So I had an adventure where the small party that uses spike growth a lot and after a few battles with it, an idea came to mind that I think might be interesting.
Instead of having the party at one side of the thorns, what if a tank character with thorn whip was in the middle just pulling enemies inside?
Ideally one would use a Artificer/Armorer for access to synergistic abilities and spells: repelling shield, thorn whip, thunderwave and possibly sword burst... if possible, taking Fey Touched feat provides a convenient exit when things get rough..
Does this seem like a workable concept or am I missing something and end up getting this character killed?
You would need the right battlefield for this. In an open area, enemies would just avoid you entirely and now you have to wade through the SG yourself to get to them.
You would need the right battlefield for this. In an open area, enemies would just avoid you entirely and now you have to wade through the SG yourself to get to them.
True, but its not uncommon to be in fairly narrow spaces.
Additionally, the other party members are extremely mobile (the Dao Genie Warlock literally flies and the rogue is a Tabaxi with mobility) so for the most part the Artificer tank is the pretty obvious target unless the enemies are flying or 100% ranged. Spiked growth us camouflaged so its not unlikely for at least a few enemies to get caught before its noticed. Thorn whip also allows the tank in the center to pull enemies in who get too close.
As far as escaping if enemies don't bite or if the battle gets too tough, that's a pretty good use for misty step (fey touched feat).
The nice thing about this strategy is the parts that make it can be useful in other cases as well. Forced movement can yank spiders off celings, knock guards off walls and enemies off bridges. Forced repositioning can also can be useful in pushing enemies towards the tank and away from the softer characters.
This may look fairly specialized, but most tanking builds in 5e need specific conditions to be 100% effective.
The spell grasping vine is invincible, and can cause the same effect without risking a tank. Both spike growth and grasping vine require concentration, so two players have to work together for this one too. Ranger and Druid, maybe?
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My posting scheduled is irregular: sometimes I can post twice a week, sometimes twice a day. I may also respond to quick questions, but ignore harder responses in favor of time.
My location is where my character for my home game is (we're doing the wild beyond the witchlight).
"The Doomvault... Probably full of unicorns and rainbows." -An imaginary quote
The spell grasping vine is invincible, and can cause the same effect without risking a tank. Both spike growth and grasping vine require concentration, so two players have to work together for this one too. Ranger and Druid, maybe?
Its true that Grasping Vine cannot die, but the spell does require a dex save which is not a weak save for many creatues. This does seem like a useful tactic if you happen to have two casters that can do either spell though.
I don't necessarily think being in the spike growth puts a tank at more risk than not being in it if dealing with a large group of enemies... I guess it depends if they are also using forced movement (maybe grapple?) or if the tank is needed elsewhere more urgently (maybe the BBEG needs to be dealt with separate from the supporting mob?)
The spell grasping vine is invincible, and can cause the same effect without risking a tank. Both spike growth and grasping vine require concentration, so two players have to work together for this one too. Ranger and Druid, maybe?
Its true that Grasping Vine cannot die, but the spell does require a dex save which is not a weak save for many creatues. This does seem like a useful tactic if you happen to have two casters that can do either spell though.
I don't necessarily think being in the spike growth puts a tank at more risk than not being in it if dealing with a large group of enemies... I guess it depends if they are also using forced movement (maybe grapple?) or if the tank is needed elsewhere more urgently (maybe the BBEG needs to be dealt with separate from the supporting mob?)
This describes our party perfectly. The monk(our tank) stunlocks and 1v1s huge demons, while everyone else tries not to get killed by Quazets and Vrocks.
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Pronouns: he/him/his.
My posting scheduled is irregular: sometimes I can post twice a week, sometimes twice a day. I may also respond to quick questions, but ignore harder responses in favor of time.
My location is where my character for my home game is (we're doing the wild beyond the witchlight).
"The Doomvault... Probably full of unicorns and rainbows." -An imaginary quote
The spell grasping vine is invincible, and can cause the same effect without risking a tank. Both spike growth and grasping vine require concentration, so two players have to work together for this one too. Ranger and Druid, maybe?
Its true that Grasping Vine cannot die, but the spell does require a dex save which is not a weak save for many creatues. This does seem like a useful tactic if you happen to have two casters that can do either spell though.
I don't necessarily think being in the spike growth puts a tank at more risk than not being in it if dealing with a large group of enemies... I guess it depends if they are also using forced movement (maybe grapple?) or if the tank is needed elsewhere more urgently (maybe the BBEG needs to be dealt with separate from the supporting mob?)
