In trying to develop a classic detective-noir kind of character, I realized that there are countless ways to build this sort of character in Dungeons & Dragons.
You know the type...trenchcoat, fedora, a shady past, and perhaps even an internal monologue...who specializes in investigation, tracking down suspects, interrogation, and navigating the places where both criminals & law enforcement can't.
At first glance, you couldn't be blamed for just going automatically with an Inquisitive Rogue...they are, after all, the subclass modeled after characters such as Sherlock Holmes, specializing in sniffing out lies & illusions. Add to that the standard Rogue chassis of "Reliable Talent" and "Cunning Action", and you have a skillful character who's good at catching liars.
However, it would be foolish to say that a "private investigator" is a character limited to the Inquisitive Rogue...the classic detective isn't just sniffing out lies...in fact, usually such investigators are somewhat bad at reading people...getting fooled by pretty faces, scheming businessmen, shifty politicians, and pretty much anybody who wants to use the investigator as a cheap tool or a scapegoat. They might have proficiency in "Investigation"...picking up on clues or incongruities...but not be much of a people-person.
Sometimes, a private investigator is just someone who's able to survive an urban setting, take a beating, and have just enough grit to get the answers they wish.
Some unconventional "private investigator" characters may include Wizards, Clerics, Monks, or even Bards...not just Rogues.
A Divination Wizard who specializes in information-gathering spells is a pretty great private investigator...aside from the ever-useful Portents, their "Third Eye" is quite flavorful in seeing things that others can't...and their Intelligence will make them quite good at passive "Investigation".
A Knowledge Cleric makes for an astoundingly-great private investigator...flexible proficiencies, information-gathering bonus spells, access to "Zone of Truth", and the innate resiliency that all Clerics have over other spellcasters. Their high-level abilities even allow them to "Detect Thoughts" or re-create a crime scene.
Monks are a fascinating representation of a rough-&-tumble private investigator...their high Wisdom makes them quite insightful, while their fist-fighting makes them great sluggers who can handle a scrap or two in a tavern or back alley while chasing down leads.
Bards are the skill-machines...gaining Expertise in all the social skills / investigation skills they might require (Persuasion, Intimidation, Insight, Investigation) means they can pretty much dominate social encounters in any corner of an urban environment. The new Eloquence Bard, I think, makes for a remarkably witty detective (and probably the most likely to have an internal monologue)...while a Lore Bard's "Peerless Skill" serves to cover nearly any skill check they might want.
Gloomstalker Rangers make for interesting trackers...good for finding suspects or missing persons...and their ability to hide in shadows is pretty neat in urban environments.
I'm curious to hear if anybody has had successful experiences in creating a "private detective" character in their games...and if so, what sort of character were they?
What were their features? What were their races?
Did you take feats like "Observant" or "Keen Mind"? Were those useful feats to have?
Were they spellcasters? If so, what spells did they use?
Were they more martial-minded?
What were some experiences you had with this character? What was their backstory?
I have an abjuration wizard that I setup to be like Sherlock Holmes. Took one level of Rogue for expertise as well as observant so his passive investigation is over 30. Legend lore is an underrated spell but spectacular as well as detect thoughts as there is no save to see surface thoughts. Divination would probably be a better fit than abjuration, but as he was my first Wizard I wanted to have more survivability especially in AL games when who knows what party comp and skill level you have when you sit down to a table.
I think Mastermind fits better than Inquisitive for the Private investigator. Cloak of Billowing would be a nice piece, but reflavored as a trench coat
I have an abjuration wizard that I setup to be like Sherlock Holmes. Took one level of Rogue for expertise as well as observant so his passive investigation is over 30. Legend lore is an underrated spell but spectacular as well as detect thoughts as there is no save to see surface thoughts. Divination would probably be a better fit than abjuration, but as he was my first Wizard I wanted to have more survivability especially in AL games when who knows what party comp and skill level you have when you sit down to a table.
wait...
Sherlock Tomes!
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Rogue Shadow, the DM (and occasional) PC with schemes of inventive thinking
For the type of detective you're going for, I'd definitely go for more of a fighter, maybe brawling fighting style. To still get the investigator feel you might wanna back up the class with maybe a tracker type background, high wisdom, and maybe some feats like Observant or something.
