Lurker in the Deep: Any watery tentacled patron from the Elemental Plane of Water. This is related to planescape. Revived Rogue: Shadowfell or Fugue Plane. Definitely planescape themed. Beast Barbarian: The Beastlands is one of the planes of existence. It is planescape. Twilight Cleric: Shadowfell, easily. Likely a worshiper of the Raven Queen. Swarmkeeper Rangers: They're fey. No arguing about it. This is 100% planescape. Stars Druid: This one is a bit of a stretch, but I could easily see it being related to any of the positive planes of existence.
These are planescape related (maybe not stars druid).
It's got to be planescape.
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Lurker in the Deep: Any watery tentacled patron from the Elemental Plane of Water. This is related to planescape. Revived Rogue: Shadowfell or Fugue Plane. Definitely planescape themed. Beast Barbarian: The Beastlands is one of the planes of existence. It is planescape. Twilight Cleric: Shadowfell, easily. Likely a worshiper of the Raven Queen. Swarmkeeper Rangers: They're fey. No arguing about it. This is 100% planescape. Stars Druid: This one is a bit of a stretch, but I could easily see it being related to any of the positive planes of existence.
These are planescape related (maybe not stars druid).
It's got to be planescape.
just becuase you can flavour them to be somewhat related to one of the planes of existance does not mean that it is planescape related, there are planes of existance for literally everything and your motivations just feels a lot like confirmation bias, for instance twilight cleric
Twilight Domain The Twilight Domain governs the transition and blending of light into darkness. It is a time of rest and comfort, but also the threshold between safety and the unknown. Deities of healing or respite (such as Boldrei, Hestia, Mishakal, or Pelor), bravery or protection (such as Dol Arrah, Hajama, Helm, or Ilmater), travel or transition (such as Fharlanghn, Hermes, the Raven Queen, or the Traveler), or the night and dreams (such as Celestian, Morpheus, Nut, or Selûne) might grant their clerics the Twilight Domain
the raven queen is mentioned as one of the many possible dieties that might grant this domain, but it is only briefly mentioned as one possibillity, this domain is all about protection, about feeling safe and well rested, the shadowfell is an massive hellscape of torment, an dark reflection of the material plane that supposedly lacks emotion yet has a lot of things that are both angry and hungry, a place where those who merely visits may be haunted by immense dread, terror and possible depression. Fall asleep next to an twilight cleric and you will awaken safe, protected and well rested. Fall asleep in the shadowfell and you will wake up feeling misserable or dead (or maybe even a shadow dragon).
the beast barbarian has a few suggested origins, from having one of your ancestors be a druid who wild shaped a lot to it having to do with an animal spirit or it being a gift from a fey spirit. None of those suggested origins of your power even MENTION the beastlands, just becuase there is an plane of existence for it does not mean it is connected to that plane, you are clutching at straws here, it is like saying that the four elements monk is connected to the elemental planes or that the sun soul monk is related to the upper planes, like saying that the ranger class and beast master archetype are also planescape related becuase beastlands exist
yes an planescape book is probably comming and a lot of these are probably made with the planes of existance in mind, but a lot of these will also not be connected to planescape and just be completely normal subclasses with no particular connection to any of the planes whatsoever
also onomancy is still a bit of an stretch, but i guess a lot of extraplanar creatures, epsecially fiends posess true name and knowledge of those true names does give you power over them (finding the books of keeping as an onomancy wizard in an planescape campaign would be dope)
Clockwork Soul, Oath of the Watchers, and Noble Genie are explicitly planes-related, but I'm not even sure the warlock counts because warlocks in general are about gaining power from extraplanar beings.
Clockwork Soul, Oath of the Watchers, and Noble Genie are explicitly planes-related, but I'm not even sure the warlock counts because warlocks in general are about gaining power from extraplanar beings.
patrons do not have to reside in other planes of existance, even if most are at the very least connected to one in some manner, aboleths and krakens are connected to the water plane but found mostly here back in mother material (i refuse to call the material plane anything else), hexblade weapons can be found on the material plane, even if they are made by the raven queen
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Clockwork Soul, Oath of the Watchers, and Noble Genie are explicitly planes-related, but I'm not even sure the warlock counts because warlocks in general are about gaining power from extraplanar beings.
patrons do not have to reside in other planes of existance, even if most are at the very least connected to one in some manner, aboleths and krakens are connected to the water plane but found mostly here back in mother material (i refuse to call the material plane anything else), hexblade weapons can be found on the material plane, even if they are made by the raven queen
I...know all this already. That's why I said "in general". The point I was making was that the Genie patron is nothing special because most other patrons in 5e at present live in other planes of existence.
