Weapon masteries are great. They give much needed battlefield impact to martials beyond damage but currently they don't really provide turn-by-turn decision making. That stems from the fact that all weapons have a fixed weapon mastery assigned and since they have no resource or limitation, you will use them every single attack (if possible). A fighter with a topple weapon, might call for up to 6 topple saving throws with Action Surge at level 11, which is also highly disruptive. Fighters having to decide which to use on a long rest feels also thematically very weird and needlessly limiting.
To address the lack of meaningful options, I'd love to see all masteries a weapon is suitable for be available all the time. In UA 7 that would result in the following:
LIGHT: Vex, Nick, Slow
VERSATILE: Sap, Push, Topple, Slow
HEAVY: Graze, Cleave, Push, Topple, Slow
Not all weapons fall neatly into these categories (e.g., Flail, Mace, Greatclub etc.) so I'd actually categorize them into One-Handed and Two-Handed. All Light weapons are currently One-Handed and all Heavy weapons are currently Two-Handed anyway. Versatile weapons depend on if you use them One- or Two-Handed. Nick would still be exclusive to Light weapons and Cleave would still be exclusive to Heavy weapons.
One-Handed: Vex, Sap, Push, Slow
Two-Handed: Graze, Topple, Push, Slow
Light: Nick
Heavy: Cleave
That way you can choose to use Graze to still deal damage on a miss or cleave two enemies or try to topple a creature, which adds choice AND meaningful decision making.
With the added versatility, they should each be limited to be usable once-per-turn by default (some like Cleave, Nick are already once per turn anyway), which would also remove the disruptive topple-spam. Personally, I'd prefer to have weapon masteries only once-per-turn as a whole, so you have to choose even more, but would buff a few to make them more appealable. Class features, such as UA 7 Fighter could either include the choice from the other table, make the effects stronger or allow multiple to be used on the same attack or make the same mastery usable twice instead of once etc.
Overall, this would vastly increase turn-by-turn decision making for martials and gives them options how they want to impact the battlefield which adds also depth. It also has the potential to give unique and magical weapons additional unique option to choose from, which makes them easily balanceable and flavorful.
You've clearly put some thought into this, Zukuu! I love when there's a new perspective on mechanics.
PROS: Dynamic combat decisions, less repetition of same move-sets.
CONS: Loss of weapon identity (a concern?), chance for cookie-cutter-meta-combos appearing.
Either way, I do like the categories and their respective traits. With Push AND Slow available for all, it'll mean a much more mobile and counter-mobility based set of decisions to be made, that's for sure.
Now, kvestshun:
How does the Weapon Mastery feature, uh, feature into this? Do you pick a weapon to master, or do you pick a mastery option to... uhm... weaponise?
You've clearly put some thought into this, Zukuu! I love when there's a new perspective on mechanics.
PROS: Dynamic combat decisions, less repetition of same move-sets.
CONS: Loss of weapon identity (a concern?), chance for cookie-cutter-meta-combos appearing.
Either way, I do like the categories and their respective traits. With Push AND Slow available for all, it'll mean a much more mobile and counter-mobility based set of decisions to be made, that's for sure.
Now, kvestshun:
How does the Weapon Mastery feature, uh, feature into this? Do you pick a weapon to master, or do you pick a mastery option to... uhm... weaponise?
I don't think the weapon-identity for base weapons is attached to weapon masteries. In current 5e we don't have these and the weapons still have some different flavors. They are still different damage types, damage-dice, reach, heavy, light, versatile, thrown, ranged, loading-properites and are martial or simple etc.
Once you have the baseline that you allow multiple masteries, you could also introduce unique masteries for each weapon on top of the category they fall into to add actual decision making when it comes to weapon choice as well. Since they are only one additional option and once per-turn, they can easily be balanced and flavorful side-grades. E.g. a whip could qualify for topple despite being 1h. Flails could have a -2 AC debuff for a round. A Lance could have an additional 5f attack range once or something etc.
Class features and unique weapons could also give new mastery options. The possibilities are endless.
While I think it would be nice if there were more options when attacking, I don't think Weapon Masteries are particularly the way it should be implemented, I'd rather see more class specific choices than weapon specific choices. Weapon Masteries are just meant to be a quick and easy property of a weapon that gives certain weapons more uniqueness from others than just damage type or damage die, in ways that help fix a few class issues, like Rogues only having 1 attack (when sneak attack already has other limitations on top).
Nice idea, though I'd link masteries with properties and damage type.
Light: Nick
One-handed: Sap
Heavy: Graze
Versatile: gets to choose between Sap and Graze depending on how it is handled
Slashing: Cleave, Slow
Piercing: Vex, Disable (enemy cannot make an AoO, rogues and PAM would love this)
Bludgeoning: Push, Topple
You get to use one of the three once on each turn. Martials get to use masteries twice, fighters - on all their attacks, and also get to choose a mastery to use regardless of weapon type. Like Nick with one-handed non-light weapons.
Nice idea, though I'd link masteries with properties and damage type.
Light: Nick
One-handed: Sap
Heavy: Graze
Versatile: gets to choose between Sap and Graze depending on how it is handled
Slashing: Cleave, Slow
Piercing: Vex, Disable (enemy cannot make an AoO, rogues and PAM would love this)
Bludgeoning: Push, Topple
You get to use one of the three once on each turn. Martials get to use masteries twice, fighters - on all their attacks, and also get to choose a mastery to use regardless of weapon type. Like Nick with one-handed non-light weapons.
That was another idea I played around with, but ultimately it leaves less choice so I went with 1h/2h solution. If you mix both like you have done, you get more choice again, but make the system more complex and I'm not sure that is needed. It also runs into the issue of what happens if you change the damage type of your weapon via magic, since you suddenly don't deal bludgeon damage anymore. Personally, I also like this idea tho, but it might be too many tables to look up for very little actual gain.
That was another idea I played around with, but ultimately it leaves less choice so I went with 1h/2h solution. If you mix both like you have done, you get more choice again, but make the system more complex and I'm not sure that is needed. It also runs into the issue of what happens if you change the damage type of your weapon via magic, since you suddenly don't deal bludgeon damage anymore. Personally, I also like this idea tho, but it might be too many tables to look up for very little actual gain.
I don't find it too hard to remember, just two properties per damage type (okay, base damage type) and one per size category. And most of them are intuitively obvious, like light weapons having Nick and bludgeoning damage having Push and Topple.
I think this is a feature, not a bug. Martials - especially fighter, the poster child for mastery - are supposed to be more straightforward with less decision making. The idea is that if you want to have an array of tricks at your fingers, you will play a spellcaster.
I'm not saying I agree with this approach - my favorite builds are complex martial characters. But I think WotC is pretty firmly entrenched in the idea that martials are for those who just want to run in and start swinging instead of making lots of thoughtful, tactical decisions. If martials have any hope for complexity, it will come in subclass options so that people can opt out if they want.
I think this is a feature, not a bug. Martials - especially fighter, the poster child for mastery - are supposed to be more straightforward with less decision making. The idea is that if you want to have an array of tricks at your fingers, you will play a spellcaster.
*inhales* Okay listen up you-
I'm not saying I agree with this approach - my favorite builds are complex martial characters. But I think WotC is pretty firmly entrenched in the idea that martials are for those who just want to run in and start swinging instead of making lots of thoughtful, tactical decisions. If martials have any hope for complexity, it will come in subclass options so that people can opt out if they want.
*exhales* Oh. Sorry. Carry on.
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Weapon masteries are great. They give much needed battlefield impact to martials beyond damage but currently they don't really provide turn-by-turn decision making. That stems from the fact that all weapons have a fixed weapon mastery assigned and since they have no resource or limitation, you will use them every single attack (if possible). A fighter with a topple weapon, might call for up to 6 topple saving throws with Action Surge at level 11, which is also highly disruptive. Fighters having to decide which to use on a long rest feels also thematically very weird and needlessly limiting.
To address the lack of meaningful options, I'd love to see all masteries a weapon is suitable for be available all the time. In UA 7 that would result in the following:
Not all weapons fall neatly into these categories (e.g., Flail, Mace, Greatclub etc.) so I'd actually categorize them into One-Handed and Two-Handed. All Light weapons are currently One-Handed and all Heavy weapons are currently Two-Handed anyway. Versatile weapons depend on if you use them One- or Two-Handed. Nick would still be exclusive to Light weapons and Cleave would still be exclusive to Heavy weapons.