You could also go Paladin. Some of the Vengeance things really lend themselves to the dogged pursuer, grizzled detective type. Especially if you go the "trying to find X loved one's killer" route. You can totally be a paladin in a trench coat instead of shining armor.
Side note, one useful feat for any adventuring investigator is the Ritual Master feat. You can get detect magic, identify, and find familiar-- all useful tricks to have up your sleeve for any investigator.
this maybe a little more outside the box but have you considered Barbarian path of the totem warrior?
flavour it as hard nosed and hard drinking private detective, his "rage" is due to drinking to forget his biggest case failure (enter back story with lots of murder, mystery and double crosses), entering a rage is him taking a swig from a hip flask and yelling some obscenity. His totems are: lvl 3: Fighting Dog (as per bear totem, his frequened more than one dog fighting pit in his day), lvl 6: Rat (in place of Wolf, rats know all the shadowy places to follow people and get in and out of places), lvl 10: Pidgeon (in place of Eagle, pidgeons are often ignored and get to all the high places).
Race Variant Human (taking Prodigy as a feat)
Background: Urban Bounty Hunter
Skills: Intimidation and Survival from Barbarian, Insight and Stealth from Bounty Hunter, Perception or Medicine for Human, Investigation from Human/Prodigy and put the free "expertise" from prodigy in which ever skill you think you need most.
Feat as you level up take Observant and Tavern Brawler in addition to the usualTough and ASI
Adventurers of all stripes and classes can make great investigators. Sure the private investigator is an archetype (though you're missing the fact that in real life and fictional genre despite their independent or mercenary dependent means, they're still licensed for the most part), but really adventurers could have a number of reasons to be employed as investigators either directly for the powers that be, or in a capacity available to private individuals. Inquisitors are a type of investigator as well.
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Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
I think Mastermind fits better than Inquisitive for the Private investigator. Cloak of Billowing would be a nice piece, but reflavored as a trench coat
I've heard this suggested once before (the Cloak of Billowing is a nice addition ; )
High int variant human rogue with observant and investigation expertise. One can get a crazy starting passive investigation.
I would actually prioritize Wis over Int for the kind of investigator you're going for. Int gets you Arcana, History, Religion, and Investigation, only one of which is really in the lane of the grizzled detective.
With wisdom, you get Perception (a MUST), Insight (so you can go with your gut on stuff), medicine (so you can stitch up your own cuts like batman), and survival (so you can be an expert tracker).
Many more useful skills under the Wisdom umbrella, and you can always grab proficiency in Investigation if it feels wrong not having it.
High int variant human rogue with observant and investigation expertise. One can get a crazy starting passive investigation.
I would actually prioritize Wis over Int for the kind of investigator you're going for. Int gets you Arcana, History, Religion, and Investigation, only one of which is really in the lane of the grizzled detective.
With wisdom, you get Perception (a MUST), Insight (so you can go with your gut on stuff), medicine (so you can stitch up your own cuts like batman), and survival (so you can be an expert tracker).
Many more useful skills under the Wisdom umbrella, and you can always grab proficiency in Investigation if it feels wrong not having it.
This is table-dependent of course, but a lot of DMs treat Investigation as Perception, Investigation, and Survival all rolled into one. They let you search for clues with Investigation. They let you follow tracks with Investigation, especially when not in the wilderness.
The definition of Investigation they give us in the PHB starts out with, "When you look around for clues and make deductions based on those clues, you make an Intelligence (Investigation) check." How in the world they thought "look around for clues" was any different from basically all of Perception and half of Survival I'll never know, but our table limits Investigation to deduction so that it doesn't steamroll over other skills so easily.
High int variant human rogue with observant and investigation expertise. One can get a crazy starting passive investigation.
I would actually prioritize Wis over Int for the kind of investigator you're going for. Int gets you Arcana, History, Religion, and Investigation, only one of which is really in the lane of the grizzled detective.
With wisdom, you get Perception (a MUST), Insight (so you can go with your gut on stuff), medicine (so you can stitch up your own cuts like batman), and survival (so you can be an expert tracker).
Many more useful skills under the Wisdom umbrella, and you can always grab proficiency in Investigation if it feels wrong not having it.