Lurker in the Deep: Any watery tentacled patron from the Elemental Plane of Water. This is related to planescape. Revived Rogue: Shadowfell or Fugue Plane. Definitely planescape themed. Beast Barbarian: The Beastlands is one of the planes of existence. It is planescape. Twilight Cleric: Shadowfell, easily. Likely a worshiper of the Raven Queen. Swarmkeeper Rangers: They're fey. No arguing about it. This is 100% planescape. Stars Druid: This one is a bit of a stretch, but I could easily see it being related to any of the positive planes of existence.
These are planescape related (maybe not stars druid).
It's got to be planescape.
just becuase you can flavour them to be somewhat related to one of the planes of existance does not mean that it is planescape related, there are planes of existance for literally everything and your motivations just feels a lot like confirmation bias, for instance twilight cleric
There are not planes of existence for literally everything. You just made up a claim with no evidence, which is the definition of confirmation bias. Show me the plane of existence of Chefs and Pizza, and I'll believe you. Not use fallacies to back up your arguments.
Twilight Domain The Twilight Domain governs the transition and blending of light into darkness. It is a time of rest and comfort, but also the threshold between safety and the unknown. Deities of healing or respite (such as Boldrei, Hestia, Mishakal, or Pelor), bravery or protection (such as Dol Arrah, Hajama, Helm, or Ilmater), travel or transition (such as Fharlanghn, Hermes, the Raven Queen, or the Traveler), or the night and dreams (such as Celestian, Morpheus, Nut, or Selûne) might grant their clerics the Twilight Domain
the raven queen is mentioned as one of the many possible dieties that might grant this domain, but it is only briefly mentioned as one possibillity, this domain is all about protection, about feeling safe and well rested, the shadowfell is an massive hellscape of torment, an dark reflection of the material plane that supposedly lacks emotion yet has a lot of things that are both angry and hungry, a place where those who merely visits may be haunted by immense dread, terror and possible depression. Fall asleep next to an twilight cleric and you will awaken safe, protected and well rested. Fall asleep in the shadowfell and you will wake up feeling misserable or dead (or maybe even a shadow dragon).
The shadowfell isn't a hellscape of torment. It is the opposite of the Feywild. The Feywild is a plane of vibrant, physical emotions, and the Shadowfell is the opposite of that. It is the plane devoid of powerful emotions, leaving behind the darker ones. The shadows of the emotions. The sorrows. Anger, Hatred, Hunger, Thirst, those are the realm of the Shadowfell. The Shadowfell isn't a hellscape, the Nine Hells are.
The Shadowfell isn't an "evil" plane, technically speaking. Is it evil to be hungry? Is it evil to be sad? No, it's just dark. They're just feelings we don't like. That is what the Shadowfell is about. Darker emotions. Twilight Clerics are the ones that use darkness to their benefit. Their abilities scream Shadowfell. The fact that they can create spheres of dim light, empower themselves with it, see through infinite darkness, give that power to others. They are the perfect guides through the Shadowfell all in mechanics. The fact that the flavor text doesn't say that they're "Shadowfell" clerics doesn't prove your point or mine, but it does make me wonder if they omitted that because they don't want to scream "THIS WILL BE A PLANESCAPE BOOK!" It makes more sense to test the mechanics for a setting that you want to develop without alerting everyone of the book that you're going to publish.
the beast barbarian has a few suggested origins, from having one of your ancestors be a druid who wild shaped a lot to it having to do with an animal spirit or it being a gift from a fey spirit. None of those suggested origins of your power even MENTION the beastlands, just becuase there is an plane of existence for it does not mean it is connected to that plane, you are clutching at straws here, it is like saying that the four elements monk is connected to the elemental planes or that the sun soul monk is related to the upper planes, like saying that the ranger class and beast master archetype are also planescape related becuase beastlands exist
Again, they wouldn't publish the UA screaming the identity of the book this UA will go in. When they published the Oath of Heroism (Glory) for the Theros book, they didn't yell "THIS GUY SERVES THE THEROS GODS." They made the mechanics to see if people liked it, got advice on how to fix it, and then when they were ready to introduce the new book to the community, they said, "Oh, remember that Heroism paladin we playtested a few months back? Yeah, that was for this."
