Well, about 32 people on the oar benches and everyone else packed onto the top deck. People don't fill a 5-ft square normally. You can pack people close together if you need for travel purposes.
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"The mongoose blew out its candle and was asleep in bed before the room went dark." —Llanowar fable
Thank you, I still think it would be very crowded, I don't really think they are ideal passenger ships. Maybe that listing of 100 passengers needs review - where would everyone sleep?
Thank you, I still think it would be very crowded, I don't really think they are ideal passenger ships. Maybe that listing of 100 passengers needs review - where would everyone sleep?
To be fair, you may be confusing maximum capacity with comfortable capacity. Also, there is likely storage space below decks (maybe not a full "lower deck," but a crawl space of sorts) for sleeping gear and resting times.
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"The mongoose blew out its candle and was asleep in bed before the room went dark." —Llanowar fable
Thank you, I still think it would be very crowded, I don't really think they are ideal passenger ships. Maybe that listing of 100 passengers needs review - where would everyone sleep?
Those ships generally were crowded and unpleasant ways to travel, but people endured it because that was what they had. There's a reason that you don't see to many people still traveling that way anymore.
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Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
The deck plan for the longship isn’t actually intended for that statblock. There are two versions of most of the ships, the one in the DMG, and the one from Ghosts of Saltmarsh. The deck plans are for the descriptions in the DMG which have no statsblocks, only rough info. The statblocks are from Saltmarsh which have no pictures. DDB stuck them together. that’s why they don’t match.
(A 15m longship was a very small one, a 30m longship a very big one).
Meaning that they were ≈60 foot
(A 20f - 6.5m longship is not a longship, is a shortship, maybe 😂😂😂)
(BTW I still don’t get why d&d uses foots and miles when 95% of the world uses meters and kilometers. Damned American provincialism!)
In terms of “passengers” you have to think about very crowded warship full of soldiers. Like when a fleet was used to invade a coastal city.
In normal situations probably you could have 50 people at best, since almost all crew members doubled as warriors (in warring situations) or as traders (in peaceful situations). I think that even 10 people staying idle (like paying travelers) was exceptional, unless, again the ship was basically used to ferry an army.
Also the cargo capacity is wrong, it was usually ≈40 tons (≈2-3 modern shipping containers).
Knowing that the measures of the game material are wrong, maybe is more plausible for you to imagine how you could have 100 people fitting in a longship.
Anyway, as said, I suggest you to do your own researches if you want to make your game richer and more lifelike.
The deck plan for the longship isn’t actually intended for that statblock. There are two versions of most of the ships, the one in the DMG, and the one from Ghosts of Saltmarsh. The deck plans are for the descriptions in the DMG which have no statsblocks, only rough info. The statblocks are from Saltmarsh which have no pictures. DDB stuck them together. that’s why they don’t match.
This is incorrect, the deck plans are from Ghosts of Saltmarsh and are associated with the statblocks for said ships as you can see here (or in your physical book if you so wish)
The deck plan for the longship isn’t actually intended for that statblock. There are two versions of most of the ships, the one in the DMG, and the one from Ghosts of Saltmarsh. The deck plans are for the descriptions in the DMG which have no statsblocks, only rough info. The statblocks are from Saltmarsh which have no pictures. DDB stuck them together. that’s why they don’t match.
This is incorrect, the deck plans are from Ghosts of Saltmarsh and are associated with the statblocks for said ships as you can see here (or in your physical book if you so wish)
And here I was giving WotC the benefit of the doubt. Nevermind, they just done ****ed up.
Thank you, I still think it would be very crowded, I don't really think they are ideal passenger ships. Maybe that listing of 100 passengers needs review - where would everyone sleep?
Yep, historically they weren't ideal. Crowded and exposed.
You didn't sleep on a longship. Each night the crew would beach the boat and everyone would camp ashore. It's dangerous to navigate in the darkness.
If you're talking about 'decks' on a longboat - you're wrong. There is no such thing. It's hull, oars, benches, sail. That's the whole ship right there. No 'below decks' for storage, no 'top deck' for sunning yourself. If it rains, you get wet. I have no idea how they managed to sleep.
If the weather got too rough, they'd dismount the mast, place it lengthwise along the ship, and the sail pulled over, to create some cover.
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Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
Thankyou Greenstone and Acromos. Really helpful knowledge and advice. I have 3 PCs travelling on a longship from Waterdeep to Velen. Sounds like they will have quite an uncomfortable journey. I wonder if any magic could be used to help? Can you put up a Tiny Hut on a longship? Are there navigation spells? I don't really know the rules inside out.