This describes our party perfectly. The monk(our tank) stunlocks and 1v1s huge demons, while everyone else tries not to get killed by Quazets and Vrocks.
I could definately see a use of zone effects like spike growth or web combined with force movement on the rest of the party in a case like this... if its something compatible with the character builds you already have.
So far the main issue I ran into when trying spiked growth is being vastly outnumbered in wide open spaces which is why tanking in the center seemed like an interesting concept.
I think everyone on here has had valid points to consider though.
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So I had an adventure where the small party that uses spike growth a lot and after a few battles with it, an idea came to mind that I think might be interesting.
Instead of having the party at one side of the thorns, what if a tank character with thorn whip was in the middle just pulling enemies inside?
Ideally one would use a Artificer/Armorer for access to synergistic abilities and spells: repelling shield, thorn whip, thunderwave and possibly sword burst... if possible, taking Fey Touched feat provides a convenient exit when things get rough..
Does this seem like a workable concept or am I missing something and end up getting this character killed?
Seems really good. You could also put an Evil Yoda in the party to push enemies into the spike growth to hang out with you.
Founding Member of the High Roller Society. (Currently trying to roll max on 4d6)
We already have a Dao Genie Warlock with Crusher feat, Repelling Blast and Grasp of Hadar, does that count?
Pretty much already there...the lance of lethargy is there just to ensure they can't get out of the spike growth and still have actions.
Founding Member of the High Roller Society. (Currently trying to roll max on 4d6)
You would need the right battlefield for this. In an open area, enemies would just avoid you entirely and now you have to wade through the SG yourself to get to them.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm
True, but its not uncommon to be in fairly narrow spaces.
Additionally, the other party members are extremely mobile (the Dao Genie Warlock literally flies and the rogue is a Tabaxi with mobility) so for the most part the Artificer tank is the pretty obvious target unless the enemies are flying or 100% ranged. Spiked growth us camouflaged so its not unlikely for at least a few enemies to get caught before its noticed. Thorn whip also allows the tank in the center to pull enemies in who get too close.
As far as escaping if enemies don't bite or if the battle gets too tough, that's a pretty good use for misty step (fey touched feat).
The nice thing about this strategy is the parts that make it can be useful in other cases as well. Forced movement can yank spiders off celings, knock guards off walls and enemies off bridges. Forced repositioning can also can be useful in pushing enemies towards the tank and away from the softer characters.
This may look fairly specialized, but most tanking builds in 5e need specific conditions to be 100% effective.
The spell grasping vine is invincible, and can cause the same effect without risking a tank. Both spike growth and grasping vine require concentration, so two players have to work together for this one too. Ranger and Druid, maybe?
Pronouns: he/him/his.
My posting scheduled is irregular: sometimes I can post twice a week, sometimes twice a day. I may also respond to quick questions, but ignore harder responses in favor of time.
My location is where my character for my home game is (we're doing the wild beyond the witchlight).
"The Doomvault... Probably full of unicorns and rainbows." -An imaginary quote
Its true that Grasping Vine cannot die, but the spell does require a dex save which is not a weak save for many creatues. This does seem like a useful tactic if you happen to have two casters that can do either spell though.
I don't necessarily think being in the spike growth puts a tank at more risk than not being in it if dealing with a large group of enemies... I guess it depends if they are also using forced movement (maybe grapple?) or if the tank is needed elsewhere more urgently (maybe the BBEG needs to be dealt with separate from the supporting mob?)
This describes our party perfectly. The monk(our tank) stunlocks and 1v1s huge demons, while everyone else tries not to get killed by Quazets and Vrocks.
Pronouns: he/him/his.
My posting scheduled is irregular: sometimes I can post twice a week, sometimes twice a day. I may also respond to quick questions, but ignore harder responses in favor of time.
My location is where my character for my home game is (we're doing the wild beyond the witchlight).
"The Doomvault... Probably full of unicorns and rainbows." -An imaginary quote
I could definately see a use of zone effects like spike growth or web combined with force movement on the rest of the party in a case like this... if its something compatible with the character builds you already have.
So far the main issue I ran into when trying spiked growth is being vastly outnumbered in wide open spaces which is why tanking in the center seemed like an interesting concept.
I think everyone on here has had valid points to consider though.