Well it depends - are they on their home plane or not. Banishment sends them to their home plane if they're not already there - so they could cast Plane Shift to return prematurely. But if they are already on their home plane then Banishment sends them to a harmless demiplane - where it incapacitates them - so they can't do anything.
It's possible to infer that it incapacitates them even if they go to their home plane - but I'm not sure it's clear enough to say that.
As for being immune - I think the stat block would have to say it's immune to forced planar travel if that were the case.
I'd rule that the banishment works, to send said creature back to original plane of existence. Said creature with a plane shift spell ability could choose to return the next round. A lot could depend upon on whether or not the party realizes a creature could do so. Would they use this monster-free round to heal-up, set up other traps, and realize that a monster (probably) only has the ability to plane shift once/day, and attempt to re-banish it again as soon as it appears through a held action? or would they instead be giving themselves slaps on the back and get caught off guard a round or two later once the monster returns?
I would have Banishment hold the creature where it’s sent for the full duration of the spell. It’s a 4th level concentration spell and it only lasts for one minute. That’s not over powered.
I would have Banishment hold the creature where it’s sent for the full duration of the spell. It’s a 4th level concentration spell and it only lasts for one minute. That’s not over powered.
The OP part is that extraplanar creatures stay in their home plane if the spell is not interrupted and goes the full minute. If they don't have planeshift or and legendary resistances left it's pretty darn powerful. Leads me to the be careful with your back story with you DM too.... Had an Eladrin that was born in the Feywild, had banishment cast and POP he was back there and was one round away from not being able to return when the stupid cleric was finally killed.
There's no need to make an inference about whether the creature is Incapacitated or not because they just aren't--that only applies to the demiplane.
The thing about a creature banished to their home plane via Banishment, and what their options are, comes down to the spell being a concentration spell. Whether the banished creature is capable of plane-shifting back is irrelevant because the caster is concentrating on keeping them banished. Concentrating on this spell is basically like the caster is pressing all their weight against a one-way door that pushes open from the opposite side.
When concentration ends, the banished creature is capable of returning to the plane it was banished from. If concentration ended prematurely (broken @ <1min), the creature automatically returns. If concentration ended maturely, the creature can return if they have a method available to them.
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You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
The creature is native to a different plane than the one upon which the spell is cast
The spell is successful
then the creature goes back to its "home" plane. That much is explicit. Beyond that, the caster can continue concentrating on the spell for up to the next minute. At this point, the spell has been successfully cast, all that happens from here on out is the determination of the spell's duration. The banished creature is not incapacitated during this time (my interpretation of RAW) and if it has the ability to plane shift, it is free to shift back to the plane it was banished from.
This could create an odd situation where the creature comes back while the caster has already banished it and continues to concentrate on the spell that would make it permanent. The slightly more interesting situation would be if the creature plane shifts to come back across the room from the caster, who then drops concentration, pulling the creature back to the exact spot where it was when the spell was first cast. Even funnier if the creature attacks the caster, causing it to lose concentration and blink the creature over a few feet to where the action first went down.
This could create an odd situation where the creature comes back while the caster has already banished it and continues to concentrate on the spell that would make it permanent. The slightly more interesting situation would be if the creature plane shifts to come back across the room from the caster, who then drops concentration, pulling the creature back to the exact spot where it was when the spell was first cast. Even funnier if the creature attacks the caster, causing it to lose concentration and blink the creature over a few feet to where the action first went down.
I don't think this is a possibility. The effect of Banishment is to force the target to be in their home (or demi) plane, rather than simply not being where they were before the spell took effect. Then the effect the caster is concentrating on is forcing the target to remain in their home (or demi) plane. If the target can (during this concentration period) still return, by any conceivable method, it invalidates the concept of concentrating on this spell. What else would there be to actually concentrate on?
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
If the target is native to a different plane of existence than the one you're on, the target is banished with a faint popping noise, returning to its home plane. If the spell ends before 1 minute has passed, the target reappears in the space it left or in the nearest unoccupied space if that space is occupied. Otherwise, the target doesn't return.
If we choose to interpret "the target doesn't return" as "the target cannot return" then you are correct. That is not how the rule reads to my eye.