Depends on what you are investigating though. In a magical world, arcana, history and religion are also all in line for a grizzled detective. A perfect example would be Carl Kolchak https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0071003/
That's why I also recommended Ritual Master for when you do find yourself investigating a magical-based mystery. Detect magic and identify are often what people are trying to do when they ask "can I roll Arcana?" anyways, so why not cut out the middleman?
I've always enjoyed the opposite ends of the Wisdom (Insight , Perception) & Intelligence (Investigation , History) when it comes to the private investigator.
Wisdom's "Perception" implies something akin to hyper-awareness to surroundings akin to say, BBC Sherlock Holmes (and even Robert Downey Jr.'s Sherlock)...taking in all the details of a scene...while "Insight" reminds me of Cal Lightman from the show "Lie to Me" (an expert in facial expressions who theoretically implies that there are universal "tells" in body language when someone lies)...and the "Observant" feat compounds these ideas.
Intelligence, on the other hand, would be less of a general awareness of surroundings, and more "Investigation" for an analysis of specific details...a scene of a struggle and how it may have played out, markings on an object that might have gone unnoticed, or uncovering cryptic codes or patterns within books or someone's notes...and "History" would be an ability to recall details, names, places, or dates which could help organize the "big reveal" of the mystery...the kind of person who puts all their theories on a bulletin board...and the "Keen Mind" feat supports this type of character (doesn't even need the board!)
Now, I personally subscribe to the latter kind of private investigator (an emphasis on "Intelligence" based skills), if only because the "hard-boiled" detective A) usually gets ambushed or taken by surprise by bruisers...implying their passive-perception needs a bit of work...and B) they typically are betrayed by those around them because they weren't as savvy with their Insight.
Granted, this is usually because it's a novel, show or movie and the plot needs to move along & stakes need raising...but I like the idea that the hard-boiled detective stumbles through conflict, and due to their "Investigation" and ability to recall details through "History", they're able to put the pieces together through the bumps & bruises. : )
I started a thread where we build characters based off rolling randomly for Race, Class, Subclass, and Background. This week, the challenge was a Human Psionic Soul Sorcerer Investigator. I went with Sorcerer 14 / Bard (College of Whispers) 6, with the Actor and Observant feat, and expertise in Perception and Persuasion. The idea is an aristocrat who investigates by throwing lavish parties and using his charisma to get people to open up and share gossip. The Psionic Soul option has some interesting abilities for investigator, giving them a lot of mobility and random access to divination magic. Bard opens up a lot of skills and influential spells.
It's worth remembering as well that if you have expertise in a skill then having a high ability score attached to that skill isn't always needed, Investigation and Perception are two good examples of this, for instance, assuming level 4 and Int & Wis are both 12, Passive Investigation and Perception would be be 15 (Base 10 +1 for ability score bonus, +4 for double Proficicency bonus), as soon as you hit level 5 they both go up to 17 and should you ever get to level 17 they are both 23, if you add in the observant feat then at level 4 you actually have passive Investigation and Perception of 20 due to the +5 bump from the feat.
It's also quite dependant on your DM and whether they like using passive skill checks or prefer you to roll.
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* Need a character idea? Search for "Rob76's Unused" in the Story and Lore section.
This was hella helpful. I'm playing a halfling with a back story as a spy/assassin. Given that backstory I was trying to build in some of this noir-ian detective character/knight errant quest taking mystery solver. I'm brand new to DnD so the discourse here has been great.
Especially the distinction between "wider scope, passive investIgation" really being high proficiency "perception". Does this mean that "investigation" would apply more to ... Like "studying" like a battle schematic? Seems like the DnD def of investigation being more like "scene studying/Trail following/brainy deduction skillz", while vibing, sensing, spotting stuff and getting reads on Situations kinda think an investigator might do, would be more "perception".
Kinda. As written perception is largely implied to be observation "in the moment" like almost literally sense impressions; and investigation is sort of the art or science of putting it all together, deliberation basically. Some tables play like that. Other tables basically treat perception and investigation as the same skill just one is INT based and one WIS based (having my fair share of experience doing investigations and working with investigators in a number of context, I think that's fair trade). If "detective work" is something you definitely want to have in your game, make sure you get a sense of how your DM rules on using perception and investigation before you fully commit expertise.
