Or; Adventurers who don't want to adventure, pt. 2.
Long story short, some of my PC's picked a fight WAY above their level in a dragon. I warned them off but they insisted and due to some absurd luck with saves and one timely crit sneak attack, they cut off the end of its tail and it fled, vowing terrible vengeance. Fast forward a year in game and here we are... the dragon is hatching its master plan for revenge. It attacked a bunch of the PCs NPC buddies, activated a mole in their group and stole a bunch of stuff, and dared them to come out and face its wrath.
But they won't come out. They took the interesting path of trying to provoke the dragon further, organizing a 3 act play mocking the dragon and paying bards to write songs making fun of it. This has resulted in the dragon making additional attacks throughout the countryside trying to draw them out. But their end game is not to fight it. They hope the dragon will cause so much trouble someone else will come along and kill it for them. Meanwhile they hide in their compound. The leader PC advised he has no problems with collateral damage and that his character will not put himself in harms way. I think more and more he sees himself as a kind of selfish batman, who masterminds things and only fights when he has already won. The other PCs defer to him in all things.
So for the foreseeable future, the game is them hiding out, antagonizing this dragon, and waiting for some real heroes to do something about it. Its probably just the frustration of them hiding from months of work... but this is stupid. I even tried giving them back some dragon-slaying arrows (thats what the dragon's spy stole from them) but they still want to sit pat.
At this point I wish the dragon would just go away but I'm boxed in by my own lore. The "dragon" is out of the bag and I can't put it back. And now the whole campaign is frozen since they won't confront this thing. How do I get out of this mess?
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PC - Ethel - Human - Lvl 4 Necromancer - Undying Dragons * Serge Marshblade - Human - Lvl 5 Eldritch Knight - Hoard of the Dragon Queen
DM -(Homebrew) Heroes of Bardstown *Red Dead Annihilation: ToA *Where the Cold Winds Blow : DoIP * Covetous, Dragonish Thoughts: HotDQ * Red Wine, Black Rose: CoS * Greyhawk: Tides of War
I'd have the dragon turn into it's humanoid form, human, dwarf, elf etc. Then befriend the players at a pub or what have you. Then I'd get one alone to capture the player dragging said player off to the dragons lair. That would get my group to go after their friend.
If they didn't then the dragon eats said player and returns to get another. Because I'm evil that way.
Similar to above but if the dragon can't attack the compound (sounds like there must be some reason why) then rather than have it terrorise the surrounding area (which isn't working as the leader doesn't care for others) have it turn humanoid and start to charm (in it's normal meaning not as in a spell) the locals and slowly turn all of the surrounding areas agaisnt the party. The longer they wait the more locals hate them. Eventually the dragon leading an army of the locals storm the compound.
It shouldn't be hard for the dragon to be able to paint the party as the selfish ones causing all the harm... as seems that is who they are...
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All posts come with the caveat that I don't know what I'm talking about.
Similar to above but if the dragon can't attack the compound (sounds like there must be some reason why) then rather than have it terrorise the surrounding area (which isn't working as the leader doesn't care for others) have it turn humanoid and start to charm (in it's normal meaning not as in a spell) the locals and slowly turn all of the surrounding areas agaisnt the party. The longer they wait the more locals hate them. Eventually the dragon leading an army of the locals storm the compound.
It shouldn't be hard for the dragon to be able to paint the party as the selfish ones causing all the harm... as seems that is who they are...
The dragon could attack the compound, but it knows from its spy that the PC's invested a lot of time and gp "dragon-proofing" it, with underground passages and bunkers, reinforced buildings, a ballista, heavy crossbow mounts, etc. Attacking them at their base would still be possible but it would be the most disadvantageous way for the dragon to do it. And the dragon would know that is where they want it to attack and wants to do this on its own terms.
I like the idea of the dragon walking as human and turning the people against the PCs. A problem is that the PCs have met and are familiar with the dragon's human form. And they have been bribing the thieves guild since the dragon attacks started asking for anyone who matches that appearance (or the spy, who they identified after the fact) be brought to their attention. My players are actually pretty good at playing ultra paranoid, defense-minded shut-ins.