The fact that it isn't screaming that it is designed to be a Beastlands barbarian doesn't disprove my point. It just shows that in the Planescape book, they will likely list what the connections were supposed to be. This barbarian screams Beastlands not only in name, but in flavor and abilities. Beast Master ranger and the Ranger class have nothing to do with this. They weren't designing a planescape book when they made the PHB. The fact that the 4 elements monk exists doesn't disprove my theory either. Beast Barbarians are much more "extraplanar" in theme than the Beast Master Ranger, so I don't know what you were trying to do there.
yes an planescape book is probably comming and a lot of these are probably made with the planes of existance in mind, but a lot of these will also not be connected to planescape and just be completely normal subclasses with no particular connection to any of the planes whatsoever
also onomancy is still a bit of an stretch, but i guess a lot of extraplanar creatures, epsecially fiends posess true name and knowledge of those true names does give you power over them (finding the books of keeping as an onomancy wizard in an planescape campaign would be dope)
If you think that a planescape book is coming out and a lot of these subclasses are themed like that, why are you even arguing about this? We agree with each other! The fact that a lot of this at first glance don't scream Planescape is likely WotC's goal for these. Test out the mechanics and general theme without spoiling the identity of your future book.
Onoumancy is not a stretch. Demons and Devils revolve around the existence of true names. The fact that these fiends are related to true names could even be why these mages exist. I can just imagine the section of the book where they have player options and tie them to the different planes of existence. It's not a stretch, the idea of true naming came from these fiends.
I think that they weren't trying to spoil the identity of the book these subclasses are going in, and so when they do announce it and all the subclasses in it, the community will go, "duh! How did I not see that?"
The fact that some of the options don't leap out at you as Planescape is likely the intent of Wizards of the Coast, as they don't like it when they aren't able to release the identity of their future books when they want to. (Explorer's Guide to Wildemount and Mythic Odysseys of Theros were both leaked before WotC could officially announce them. They probably want to avoid that again.)
Hiding the initial identities of these subclasses and the book is in the best interests of WotC.
We don't even need to be arguing about this, we agree that Planescape is coming, right?
Lurker in the Deep: Any watery tentacled patron from the Elemental Plane of Water. This is related to planescape. Revived Rogue: Shadowfell or Fugue Plane. Definitely planescape themed. Beast Barbarian: The Beastlands is one of the planes of existence. It is planescape. Twilight Cleric: Shadowfell, easily. Likely a worshiper of the Raven Queen. Swarmkeeper Rangers: They're fey. No arguing about it. This is 100% planescape. Stars Druid: This one is a bit of a stretch, but I could easily see it being related to any of the positive planes of existence.
These are planescape related (maybe not stars druid).
It's got to be planescape.
just becuase you can flavour them to be somewhat related to one of the planes of existance does not mean that it is planescape related, there are planes of existance for literally everything and your motivations just feels a lot like confirmation bias, for instance twilight cleric
There are not planes of existence for literally everything. You just made up a claim with no evidence, which is the definition of confirmation bias. Show me the plane of existence of Chefs and Pizza, and I'll believe you. Not use fallacies to back up your arguments.
this is an hyperbole, i did not literally mean there are planes of existance for every type of thing, just that there are loads of them
Twilight Domain The Twilight Domain governs the transition and blending of light into darkness. It is a time of rest and comfort, but also the threshold between safety and the unknown. Deities of healing or respite (such as Boldrei, Hestia, Mishakal, or Pelor), bravery or protection (such as Dol Arrah, Hajama, Helm, or Ilmater), travel or transition (such as Fharlanghn, Hermes, the Raven Queen, or the Traveler), or the night and dreams (such as Celestian, Morpheus, Nut, or Selûne) might grant their clerics the Twilight Domain
the raven queen is mentioned as one of the many possible dieties that might grant this domain, but it is only briefly mentioned as one possibillity, this domain is all about protection, about feeling safe and well rested, the shadowfell is an massive hellscape of torment, an dark reflection of the material plane that supposedly lacks emotion yet has a lot of things that are both angry and hungry, a place where those who merely visits may be haunted by immense dread, terror and possible depression. Fall asleep next to an twilight cleric and you will awaken safe, protected and well rested. Fall asleep in the shadowfell and you will wake up feeling misserable or dead (or maybe even a shadow dragon).