To the topic at hand more broadly, I finally have a College of Whispers Bard in my game and the player definitely plays this character as an investigator, with a bit of a dip into the Pulp Hero The Shadow.
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Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
This was hella helpful. I'm playing a halfling with a back story as a spy/assassin. Given that backstory I was trying to build in some of this noir-ian detective character/knight errant quest taking mystery solver. I'm brand new to DnD so the discourse here has been great.
Especially the distinction between "wider scope, passive investIgation" really being high proficiency "perception". Does this mean that "investigation" would apply more to ... Like "studying" like a battle schematic? Seems like the DnD def of investigation being more like "scene studying/Trail following/brainy deduction skillz", while vibing, sensing, spotting stuff and getting reads on Situations kinda think an investigator might do, would be more "perception".
Righto?
I think you got it down!
Perception (Wisdom) has always been based on the senses...what you "feel"...so it deals with your immediate surroundings, or those impulses when you feel like someone is lying, or is uncomfortable.
Investigation (Intelligence) is more about analytics, and honing in on narrow details...finding things that are hidden, like coded messages in notes, hidden mechanisms in traps, or secret compartments / passages.
Both are useful to a private investigator, I feel.
It's really strange. I remember the original post, I found it interesting, and yet I never responded. Seven months later...
Oh well. Guess I can share my thoughts now.
When I think of a swords and sorcery fantasy story, and a hard boiled detective with a dash of noir, I think of Garret PI, from Glen Cook's Garret Files. The first one was "Sweet Silver Blues" published in 1988, the most recent is number 14, "Wicked Bronze Ambition" and was published in 2013. Garret is a former Marine, he's been thumped enough for his face to have developed "character" and his favorite thing to do is chase skirts. He works out of a house he bought that holds his partner, the Dead Man, who is a member of a rare and exotic species whose spirits don't go away when they are killed.
Garret is intentionally modeled after a number of the most famous detectives of fiction. Particularly Rex Stout's Nero Wolf. There's a dash of Dashiell Hammett in there, seasoned lightly with Raymond Chandler and others.
So imagine your typical Mike Hammer type character. Internal monologue, Harlem Nocturn playing on the saxophone in the background, traveling the mean streets of any given fantasy city. He's rough, he's tough, and he doesn't take orders from anyone. I imagine a Fighter, soldier background works fine, with the usual skills. None of his scores needs to be high, but all of them need to be above average, making point buy a good choice. Human so he blends in, but this is not essential. He gets dragged into cases, usually by a beautiful girl, and he gets to the bottom of things less by his brains than by hanging around and bothering people until he gets answers to his questions. Or thumped. He's all about grim determination.
Really, any class could work. It would be somewhat strange for a Barbarian, as they aren't usually the city type, but it's workable. I can't picture a Wizard or Sorcerer in that role, they fair better as the more cerebral type. That's your Sherlock Homes kind of jam. A Monk might be interesting, though coming from a long away and isolated monastery to living a life on the mean streets is weird. At least Monks are great at the rough and tumble part and when someone is going to get kicked around, it ain't gonna be the Monk.
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In trying to develop a classic detective-noir kind of character, I realized that there are countless ways to build this sort of character in Dungeons & Dragons.
You know the type...trenchcoat, fedora, a shady past, and perhaps even an internal monologue...who specializes in investigation, tracking down suspects, interrogation, and navigating the places where both criminals & law enforcement can't.
At first glance, you couldn't be blamed for just going automatically with an Inquisitive Rogue...they are, after all, the subclass modeled after characters such as Sherlock Holmes, specializing in sniffing out lies & illusions. Add to that the standard Rogue chassis of "Reliable Talent" and "Cunning Action", and you have a skillful character who's good at catching liars.
However, it would be foolish to say that a "private investigator" is a character limited to the Inquisitive Rogue...the classic detective isn't just sniffing out lies...in fact, usually such investigators are somewhat bad at reading people...getting fooled by pretty faces, scheming businessmen, shifty politicians, and pretty much anybody who wants to use the investigator as a cheap tool or a scapegoat. They might have proficiency in "Investigation"...picking up on clues or incongruities...but not be much of a people-person.