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PC - Ethel - Human - Lvl 4 Necromancer - Undying Dragons * Serge Marshblade - Human - Lvl 5 Eldritch Knight - Hoard of the Dragon Queen
DM -(Homebrew) Heroes of Bardstown *Red Dead Annihilation: ToA *Where the Cold Winds Blow : DoIP * Covetous, Dragonish Thoughts: HotDQ * Red Wine, Black Rose: CoS * Greyhawk: Tides of War
I mean, in medieval times when a group of fighters refused to come out of their hidy-hole (read: castle) and the invading aggressor still wanted to kill them, they'd just cut off all food and other supplies into the castle. Do that here -- there's no reason they should have endless food and water in whatever their compound is. Eventually they (or their workers, or whatever) need to go out and get supplies. And if those errand runs never come back? Well, eventually they'll have to come out themselves.
So for the foreseeable future, the game is them hiding out, antagonizing this dragon, and waiting for some real heroes to do something about it. Its probably just the frustration of them hiding from months of work... but this is stupid. I even tried giving them back some dragon-slaying arrows (thats what the dragon's spy stole from them) but they still want to sit pat.
At this point I wish the dragon would just go away but I'm boxed in by my own lore. The "dragon" is out of the bag and I can't put it back. And now the whole campaign is frozen since they won't confront this thing. How do I get out of this mess?
Well, given that they assume 'real heroes' are around -- have some 'real heroes' come around, capture the PCs, and stake them out as dragon bait? Or possibly, rather than real heroes, the local assassin's guild because the PCs are being bad for business.
Similar to above but if the dragon can't attack the compound (sounds like there must be some reason why) then rather than have it terrorise the surrounding area (which isn't working as the leader doesn't care for others) have it turn humanoid and start to charm (in it's normal meaning not as in a spell) the locals and slowly turn all of the surrounding areas agaisnt the party. The longer they wait the more locals hate them. Eventually the dragon leading an army of the locals storm the compound.
It shouldn't be hard for the dragon to be able to paint the party as the selfish ones causing all the harm... as seems that is who they are...
The dragon could attack the compound, but it knows from its spy that the PC's invested a lot of time and gp "dragon-proofing" it, with underground passages and bunkers, reinforced buildings, a ballista, heavy crossbow mounts, etc. Attacking them at their base would still be possible but it would be the most disadvantageous way for the dragon to do it. And the dragon would know that is where they want it to attack and wants to do this on its own terms.
I like the idea of the dragon walking as human and turning the people against the PCs. A problem is that the PCs have met and are familiar with the dragon's human form. And they have been bribing the thieves guild since the dragon attacks started asking for anyone who matches that appearance (or the spy, who they identified after the fact) be brought to their attention. My players are actually pretty good at playing ultra paranoid, defense-minded shut-ins.
Even if the PCs having bribing the thieves' guild, the dragon can probably offer them a lot more. Have the thieves' guild contact the players and tell them they captured someone who matches the dragon's appearance. The 'dragon' is actually a member of the thieves' guild subject to a simple disguise self spell. When the players approach the 'captive,' the dragon and thieves' guild members lunge from the shadows and attack.
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All stars fade. Some stars forever fall. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Homebrew (Mostly Outdated):Magic Items,Monsters,Spells,Subclasses ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If there was no light, people wouldn't fear the dark.
Similar to above but if the dragon can't attack the compound (sounds like there must be some reason why) then rather than have it terrorise the surrounding area (which isn't working as the leader doesn't care for others) have it turn humanoid and start to charm (in it's normal meaning not as in a spell) the locals and slowly turn all of the surrounding areas agaisnt the party. The longer they wait the more locals hate them. Eventually the dragon leading an army of the locals storm the compound.
It shouldn't be hard for the dragon to be able to paint the party as the selfish ones causing all the harm... as seems that is who they are...
The dragon could attack the compound, but it knows from its spy that the PC's invested a lot of time and gp "dragon-proofing" it, with underground passages and bunkers, reinforced buildings, a ballista, heavy crossbow mounts, etc. Attacking them at their base would still be possible but it would be the most disadvantageous way for the dragon to do it. And the dragon would know that is where they want it to attack and wants to do this on its own terms.