(A 15m longship was a very small one, a 30m longship a very big one).
Meaning that they were ≈60 foot
(A 20f - 6.5m longship is not a longship, is a shortship, maybe 😂😂😂)
(BTW I still don’t get why d&d uses foots and miles when 95% of the world uses meters and kilometers. Damned American provincialism!)
In terms of “passengers” you have to think about very crowded warship full of soldiers. Like when a fleet was used to invade a coastal city.
In normal situations probably you could have 50 people at best, since almost all crew members doubled as warriors (in warring situations) or as traders (in peaceful situations). I think that even 10 people staying idle (like paying travelers) was exceptional, unless, again the ship was basically used to ferry an army.
Also the cargo capacity is wrong, it was usually ≈40 tons (≈2-3 modern shipping containers).
Knowing that the measures of the game material are wrong, maybe is more plausible for you to imagine how you could have 100 people fitting in a longship.
Anyway, as said, I suggest you to do your own researches if you want to make your game richer and more lifelike.
Thanks Alfonso, really helpful too. You are right, I should have at least checked out Wikipedia.
You didn't sleep on a longship. Each night the crew would beach the boat and everyone would camp ashore. It's dangerous to navigate in the darkness.
Well - they did reach England, and the Faroe islands, and Iceland, and Greenland, and America. I think it would be quite tough to stay awake for the entire journey. Or find a place to beach.
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Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
(A 15m longship was a very small one, a 30m longship a very big one).
Meaning that they were ≈60 foot
(A 20f - 6.5m longship is not a longship, is a shortship, maybe 😂😂😂)
(BTW I still don’t get why d&d uses foots and miles when 95% of the world uses meters and kilometers. Damned American provincialism!)
In terms of “passengers” you have to think about very crowded warship full of soldiers. Like when a fleet was used to invade a coastal city.
In normal situations probably you could have 50 people at best, since almost all crew members doubled as warriors (in warring situations) or as traders (in peaceful situations). I think that even 10 people staying idle (like paying travelers) was exceptional, unless, again the ship was basically used to ferry an army.
Also the cargo capacity is wrong, it was usually ≈40 tons (≈2-3 modern shipping containers).
Knowing that the measures of the game material are wrong, maybe is more plausible for you to imagine how you could have 100 people fitting in a longship.
Anyway, as said, I suggest you to do your own researches if you want to make your game richer and more lifelike.
Thanks Alfonso, really helpful too. You are right, I should have at least checked out Wikipedia.
You are welcome Tawny, “when in doubt, Tawny, always follow the reference sources” 😉. I always find useful to follow game material for game stats and to do some research for game realism. If some stat are wrong I homebrew and adapt what I think they got wrong in the game material.
You don’t need to do it always, only when you find things that are both highly illogic, but easy to fix.
You didn't sleep on a longship. Each night the crew would beach the boat and everyone would camp ashore. It's dangerous to navigate in the darkness.
Well - they did reach England, and the Faroe islands, and Iceland, and Greenland, and America. I think it would be quite tough to stay awake for the entire journey. Or find a place to beach.
Yea, but those would be big deal events. Lief Ericson, etc. But just everyday sailing? The old world sailors stayed close to shore to navigate because landmarks were all you had to know where you were.
I would note that, contrary to comments in the thread, the map is actually 70' long, which is entirely reasonable for a longship. It is, however, 20' wide, which is not. A reasonable comparison would be the Gokstad ship, which is 78' long and 17' wide. Reduce that by 10% to conveniently fit on 5' squares and you wind up with 70' long and 15' wide. A narrower build might only be 10' wide.
And no, there's no way you'd fit 140 people. 40 crew, no problem, maybe even 50, but passengers really weren't a thing on longships.
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How do 40 crew and 100 passengers fit on a Longship given the deck plan?
Thanks for any advice.
Longship - Vehicles - D&D Beyond (dndbeyond.com)
Well, about 32 people on the oar benches and everyone else packed onto the top deck. People don't fill a 5-ft square normally. You can pack people close together if you need for travel purposes.
Thank you, I still think it would be very crowded, I don't really think they are ideal passenger ships. Maybe that listing of 100 passengers needs review - where would everyone sleep?
why do some of the ships require 10 crew per weapon, but some require 3 or even 1? Because there's no real math to it.
