Psionicist back in the day, but wouldn’t be too different from the existing magic mechanics so as not to “intimidate” newer players into not buying the product. I’m personally not sure that particular combination is possible since, as everything else in 5e has proven, there is no way to make everyone happy at the same time.)
The most recent thing I saw about it was on YouTube towards the end of last year. Then the whole “Zac fiasco” hit and no one has heard anything since about the Psion, and people have barely heard anything at all from Mearls either since he used his reaction to take a semipermanent Hide action. (Lead game designer class feature I think.) Here is a link to everything he had been working on up until he pulled the proverbial blanket over his head.
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This is exactly what the did with the 2016(?) version of the mystic. Idk if you know about that train wreck but it was the biggest headache in the life of every DM in the world. It had its own “spell” and “cantrips” but they were so ridiculously overpowered AND convoluted that Wizards hasnt even known how to come back to it so this is their solution.
It may not be what you have always dreamed if, but this is better. Trust me
Ya gotta think of it this way:
If WotC was to make what everyone here wanted, with a specific list of abilities for this class so that it isnt a spell caster its a unique thing, first of all think about what you are asking its very unrealistic, and second thats the reason the old version was so overpowered. I’ll elaborate
In order to create an entire new class, it has to fit a niche. The Artificer for example is a crafting class, something Thats didn’t exist hardly at all in 5e prior. The idea of a Psionic person, using psychic damage and telepathy is not a niche. It is a flavor of spell casting/character building. SO in order for them to make what is essentially an entirely new list of spells for just one class, said spells cannot be copies of what already exists because it defeats the purpose so qll the spells must be completely unique. Last time they did that almost all of the abilities were extremely overpowered; such as dealing psychic damage with no saving throw or attack roll, or shrinking down to 1 inch tall at will (which was basically a first level spell)
TL;DR/Moral of the story; Y'all are asking for too much, and what you are asking for isn’t actually that probable anyway
Atrome,
In general you are 100% correct. That’s why I would have been happy with using a lot of the same spells if they had just given us an alternative (pretty much any alternative) to the same old boring Spell Slots system. Heck, if they based the entire thing on nothing but Cantrips and Concentration Spells with nothing in between and any mechanic at all besides Spell Slots I would have accepted it so long as the Class Features and lore they had used fit the theme. But WotC is frankly too afraid that if they try anything at all different than Spell Slots that people would find it too different/complicated and not shovel over the shekels to buy it. 😓
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The Psion Table
Level
Proficiency
Bonus
Features
Talents
Known
Disciplines
Known
Slots
Discoveries
Known
1st
+2
Psionics, Discovery
3
2
2
1
2nd
+2
-
3
3
2
1
3rd
+2
Psionic Path
3
4
2
1
4th
+2
Ability Score Improvement
3
5
2
2
5th
+3
—
4
6
2
2
6th
+3
Path Feature
4
7
3
2
7th
+3
—
4
8
3
2
8th
+3
Ability Score Improvement
4
9
3
3
9th
+4
—
5
10
3
3
10th
+4
Path Feature
5
10
4
3
11th
+4
--
5
11
4
3
12th
+4
Ability Score Improvement
5
11
4
4
13th
+5
--
5
12
4
4
14th
+5
Path Feature
5
12
4
4
15th
+5
--
5
13
5
4
16th
+5
Ability Score Improvement
5
13
5
5
17th
+6
--
5
14
5
5
18th
+6
--
5
14
5
5
19th
+6
Ability Score Improvement
5
15
5
5
20th
+6
Ascendance
5
15
5
5
Class Features
As a psion, you gain the following class features:
Hit Points
Hit Dice: 1d8 per Psion level
Hit Points at 1st Level: 8 + your Constitution modifier
Hit Points at Higher Levels: 1d8 (or 4) + your Constitution modifier per psion level after 1st
Proficiencies
Armor: None
Weapons: Simple weapons
Tools: None
Saving Throws: Intelligence, Wisdom
Skills: Choose two from Arcana, Deception, Insight, Investigation, Medicine, Perception, and Persuasion
Psionics
As a Psion, you have spent years conditioning your mind and evolving your natural gifts to use psionic talents and disciplines. Though easily confused by the laymen as magic, psionics is the power of the mind to affect the natural word through force of will.
Psionic Talents (Cantrips)
A psionic talent is a minor psionic ability you have practiced to the point that you can perform it with ease. At 1st level, you know three talents of your choosing from the Talents list. As you level you learn more talents of your choice in accordance with the Psion table.
Psionic Disciplines (Spells)
A psionic discipline is a more complex and powerful ability that is taxing on the mind and body of the psion which limits there use.