I like the idea of the dragon walking as human and turning the people against the PCs. A problem is that the PCs have met and are familiar with the dragon's human form. And they have been bribing the thieves guild since the dragon attacks started asking for anyone who matches that appearance (or the spy, who they identified after the fact) be brought to their attention. My players are actually pretty good at playing ultra paranoid, defense-minded shut-ins.
So, why does it have to be the dragon that turns the people against the PCs. If a Dragon is terrorizing the countryside ( Or whatever ) and They know that there is a group of heroes not doing a durned thing about it then the People would turn against the PCs on their own without the dragon having to get involved. I mean, it's pretty simple when you think about it. The party is aggravating the dragon and they are the reason it's rampaging and destroying everything, so if it's the party's fault that this is happening then the Blame can be assigned to them, and then you can make the rumors get out of control and suddenly, your PCs are Evil Dragon Controlling warlocks in need of exterminating. Then the only hope for your PCs would then be telling them that they were preparing to fight the dragon and were staying here planning a way to defeat them. Then Some important person would send them on their way to defeat the dragon and all that.
"Well, guys, since you are going to hide in your castle and never come out, and the dragon isn't stupid enough to attack you, it looks like we have a stalemate. Let's retire these characters, and start a new campaign."
I mean... there is no point to just RPing week after week some guys hiding in a castle. That's not D&D. So stop that campaign and start a new one.
You might wanna throw in, "Whose turn it is to DM?" Depends how ornery you're feeling, heheh.
My guess is... they don't really want to STOP playing. I'd say if they want to continue this campaign, they need to find some way to make forward progress on the dragon in each session or else come up with something else to do, because sitting in the castle knitting sweaters is not the D&D I signed up to play, or in this case, DM.
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WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
I wouldn't go that far. You don't have to show up every week and RP them doing nothing - just fast-forward through the boring parts. You can always say "ok, three weeks later..."
They've picked a strategy - they're going to hole up in their castle until the dragon is captured. It's a valid choice, though sort of an unconventional one. So just figure out what the results of their choice are! The conflict isn't over!
Here's a few options that I can think of:
1) The plan works. The dragon has terrorized the countryside enough, some Real Heroes come out and slay the dragon. (I can tell you don't like this option! It IS an option, though, if after thinking about it you think the plan would work!)
2) ...the above, but with a twist. The Actual Heroes have done this in exchange for a promised reward - a reward that includes this compound that the PCs think is theirs. But isn't anymore, because the King has given it away to the Real Heroes, along with a bunch of other stuff. (And yeah, if they try to oppose these Real Heroes - great, now instead of antagonizing a dragon, they're antagonizing a party that is higher level than that dragon and easily took the dragon down. What an upgrade! Or they have to give up their hard-earned compound.)
3) Siege. The Dragon cuts off all travel to their compound, if the compound is isolated enough. It's smart; it can try to do this in a way that doesn't antagonize anyone! It politely tells merchants or anyone carrying food or water to go away (or be burned), it lets anyone who wants to leave the compound leave peacefully (EXCEPT the PCs.) Heck, it can even be helpful! Even Evil dragons are able to plot and plan, including diplomacy and acting nice when they want to. No Big Damn Heroes are going to come when the Dragon mostly seems to be a good neighbor with a grudge against some random PCs!
4) Just let the PCs fast forward time as they want. The dragon stops burning the countryside so no Big Damn Heroes come for it, and just waits for the PCs to come out. Dragons are longer-lived and more patient than most PC races. You wait a week? Nothing changes. Wait a year? Nothing changes. PCs wait a decade, in their nice little self-inflicted prison? Dragon's still out there somewhere! It'll wait to wait a century if that's what it takes. Tell all the PCs to start checking off time from their expected lifespan based on their race.
5) ...did I say the Dragon would wait? I meant plot. If the PCs go and say sure, we'll wait in here for a decade - congratulations, you as DM can now have the Dragon put forth an arbitrarily complicated plot, saying it's had a decade to bring it to fruition. Go wild and come up with literally anything you want - Dragons are smarter than humans and more patient, it could have used that time to come up with arbitrarily powerful allies. It's had that time to scout out all their defenses and come up with a perfect counter to each of them. That's what a dragon could do if given time (dragon - way smarter than even most smart humans).
