So I'm playing a tiefling fiend-pact warlock in a campaign with a great DM who focuses a lot on his narratives and plot twists, but he's left me completely in the dark with the identity of my patron, which I'm struggling to think of strategies to uncover.
Some Background Information My character was initially a warlock bound to an unkown devil of fire and blood, who granted him an imp familiar. However, when my character recently died, the DM roleplayed me waking in a space of darkness and fire, a great red arm reaching out to take my soul, but my imp saved me. It turns out that my imp made a deal behind my back with another archdevil to free me from my pact, but in doing so unwittingly bound me to this new archdevil instead.
Current Situation When I woke my red skin had gone completely ice blue, with an icy mist wafting from my horns, and my imp familiar had disappeared. The next in-game day I was confronted by a towering ice devil who declared that he was my 'handler" to enforce my obedience to my new master. He also revealed that they have my imp captive, and will relentlessly torture it unless I slay one innocent soul per day. It wouldn't reveal the name of my new master. Shortly after this towering, terrifying creature left, my character regrettably made his first sacrifice.
The Problem So, obviously I am bound to this new master for the time being, leaving me with two options. I can obediently follow orders, or I can scheme my rebellion back, the latter of which is of course complicated and problematic.
I am certain my handler is probably keeping a close eye on my every move, which means I can't openly scheme or find ways to fight back without incurring their wrath upon me and my familiar. That being said, if I'm to fight back I need to find out the identity of my master, who is likely from Stygia or Cania. I'm thinking it's probably Levistus, seeing as though one of his specialities is helping mortals escape fates and other devil pacts for a price. That being said, I'm not certain yet, and can't think of any ways of finding out.
My plan is that if I can find out who, or at least where, my patron is I may be able to strike up a new pact with a rival archdevil (eg. Glasya or Geryon if it is indeed Levistus). But how can I plot behind their back and how can I find out who they are, all without being discovered? I probably can't even voice the problem to the other party members if I'm being scryed upon or something, but I'm thinking that maybe I can find a magic item to block scrying? But that may too be too obviously defiant...
Is there anything else you know? Do you just have to kill someone 'innocent', or is there a ritual or a specific weapon that must be used? Is there any discernible purpose to this? I mean, the soul of an innocent doesn't end up in Hell in most settings. Is there anything your unknown patron might get out of this other than corrupting you? I assume there are no clues (yet) you can study, like unholy symbols, recognizeable weapons on the handler, anything obvious like that?
You might try to contrive a situation where being scryed upon is unlikely and simply take a chance and tell the others in your party. A temple or a wizard's quarters probably have wards against such intrusions from fiends, and if pressed by the handler you can claim there was another reason to need to be there - the party needed healing or an item researched or whatever.
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Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
So I'm playing a tiefling fiend-pact warlock in a campaign with a great DM who focuses a lot on his narratives and plot twists, but he's left me completely in the dark with the identity of my patron, which I'm struggling to think of strategies to uncover.
Maybe I'm assuming too much, but take the two bolded statements together and it's pretty likely that you're not going to find out until the plot dictates it.
Typically your Patron, just like the other aspects of your character, is absolutely and solely your choice, and this is kind of crossing the line between PC and NPC. Holding the imp hostage so that you do what the NPC (or rather the DM) wants you to do instead of what you want to do is another questionable tactic that really forces your hand in terms of the choices your character makes. But it's ok if you're on board with it and hopefully there is a nice story payoff to it that eventually allows you to make your own choices.
Holding the imp hostage so that you do what the NPC (or rather the DM) wants you to do instead of what you want to do is another questionable tactic that really forces your hand in terms of the choices your character makes. But it's ok if you're on board with it and hopefully there is a nice story payoff to it that eventually allows you to make your own choices.
I'm absolutely on board with it! I trust my DM, and honestly the patron hasn't demanded anything yet that compromises the goals of my character or my party other than the sacrifice of a soul daily.
He really listens to any feedback or character ideas given, though he hasn't done anything that needs criticising throughout the entire campaign so far. I enjoy the personal touches that come from having a patron, or it's emesarries at least, having that participation in the story from a roleplay perspective, and keeping things in the dark really keeps me guessing.