That way you can choose to use Graze to still deal damage on a miss or cleave two enemies or try to topple a creature, which adds choice AND meaningful decision making.
With the added versatility, they should each be limited to be usable once-per-turn by default (some like Cleave, Nick are already once per turn anyway), which would also remove the disruptive topple-spam. Personally, I'd prefer to have weapon masteries only once-per-turn as a whole, so you have to choose even more, but would buff a few to make them more appealable. Class features, such as UA 7 Fighter could either include the choice from the other table, make the effects stronger or allow multiple to be used on the same attack or make the same mastery usable twice instead of once etc.
Overall, this would vastly increase turn-by-turn decision making for martials and gives them options how they want to impact the battlefield which adds also depth. It also has the potential to give unique and magical weapons additional unique option to choose from, which makes them easily balanceable and flavorful.
You've clearly put some thought into this, Zukuu! I love when there's a new perspective on mechanics.
PROS: Dynamic combat decisions, less repetition of same move-sets.
CONS: Loss of weapon identity (a concern?), chance for cookie-cutter-meta-combos appearing.
Either way, I do like the categories and their respective traits. With Push AND Slow available for all, it'll mean a much more mobile and counter-mobility based set of decisions to be made, that's for sure.
Now, kvestshun:
How does the Weapon Mastery feature, uh, feature into this? Do you pick a weapon to master, or do you pick a mastery option to... uhm... weaponise?
I don't think the weapon-identity for base weapons is attached to weapon masteries. In current 5e we don't have these and the weapons still have some different flavors. They are still different damage types, damage-dice, reach, heavy, light, versatile, thrown, ranged, loading-properites and are martial or simple etc.
Once you have the baseline that you allow multiple masteries, you could also introduce unique masteries for each weapon on top of the category they fall into to add actual decision making when it comes to weapon choice as well. Since they are only one additional option and once per-turn, they can easily be balanced and flavorful side-grades. E.g. a whip could qualify for topple despite being 1h. Flails could have a -2 AC debuff for a round. A Lance could have an additional 5f attack range once or something etc.
Class features and unique weapons could also give new mastery options. The possibilities are endless.
While I think it would be nice if there were more options when attacking, I don't think Weapon Masteries are particularly the way it should be implemented, I'd rather see more class specific choices than weapon specific choices. Weapon Masteries are just meant to be a quick and easy property of a weapon that gives certain weapons more uniqueness from others than just damage type or damage die, in ways that help fix a few class issues, like Rogues only having 1 attack (when sneak attack already has other limitations on top).
Nice idea, though I'd link masteries with properties and damage type.
You get to use one of the three once on each turn. Martials get to use masteries twice, fighters - on all their attacks, and also get to choose a mastery to use regardless of weapon type. Like Nick with one-handed non-light weapons.
That was another idea I played around with, but ultimately it leaves less choice so I went with 1h/2h solution. If you mix both like you have done, you get more choice again, but make the system more complex and I'm not sure that is needed. It also runs into the issue of what happens if you change the damage type of your weapon via magic, since you suddenly don't deal bludgeon damage anymore. Personally, I also like this idea tho, but it might be too many tables to look up for very little actual gain.
I don't find it too hard to remember, just two properties per damage type (okay, base damage type) and one per size category. And most of them are intuitively obvious, like light weapons having Nick and bludgeoning damage having Push and Topple.
This feel more real overall than me being proficient and a master of my weapon only doing one trick pony once a turn each long rest.
I think this is a feature, not a bug. Martials - especially fighter, the poster child for mastery - are supposed to be more straightforward with less decision making. The idea is that if you want to have an array of tricks at your fingers, you will play a spellcaster.
I'm not saying I agree with this approach - my favorite builds are complex martial characters. But I think WotC is pretty firmly entrenched in the idea that martials are for those who just want to run in and start swinging instead of making lots of thoughtful, tactical decisions. If martials have any hope for complexity, it will come in subclass options so that people can opt out if they want.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm
*inhales* Okay listen up you-
*exhales* Oh. Sorry. Carry on.