Sometimes, a private investigator is just someone who's able to survive an urban setting, take a beating, and have just enough grit to get the answers they wish.
Some unconventional "private investigator" characters may include Wizards, Clerics, Monks, or even Bards...not just Rogues.
A Divination Wizard who specializes in information-gathering spells is a pretty great private investigator...aside from the ever-useful Portents, their "Third Eye" is quite flavorful in seeing things that others can't...and their Intelligence will make them quite good at passive "Investigation".
A Knowledge Cleric makes for an astoundingly-great private investigator...flexible proficiencies, information-gathering bonus spells, access to "Zone of Truth", and the innate resiliency that all Clerics have over other spellcasters. Their high-level abilities even allow them to "Detect Thoughts" or re-create a crime scene.
Monks are a fascinating representation of a rough-&-tumble private investigator...their high Wisdom makes them quite insightful, while their fist-fighting makes them great sluggers who can handle a scrap or two in a tavern or back alley while chasing down leads.
Bards are the skill-machines...gaining Expertise in all the social skills / investigation skills they might require (Persuasion, Intimidation, Insight, Investigation) means they can pretty much dominate social encounters in any corner of an urban environment. The new Eloquence Bard, I think, makes for a remarkably witty detective (and probably the most likely to have an internal monologue)...while a Lore Bard's "Peerless Skill" serves to cover nearly any skill check they might want.
Gloomstalker Rangers make for interesting trackers...good for finding suspects or missing persons...and their ability to hide in shadows is pretty neat in urban environments.
I'm curious to hear if anybody has had successful experiences in creating a "private detective" character in their games...and if so, what sort of character were they?
What were their features? What were their races?
Did you take feats like "Observant" or "Keen Mind"? Were those useful feats to have?
Were they spellcasters? If so, what spells did they use?
Were they more martial-minded?
What were some experiences you had with this character? What was their backstory?
Share below!
I have an abjuration wizard that I setup to be like Sherlock Holmes. Took one level of Rogue for expertise as well as observant so his passive investigation is over 30. Legend lore is an underrated spell but spectacular as well as detect thoughts as there is no save to see surface thoughts. Divination would probably be a better fit than abjuration, but as he was my first Wizard I wanted to have more survivability especially in AL games when who knows what party comp and skill level you have when you sit down to a table.
rogue, maybe inquisitive, go investigation, perception, stealth, and athletics for initial skills
Rogue Shadow, the DM (and occasional) PC with schemes of inventive thinking
I think Mastermind fits better than Inquisitive for the Private investigator. Cloak of Billowing would be a nice piece, but reflavored as a trench coat
wait...
Sherlock Tomes!
Rogue Shadow, the DM (and occasional) PC with schemes of inventive thinking
For the type of detective you're going for, I'd definitely go for more of a fighter, maybe brawling fighting style. To still get the investigator feel you might wanna back up the class with maybe a tracker type background, high wisdom, and maybe some feats like Observant or something.
You could also go Paladin. Some of the Vengeance things really lend themselves to the dogged pursuer, grizzled detective type. Especially if you go the "trying to find X loved one's killer" route. You can totally be a paladin in a trench coat instead of shining armor.
Side note, one useful feat for any adventuring investigator is the Ritual Master feat. You can get detect magic, identify, and find familiar-- all useful tricks to have up your sleeve for any investigator.
I add medicine proficiency. It's used for forensics checks like a coroner or CSI analyst. Medical examiner style.
Rogue is the typical class, but artificers, rogues, wizards, bards, rangers, and even fighters are easy enough to build the trope.
INT based or skill benefits classes do it best.
this maybe a little more outside the box but have you considered Barbarian path of the totem warrior?
flavour it as hard nosed and hard drinking private detective, his "rage" is due to drinking to forget his biggest case failure (enter back story with lots of murder, mystery and double crosses), entering a rage is him taking a swig from a hip flask and yelling some obscenity. His totems are: lvl 3: Fighting Dog (as per bear totem, his frequened more than one dog fighting pit in his day), lvl 6: Rat (in place of Wolf, rats know all the shadowy places to follow people and get in and out of places), lvl 10: Pidgeon (in place of Eagle, pidgeons are often ignored and get to all the high places).