The shadowfell isn't a hellscape of torment. It is the opposite of the Feywild. The Feywild is a plane of vibrant, physical emotions, and the Shadowfell is the opposite of that. It is the plane devoid of powerful emotions, leaving behind the darker ones. The shadows of the emotions. The sorrows. Anger, Hatred, Hunger, Thirst, those are the realm of the Shadowfell. The Shadowfell isn't a hellscape, the Nine Hells are.
The Shadowfell isn't an "evil" plane, technically speaking. Is it evil to be hungry? Is it evil to be sad? No, it's just dark. They're just feelings we don't like. That is what the Shadowfell is about. Darker emotions. Twilight Clerics are the ones that use darkness to their benefit. Their abilities scream Shadowfell. The fact that they can create spheres of dim light, empower themselves with it, see through infinite darkness, give that power to others. They are the perfect guides through the Shadowfell all in mechanics. The fact that the flavor text doesn't say that they're "Shadowfell" clerics doesn't prove your point or mine, but it does make me wonder if they omitted that because they don't want to scream "THIS WILL BE A PLANESCAPE BOOK!" It makes more sense to test the mechanics for a setting that you want to develop without alerting everyone of the book that you're going to publish
again tho, the mechanics does not seem like the kind of cleric who would draw power from the shadowfell, more like the kind of cleric who would oppose the powers that reside there and serve as a guide through the plane
honestly yeah, with how much they are connected to fiends they are saying they are befit an planescape campaign or even meant for planescape is not a stretch i take that back, but true name magic is not completely tied to it, it has stood as its own thing previously with all creatures and objects, not just fiends having their own true names.
the beast barbarian has a few suggested origins, from having one of your ancestors be a druid who wild shaped a lot to it having to do with an animal spirit or it being a gift from a fey spirit. None of those suggested origins of your power even MENTION the beastlands, just becuase there is an plane of existence for it does not mean it is connected to that plane, you are clutching at straws here, it is like saying that the four elements monk is connected to the elemental planes or that the sun soul monk is related to the upper planes, like saying that the ranger class and beast master archetype are also planescape related becuase beastlands exist
The fact that it isn't screaming that it is designed to be a Beastlands barbarian doesn't disprove my point. It just shows that in the Planescape book, they will likely list what the connections were supposed to be. This barbarian screams Beastlands not only in name, but in flavor and abilities. Beast Barbarians are much more "extraplanar" in theme than the Beast Master Ranger, so I don't know what you were trying to do there.
i do not know much of the planes, but i dont think there is much that really connects the beast barbarian to that particular plane of existance. Yes that plane has the abillity to permanently or temporarily turn somebody to a beast if they kill something, and i guess you could make an argument for the abillities that affect others behavior as "awakening some deep primal savagery" but i really dont think it really has much else to do with the beastlands, beastlands does not alter your mental state in the same way as arborea, the abyss or the shadowfell might. If they are hiding something with the flavour it might be the fact that this is actiually some kind of psionic barbarian, he can use his mind to alter his body like many psionic disiplinces both from 5e and earlier could do, deal psychic damage and affect your victims behavior, all things that are very psi-like, you always choose what transformation you take on and the diffrent transformations do not seem to come from the same types of animals, none of the beast barbarians features have much connection to the beastlands and do not really feel that extraplanar, from what i can read of the beastlands in the DMG it has nothing to do with this, the beastlands can forcefully transform another creature, you can partially transform yourself, it is not the same
the reason i said it all looks like confirmation bias is it seems like you take this vague pattter "many of the new subclasses have an extraplanar theme" and seem to apply them where they do not exactly fit, and yeah planescape or something similar is probably comming, but again these subclasses dont have to nessesarily be connected to that, they could just be part of an project we as of yet have not heard about, or just be random ideas they liked that have no particular connection for their greater plans
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Maybe I'm biased, but it does seem like Wizards to create a subclass and reveal the identity of the book it'll be in later.
(Also, True Naming has always been tied to fiends in D&D)
There's a video on the Twilight Domain Cleric from the D&D Beyond youtube channel. You should watch it. It explains the theme a lot better than I can here.
There's an effect in the Beastlands that if you kill a native animal there, you turn into them. That seems pretty similar to the Beast Barbarian. This is a pretty big connection, IMHO.
Well, anyway, this seems like Planescape to me. I don't think it's a stretch to connect all of them, the summoning spells, and other information to a possible Planescape book.
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Maybe I'm biased, but it does seem like Wizards to create a subclass and reveal the identity of the book it'll be in later.
yes but that does not mean you can just assume every single new subclass is always going to be connected to that, it could be part of some sepperate project or an idea they had sepperately
There's an effect in the Beastlands that if you kill a native animal there, you turn into them. That seems pretty similar to the Beast Barbarian. This is a pretty big connection, IMHO.
yeah but again, it is an full transformation that happens involentarily, if this truly was an beastlands subclass you would expect to be able to do this curse onto others whenever you take damage or sometimes fully polymorph into an animal, and maybe also something that somehow lets you track better to emulate the other effect the beastlands, and again if this was themed after the beast lands there would be an much greater connection mechanically, i mean the only real connections the two have is the fact that this subclass transforms into animal shapes, something that loads of other things can do, and other than that there are no connections at all, and what about all the features they have that dont fit neatly into the beastlands theory, like the mind affecting stuff?
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The Beastlands are good. I'm just saying, an easy way to make yourself be a Beast Barbarian is to be under that curse before the game starts, or have an ancestor be effected by it, or possibly have other connections.
It might be a stretch predicting this before Planescape is announced, but I'm just saying that Wizards wouldn't tell everyone the identity of their next book in the UAs.
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The Beastlands are good. I'm just saying, an easy way to make yourself be a Beast Barbarian is to be under that curse before the game starts, or have an ancestor be effected by it, or possibly have other connections.
It might be a stretch predicting this before Planescape is announced, but I'm just saying that Wizards wouldn't tell everyone the identity of their next book in the UAs.
if it will be released as part of an planescape book, beastlands might be listed as one of the many possible origins for your barbarian, but not as the only alternaative, especially since if this really was an beastlands barbarian, we would see a lot more features that has to do with the beastlands, but we dont, instead we get this weird psionic crap
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I don't think they would make the mechanics exactly specific to the planes of existence they are related to. So for other campaign settings you can reflavor them without having the mechanics dictate the origin of the subclasses. This way, Eberron can reflavor the Beast Barbarian from being from Lammania or Shifters.
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I don't think they would make the mechanics exactly specific to the planes of existence they are related to. So for other campaign settings you can reflavor them without having the mechanics dictate the origin of the subclasses. This way, Eberron can reflavor the Beast Barbarian from being from Lammania or Shifters.
yeah but at least they could use mechanics that ya' know, all at least make some amount of sense for the "intended" flavour, like with what we got this makes more sense as an user of psionics, again while it is completely possible that design staff is trying to trick us here, but the way they describe the design process for new player options and and the way they seem to describe it in other media seem to indicate that they made the beast barbarian first, and perhaps worried about how it will fit into the larger whole second, even if the planescape book ever releases i dont think they will even think to include the beastlands connection in the book, they will just print the barbarian as is, content that you possibly getting your powers from an fey spirit, it does not have to fit perfectly into the theme to be included
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I wonder what the next UA will be. They seem to have stopped doing unearthed arcana for races (they are fairly easy to homebrew), so I doubt they'll do a UA for Thri-Kreen or Mul if they are making a Dark Sun book, but I do think it is likely for us to get new feats in the next UA, as they normally do playtest those.
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I wonder what the next UA will be. They seem to have stopped doing unearthed arcana for races (they are fairly easy to homebrew), so I doubt they'll do a UA for Thri-Kreen or Mul if they are making a Dark Sun book, but I do think it is likely for us to get new feats in the next UA, as they normally do playtest those.
i donno, maybe it is a matter of the design crew not really having any ideas for new races, or not really knowing how to approach an particular race/ subrace, or them being so confident in their new races being balanced that they always go straight to being published in a book with no playtest phase
that being said it would be cool if we got an feat or an subrace for the kobold to represent the urds, and hey speaking of monsterous races would it not be cool to have an fighter subclass all about battle tactics that rewards an high intelegence stat without having anything to do with magic, so that hobgoblins have a reason for their +1 int? and maybe an variant that states that if you are using the honor abillity score, certain more honorable races like hobgoblins and dwarves gain an racial +2 to honor and that less honorable races gain an -1 penalty to honor
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Heh, they're never adding more ability scores. I could see them using Honor as a variant version of Renown, like they're doing in the M:tG settings, but not as an ability score.