6) The dragon vanishes. One day, the PCs wake up and realize they haven't heard anything from it. As far as they can tell, it's gone. It has gone into hiding and, as far as the PCs can find out, is nowhere to be seen. Start whatever next adventure the PCs want to do. Midway through it have the dragon ambush them. Double points if the next adventure hooks are all, in some way, caused by the Dragon laying traps for the PCs. If the PCs continue to fail to take the bait, happily narrate how everything the PCs ever to accomplish in the world outside their compound is destroyed. The Dragon is smart enough not to antagonize the general population, just the PCs specifically. Do the PCs have anything outside this compound that they care about?
The problem with sieges in D&D is that if it's just a party inside a fort hunkered down, there are spells that can provide them with food and water. So it's impossible to "starve out" a D&D party unless they are very low level (and maybe not even then). Having it ravage the countryside... would only work if the PCs care. Which apparently they don't.
The OP wishes the dragon would go away... Well make it go away. A powerful group of high-level heroes takes it out. Problem solved.
Or is it? Will they just run from every other boss monster you create? If not, then why just the dragon? If so, is it their idea that the only fun way to play D&D is with level 10s against kobolds?
I wouldn't want to DM under these conditions, which is why I said I would probably propose bringing the campaign to a close and starting up with someone else DMing.
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WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
The problem with sieges in D&D is that if it's just a party inside a fort hunkered down, there are spells that can provide them with food and water. So it's impossible to "starve out" a D&D party unless they are very low level (and maybe not even then).
On the other hand, assaults aren't that hard. However, the basic problem here is the players, so the fact that their tactics can be overcome doesn't mean the result will be a good game.
Maybe the dragon hires a mercenary army that assaults the PCs fortress. Dragons have lots of money. Send thousands of soldiers at them. Enough to flush them out through those tunnels and fight them in the open somewhere.
Or do biowizard’s idea.
Or, to go really off the map, just tpk them. These seem like players who need to adjust to the idea that characters die sometimes. Usually I’d never say do something like this, because it’s obviously adversarial, but they need a lesson. Have the dragon hire a wizard who flys over them invisibly and casts meteor swarm and a delayed blast fireball or two.
In an evil way I kinda want to see the dragon kill one PC just to let the rest of the party know that you mean business. Then maybe the rest of the party will come out to avenge the dead comrade. If they don't that repeat the process until they do.
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May your blades stay ever sharp, and your minds as well.
DM: you party is approached by a bug bear.
Newbie: that sounds terrifying its like a bear with wings and pincers!
Veteran No, Its a...
DM: *scribbling furiously* The bugbears mandibles click furiously, everybody roll initiative!
I think the biggest problem is the one player bullying the other players around and not giving them a say. Ask the other players what they want to do. Maybe they want to confront the Dragon. If the bully doesn't help them and you are worried they will be wiped out, give them an npc of roughly equal strength.
Either way, kill the party because you need to start a new campaign without the leader of the group.
If this is the goal, then I think it is far better as a DM to say something like, "Well you guys have made this campaign not be fun for me so let's start another one or someone else take over as DM."
The players need to understand that their refusal to act like protagonists, and instead to "turtle" inside their castle as literal cowards (not just hiding but hoping for someone else to come by and be the heroes) is not acceptable to the DM, because the DM doesn't want to run a game like that. The OP says the head PC thinks of himself as a "selfish Batman" -- that is an oxymoron. Batman was not selfish and there is no effing way Batman would sit in the batcave while the Joker or the Riddler or heck even Darkseid was out there screwing with Gotham City. The PC is not being a hero. He has literally become a villain -- someone who hides in his fortress and lets other people take the risks instead of himself. That's what the bad guys do.
One thing the OP could possibly do, though frankly I probably wouldn't, would be to make up the heroes who beat the dragon, and hand the character sheets to the PCs and say, "OK tonight we are going to RP out the other heroes who came to save your butts from the dragon." Make sure the PCs are strong enough to win the fight. Show them how much fun it can be to fight a dragon in D&D. (There is, after all, a reason the game is called "Dungeons and Dragons" -- it's named after what people thought, and many still do, are the 2 most fun activities in the game.)
