If a plasmoid is using the Shape Self creature to create their 10 foot long appendage, does that influence the reach and area of effects targeting all creatures within 5 feet of you? Like would a target that is within 5 feet of the edge of the appendage be affected by the spell?
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i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
Absolutely yes, looking at the rules for AOEs emanating from a creature, provided you're not using the grid rules - the core rules simply measure from your entire body.
I'm frankly not sure how to resolve this when playing on a grid or hex, though.
Absolutely yes, looking at the rules for AOEs emanating from a creature, provided you're not using the grid rules - the core rules simply measure from your entire body.
I'm frankly not sure how to resolve this when playing on a grid or hex, though.
There's no "absolutely" about it. The core rules say absolutely nothing about measuring effects from the ends of various appendages of your body. They say exactly what they say: 5ft from "you". In normal, common-use English something that is standing 5ft beyond the reach of your bizarrely 10ft long arm would not be described as "5ft from you" - it would be 15ft from you.
This would be DM call (as is everything) but my reading of the intention of the rules is that "5ft from you" will always be 5ft from the space you occupy (with or without a grid, you occupy a 5ft wide area).
my reading of the intention of the rules is that "5ft from you" will always be 5ft from the space you occupy (with or without a grid, you occupy a 5ft wide area).
It is my understanding as well.
Otherwise it'd be possible to have 2 spaces/squares 5 feet apart with creatures in them being not within 5 feet of each other.
my reading of the intention of the rules is that "5ft from you" will always be 5ft from the space you occupy (with or without a grid, you occupy a 5ft wide area).
It is my understanding as well.
Otherwise it'd be possible to have 2 spaces/squares 5 feet apart with creatures in them being not within 5 feet of each other.
Agreed, if it was based off of appendage length or reach, then a Bugbear PC would run into the same issue.
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You still occupy your 5 feet space even if your arms can reach into the adjacent space/square. Or your head in 3D cube. A 7 foot tall prone creature can be beyond it's 5 feet space/square, but it will still occupy the space of his body, not the space adjacent where his head may lie.
For a creature with long appendage such as a Roper, it still occupy the space his body is in, even when reaching up to 50 feet away for exemple.
Absolutely yes, looking at the rules for AOEs emanating from a creature, provided you're not using the grid rules - the core rules simply measure from your entire body.
I'm frankly not sure how to resolve this when playing on a grid or hex, though.
There's no "absolutely" about it. The core rules say absolutely nothing about measuring effects from the ends of various appendages of your body. They say exactly what they say: 5ft from "you". In normal, common-use English something that is standing 5ft beyond the reach of your bizarrely 10ft long arm would not be described as "5ft from you" - it would be 15ft from you.
This would be DM call (as is everything) but my reading of the intention of the rules is that "5ft from you" will always be 5ft from the space you occupy (with or without a grid, you occupy a 5ft wide area).
A spell's effect expands in straight lines from the point of origin. Same link clarifies that an entire creature can be a point of origin. The RAW is explicitly clear - the AOE is determined via straight lines from the creature. You're violating the explicit RAW if you change the point of origin of a spell from a creature to a point in space, which is what you appear to be doing with your interpretation. The RAW is explicit and unambiguous - you determine the AOE via straight lines emanating from the creature, in this case. The whole thing.
While your hands can reach into adjacent space/square of yours, i don't think an effect can originate from that space/square when it originate from you, otherwise it would mess with range, by having effects originate from a space/square you can reach into but that you don't even occupy.
Absolutely yes, looking at the rules for AOEs emanating from a creature, provided you're not using the grid rules - the core rules simply measure from your entire body.
I'm frankly not sure how to resolve this when playing on a grid or hex, though.
There's no "absolutely" about it. The core rules say absolutely nothing about measuring effects from the ends of various appendages of your body. They say exactly what they say: 5ft from "you". In normal, common-use English something that is standing 5ft beyond the reach of your bizarrely 10ft long arm would not be described as "5ft from you" - it would be 15ft from you.
This would be DM call (as is everything) but my reading of the intention of the rules is that "5ft from you" will always be 5ft from the space you occupy (with or without a grid, you occupy a 5ft wide area).