Race Variant Human (taking Prodigy as a feat)
Background: Urban Bounty Hunter
Skills: Intimidation and Survival from Barbarian, Insight and Stealth from Bounty Hunter, Perception or Medicine for Human, Investigation from Human/Prodigy and put the free "expertise" from prodigy in which ever skill you think you need most.
Feat as you level up take Observant and Tavern Brawler in addition to the usualTough and ASI
Adventurers of all stripes and classes can make great investigators. Sure the private investigator is an archetype (though you're missing the fact that in real life and fictional genre despite their independent or mercenary dependent means, they're still licensed for the most part), but really adventurers could have a number of reasons to be employed as investigators either directly for the powers that be, or in a capacity available to private individuals. Inquisitors are a type of investigator as well.
Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
I've heard this suggested once before (the Cloak of Billowing is a nice addition ; )
I would actually prioritize Wis over Int for the kind of investigator you're going for. Int gets you Arcana, History, Religion, and Investigation, only one of which is really in the lane of the grizzled detective.
With wisdom, you get Perception (a MUST), Insight (so you can go with your gut on stuff), medicine (so you can stitch up your own cuts like batman), and survival (so you can be an expert tracker).
Many more useful skills under the Wisdom umbrella, and you can always grab proficiency in Investigation if it feels wrong not having it.
This is table-dependent of course, but a lot of DMs treat Investigation as Perception, Investigation, and Survival all rolled into one. They let you search for clues with Investigation. They let you follow tracks with Investigation, especially when not in the wilderness.
The definition of Investigation they give us in the PHB starts out with, "When you look around for clues and make deductions based on those clues, you make an Intelligence (Investigation) check." How in the world they thought "look around for clues" was any different from basically all of Perception and half of Survival I'll never know, but our table limits Investigation to deduction so that it doesn't steamroll over other skills so easily.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm
That's why I also recommended Ritual Master for when you do find yourself investigating a magical-based mystery. Detect magic and identify are often what people are trying to do when they ask "can I roll Arcana?" anyways, so why not cut out the middleman?
I've always enjoyed the opposite ends of the Wisdom (Insight , Perception) & Intelligence (Investigation , History) when it comes to the private investigator.
Wisdom's "Perception" implies something akin to hyper-awareness to surroundings akin to say, BBC Sherlock Holmes (and even Robert Downey Jr.'s Sherlock)...taking in all the details of a scene...while "Insight" reminds me of Cal Lightman from the show "Lie to Me" (an expert in facial expressions who theoretically implies that there are universal "tells" in body language when someone lies)...and the "Observant" feat compounds these ideas.
Intelligence, on the other hand, would be less of a general awareness of surroundings, and more "Investigation" for an analysis of specific details...a scene of a struggle and how it may have played out, markings on an object that might have gone unnoticed, or uncovering cryptic codes or patterns within books or someone's notes...and "History" would be an ability to recall details, names, places, or dates which could help organize the "big reveal" of the mystery...the kind of person who puts all their theories on a bulletin board...and the "Keen Mind" feat supports this type of character (doesn't even need the board!)
Now, I personally subscribe to the latter kind of private investigator (an emphasis on "Intelligence" based skills), if only because the "hard-boiled" detective A) usually gets ambushed or taken by surprise by bruisers...implying their passive-perception needs a bit of work...and B) they typically are betrayed by those around them because they weren't as savvy with their Insight.
Granted, this is usually because it's a novel, show or movie and the plot needs to move along & stakes need raising...but I like the idea that the hard-boiled detective stumbles through conflict, and due to their "Investigation" and ability to recall details through "History", they're able to put the pieces together through the bumps & bruises. : )
I started a thread where we build characters based off rolling randomly for Race, Class, Subclass, and Background. This week, the challenge was a Human Psionic Soul Sorcerer Investigator. I went with Sorcerer 14 / Bard (College of Whispers) 6, with the Actor and Observant feat, and expertise in Perception and Persuasion. The idea is an aristocrat who investigates by throwing lavish parties and using his charisma to get people to open up and share gossip. The Psionic Soul option has some interesting abilities for investigator, giving them a lot of mobility and random access to divination magic. Bard opens up a lot of skills and influential spells.