However, this feels a little too much like a reward to me, and there is the risk that it could backfire -- if they don't play competently or dice rolls go bad, and the hero team dies, the coward player will say see, I was right, there's no point to fighting this dragon.
I still think the best bet at this point is an OOC solution. The DM is not having fun. This is a road to disaster. The campaign WILL end if the DM is not having fun. So the DM needs to explain straight up, this is not fun for me, and if it keeps up I don't want to play anymore. The players don't get to make the DM miserable.
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WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
I'm switching away from any "smart" in game answer and going with BioWizard idea of the campaign ending and seeing if someone else wants to DM.
If you felt like highlighting the reason why in game could say "and the stalemate continued, the dragon scorched all the earth 2 days ride from the compound. As the years past those who knew the party as heroes forget about them. New adventures and kingdoms rise and fall. Eventually the party dies one by one of old age, forgotten leaving no legacy beyond a desolate patch of ground. The dragon barely notices the passage of time as years mean little to them"
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All posts come with the caveat that I don't know what I'm talking about.
One of the fundamental aspects of D&D is that the actions the players take have consequences. Right now they are hiding from the consequences of their actions and hoping someone else will clean up their mess - it's your job not to let them.
As others have mentioned, whether or not your party is okay with the collateral damage, no one else in the area should be. They should be despised by every NPC, or at least berated to do something about it. People would take up collections to hire mercenaries or adventurers to root them out, or straight-up collaborate with the dragon.
And the dragon is another vehicle. Dragons are smart. If collateral damage doesn't work, it will change tactics. Dig under the castle, or just waltz up to it and claw the door down. Find ways to approach the other party members who might be less okay with leader PCs decisions and encourage mutiny. At any rate, the party should not feel safe. They should feel the weight of their choices bearing down on them.
There's a number of in-game ways to approach this, but it would also help to speak to the players directly about consequences and how if you don't enforce them, the game simply doesn't work. It's just a string of random actions that have no point.
Or; Adventurers who don't want to adventure, pt. 2.
Long story short, some of my PC's picked a fight WAY above their level in a dragon. I warned them off but they insisted and due to some absurd luck with saves and one timely crit sneak attack, they cut off the end of its tail and it fled, vowing terrible vengeance. Fast forward a year in game and here we are... the dragon is hatching its master plan for revenge. It attacked a bunch of the PCs NPC buddies, activated a mole in their group and stole a bunch of stuff, and dared them to come out and face its wrath.
But they won't come out. They took the interesting path of trying to provoke the dragon further, organizing a 3 act play mocking the dragon and paying bards to write songs making fun of it. This has resulted in the dragon making additional attacks throughout the countryside trying to draw them out. But their end game is not to fight it. They hope the dragon will cause so much trouble someone else will come along and kill it for them. Meanwhile they hide in their compound. The leader PC advised he has no problems with collateral damage and that his character will not put himself in harms way. I think more and more he sees himself as a kind of selfish batman, who masterminds things and only fights when he has already won. The other PCs defer to him in all things.
So for the foreseeable future, the game is them hiding out, antagonizing this dragon, and waiting for some real heroes to do something about it. Its probably just the frustration of them hiding from months of work... but this is stupid. I even tried giving them back some dragon-slaying arrows (thats what the dragon's spy stole from them) but they still want to sit pat.
At this point I wish the dragon would just go away but I'm boxed in by my own lore. The "dragon" is out of the bag and I can't put it back. And now the whole campaign is frozen since they won't confront this thing. How do I get out of this mess?
PC - Ethel - Human - Lvl 4 Necromancer - Undying Dragons * Serge Marshblade - Human - Lvl 5 Eldritch Knight - Hoard of the Dragon Queen
DM - (Homebrew) Heroes of Bardstown * Red Dead Annihilation: ToA * Where the Cold Winds Blow : DoIP * Covetous, Dragonish Thoughts: HotDQ * Red Wine, Black Rose: CoS * Greyhawk: Tides of War
I'd have the dragon turn into it's humanoid form, human, dwarf, elf etc. Then befriend the players at a pub or what have you. Then I'd get one alone to capture the player dragging said player off to the dragons lair. That would get my group to go after their friend.
If they didn't then the dragon eats said player and returns to get another. Because I'm evil that way.