Guide to the Five Factions (PWYW)
Deck of Decks
Something for the new edition to consider perhaps?
To be fair, you may be confusing maximum capacity with comfortable capacity. Also, there is likely storage space below decks (maybe not a full "lower deck," but a crawl space of sorts) for sleeping gear and resting times.
Those ships generally were crowded and unpleasant ways to travel, but people endured it because that was what they had. There's a reason that you don't see to many people still traveling that way anymore.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
The deck plan for the longship isn’t actually intended for that statblock. There are two versions of most of the ships, the one in the DMG, and the one from Ghosts of Saltmarsh. The deck plans are for the descriptions in the DMG which have no statsblocks, only rough info. The statblocks are from Saltmarsh which have no pictures. DDB stuck them together. that’s why they don’t match.Never mind, WotC is just stupid.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Thanks for all the replies, really helpful as I try to prep a voyage from Waterdeep to Velen.
Great to have help from the community, thank you.
Don’t blindly trust what you find in game material https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Longship
Longships were usually ≈20m, not 20 foot.
(A 15m longship was a very small one, a 30m longship a very big one).
Meaning that they were ≈60 foot
(A 20f - 6.5m longship is not a longship, is a shortship, maybe 😂😂😂)
(BTW I still don’t get why d&d uses foots and miles when 95% of the world uses meters and kilometers. Damned American provincialism!)
In terms of “passengers” you have to think about very crowded warship full of soldiers. Like when a fleet was used to invade a coastal city.
In normal situations probably you could have 50 people at best, since almost all crew members doubled as warriors (in warring situations) or as traders (in peaceful situations). I think that even 10 people staying idle (like paying travelers) was exceptional, unless, again the ship was basically used to ferry an army.
Also the cargo capacity is wrong, it was usually ≈40 tons (≈2-3 modern shipping containers).
Knowing that the measures of the game material are wrong, maybe is more plausible for you to imagine how you could have 100 people fitting in a longship.
Anyway, as said, I suggest you to do your own researches if you want to make your game richer and more lifelike.
This is incorrect, the deck plans are from Ghosts of Saltmarsh and are associated with the statblocks for said ships as you can see here (or in your physical book if you so wish)
Find my D&D Beyond articles here
And here I was giving WotC the benefit of the doubt. Nevermind, they just done ****ed up.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Yep, historically they weren't ideal. Crowded and exposed.
You didn't sleep on a longship. Each night the crew would beach the boat and everyone would camp ashore. It's dangerous to navigate in the darkness.
If you're talking about 'decks' on a longboat - you're wrong. There is no such thing. It's hull, oars, benches, sail. That's the whole ship right there. No 'below decks' for storage, no 'top deck' for sunning yourself. If it rains, you get wet. I have no idea how they managed to sleep.
If the weather got too rough, they'd dismount the mast, place it lengthwise along the ship, and the sail pulled over, to create some cover.
Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
Thankyou Greenstone and Acromos. Really helpful knowledge and advice. I have 3 PCs travelling on a longship from Waterdeep to Velen. Sounds like they will have quite an uncomfortable journey. I wonder if any magic could be used to help? Can you put up a Tiny Hut on a longship? Are there navigation spells? I don't really know the rules inside out.
Thanks Alfonso, really helpful too. You are right, I should have at least checked out Wikipedia.
Well - they did reach England, and the Faroe islands, and Iceland, and Greenland, and America. I think it would be quite tough to stay awake for the entire journey. Or find a place to beach.
Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
You are welcome Tawny, “when in doubt, Tawny, always follow the reference sources” 😉.
I always find useful to follow game material for game stats and to do some research for game realism. If some stat are wrong I homebrew and adapt what I think they got wrong in the game material.
You don’t need to do it always, only when you find things that are both highly illogic, but easy to fix.
Have fun sailing your party 😊.
Yea, but those would be big deal events. Lief Ericson, etc. But just everyday sailing? The old world sailors stayed close to shore to navigate because landmarks were all you had to know where you were.
I would note that, contrary to comments in the thread, the map is actually 70' long, which is entirely reasonable for a longship. It is, however, 20' wide, which is not. A reasonable comparison would be the Gokstad ship, which is 78' long and 17' wide. Reduce that by 10% to conveniently fit on 5' squares and you wind up with 70' long and 15' wide. A narrower build might only be 10' wide.
And no, there's no way you'd fit 140 people. 40 crew, no problem, maybe even 50, but passengers really weren't a thing on longships.