A spell's effect expands in straight lines from the point of origin. Same link clarifies that an entire creature can be a point of origin. The RAW is explicitly clear - the AOE is determined via straight lines from the creature. You're violating the explicit RAW if you change the point of origin of a spell from a creature to a point in space, which is what you appear to be doing with your interpretation. The RAW is explicit and unambiguous - you determine the AOE via straight lines emanating from the creature, in this case. The whole thing.
The rules do not say "an entire creature", nor "the whole thing" when talking about points of origin. You invented those words. The RAW is ambiguous and very nonspecific on the topic.
The rules have already introduced the areas/volumes that creatures take up in combat, and implied that reach and ranges are measured from the edges of those spaces. That, combined with plain English, tells us that a spell which hits every target within 5ft of the caster will hit all targets within 5ft of the edges of a caster's occupied space (as defined by their creature size).
I am not changing RAW for things to emanate from a creature's space rather that the creature itself. A creature only occupies its space, not other spaces. A spell cannot emanate from a space where the creature is not, and the rules abstract the location of a creature to be its space (defined by its size). Having a long arm does not turn you from a medium creature into a large creature, so you still occupy the same space. A gnome and a goliath (or bugbear) both cast a Thunderclap of the exactly the same size.
RAI, the pseudopod is clearly intended to work like mage hand, albeit at a shorter range:
Shape Self. If you are not incapacitated, you can reshape your body to give yourself a head, one or two arms, one or two legs, and makeshift hands and feet, or you can revert to a limbless blob (no action required).
As a bonus action, you can extrude a pseudopod that is up to 6 inches wide and 10 feet long or reabsorb it into your body. You can use this pseudopod to manipulate an object, open an unlocked door or container, stow or retrieve an item from an open container, or pour out the contents of a container. The pseudopod can’t attack, activate magic items, or carry more than 10 pounds.
A spectral, floating hand appears at a point you choose within range. The hand lasts for the duration or until you dismiss it as an action. The hand vanishes if it is ever more than 30 feet away from you or if you cast this spell again.
You can use your action to control the hand. You can use the hand to manipulate an object, open an unlocked door or container, stow or retrieve an item from an open container, or pour the contents out of a vial. You can move the hand up to 30 feet each time you use it.
The hand can't attack, activate magic items, or carry more than 10 pounds.
If it was intended to increase your size (and thus make spells like thunderclap more effective) too, it would say so.
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Active characters:
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock) Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric) Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue) Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
Absolutely yes, looking at the rules for AOEs emanating from a creature, provided you're not using the grid rules - the core rules simply measure from your entire body.
I'm frankly not sure how to resolve this when playing on a grid or hex, though.
There's no "absolutely" about it. The core rules say absolutely nothing about measuring effects from the ends of various appendages of your body. They say exactly what they say: 5ft from "you". In normal, common-use English something that is standing 5ft beyond the reach of your bizarrely 10ft long arm would not be described as "5ft from you" - it would be 15ft from you.
This would be DM call (as is everything) but my reading of the intention of the rules is that "5ft from you" will always be 5ft from the space you occupy (with or without a grid, you occupy a 5ft wide area).
A spell's effect expands in straight lines from the point of origin. Same link clarifies that an entire creature can be a point of origin. The RAW is explicitly clear - the AOE is determined via straight lines from the creature. You're violating the explicit RAW if you change the point of origin of a spell from a creature to a point in space, which is what you appear to be doing with your interpretation. The RAW is explicit and unambiguous - you determine the AOE via straight lines emanating from the creature, in this case. The whole thing.
So just to be clear, you're arguing that a bugbear could similarly say "I put my arm into the adjacent square and use that square as my point of origin?"
When he pulls his hand back, do creatures adjacent to the arm get OAs? If a Fireball hits the square his arm is in, does it hit him? If he pulls it back just before the fireball hit, was that a Reaction or are we just handing out free movement now? If he T-poses while standing still in Spike Growth, does he take damage?
There is a whole avalanche of stuff that comes down if you try to argue that creatures are occupying squares outside their body. The game just can't handle it. So any sane DM is going to make the ruling that doesn't crack the game open like a rotten melon.