Similar to above but if the dragon can't attack the compound (sounds like there must be some reason why) then rather than have it terrorise the surrounding area (which isn't working as the leader doesn't care for others) have it turn humanoid and start to charm (in it's normal meaning not as in a spell) the locals and slowly turn all of the surrounding areas agaisnt the party. The longer they wait the more locals hate them. Eventually the dragon leading an army of the locals storm the compound.
It shouldn't be hard for the dragon to be able to paint the party as the selfish ones causing all the harm... as seems that is who they are...
All posts come with the caveat that I don't know what I'm talking about.
The dragon could attack the compound, but it knows from its spy that the PC's invested a lot of time and gp "dragon-proofing" it, with underground passages and bunkers, reinforced buildings, a ballista, heavy crossbow mounts, etc. Attacking them at their base would still be possible but it would be the most disadvantageous way for the dragon to do it. And the dragon would know that is where they want it to attack and wants to do this on its own terms.
I like the idea of the dragon walking as human and turning the people against the PCs. A problem is that the PCs have met and are familiar with the dragon's human form. And they have been bribing the thieves guild since the dragon attacks started asking for anyone who matches that appearance (or the spy, who they identified after the fact) be brought to their attention. My players are actually pretty good at playing ultra paranoid, defense-minded shut-ins.
PC - Ethel - Human - Lvl 4 Necromancer - Undying Dragons * Serge Marshblade - Human - Lvl 5 Eldritch Knight - Hoard of the Dragon Queen
DM - (Homebrew) Heroes of Bardstown * Red Dead Annihilation: ToA * Where the Cold Winds Blow : DoIP * Covetous, Dragonish Thoughts: HotDQ * Red Wine, Black Rose: CoS * Greyhawk: Tides of War
I mean, in medieval times when a group of fighters refused to come out of their hidy-hole (read: castle) and the invading aggressor still wanted to kill them, they'd just cut off all food and other supplies into the castle. Do that here -- there's no reason they should have endless food and water in whatever their compound is. Eventually they (or their workers, or whatever) need to go out and get supplies. And if those errand runs never come back? Well, eventually they'll have to come out themselves.
Well, given that they assume 'real heroes' are around -- have some 'real heroes' come around, capture the PCs, and stake them out as dragon bait? Or possibly, rather than real heroes, the local assassin's guild because the PCs are being bad for business.
Even if the PCs having bribing the thieves' guild, the dragon can probably offer them a lot more. Have the thieves' guild contact the players and tell them they captured someone who matches the dragon's appearance. The 'dragon' is actually a member of the thieves' guild subject to a simple disguise self spell. When the players approach the 'captive,' the dragon and thieves' guild members lunge from the shadows and attack.
All stars fade. Some stars forever fall.
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Homebrew (Mostly Outdated): Magic Items, Monsters, Spells, Subclasses
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If there was no light, people wouldn't fear the dark.
: Systems Online : Nikoli_Goodfellow Homebrew : My WIP Homebrew Class :
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o/ \🥛🍪 Hey, take care of yourself alright?
I have a very non-conventional solution....
"Well, guys, since you are going to hide in your castle and never come out, and the dragon isn't stupid enough to attack you, it looks like we have a stalemate. Let's retire these characters, and start a new campaign."
I mean... there is no point to just RPing week after week some guys hiding in a castle. That's not D&D. So stop that campaign and start a new one.
You might wanna throw in, "Whose turn it is to DM?" Depends how ornery you're feeling, heheh.
My guess is... they don't really want to STOP playing. I'd say if they want to continue this campaign, they need to find some way to make forward progress on the dragon in each session or else come up with something else to do, because sitting in the castle knitting sweaters is not the D&D I signed up to play, or in this case, DM.
WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
I wouldn't go that far. You don't have to show up every week and RP them doing nothing - just fast-forward through the boring parts. You can always say "ok, three weeks later..."
They've picked a strategy - they're going to hole up in their castle until the dragon is captured. It's a valid choice, though sort of an unconventional one. So just figure out what the results of their choice are! The conflict isn't over!
Here's a few options that I can think of:
1) The plan works. The dragon has terrorized the countryside enough, some Real Heroes come out and slay the dragon. (I can tell you don't like this option! It IS an option, though, if after thinking about it you think the plan would work!)