Edit to elaborate: My interpretation is that once the spell has banished the target from its original location, the spell has served its purpose. The only variable at that point is whether the automatic return happens or not. A creature using its own action to plane shift would be an external activity outside the scope of the spell.
If the target is in their home plane and isn't incapacitated - that is - capable of taking actions - I think them casting a 7th level spell to return could overwrite a 4th level spell keeping them away - couldn't it?
If the target is native to a different plane of existence than the one you're on, the target is banished with a faint popping noise, returning to its home plane. If the spell ends before 1 minute has passed, the target reappears in the space it left or in the nearest unoccupied space if that space is occupied. Otherwise, the target doesn't return.
If we choose to interpret "the target doesn't return" as "the target cannot return" then you are correct. That is not how the rule reads to my eye.
I don't think that's the relevant area of focus. The conditional presented to the caster is in reference to the spell ending. If it were possible for a creature to plane-shift itself back, while the caster is still concentrating on banishment, I would expect that to be explicitly stated as causing the spell to end. Otherwise, it's an ongoing effect--keeping the door blocked.
Conversely, if the target isn't necessarily blocked from plane-shifting back, what happens if they do shift back while the caster is still concentrating? Do they only reappear for a moment before getting sucked back to their home plane again? The spell hasn't ended.
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You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
I think that's a reasonable reading of RAW. I still have my doubts about it, but the fact that the spell has a duration of 1 minute instead of instant speaks to that being a possibility. Nonetheless, it's still not how the wording looks to me. For me, if the spell was meant to include a kind of dimensional anchor, it would have to say so.
Keep in mind the creature is incapacitated while under the effects of Banishment. So regardless of if they are on their home plane or not, they can't Plane Shift until the Banishment duration runs out.
Edit: incap only applies if they are native it looks like. Regardless, I would say they can't return until the duration is up.
The incapacitation reads to me as more of a symptom of the "harmless" demiplane's characteristics, not something that the spell would impose on a creature sent to its home plane.
I do think there's analogous, linguistic, and mechanical support for Sigred's position:
Analogous: Banishment keeps a native plane creature away for the full duration, so it would be quite odd if it worked less well on an extra planar creature. By and large, spells should work intuitively on any and all targets without a bunch of exceptions and special edge cases, unless the rule text clearly describes otherwise.
Mechanical: As mentioned, it's a one-minute Concentration spell, meaning that the target creature is still under the "effect" of the spell during that minute. 'Was sent to X plane' is not an ongoing effect worthy of a concentration spell, so that can't be all that's going on.
Linguistic: "the target must succeed on a Charisma saving throw or be banished." It isn't just the name of the spell, the creature is "banished," not "teleported" or "sent." The common understanding of banished implies not just travel or sending away, but also an inability to return. I wouldn't go so far as to say that that sense of permanence is part of the Dictionary definition, but its certainly a loaded meaning behind its common use, as opposed to other synonyms like expel, deport, eject, oust, etc. If a creature under the effect is "banished" while Concentration is maintained, I would treat that as a unique condition which totally precludes them returning to the plane on their own or anyone else's power, so long as the spell is still maintained.
Obviously, there's no RAW language saying anything one way or the other. But considering that it definitely RAW works that way for banishing creatures native to the plane (they're Incapacitated and alone in a demiplane, and thus can't act to come back), I think there's a strong RAI argument that its "supposed" to work that way for extra-planar creatures as well, and that RAI dovetails nicely with the mechanical (its a concentration spell) and linguistic (banished strongly implies you don't come back) context for the spell.
If the target is native to a different plane of existence than the one you're on, the target is banished with a faint popping noise, returning to its home plane. If the spell ends before 1 minute has passed, the target reappears in the space it left or in the nearest unoccupied space if that space is occupied. Otherwise, the target doesn't return.
If we choose to interpret "the target doesn't return" as "the target cannot return" then you are correct. That is not how the rule reads to my eye.
I don't think that's the relevant area of focus. The conditional presented to the caster is in reference to the spell ending. If it were possible for a creature to plane-shift itself back, while the caster is still concentrating on banishment, I would expect that to be explicitly stated as causing the spell to end. Otherwise, it's an ongoing effect--keeping the door blocked.