I guess I'm just so damn curious and expect to approach this as a problem or puzzle to be solved. I look forward to seeing where my patron takes me, but I also want vengeance and rebellion against it so much that I can't not try and work out a discreet rebellion.
Is there anything else you know? Do you just have to kill someone 'innocent', or is there a ritual or a specific weapon that must be used? Is there any discernible purpose to this? I mean, the soul of an innocent doesn't end up in Hell in most settings. Is there anything your unknown patron might get out of this other than corrupting you? I assume there are no clues (yet) you can study, like unholy symbols, recognizeable weapons on the handler, anything obvious like that?
You might try to contrive a situation where being scryed upon is unlikely and simply take a chance and tell the others in your party. A temple or a wizard's quarters probably have wards against such intrusions from fiends, and if pressed by the handler you can claim there was another reason to need to be there - the party needed healing or an item researched or whatever.
So I just got home from another session, so I know now that it's not an innocent soul I need to kill, just killing any creature with a soul will do. When I slew an enemy tonight (a hag) he DM described the soul and life essence being consumed into my shortsword, after my patron spoke into my mind, egging me on to consume the soul of this enemy. Also, all of my attacks now are very ice themed, with my previous spell choices of green-flame blade and fire spells now leaving jagged shards of ice and frost after my slashes. After being pierced by the hags claws and reduced to low hp, the DM described daggers of ice exploding from the wounds to jab the hag and freezing her claws to me, so that's pretty awesome. It really hammers home that my master originates from an infernal layer of ice.
I don't know what my patron can really get out of a pact with me other than receiving consumed souls daily and perhaps a powerful servant after my eventual death. There hasn't been any symbols or signs on my handler that my DM described, only that it was an ice devil that wielded a spear tipped with blood.
Would be a good idea to try communicating to my allies within a temple! They're certainly easy enough to find, and easy enough to justify being within.
So I'm playing a tiefling fiend-pact warlock in a campaign with a great DM who focuses a lot on his narratives and plot twists, but he's left me completely in the dark with the identity of my patron, which I'm struggling to think of strategies to uncover.
Some Background Information My character was initially a warlock bound to an unkown devil of fire and blood, who granted him an imp familiar. However, when my character recently died, the DM roleplayed me waking in a space of darkness and fire, a great red arm reaching out to take my soul, but my imp saved me. It turns out that my imp made a deal behind my back with another archdevil to free me from my pact, but in doing so unwittingly bound me to this new archdevil instead.
Current Situation When I woke my red skin had gone completely ice blue, with an icy mist wafting from my horns, and my imp familiar had disappeared. The next in-game day I was confronted by a towering ice devil who declared that he was my 'handler" to enforce my obedience to my new master. He also revealed that they have my imp captive, and will relentlessly torture it unless I slay one innocent soul per day. It wouldn't reveal the name of my new master. Shortly after this towering, terrifying creature left, my character regrettably made his first sacrifice.
The Problem So, obviously I am bound to this new master for the time being, leaving me with two options. I can obediently follow orders, or I can scheme my rebellion back, the latter of which is of course complicated and problematic.
I am certain my handler is probably keeping a close eye on my every move, which means I can't openly scheme or find ways to fight back without incurring their wrath upon me and my familiar. That being said, if I'm to fight back I need to find out the identity of my master, who is likely from Stygia or Cania. I'm thinking it's probably Levistus, seeing as though one of his specialities is helping mortals escape fates and other devil pacts for a price. That being said, I'm not certain yet, and can't think of any ways of finding out.
My plan is that if I can find out who, or at least where, my patron is I may be able to strike up a new pact with a rival archdevil (eg. Glasya or Geryon if it is indeed Levistus). But how can I plot behind their back and how can I find out who they are, all without being discovered? I probably can't even voice the problem to the other party members if I'm being scryed upon or something, but I'm thinking that maybe I can find a magic item to block scrying? But that may too be too obviously defiant...
Any suggestions?