2) ...the above, but with a twist. The Actual Heroes have done this in exchange for a promised reward - a reward that includes this compound that the PCs think is theirs. But isn't anymore, because the King has given it away to the Real Heroes, along with a bunch of other stuff. (And yeah, if they try to oppose these Real Heroes - great, now instead of antagonizing a dragon, they're antagonizing a party that is higher level than that dragon and easily took the dragon down. What an upgrade! Or they have to give up their hard-earned compound.)
3) Siege. The Dragon cuts off all travel to their compound, if the compound is isolated enough. It's smart; it can try to do this in a way that doesn't antagonize anyone! It politely tells merchants or anyone carrying food or water to go away (or be burned), it lets anyone who wants to leave the compound leave peacefully (EXCEPT the PCs.) Heck, it can even be helpful! Even Evil dragons are able to plot and plan, including diplomacy and acting nice when they want to. No Big Damn Heroes are going to come when the Dragon mostly seems to be a good neighbor with a grudge against some random PCs!
4) Just let the PCs fast forward time as they want. The dragon stops burning the countryside so no Big Damn Heroes come for it, and just waits for the PCs to come out. Dragons are longer-lived and more patient than most PC races. You wait a week? Nothing changes. Wait a year? Nothing changes. PCs wait a decade, in their nice little self-inflicted prison? Dragon's still out there somewhere! It'll wait to wait a century if that's what it takes. Tell all the PCs to start checking off time from their expected lifespan based on their race.
5) ...did I say the Dragon would wait? I meant plot. If the PCs go and say sure, we'll wait in here for a decade - congratulations, you as DM can now have the Dragon put forth an arbitrarily complicated plot, saying it's had a decade to bring it to fruition. Go wild and come up with literally anything you want - Dragons are smarter than humans and more patient, it could have used that time to come up with arbitrarily powerful allies. It's had that time to scout out all their defenses and come up with a perfect counter to each of them. That's what a dragon could do if given time (dragon - way smarter than even most smart humans).
6) The dragon vanishes. One day, the PCs wake up and realize they haven't heard anything from it. As far as they can tell, it's gone. It has gone into hiding and, as far as the PCs can find out, is nowhere to be seen. Start whatever next adventure the PCs want to do. Midway through it have the dragon ambush them. Double points if the next adventure hooks are all, in some way, caused by the Dragon laying traps for the PCs. If the PCs continue to fail to take the bait, happily narrate how everything the PCs ever to accomplish in the world outside their compound is destroyed. The Dragon is smart enough not to antagonize the general population, just the PCs specifically. Do the PCs have anything outside this compound that they care about?
Give it innate spellcasting and spells it can use to dig into the basement of the compound, past the PC's defenses.
I have a weird sense of humor.
I also make maps.(That's a link)
The problem with sieges in D&D is that if it's just a party inside a fort hunkered down, there are spells that can provide them with food and water. So it's impossible to "starve out" a D&D party unless they are very low level (and maybe not even then). Having it ravage the countryside... would only work if the PCs care. Which apparently they don't.
The OP wishes the dragon would go away... Well make it go away. A powerful group of high-level heroes takes it out. Problem solved.
Or is it? Will they just run from every other boss monster you create? If not, then why just the dragon? If so, is it their idea that the only fun way to play D&D is with level 10s against kobolds?
I wouldn't want to DM under these conditions, which is why I said I would probably propose bringing the campaign to a close and starting up with someone else DMing.
WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
On the other hand, assaults aren't that hard. However, the basic problem here is the players, so the fact that their tactics can be overcome doesn't mean the result will be a good game.
Maybe the dragon hires a mercenary army that assaults the PCs fortress. Dragons have lots of money. Send thousands of soldiers at them. Enough to flush them out through those tunnels and fight them in the open somewhere.
Or do biowizard’s idea.
Or, to go really off the map, just tpk them. These seem like players who need to adjust to the idea that characters die sometimes. Usually I’d never say do something like this, because it’s obviously adversarial, but they need a lesson. Have the dragon hire a wizard who flys over them invisibly and casts meteor swarm and a delayed blast fireball or two.