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Lurker in the Deep: Any watery tentacled patron from the Elemental Plane of Water. This is related to planescape.
Revived Rogue: Shadowfell or Fugue Plane. Definitely planescape themed.
Beast Barbarian: The Beastlands is one of the planes of existence. It is planescape.
Twilight Cleric: Shadowfell, easily. Likely a worshiper of the Raven Queen.
Swarmkeeper Rangers: They're fey. No arguing about it. This is 100% planescape.
Stars Druid: This one is a bit of a stretch, but I could easily see it being related to any of the positive planes of existence.
These are planescape related (maybe not stars druid).
It's got to be planescape.
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Spells, Monsters, Subclasses, Races, Arcknight Class, Occultist Class, World, Enigmatic Esoterica forms
Yeah, it fits Spelljammer best, IMHO, but I don't think we're getting that for a long time. Planescape fits with the Astral Plane.
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just becuase you can flavour them to be somewhat related to one of the planes of existance does not mean that it is planescape related, there are planes of existance for literally everything and your motivations just feels a lot like confirmation bias, for instance twilight cleric
the raven queen is mentioned as one of the many possible dieties that might grant this domain, but it is only briefly mentioned as one possibillity, this domain is all about protection, about feeling safe and well rested, the shadowfell is an massive hellscape of torment, an dark reflection of the material plane that supposedly lacks emotion yet has a lot of things that are both angry and hungry, a place where those who merely visits may be haunted by immense dread, terror and possible depression. Fall asleep next to an twilight cleric and you will awaken safe, protected and well rested. Fall asleep in the shadowfell and you will wake up feeling misserable or dead (or maybe even a shadow dragon).
the beast barbarian has a few suggested origins, from having one of your ancestors be a druid who wild shaped a lot to it having to do with an animal spirit or it being a gift from a fey spirit. None of those suggested origins of your power even MENTION the beastlands, just becuase there is an plane of existence for it does not mean it is connected to that plane, you are clutching at straws here, it is like saying that the four elements monk is connected to the elemental planes or that the sun soul monk is related to the upper planes, like saying that the ranger class and beast master archetype are also planescape related becuase beastlands exist
yes an planescape book is probably comming and a lot of these are probably made with the planes of existance in mind, but a lot of these will also not be connected to planescape and just be completely normal subclasses with no particular connection to any of the planes whatsoever
also onomancy is still a bit of an stretch, but i guess a lot of extraplanar creatures, epsecially fiends posess true name and knowledge of those true names does give you power over them (finding the books of keeping as an onomancy wizard in an planescape campaign would be dope)
i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
Clockwork Soul, Oath of the Watchers, and Noble Genie are explicitly planes-related, but I'm not even sure the warlock counts because warlocks in general are about gaining power from extraplanar beings.
patrons do not have to reside in other planes of existance, even if most are at the very least connected to one in some manner, aboleths and krakens are connected to the water plane but found mostly here back in mother material (i refuse to call the material plane anything else), hexblade weapons can be found on the material plane, even if they are made by the raven queen
i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
I...know all this already. That's why I said "in general". The point I was making was that the Genie patron is nothing special because most other patrons in 5e at present live in other planes of existence.
There are not planes of existence for literally everything. You just made up a claim with no evidence, which is the definition of confirmation bias. Show me the plane of existence of Chefs and Pizza, and I'll believe you. Not use fallacies to back up your arguments.
The shadowfell isn't a hellscape of torment. It is the opposite of the Feywild. The Feywild is a plane of vibrant, physical emotions, and the Shadowfell is the opposite of that. It is the plane devoid of powerful emotions, leaving behind the darker ones. The shadows of the emotions. The sorrows. Anger, Hatred, Hunger, Thirst, those are the realm of the Shadowfell. The Shadowfell isn't a hellscape, the Nine Hells are.
The Shadowfell isn't an "evil" plane, technically speaking. Is it evil to be hungry? Is it evil to be sad? No, it's just dark. They're just feelings we don't like. That is what the Shadowfell is about. Darker emotions. Twilight Clerics are the ones that use darkness to their benefit. Their abilities scream Shadowfell. The fact that they can create spheres of dim light, empower themselves with it, see through infinite darkness, give that power to others. They are the perfect guides through the Shadowfell all in mechanics. The fact that the flavor text doesn't say that they're "Shadowfell" clerics doesn't prove your point or mine, but it does make me wonder if they omitted that because they don't want to scream "THIS WILL BE A PLANESCAPE BOOK!" It makes more sense to test the mechanics for a setting that you want to develop without alerting everyone of the book that you're going to publish.
Again, they wouldn't publish the UA screaming the identity of the book this UA will go in. When they published the Oath of Heroism (Glory) for the Theros book, they didn't yell "THIS GUY SERVES THE THEROS GODS." They made the mechanics to see if people liked it, got advice on how to fix it, and then when they were ready to introduce the new book to the community, they said, "Oh, remember that Heroism paladin we playtested a few months back? Yeah, that was for this."
The fact that it isn't screaming that it is designed to be a Beastlands barbarian doesn't disprove my point. It just shows that in the Planescape book, they will likely list what the connections were supposed to be. This barbarian screams Beastlands not only in name, but in flavor and abilities. Beast Master ranger and the Ranger class have nothing to do with this. They weren't designing a planescape book when they made the PHB. The fact that the 4 elements monk exists doesn't disprove my theory either. Beast Barbarians are much more "extraplanar" in theme than the Beast Master Ranger, so I don't know what you were trying to do there.
If you think that a planescape book is coming out and a lot of these subclasses are themed like that, why are you even arguing about this? We agree with each other! The fact that a lot of this at first glance don't scream Planescape is likely WotC's goal for these. Test out the mechanics and general theme without spoiling the identity of your future book.
Onoumancy is not a stretch. Demons and Devils revolve around the existence of true names. The fact that these fiends are related to true names could even be why these mages exist. I can just imagine the section of the book where they have player options and tie them to the different planes of existence. It's not a stretch, the idea of true naming came from these fiends.
I think that they weren't trying to spoil the identity of the book these subclasses are going in, and so when they do announce it and all the subclasses in it, the community will go, "duh! How did I not see that?"
The fact that some of the options don't leap out at you as Planescape is likely the intent of Wizards of the Coast, as they don't like it when they aren't able to release the identity of their future books when they want to. (Explorer's Guide to Wildemount and Mythic Odysseys of Theros were both leaked before WotC could officially announce them. They probably want to avoid that again.)
Hiding the initial identities of these subclasses and the book is in the best interests of WotC.
We don't even need to be arguing about this, we agree that Planescape is coming, right?
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Sorry for the long post. I was working on it for awhile.
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this is an hyperbole, i did not literally mean there are planes of existance for every type of thing, just that there are loads of them
again tho, the mechanics does not seem like the kind of cleric who would draw power from the shadowfell, more like the kind of cleric who would oppose the powers that reside there and serve as a guide through the plane
honestly yeah, with how much they are connected to fiends they are saying they are befit an planescape campaign or even meant for planescape is not a stretch i take that back, but true name magic is not completely tied to it, it has stood as its own thing previously with all creatures and objects, not just fiends having their own true names.
i do not know much of the planes, but i dont think there is much that really connects the beast barbarian to that particular plane of existance. Yes that plane has the abillity to permanently or temporarily turn somebody to a beast if they kill something, and i guess you could make an argument for the abillities that affect others behavior as "awakening some deep primal savagery" but i really dont think it really has much else to do with the beastlands, beastlands does not alter your mental state in the same way as arborea, the abyss or the shadowfell might. If they are hiding something with the flavour it might be the fact that this is actiually some kind of psionic barbarian, he can use his mind to alter his body like many psionic disiplinces both from 5e and earlier could do, deal psychic damage and affect your victims behavior, all things that are very psi-like, you always choose what transformation you take on and the diffrent transformations do not seem to come from the same types of animals, none of the beast barbarians features have much connection to the beastlands and do not really feel that extraplanar, from what i can read of the beastlands in the DMG it has nothing to do with this, the beastlands can forcefully transform another creature, you can partially transform yourself, it is not the same
the reason i said it all looks like confirmation bias is it seems like you take this vague pattter "many of the new subclasses have an extraplanar theme" and seem to apply them where they do not exactly fit, and yeah planescape or something similar is probably comming, but again these subclasses dont have to nessesarily be connected to that, they could just be part of an project we as of yet have not heard about, or just be random ideas they liked that have no particular connection for their greater plans
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Maybe I'm biased, but it does seem like Wizards to create a subclass and reveal the identity of the book it'll be in later.