If a plasmoid is using the Shape Self creature to create their 10 foot long appendage, does that influence the reach and area of effects targeting all creatures within 5 feet of you? Like would a target that is within 5 feet of the edge of the appendage be affected by the spell?
i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
Absolutely yes, looking at the rules for AOEs emanating from a creature, provided you're not using the grid rules - the core rules simply measure from your entire body.
I'm frankly not sure how to resolve this when playing on a grid or hex, though.
There's no "absolutely" about it. The core rules say absolutely nothing about measuring effects from the ends of various appendages of your body. They say exactly what they say: 5ft from "you". In normal, common-use English something that is standing 5ft beyond the reach of your bizarrely 10ft long arm would not be described as "5ft from you" - it would be 15ft from you.
This would be DM call (as is everything) but my reading of the intention of the rules is that "5ft from you" will always be 5ft from the space you occupy (with or without a grid, you occupy a 5ft wide area).
It is my understanding as well.
Otherwise it'd be possible to have 2 spaces/squares 5 feet apart with creatures in them being not within 5 feet of each other.
Agreed, if it was based off of appendage length or reach, then a Bugbear PC would run into the same issue.
Four-time Judge of the Competition of the Finest Brews! Come join us in making fun, unique homebrew and voting for your favorite entries!
You still occupy your 5 feet space even if your arms can reach into the adjacent space/square. Or your head in 3D cube. A 7 foot tall prone creature can be beyond it's 5 feet space/square, but it will still occupy the space of his body, not the space adjacent where his head may lie.
For a creature with long appendage such as a Roper, it still occupy the space his body is in, even when reaching up to 50 feet away for exemple.
A spell's effect expands in straight lines from the point of origin. Same link clarifies that an entire creature can be a point of origin. The RAW is explicitly clear - the AOE is determined via straight lines from the creature. You're violating the explicit RAW if you change the point of origin of a spell from a creature to a point in space, which is what you appear to be doing with your interpretation. The RAW is explicit and unambiguous - you determine the AOE via straight lines emanating from the creature, in this case. The whole thing.
Since you bring it up, the rules for a creature's space are found here. There is simply no RAW basis for changing a spell that emanates from a creature to instead emanate from its space, unless you are using the variant grid rules (found just under where this link goes), which change how distances are measured.
While your hands can reach into adjacent space/square of yours, i don't think an effect can originate from that space/square when it originate from you, otherwise it would mess with range, by having effects originate from a space/square you can reach into but that you don't even occupy.
The rules do not say "an entire creature", nor "the whole thing" when talking about points of origin. You invented those words. The RAW is ambiguous and very nonspecific on the topic.
The rules have already introduced the areas/volumes that creatures take up in combat, and implied that reach and ranges are measured from the edges of those spaces. That, combined with plain English, tells us that a spell which hits every target within 5ft of the caster will hit all targets within 5ft of the edges of a caster's occupied space (as defined by their creature size).
I am not changing RAW for things to emanate from a creature's space rather that the creature itself. A creature only occupies its space, not other spaces. A spell cannot emanate from a space where the creature is not, and the rules abstract the location of a creature to be its space (defined by its size). Having a long arm does not turn you from a medium creature into a large creature, so you still occupy the same space. A gnome and a goliath (or bugbear) both cast a Thunderclap of the exactly the same size.
RAI, the pseudopod is clearly intended to work like mage hand, albeit at a shorter range:
If it was intended to increase your size (and thus make spells like thunderclap more effective) too, it would say so.
Active characters:
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock)
Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric)
Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue)
Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
So just to be clear, you're arguing that a bugbear could similarly say "I put my arm into the adjacent square and use that square as my point of origin?"
When he pulls his hand back, do creatures adjacent to the arm get OAs? If a Fireball hits the square his arm is in, does it hit him? If he pulls it back just before the fireball hit, was that a Reaction or are we just handing out free movement now? If he T-poses while standing still in Spike Growth, does he take damage?
There is a whole avalanche of stuff that comes down if you try to argue that creatures are occupying squares outside their body. The game just can't handle it. So any sane DM is going to make the ruling that doesn't crack the game open like a rotten melon.
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(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
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(Warlock) The Swarm