In an evil way I kinda want to see the dragon kill one PC just to let the rest of the party know that you mean business. Then maybe the rest of the party will come out to avenge the dead comrade. If they don't that repeat the process until they do.
May your blades stay ever sharp, and your minds as well.
DM: you party is approached by a bug bear.
Newbie: that sounds terrifying its like a bear with wings and pincers!
Veteran No, Its a...
DM: *scribbling furiously* The bugbears mandibles click furiously, everybody roll initiative!
Dragon hires assassins and kills party
The surrounding people turn on the party, go to Baron, or King, King sends army kills party
Dragon, picks away a castle, slowly destroying its walls, until nothing is left and party cannot hide any more, Dragon Kills party
I give Dragons in 5E spells, lots of spells, dragon kills party
Either way, kill the party because you need to start a new campaign without the leader of the group.
I think the biggest problem is the one player bullying the other players around and not giving them a say. Ask the other players what they want to do. Maybe they want to confront the Dragon. If the bully doesn't help them and you are worried they will be wiped out, give them an npc of roughly equal strength.
If this is the goal, then I think it is far better as a DM to say something like, "Well you guys have made this campaign not be fun for me so let's start another one or someone else take over as DM."
The players need to understand that their refusal to act like protagonists, and instead to "turtle" inside their castle as literal cowards (not just hiding but hoping for someone else to come by and be the heroes) is not acceptable to the DM, because the DM doesn't want to run a game like that. The OP says the head PC thinks of himself as a "selfish Batman" -- that is an oxymoron. Batman was not selfish and there is no effing way Batman would sit in the batcave while the Joker or the Riddler or heck even Darkseid was out there screwing with Gotham City. The PC is not being a hero. He has literally become a villain -- someone who hides in his fortress and lets other people take the risks instead of himself. That's what the bad guys do.
One thing the OP could possibly do, though frankly I probably wouldn't, would be to make up the heroes who beat the dragon, and hand the character sheets to the PCs and say, "OK tonight we are going to RP out the other heroes who came to save your butts from the dragon." Make sure the PCs are strong enough to win the fight. Show them how much fun it can be to fight a dragon in D&D. (There is, after all, a reason the game is called "Dungeons and Dragons" -- it's named after what people thought, and many still do, are the 2 most fun activities in the game.)
However, this feels a little too much like a reward to me, and there is the risk that it could backfire -- if they don't play competently or dice rolls go bad, and the hero team dies, the coward player will say see, I was right, there's no point to fighting this dragon.
I still think the best bet at this point is an OOC solution. The DM is not having fun. This is a road to disaster. The campaign WILL end if the DM is not having fun. So the DM needs to explain straight up, this is not fun for me, and if it keeps up I don't want to play anymore. The players don't get to make the DM miserable.
WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
I'm switching away from any "smart" in game answer and going with BioWizard idea of the campaign ending and seeing if someone else wants to DM.
If you felt like highlighting the reason why in game could say "and the stalemate continued, the dragon scorched all the earth 2 days ride from the compound. As the years past those who knew the party as heroes forget about them. New adventures and kingdoms rise and fall. Eventually the party dies one by one of old age, forgotten leaving no legacy beyond a desolate patch of ground. The dragon barely notices the passage of time as years mean little to them"
All posts come with the caveat that I don't know what I'm talking about.
One of the fundamental aspects of D&D is that the actions the players take have consequences. Right now they are hiding from the consequences of their actions and hoping someone else will clean up their mess - it's your job not to let them.
As others have mentioned, whether or not your party is okay with the collateral damage, no one else in the area should be. They should be despised by every NPC, or at least berated to do something about it. People would take up collections to hire mercenaries or adventurers to root them out, or straight-up collaborate with the dragon.
And the dragon is another vehicle. Dragons are smart. If collateral damage doesn't work, it will change tactics. Dig under the castle, or just waltz up to it and claw the door down. Find ways to approach the other party members who might be less okay with leader PCs decisions and encourage mutiny. At any rate, the party should not feel safe. They should feel the weight of their choices bearing down on them.
There's a number of in-game ways to approach this, but it would also help to speak to the players directly about consequences and how if you don't enforce them, the game simply doesn't work. It's just a string of random actions that have no point.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm