Okay, so in previous editions there were levels higher than level 20, right? I know they were more of variant rules, but they did exist (correct me if I'm wrong). So, the point of the thread is to discuss if they should exist, and if so, how should they be implemented? What abilities should they get at higher levels? What are the benefits to having them, and the disadvantages? How many levels should exist beyond 30?

I already know some of the issues with this. It makes Spellcasting have to be expanded for later levels, challenge ratings beyond 30, and the fact that it kind of will screw over people who multiclass. Additionally, not many people play at these higher levels, but I do think if there were solidified rules for fighting gods and other uber-powerful creatures that more people would play higher levels. 

So, what are your thoughts. Answer the poll please, and explain below your reasoning for or against this possible ruleset. I ask because I am currently creating a system for this, and would like ideas for abilities, but also to test the water. I am aware that multiple different homebrew versions of these do exist, but I would like my own version for my own campaigns, as I typically don't allow other people's homebrew in my games. 

I think they should exist. There are several NPCs in the Forgotten Realms that managed to ascend and become gods, and I think that could be an interesting story. It also opens more options for storytelling as you can now get to explore the more exotic sides of the multiverse. Help the Gith get rid of the Illithids. Help Bel to overthrow Zariel. Fight Tiamat (and win?). Find a way to break Strahd's Curse for good and free the souls trapped in Barovia. All of this can be done below level 20, of course. But most of these tasks should imho require more power than a mortal can wield.

More importantly, when I've played with a group of characters for several years I become attached to them and would not want to roll a new character just because I hit the level cap. Especially since most published adventures will take you to at least level 10, so you'd hit level 20 after two or three such adventures.

Mechanically I wouldn't add real levels. I'd instead try something like Pathfinder's mythic feats: normal feats you already have become a lot stronger but stay in line with their theme.

E.g. "Mythic Sentinel": Like Sentinel, but you get to make an additional number of AOOs equal to your dexterity modifier. Instead of making an AOO, you can impose disadvantage on an enemy's next attack against an ally within 5 ft of you."

"Mythic Action Surge: you can use Action Surge twice as often and it grants two additional actions instead of one"

"Mythic Lay on Hands": Lay on Hands now affects all creatures within 30 ft of you. You can expend x HP from your pool to make it work like Greater Restoration."

I hit uncertain because while I totally bought the epic level  books in 2e and 3e, i don't know if it's necessary in 5e. Yes levels end at 20, but the DMG has rules for essentially infinite progressions with Epic Boons. and every time you gain 30k more XP you get a new boon. I'd probably do some variant of the Theros  gifts or piety  to work in there as well.

We're currently at level 14 and will probably hit 20 by the end of the year.  I'm considering letting them dual class after level 20 and see what happens.  Unfortunately, I don't think that is supported on dndbeyond.

I don't see why making them an an option would hurt anyone. The biggest obstacle to their creation is the lack of content that goes up to 20, let alone above it. 

Epic levels should exist, but any book that is published for it would really need to expand upon more than just character options. 5e is fairly limited in high level content for the levels already supported. 

Most games end before 15, so it would be serving a market that is a very small minority of their players.

I would rather see official adventures that cover the 15-20 range first (there is currently 1).

I am all for epic levels but we need content spanning the lvl 12ish to 20 range first.  I think epic levels is a great way to bring prestige classes back.  So once you hit lvl 20 you choose a new prestige class that you qualify for.  Expanded ability score caps and epic feats or epic versions of existing feats.  

Quote from Houligan >>

I would rather see official adventures that cover the 15-20 range first (there is currently 1).

(And it doesn't really count as an "adventure," too)

Here's an example. I'm making the Warlock class up to level 30, and their capstone ability is named "The Master Becoming" and it does a few things:

1. They become immortal, don't age, and can't be aged by magic.
2. Their creature type changes, depending on their patron. If they have an Archfiend patron, they become a fiend. If their patron is a Celestial, they become a celestial.
3. They can have warlocks of their own. The type of warlock is of the patron type you have, and one additional type of your choice when you get this ability. For example, say you're a Hexblade Warlock. You can be a Hexblade patron for your warlocks, but when you get this ability you can also choose to be an Archfiend patron as well. Your warlock can be an Archfiend or Hexblade warlock. 