The Psion table shows how many Discipline slots you have to use the table also shows the power level of those slots; all of your Discipline slots are the same level. To use one of your Disciplines, you must expend one of these slots. You regain all expended Disciple slots when you finish a short or long rest.
Disciplines Known at 1st Level and Higher
At 1st level, you know two Disciplines of your choice from the Discipline list.
The Discipline known column of the Psion table shows when you learn more Disciplines. You must meet any requirements specified by the Discipline before you can learn it.
Psionic Ability
Intelligence is your Psionic ability for your Talents and Disciplines, so you use your Intelligence whenever an ability from this class refers to your Psionic ability. In addition, you use your Intelligence modifier when setting the saving throw DC for a ability you use and when making an attack roll with one.
Psion save DC = 8 + your proficiency bonus + your Intelligence modifier.
Psion attack modifier = your proficiency bonus + your Intelligence modifier.
Psionic Discoveries (Invocations)
Through the course of training you mind and strengthening your force of will, you have developed abilities and tricks to help amplify and augment your Psionic potential. A level prerequisite refers to your level in this class.
At 2nd level, you gain one Discovery of your choice from the collection of Discoveries detailed at the end of the class description. As you gain levels as a Psion, you may select additional discoveries of your choice, as shown in the Discoveries Known column of the Psion table.
If a Discovery has prerequisites, you must meet them to learn it. You can gain the Discovery when you meet its prerequisites. A level prerequisite refers to your level in this class.
Fire Within - You have an affinity for Pyrokinetics. When ever you use a Talent or Discipline that deals Fire damage, you can augment the damage dealt by adding your adding your Intelligence modifier to the total damaged rolled.
Natural Empath - You are incredibly intuitive to the emotional state of those around you. You gain expertise with the Insight, Persuasion skills.
Telepath - You can communicate telepathically with those you can see within 30 feet. You must share a common language for this ability to be effective.
Empowered Force of Will - Your mind is a powerful weapon. Whenever you use a Discipline or Talent that deals Force damage you may add your Intelligence modifier to the total damaged rolled.
Strength of Will - Your self-control is incredibly potent. You have advantage on saving throws to resist Charm and Fear Effects.
Impenetrable Thoughts - Your mind is like a well-guarded fortress. You have advantage on saving throws to resist abilities that attempt to read your thoughts or target you for scrying.
Touch the Mind - You can sense the presence of others by their mental energies. You can use a bonus action to detect the presence of those you can’t otherwise see within 30 feet, negating disadvantage when attacking in total darkness or against invisible targets within range.
Disrupting Visions - You can disrupt the thought patterns of others with flashes of incoherent or frightening visions. You may use a reaction to force a target to re-roll an attack made against you if you can see the attacker.
Veiled Presence: You can distort the vision of those around you making you more difficult to notice. You have advantage on Stealth checks.
Assail the Mind and Body - You have learned to blend your mental attacks with your physical attacks. When you deal damage with a melee weapon attack, you may deal additional psychic damage equal to your intelligence modifier. You can use this ability only once on each of your turns.
Psionic Path
At 3rd level, you begin your travels down a path of Psionic specialization. You gain one of the following features of your choice.
Path of the Mind Killer
You have chosen to master the art of destroying the mind as you attack the body. When you select this path, you may choose to add your Intelligence modifier instead or strength or dexterity to make weapon attack and damage rolls.
Additionally, you can manifest a melee weapon of pure psychic energy. It takes the form and properties of a melee weapon that you are proficient in but instead of the normal damage type for that weapon, you deal Psychic damage instead.
Your Psionic weapon disappears if it is more than 5 feet away from you for 1 minute or more. It also disappears if you use this feature again, if you dismiss the weapon (no action required), or if you die.
Path of the Mentalist
Through your focus and mental training, you have gained greater mastery of your Psionic abilities. You may select one extra Talent and Discipline of your choice to add to those you already know.
Additionally, you gain two extra Discipline slots beyond those that you would normally have. You regain these extra slots just as you would your regular slots.
Path of the Calming Mind
You have mastered the ability to exert your will over the body’s naturally healing and boost its capabilities.
During a short rest you can use your mental abilities to help you and your allies heal. Anyone that uses their Hit Dice may add your Intelligence Modifier on top of the results they would have normally gained from the roll.
As a bonus action on your turn, you can boost the abilities of your allies granting a bonus to either their next attack roll or damage roll equal to your Intelligence modifier. You can use this ability a number of times equal to your Intelligence modifier plus half your level in this class per long rest.
A little more...
She/Her Player and Dungeon Master
You mean like the spell point system in the DMG?