Conversely, if the target isn't necessarily blocked from plane-shifting back, what happens if they do shift back while the caster is still concentrating? Do they only reappear for a moment before getting sucked back to their home plane again? The spell hasn't ended.
I think you're reading more into the spell that what's on the page. The only mention of keeping the target anywhere is in relation to the demiplane when then target was already in their home plane. Initially, the spell describes how it attempts to "send" (not "keep") the target to another plane. It then goes on to describe what happens when the target is on their home plane (not relevant), and then what happens when the target is not on their home plane. In this case: the target is sent to their home plane, and is returned back if the spell ends before the 1 minute is up. If the spell is concentrated on for its full duration, the target is not automatically returned. What happens if the target makes their way back to where they were before being banished is similar to what happens if enemies somehow find their way through a Wall of Force you cast to keep them out: you can keep concentrating on the spell, but it's not doing anything useful at that point. The intent might have been to prevent the target from coming back... but I doubt it: can the target use Plane Shift to go to a different plane? Could they be plane shifted against their will into the plane they were banished from? Could they plane shift into the Astral Plane, and use a color pool to cross over into the plane they were banished from?
I think, for me, the telling thing is that it specifically says that on the demiplane the target is incapacitated, but not elsewhere. If the spell ends early, it returns to exactly where it was banished from, but other than that there is nothing stopping the creature from doing whatever it wants. It could go have a nap, read a book, eat some ice cream, behead a minion... or cast a spell to bring it back to the plane it was banished from. (However, even if they had done that, if the caster ended the spell early the creature would be returned to the same exact spot they were banished from, whatever had happened in the meantime).
If it was intended that the target be incapacitated, it would say so as it does in the description of the effect for natives. If they intended that they be held in their own plane, or barred from returning, while the spell was in effect, it would say so.
If the target is native to a different plane of existence than the one you're on, the target is banished with a faint popping noise, returning to its home plane. If the spell ends before 1 minute has passed, the target reappears in the space it left or in the nearest unoccupied space if that space is occupied. Otherwise, the target doesn't return.
If we choose to interpret "the target doesn't return" as "the target cannot return" then you are correct. That is not how the rule reads to my eye.
I don't think that's the relevant area of focus. The conditional presented to the caster is in reference to the spell ending. If it were possible for a creature to plane-shift itself back, while the caster is still concentrating on banishment, I would expect that to be explicitly stated as causing the spell to end. Otherwise, it's an ongoing effect--keeping the door blocked.
Conversely, if the target isn't necessarily blocked from plane-shifting back, what happens if they do shift back while the caster is still concentrating? Do they only reappear for a moment before getting sucked back to their home plane again? The spell hasn't ended.
I think you're reading more into the spell that what's on the page. The only mention of keeping the target anywhere is in relation to the demiplane when then target was already in their home plane. Initially, the spell describes how it attempts to "send" (not "keep") the target to another plane. It then goes on to describe what happens when the target is on their home plane (not relevant), and then what happens when the target is not on their home plane. In this case: the target is sent to their home plane, and is returned back if the spell ends before the 1 minute is up. If the spell is concentrated on for its full duration, the target is not automatically returned. What happens if the target makes their way back to where they were before being banished is similar to what happens if enemies somehow find their way through a Wall of Force you cast to keep them out: you can keep concentrating on the spell, but it's not doing anything useful at that point. The intent might have been to prevent the target from coming back... but I doubt it: can the target use Plane Shift to go to a different plane? Could they be plane shifted against their will into the plane they were banished from? Could they plane shift into the Astral Plane, and use a color pool to cross over into the plane they were banished from?
I'm definitely reading into things... we all are... kinda have to when the description is incomplete, but comparing the concentration of Banishment to that of Wall of Force isn't analogous.
When you concentrate on WoF, you're concentrating on the maintenance of an ongoing effect that maintains its purpose & potency all throughout, and the target of the spell itself is a location. If an enemy, or any creature, teleports from one side of the WoF to the other, the effect being concentrated on has not been impacted in any way; creatures were never the target of the spell to begin with. WoF remains entirely intact.
Banishment targets a specific creature, and concentrating on the spell maintains the ongoing effect against that specific creature. If that creature plane-shifts (anywhere) while concentration is ongoing, that directly conflicts with the purpose of the spell itself. There is no purpose to maintaining concentration if this can happen, and the possibility (if actually possible) would constitute an explicit condition for concentration to be broken. Thus, I would expect that to be stated in the spell description itself. A better relative analogy to concentration on Banishment would be concentration on Hold Person.
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
OK, now I want a hold person vs lesser restoration discussion thread.
But I think it is a valid analogy. Banishment vs plane shift works the same way as hold person vs lesser restoration. The latter spell counteracts the effect of the former without actually ending the spell. The difference is that if the banishment caster ends concentration early, the target pops back to the exact spot it was at versus remaining wherever the target is at the end of the spell's duration. Even though the distinction is minor, there is still a distinction. Hold person's only effect is to paralyze the target so once that has been circumvented by lesser restoration, there is no reason whatsoever to continue concentrating on it.
Actually, Hold Person could be a great example of why this is maybe a more open-ended question about what happens when a spell is maintained, and provides that it does "x" for its duration, but a separate source has cleared "x" without ending the spell. Banishment when a different spell tries to return the target back to the plane through a separate means is one example, but so is Hold Person if the target is the beneficiary of an ability that "ends the paralyzed condition" or something without ending the spell... do you have an ongoing active Hold Person that isn't doing anything? Is the target re-Paralyzed at some point on that turn or the end of their turn or your next turn, since they're "paralyzed for the duration"? Is the spell actually ended?
There are probably spells that are worded something like "when you cast this, the target is [condition]ed. They can make a save each round to end it, or it ends with the duration." With a wording like that, it's clear to me that the condition is imposed once and only once, and if ended prematurely, a maintained spell wouldn't re-impose the condition a second time.
But others like Hold Person, they are "[condition]ed for the duration." Is the spell active in its duration? If yes, then target is [conditioned]ed.
And Banishment is even a little different. It doesn't necessarily depend on a condition to do its leg work, instead saying ""the target remains there until the spell ends" or "the target doesn't return [until the spell ends]", period. That seems pretty absolute to me: no matter what condition-clearing abilities they may be subject to to clear their incapacitated, whatever other spells or allies or resources they may have at their disposal on their home plane.... "the target doesn't return" so long as the spell is up?
I dunno... is there granularity here for different spells to treat frustrated purpose/cleared conditions differently case by case, or should we settle on one approach to use for all spells, when their effect is cleared without the spell being ended?
So, how would you treat an Efreeti or a Nightmare that has been banished?
You could rule them immune, that it only delays them 1 round, or the spell could keep them there till the Banishment ends.
Well it depends - are they on their home plane or not. Banishment sends them to their home plane if they're not already there - so they could cast Plane Shift to return prematurely. But if they are already on their home plane then Banishment sends them to a harmless demiplane - where it incapacitates them - so they can't do anything.
It's possible to infer that it incapacitates them even if they go to their home plane - but I'm not sure it's clear enough to say that.
As for being immune - I think the stat block would have to say it's immune to forced planar travel if that were the case.
Mega Yahtzee Thread:
Highest 41: brocker2001 (#11,285).
Yahtzee of 2's: Emmber (#36,161).
Lowest 9: JoeltheWalrus (#312), Emmber (#12,505) and Dertinus (#20,953).
I'd rule that the banishment works, to send said creature back to original plane of existence. Said creature with a plane shift spell ability could choose to return the next round. A lot could depend upon on whether or not the party realizes a creature could do so. Would they use this monster-free round to heal-up, set up other traps, and realize that a monster (probably) only has the ability to plane shift once/day, and attempt to re-banish it again as soon as it appears through a held action? or would they instead be giving themselves slaps on the back and get caught off guard a round or two later once the monster returns?
Boldly go
I would have Banishment hold the creature where it’s sent for the full duration of the spell. It’s a 4th level concentration spell and it only lasts for one minute. That’s not over powered.
Professional computer geek
The OP part is that extraplanar creatures stay in their home plane if the spell is not interrupted and goes the full minute. If they don't have planeshift or and legendary resistances left it's pretty darn powerful. Leads me to the be careful with your back story with you DM too.... Had an Eladrin that was born in the Feywild, had banishment cast and POP he was back there and was one round away from not being able to return when the stupid cleric was finally killed.
There is a reason why almost every single race is humanoid and from the prime material plane.
Banishment is not OP, you picked a strong character with one significant weakness, and then got upset that he had a weakness.
Complaining about it is similar to picking a drow and complaining about having issues in sunlight.
There's no need to make an inference about whether the creature is Incapacitated or not because they just aren't--that only applies to the demiplane.
The thing about a creature banished to their home plane via Banishment, and what their options are, comes down to the spell being a concentration spell. Whether the banished creature is capable of plane-shifting back is irrelevant because the caster is concentrating on keeping them banished. Concentrating on this spell is basically like the caster is pressing all their weight against a one-way door that pushes open from the opposite side.
When concentration ends, the banished creature is capable of returning to the plane it was banished from. If concentration ended prematurely (broken @ <1min), the creature automatically returns. If concentration ended maturely, the creature can return if they have a method available to them.
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
If we assume that:
then the creature goes back to its "home" plane. That much is explicit. Beyond that, the caster can continue concentrating on the spell for up to the next minute. At this point, the spell has been successfully cast, all that happens from here on out is the determination of the spell's duration. The banished creature is not incapacitated during this time (my interpretation of RAW) and if it has the ability to plane shift, it is free to shift back to the plane it was banished from.
This could create an odd situation where the creature comes back while the caster has already banished it and continues to concentrate on the spell that would make it permanent. The slightly more interesting situation would be if the creature plane shifts to come back across the room from the caster, who then drops concentration, pulling the creature back to the exact spot where it was when the spell was first cast. Even funnier if the creature attacks the caster, causing it to lose concentration and blink the creature over a few feet to where the action first went down.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
I don't think this is a possibility. The effect of Banishment is to force the target to be in their home (or demi) plane, rather than simply not being where they were before the spell took effect. Then the effect the caster is concentrating on is forcing the target to remain in their home (or demi) plane. If the target can (during this concentration period) still return, by any conceivable method, it invalidates the concept of concentrating on this spell. What else would there be to actually concentrate on?
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
If we choose to interpret "the target doesn't return" as "the target cannot return" then you are correct. That is not how the rule reads to my eye.
Edit to elaborate: My interpretation is that once the spell has banished the target from its original location, the spell has served its purpose. The only variable at that point is whether the automatic return happens or not. A creature using its own action to plane shift would be an external activity outside the scope of the spell.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
If the target is in their home plane and isn't incapacitated - that is - capable of taking actions - I think them casting a 7th level spell to return could overwrite a 4th level spell keeping them away - couldn't it?
Mega Yahtzee Thread:
Highest 41: brocker2001 (#11,285).
Yahtzee of 2's: Emmber (#36,161).
Lowest 9: JoeltheWalrus (#312), Emmber (#12,505) and Dertinus (#20,953).
I don't think that's the relevant area of focus. The conditional presented to the caster is in reference to the spell ending. If it were possible for a creature to plane-shift itself back, while the caster is still concentrating on banishment, I would expect that to be explicitly stated as causing the spell to end. Otherwise, it's an ongoing effect--keeping the door blocked.
Conversely, if the target isn't necessarily blocked from plane-shifting back, what happens if they do shift back while the caster is still concentrating? Do they only reappear for a moment before getting sucked back to their home plane again? The spell hasn't ended.
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
I think that's a reasonable reading of RAW. I still have my doubts about it, but the fact that the spell has a duration of 1 minute instead of instant speaks to that being a possibility. Nonetheless, it's still not how the wording looks to me. For me, if the spell was meant to include a kind of dimensional anchor, it would have to say so.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
Keep in mind the creature is incapacitated while under the effects of Banishment. So regardless of if they are on their home plane or not, they can't Plane Shift until the Banishment duration runs out.
Edit: incap only applies if they are native it looks like. Regardless, I would say they can't return until the duration is up.
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The incapacitation reads to me as more of a symptom of the "harmless" demiplane's characteristics, not something that the spell would impose on a creature sent to its home plane.
I do think there's analogous, linguistic, and mechanical support for Sigred's position:
Obviously, there's no RAW language saying anything one way or the other. But considering that it definitely RAW works that way for banishing creatures native to the plane (they're Incapacitated and alone in a demiplane, and thus can't act to come back), I think there's a strong RAI argument that its "supposed" to work that way for extra-planar creatures as well, and that RAI dovetails nicely with the mechanical (its a concentration spell) and linguistic (banished strongly implies you don't come back) context for the spell.
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I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
I think you're reading more into the spell that what's on the page. The only mention of keeping the target anywhere is in relation to the demiplane when then target was already in their home plane. Initially, the spell describes how it attempts to "send" (not "keep") the target to another plane. It then goes on to describe what happens when the target is on their home plane (not relevant), and then what happens when the target is not on their home plane. In this case: the target is sent to their home plane, and is returned back if the spell ends before the 1 minute is up. If the spell is concentrated on for its full duration, the target is not automatically returned. What happens if the target makes their way back to where they were before being banished is similar to what happens if enemies somehow find their way through a Wall of Force you cast to keep them out: you can keep concentrating on the spell, but it's not doing anything useful at that point. The intent might have been to prevent the target from coming back... but I doubt it: can the target use Plane Shift to go to a different plane? Could they be plane shifted against their will into the plane they were banished from? Could they plane shift into the Astral Plane, and use a color pool to cross over into the plane they were banished from?
I think, for me, the telling thing is that it specifically says that on the demiplane the target is incapacitated, but not elsewhere. If the spell ends early, it returns to exactly where it was banished from, but other than that there is nothing stopping the creature from doing whatever it wants. It could go have a nap, read a book, eat some ice cream, behead a minion... or cast a spell to bring it back to the plane it was banished from. (However, even if they had done that, if the caster ended the spell early the creature would be returned to the same exact spot they were banished from, whatever had happened in the meantime).
If it was intended that the target be incapacitated, it would say so as it does in the description of the effect for natives. If they intended that they be held in their own plane, or barred from returning, while the spell was in effect, it would say so.
This would be my interpretation, anyway.
I'm definitely reading into things... we all are... kinda have to when the description is incomplete, but comparing the concentration of Banishment to that of Wall of Force isn't analogous.
When you concentrate on WoF, you're concentrating on the maintenance of an ongoing effect that maintains its purpose & potency all throughout, and the target of the spell itself is a location. If an enemy, or any creature, teleports from one side of the WoF to the other, the effect being concentrated on has not been impacted in any way; creatures were never the target of the spell to begin with. WoF remains entirely intact.
Banishment targets a specific creature, and concentrating on the spell maintains the ongoing effect against that specific creature. If that creature plane-shifts (anywhere) while concentration is ongoing, that directly conflicts with the purpose of the spell itself. There is no purpose to maintaining concentration if this can happen, and the possibility (if actually possible) would constitute an explicit condition for concentration to be broken. Thus, I would expect that to be stated in the spell description itself. A better relative analogy to concentration on Banishment would be concentration on Hold Person.
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
OK, now I want a hold person vs lesser restoration discussion thread.
But I think it is a valid analogy. Banishment vs plane shift works the same way as hold person vs lesser restoration. The latter spell counteracts the effect of the former without actually ending the spell. The difference is that if the banishment caster ends concentration early, the target pops back to the exact spot it was at versus remaining wherever the target is at the end of the spell's duration. Even though the distinction is minor, there is still a distinction. Hold person's only effect is to paralyze the target so once that has been circumvented by lesser restoration, there is no reason whatsoever to continue concentrating on it.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
Actually, Hold Person could be a great example of why this is maybe a more open-ended question about what happens when a spell is maintained, and provides that it does "x" for its duration, but a separate source has cleared "x" without ending the spell. Banishment when a different spell tries to return the target back to the plane through a separate means is one example, but so is Hold Person if the target is the beneficiary of an ability that "ends the paralyzed condition" or something without ending the spell... do you have an ongoing active Hold Person that isn't doing anything? Is the target re-Paralyzed at some point on that turn or the end of their turn or your next turn, since they're "paralyzed for the duration"? Is the spell actually ended?
I dunno... is there granularity here for different spells to treat frustrated purpose/cleared conditions differently case by case, or should we settle on one approach to use for all spells, when their effect is cleared without the spell being ended?
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I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.