I unpack the build more here: https://www.dndbeyond.com/forums/d-d-beyond-general/general-discussion/85908-the-monday-brews-lets-build-some-random-characters#c18
It's worth remembering as well that if you have expertise in a skill then having a high ability score attached to that skill isn't always needed, Investigation and Perception are two good examples of this, for instance, assuming level 4 and Int & Wis are both 12, Passive Investigation and Perception would be be 15 (Base 10 +1 for ability score bonus, +4 for double Proficicency bonus), as soon as you hit level 5 they both go up to 17 and should you ever get to level 17 they are both 23, if you add in the observant feat then at level 4 you actually have passive Investigation and Perception of 20 due to the +5 bump from the feat.
It's also quite dependant on your DM and whether they like using passive skill checks or prefer you to roll.
This was hella helpful. I'm playing a halfling with a back story as a spy/assassin. Given that backstory I was trying to build in some of this noir-ian detective character/knight errant quest taking mystery solver. I'm brand new to DnD so the discourse here has been great.
Especially the distinction between "wider scope, passive investIgation" really being high proficiency "perception". Does this mean that "investigation" would apply more to ... Like "studying" like a battle schematic? Seems like the DnD def of investigation being more like "scene studying/Trail following/brainy deduction skillz", while vibing, sensing, spotting stuff and getting reads on Situations kinda think an investigator might do, would be more "perception".
Righto?
Kinda. As written perception is largely implied to be observation "in the moment" like almost literally sense impressions; and investigation is sort of the art or science of putting it all together, deliberation basically. Some tables play like that. Other tables basically treat perception and investigation as the same skill just one is INT based and one WIS based (having my fair share of experience doing investigations and working with investigators in a number of context, I think that's fair trade). If "detective work" is something you definitely want to have in your game, make sure you get a sense of how your DM rules on using perception and investigation before you fully commit expertise.
To the topic at hand more broadly, I finally have a College of Whispers Bard in my game and the player definitely plays this character as an investigator, with a bit of a dip into the Pulp Hero The Shadow.
Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
I think you got it down!
Perception (Wisdom) has always been based on the senses...what you "feel"...so it deals with your immediate surroundings, or those impulses when you feel like someone is lying, or is uncomfortable.
Investigation (Intelligence) is more about analytics, and honing in on narrow details...finding things that are hidden, like coded messages in notes, hidden mechanisms in traps, or secret compartments / passages.
Both are useful to a private investigator, I feel.
It's really strange. I remember the original post, I found it interesting, and yet I never responded. Seven months later...
Oh well. Guess I can share my thoughts now.
When I think of a swords and sorcery fantasy story, and a hard boiled detective with a dash of noir, I think of Garret PI, from Glen Cook's Garret Files. The first one was "Sweet Silver Blues" published in 1988, the most recent is number 14, "Wicked Bronze Ambition" and was published in 2013. Garret is a former Marine, he's been thumped enough for his face to have developed "character" and his favorite thing to do is chase skirts. He works out of a house he bought that holds his partner, the Dead Man, who is a member of a rare and exotic species whose spirits don't go away when they are killed.
Garret is intentionally modeled after a number of the most famous detectives of fiction. Particularly Rex Stout's Nero Wolf. There's a dash of Dashiell Hammett in there, seasoned lightly with Raymond Chandler and others.
So imagine your typical Mike Hammer type character. Internal monologue, Harlem Nocturn playing on the saxophone in the background, traveling the mean streets of any given fantasy city. He's rough, he's tough, and he doesn't take orders from anyone. I imagine a Fighter, soldier background works fine, with the usual skills. None of his scores needs to be high, but all of them need to be above average, making point buy a good choice. Human so he blends in, but this is not essential. He gets dragged into cases, usually by a beautiful girl, and he gets to the bottom of things less by his brains than by hanging around and bothering people until he gets answers to his questions. Or thumped. He's all about grim determination.
Really, any class could work. It would be somewhat strange for a Barbarian, as they aren't usually the city type, but it's workable. I can't picture a Wizard or Sorcerer in that role, they fair better as the more cerebral type. That's your Sherlock Homes kind of jam. A Monk might be interesting, though coming from a long away and isolated monastery to living a life on the mean streets is weird. At least Monks are great at the rough and tumble part and when someone is going to get kicked around, it ain't gonna be the Monk.
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