The new archdevil is probably bluffing with the weakest bluff I've ever heard. Do this:
Attempt to dismiss your familiar (this is range infinity and works across planar boundaries) and then undismiss it. This should cause the imp to appear within 30 feet of you. If it does, great. If it doesn't, move on to step 2.
Dismiss your familiar forever and cast find familiar to get a new one. Forget about the old imp and walk away from any devil with the temerity to try to exploit you like this. If you like, you can seek revenge and/or still try to rescue your original imp, but don't let the handler think you genuinely give a shit - even if they have emotional leverage over you, you don't want them to know that. If a miracle happens and the find familiar spell somehow fizzles, go to step 3.
Buy a spellwrought tattoo of find familiar, so it's not even your own familiar spell you're using, and cast that. If the new archdevil can block that, you've been cursed beyond belief (see below for more), but still make your handler think you don't give a shit about the imp. Cannot emphasize this enough. Either don't sacrifice an innocent soul at all per day, or do it with innocent souls you know the devil didn't intend, like ants. Either way, accuse the handler of being a liar, incompetent, or both if he tries to show up and give you shit about this. He needs to learn his place, which is servant.
The people generally most interested in kicking archdevil ass are clerics, paladins, and fellow warlocks whose patrons hate the archdevil in question. Double plus do this if you're so cursed find familiar magic items don't work for you any more, but seek out local organizations of those three classes (like organized religions, etc) and ask them for aid in dealing with your problem, then go from there. They should be extremely sympathetic to finding out you've been pacted without your consent. As a general rule, do not explain about the captive - and if you do, do not mention the captive is an imp. You should be able to avoid needing to make Deception checks by just not bringing the topic up to begin with.
NPCs aren't the only ones who can help you. Feel free to ask your fellow PCs for help - any of them may have insights into this problem you don't expect.
So I'm playing a tiefling fiend-pact warlock in a campaign with a great DM who focuses a lot on his narratives and plot twists, but he's left me completely in the dark with the identity of my patron, which I'm struggling to think of strategies to uncover.
Some Background Information My character was initially a warlock bound to an unkown devil of fire and blood, who granted him an imp familiar. However, when my character recently died, the DM roleplayed me waking in a space of darkness and fire, a great red arm reaching out to take my soul, but my imp saved me. It turns out that my imp made a deal behind my back with another archdevil to free me from my pact, but in doing so unwittingly bound me to this new archdevil instead.
Current Situation When I woke my red skin had gone completely ice blue, with an icy mist wafting from my horns, and my imp familiar had disappeared. The next in-game day I was confronted by a towering ice devil who declared that he was my 'handler" to enforce my obedience to my new master. He also revealed that they have my imp captive, and will relentlessly torture it unless I slay one innocent soul per day. It wouldn't reveal the name of my new master. Shortly after this towering, terrifying creature left, my character regrettably made his first sacrifice.
The Problem So, obviously I am bound to this new master for the time being, leaving me with two options. I can obediently follow orders, or I can scheme my rebellion back, the latter of which is of course complicated and problematic.
I am certain my handler is probably keeping a close eye on my every move, which means I can't openly scheme or find ways to fight back without incurring their wrath upon me and my familiar. That being said, if I'm to fight back I need to find out the identity of my master, who is likely from Stygia or Cania. I'm thinking it's probably Levistus, seeing as though one of his specialities is helping mortals escape fates and other devil pacts for a price. That being said, I'm not certain yet, and can't think of any ways of finding out.
My plan is that if I can find out who, or at least where, my patron is I may be able to strike up a new pact with a rival archdevil (eg. Glasya or Geryon if it is indeed Levistus). But how can I plot behind their back and how can I find out who they are, all without being discovered? I probably can't even voice the problem to the other party members if I'm being scryed upon or something, but I'm thinking that maybe I can find a magic item to block scrying? But that may too be too obviously defiant...
Any suggestions?
The new archdevil is probably bluffing with the weakest bluff I've ever heard. Do this:
Attempt to dismiss your familiar (this is range infinity and works across planar boundaries) and then undismiss it. This should cause the imp to appear within 30 feet of you. If it does, great. If it doesn't, move on to step 2.
Dismiss your familiar forever and cast find familiar to get a new one. Forget about the old imp and walk away from any devil with the temerity to try to exploit you like this. If you like, you can seek revenge and/or still try to rescue your original imp, but don't let the handler think you genuinely give a shit - even if they have emotional leverage over you, you don't want them to know that. If a miracle happens and the find familiar spell somehow fizzles, go to step 3.
Buy a spellwrought tattoo of find familiar, so it's not even your own familiar spell you're using, and cast that. If the new archdevil can block that, you've been cursed beyond belief (see below for more), but still make your handler think you don't give a shit about the imp. Cannot emphasize this enough. Either don't sacrifice an innocent soul at all per day, or do it with innocent souls you know the devil didn't intend, like ants. Either way, accuse the handler of being a liar, incompetent, or both if he tries to show up and give you shit about this. He needs to learn his place, which is servant.
The people generally most interested in kicking archdevil ass are clerics, paladins, and fellow warlocks whose patrons hate the archdevil in question. Double plus do this if you're so cursed find familiar magic items don't work for you any more, but seek out local organizations of those three classes (like organized religions, etc) and ask them for aid in dealing with your problem, then go from there. They should be extremely sympathetic to finding out you've been pacted without your consent. As a general rule, do not explain about the captive - and if you do, do not mention the captive is an imp. You should be able to avoid needing to make Deception checks by just not bringing the topic up to begin with.
NPCs aren't the only ones who can help you. Feel free to ask your fellow PCs for help - any of them may have insights into this problem you don't expect.
So, according to my DM, my imp made a deal behind my back, apparently signing over his own immortal devil soul to this new archdevil in return for a way of breaking my pact with my old patron. What my imp didn't realize is that he also signed me over to serve this new archdevil instead. Damn imp didn't read the fine print properly I guess!
This I believe him being captive is pretty genuine if the new devil holds all the strings to the imps soul, and he has asked me to change my subclass (or multiclass) to something else to make up for the fact I can no longer use Pact of the Chain, which I'm totally fine with, but kinda seems to confirm I'm not getting my imp back any time soon. My character cares too much from the imp to walk away from the imp entirely too, since the imp has been a protective, if unbearably mischievous, guardian for multiple years.
Thay being said, the ant idea is genius 😆
Finding holy clergymen or warlocks is a great idea too, to support my little shadow war. Clerics/paladins are probably easiest since they're kindly and they're in temples which, as mentioned in a previous post, could potentially block scrying which is great.
I have, however, heard rumours about a hideout for tieflings in the last city my party was in, so finding a warlock among them would be pretty simple too! And no doubt there may be some well-read infernal experts among them too which may be able to help me identify my patron, one way or another, so I'll definitely have to keep that in mind. Thanks!
I have been concerned about bringing up to topic to the other PC's not only because they might react poorly to the knowledge I've begun sacrificing or damning the souls of others, but because that might anger my patron if it is indeed spying on me to make sure I don't rebel. But again, if there are wards against scrying in some temples, it's certainly possible and it's a great idea to do so, having gone through so much with my character already they'll be great allies in my resistance.
Thanks for your advice! I'll definitely look into warlocks and clerics sometime soon
Hey I know maybe you can hatch plan that includes having my warlock help you. My warlock outright abandoned his original being and then hatched a plan to hire about 20 clerics to stop it. My new pact holder is neutral. Let’s say he has only told me to attack a cleric and I have never seen him. Somerton I would suggest hiring blood hunters clerics and sorcerers
Hey I know maybe you can hatch plan that includes having my warlock help you. My warlock outright abandoned his original being and then hatched a plan to hire about 20 clerics to stop it. My new pact holder is neutral. Let’s say he has only told me to attack a cleric and I have never seen him. Somerton I would suggest hiring blood hunters clerics and sorcerers
Haha, I dunno if my DM would allow me to contact another potential warlock patron entry from another person's campaign, but who knows?
By the way, along the ant theme: don't forget that until the minion defines soul and innocence and gives you a way to detect both, the definitions of both are, presumably, up to you. Does art have a soul? Shrubs? Is *anyone* innocent? Useful questions to pick your own answers to.
By the way, along the ant theme: don't forget that until the minion defines soul and innocence and gives you a way to detect both, the definitions of both are, presumably, up to you. Does art have a soul? Shrubs? Is *anyone* innocent? Useful questions to pick your own answers to.
Haha, would be good to mess with my handler a little bit like that!
Found out it's actually only the sacrifice of any soul, not just an innocent soul now, so that makes things a little easier, thank goodness
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So I'm playing a tiefling fiend-pact warlock in a campaign with a great DM who focuses a lot on his narratives and plot twists, but he's left me completely in the dark with the identity of my patron, which I'm struggling to think of strategies to uncover.
Some Background Information
My character was initially a warlock bound to an unkown devil of fire and blood, who granted him an imp familiar. However, when my character recently died, the DM roleplayed me waking in a space of darkness and fire, a great red arm reaching out to take my soul, but my imp saved me. It turns out that my imp made a deal behind my back with another archdevil to free me from my pact, but in doing so unwittingly bound me to this new archdevil instead.
Current Situation
When I woke my red skin had gone completely ice blue, with an icy mist wafting from my horns, and my imp familiar had disappeared. The next in-game day I was confronted by a towering ice devil who declared that he was my 'handler" to enforce my obedience to my new master. He also revealed that they have my imp captive, and will relentlessly torture it unless I slay one innocent soul per day. It wouldn't reveal the name of my new master. Shortly after this towering, terrifying creature left, my character regrettably made his first sacrifice.
The Problem
So, obviously I am bound to this new master for the time being, leaving me with two options. I can obediently follow orders, or I can scheme my rebellion back, the latter of which is of course complicated and problematic.
I am certain my handler is probably keeping a close eye on my every move, which means I can't openly scheme or find ways to fight back without incurring their wrath upon me and my familiar. That being said, if I'm to fight back I need to find out the identity of my master, who is likely from Stygia or Cania.
I'm thinking it's probably Levistus, seeing as though one of his specialities is helping mortals escape fates and other devil pacts for a price. That being said, I'm not certain yet, and can't think of any ways of finding out.
My plan is that if I can find out who, or at least where, my patron is I may be able to strike up a new pact with a rival archdevil (eg. Glasya or Geryon if it is indeed Levistus). But how can I plot behind their back and how can I find out who they are, all without being discovered? I probably can't even voice the problem to the other party members if I'm being scryed upon or something, but I'm thinking that maybe I can find a magic item to block scrying? But that may too be too obviously defiant...
Any suggestions?
Is there anything else you know? Do you just have to kill someone 'innocent', or is there a ritual or a specific weapon that must be used? Is there any discernible purpose to this? I mean, the soul of an innocent doesn't end up in Hell in most settings. Is there anything your unknown patron might get out of this other than corrupting you? I assume there are no clues (yet) you can study, like unholy symbols, recognizeable weapons on the handler, anything obvious like that?
You might try to contrive a situation where being scryed upon is unlikely and simply take a chance and tell the others in your party. A temple or a wizard's quarters probably have wards against such intrusions from fiends, and if pressed by the handler you can claim there was another reason to need to be there - the party needed healing or an item researched or whatever.
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
Maybe I'm assuming too much, but take the two bolded statements together and it's pretty likely that you're not going to find out until the plot dictates it.
Typically your Patron, just like the other aspects of your character, is absolutely and solely your choice, and this is kind of crossing the line between PC and NPC. Holding the imp hostage so that you do what the NPC (or rather the DM) wants you to do instead of what you want to do is another questionable tactic that really forces your hand in terms of the choices your character makes. But it's ok if you're on board with it and hopefully there is a nice story payoff to it that eventually allows you to make your own choices.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm
I'm absolutely on board with it! I trust my DM, and honestly the patron hasn't demanded anything yet that compromises the goals of my character or my party other than the sacrifice of a soul daily.