(Also, True Naming has always been tied to fiends in D&D)
There's a video on the Twilight Domain Cleric from the D&D Beyond youtube channel. You should watch it. It explains the theme a lot better than I can here.
There's an effect in the Beastlands that if you kill a native animal there, you turn into them. That seems pretty similar to the Beast Barbarian. This is a pretty big connection, IMHO.
Well, anyway, this seems like Planescape to me. I don't think it's a stretch to connect all of them, the summoning spells, and other information to a possible Planescape book.
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yes but that does not mean you can just assume every single new subclass is always going to be connected to that, it could be part of some sepperate project or an idea they had sepperately
yeah but again, it is an full transformation that happens involentarily, if this truly was an beastlands subclass you would expect to be able to do this curse onto others whenever you take damage or sometimes fully polymorph into an animal, and maybe also something that somehow lets you track better to emulate the other effect the beastlands, and again if this was themed after the beast lands there would be an much greater connection mechanically, i mean the only real connections the two have is the fact that this subclass transforms into animal shapes, something that loads of other things can do, and other than that there are no connections at all, and what about all the features they have that dont fit neatly into the beastlands theory, like the mind affecting stuff?
i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
The Beastlands is a weird self-contradiction. It makes you better at hunting beasts, but it then punishes you for hunting beasts.
The Beastlands are good. I'm just saying, an easy way to make yourself be a Beast Barbarian is to be under that curse before the game starts, or have an ancestor be effected by it, or possibly have other connections.
It might be a stretch predicting this before Planescape is announced, but I'm just saying that Wizards wouldn't tell everyone the identity of their next book in the UAs.
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if it will be released as part of an planescape book, beastlands might be listed as one of the many possible origins for your barbarian, but not as the only alternaative, especially since if this really was an beastlands barbarian, we would see a lot more features that has to do with the beastlands, but we dont, instead we get this weird psionic crap
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I don't think they would make the mechanics exactly specific to the planes of existence they are related to. So for other campaign settings you can reflavor them without having the mechanics dictate the origin of the subclasses. This way, Eberron can reflavor the Beast Barbarian from being from Lammania or Shifters.
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yeah but at least they could use mechanics that ya' know, all at least make some amount of sense for the "intended" flavour, like with what we got this makes more sense as an user of psionics, again while it is completely possible that design staff is trying to trick us here, but the way they describe the design process for new player options and and the way they seem to describe it in other media seem to indicate that they made the beast barbarian first, and perhaps worried about how it will fit into the larger whole second, even if the planescape book ever releases i dont think they will even think to include the beastlands connection in the book, they will just print the barbarian as is, content that you possibly getting your powers from an fey spirit, it does not have to fit perfectly into the theme to be included
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I wonder what the next UA will be. They seem to have stopped doing unearthed arcana for races (they are fairly easy to homebrew), so I doubt they'll do a UA for Thri-Kreen or Mul if they are making a Dark Sun book, but I do think it is likely for us to get new feats in the next UA, as they normally do playtest those.
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i donno, maybe it is a matter of the design crew not really having any ideas for new races, or not really knowing how to approach an particular race/ subrace, or them being so confident in their new races being balanced that they always go straight to being published in a book with no playtest phase
that being said it would be cool if we got an feat or an subrace for the kobold to represent the urds, and hey speaking of monsterous races would it not be cool to have an fighter subclass all about battle tactics that rewards an high intelegence stat without having anything to do with magic, so that hobgoblins have a reason for their +1 int? and maybe an variant that states that if you are using the honor abillity score, certain more honorable races like hobgoblins and dwarves gain an racial +2 to honor and that less honorable races gain an -1 penalty to honor
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Heh, they're never adding more ability scores. I could see them using Honor as a variant version of Renown, like they're doing in the M:tG settings, but not as an ability score.
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I need thlo know what those final subclasses will be.
The curiosity is killing me.