He really listens to any feedback or character ideas given, though he hasn't done anything that needs criticising throughout the entire campaign so far. I enjoy the personal touches that come from having a patron, or it's emesarries at least, having that participation in the story from a roleplay perspective, and keeping things in the dark really keeps me guessing.
I guess I'm just so damn curious and expect to approach this as a problem or puzzle to be solved. I look forward to seeing where my patron takes me, but I also want vengeance and rebellion against it so much that I can't not try and work out a discreet rebellion.
So I just got home from another session, so I know now that it's not an innocent soul I need to kill, just killing any creature with a soul will do. When I slew an enemy tonight (a hag) he DM described the soul and life essence being consumed into my shortsword, after my patron spoke into my mind, egging me on to consume the soul of this enemy. Also, all of my attacks now are very ice themed, with my previous spell choices of green-flame blade and fire spells now leaving jagged shards of ice and frost after my slashes. After being pierced by the hags claws and reduced to low hp, the DM described daggers of ice exploding from the wounds to jab the hag and freezing her claws to me, so that's pretty awesome. It really hammers home that my master originates from an infernal layer of ice.
I don't know what my patron can really get out of a pact with me other than receiving consumed souls daily and perhaps a powerful servant after my eventual death. There hasn't been any symbols or signs on my handler that my DM described, only that it was an ice devil that wielded a spear tipped with blood.
Would be a good idea to try communicating to my allies within a temple! They're certainly easy enough to find, and easy enough to justify being within.
So, according to my DM, my imp made a deal behind my back, apparently signing over his own immortal devil soul to this new archdevil in return for a way of breaking my pact with my old patron. What my imp didn't realize is that he also signed me over to serve this new archdevil instead. Damn imp didn't read the fine print properly I guess!
This I believe him being captive is pretty genuine if the new devil holds all the strings to the imps soul, and he has asked me to change my subclass (or multiclass) to something else to make up for the fact I can no longer use Pact of the Chain, which I'm totally fine with, but kinda seems to confirm I'm not getting my imp back any time soon. My character cares too much from the imp to walk away from the imp entirely too, since the imp has been a protective, if unbearably mischievous, guardian for multiple years.
Thay being said, the ant idea is genius 😆
Finding holy clergymen or warlocks is a great idea too, to support my little shadow war. Clerics/paladins are probably easiest since they're kindly and they're in temples which, as mentioned in a previous post, could potentially block scrying which is great.
I have, however, heard rumours about a hideout for tieflings in the last city my party was in, so finding a warlock among them would be pretty simple too! And no doubt there may be some well-read infernal experts among them too which may be able to help me identify my patron, one way or another, so I'll definitely have to keep that in mind. Thanks!
I have been concerned about bringing up to topic to the other PC's not only because they might react poorly to the knowledge I've begun sacrificing or damning the souls of others, but because that might anger my patron if it is indeed spying on me to make sure I don't rebel. But again, if there are wards against scrying in some temples, it's certainly possible and it's a great idea to do so, having gone through so much with my character already they'll be great allies in my resistance.
Thanks for your advice! I'll definitely look into warlocks and clerics sometime soon
Hey I know maybe you can hatch plan that includes having my warlock help you. My warlock outright abandoned his original being and then hatched a plan to hire about 20 clerics to stop it. My new pact holder is neutral. Let’s say he has only told me to attack a cleric and I have never seen him. Somerton I would suggest hiring blood hunters clerics and sorcerers
Haha, I dunno if my DM would allow me to contact another potential warlock patron entry from another person's campaign, but who knows?
Sorry what I meant to say is you could be inspired by mine.
Oh, I see! My apologies :)
By the way, along the ant theme: don't forget that until the minion defines soul and innocence and gives you a way to detect both, the definitions of both are, presumably, up to you. Does art have a soul? Shrubs? Is *anyone* innocent? Useful questions to pick your own answers to.
Haha, would be good to mess with my handler a little bit like that!
Found out it's actually only the sacrifice of any soul, not just an innocent soul now, so that makes things a little easier, thank goodness