Any thoughts? This is kind of why I personally want levels beyond 20. Players at this level can become very powerful, akin to Demigods. 

There have been a few homebrew epic level stuff I have seen out there, but a lot of the ideas is just not very Epic.  I really liked the mythic characters in Pathfinder 1e as you could get the cool powers very quickly, but they were a lot of headache.  The one I played in had 2 of the players constantly forgetting their abilities.  However, it was not an over-powered campaign.  Never got very far as the group broke up just after we became mythic.

I was hoping that the MOoT source book would have things like the PF 1e mythic characters, but I have not seen anything.  D&D 5e is nice and simple for a lot of players.  They would have to have a power increase, but have to figure out how to do it very simple and easy.

I chose unsure because it's never been about levels for me. I've yet to have a character reach 20 before the character decides to retire. Without a character that desires for greatness beyond level 20, I couldn't say either way.

Ah the good days of 4th ed with his level cap been 30, and you could choose an "Legendary class" at lvl 11 and an "Epic destiny" at lvl 21...

Legendary classes where in most cases a Buffed up subclass of your Class, while Epic Destinies, where stuff that would make you either an Agent/Avatar of the Gods, the Best Swordsman/Spellcaster of the realm or other epic destinies, that was tied to your race/political power/religion etc.

I think they should exist, but cripes, on the other hand, I'm having a hard time justifying in my head why levels above 12 or maybe 15 should exist, since absent Mad Mage, just about no official content exists for those levels, and it seems like hardly anyone gets to those levels anyway.

But then I am someone who gets frustrated when I hit level caps of 50 or 70 in MMOs because I want to keep going and not retire my character.

If they're going to include it at some point, they really need to think things out better than what happened in 2nd or 3rd edition where high level play options were poorly considered an utterly broken in both directions.  The 3.0 Epic Level Handbook in particular stands out as how not to handle it, as it was obviously not playtested- powers ranged from absurdly OP for when you got them to completely useless, the Epic Level magic rules were a complete mess, and the city they created for it was ridiculous (why in the world would a 30th level fighter want to work as a door guard?).

There is ANOTHER option instead of using epic levels, basically just multi-class.

Quote from NoHammer >>

Quote from LeviRocks >>

Here's an example. I'm making the Warlock class up to level 30, and their capstone ability is named "The Master Becoming" and it does a few things:

1. They become immortal, don't age, and can't be aged by magic.
2. Their creature type changes, depending on their patron. If they have an Archfiend patron, they become a fiend. If their patron is a Celestial, they become a celestial.
3. They can have warlocks of their own. The type of warlock is of the patron type you have, and one additional type of your choice when you get this ability. For example, say you're a Hexblade Warlock. You can be a Hexblade patron for your warlocks, but when you get this ability you can also choose to be an Archfiend patron as well. Your warlock can be an Archfiend or Hexblade warlock. 

Any thoughts? This is kind of why I personally want levels beyond 20. Players at this level can become very powerful, akin to Demigods. 

Thats a whole other thing.  Just because you have better fighting and spells and magic items just makes you able to travel the planes and fight demon lords and the like.  Not turn you into a god.

It doesn't really turn you into a god, but gives you more power, and the ability to bestow that power to others. You're more akin to a Demigod in this. Most level 30 characters, IMO, should be similar to demigods. 

Quote from Mog_Dracov >>

There is ANOTHER option instead of using epic levels, basically just multi-class.

Yes. I had considered that, but thought it would be better to develop more levels than to just multiclass. What are your thoughts on this? 

I wouldn't use any such rules personally. The 3e epic rules were sorta pointless extrapolation, when epic boons seem like more of a reward. Also, with bounded accuracy we don't need to bother with epic monsters with 100 attacks and an AC in the stratosphere. Further, epic spells don't really make sense as a mechanic. In the 3e ELH, epic spells required spellcraft checks with absurd DCs, but could be cast on a per-day basis. To me, epic-level magic should be resolved as rituals more like plot points than actual spells.

If you're a 20th level paladin, taking a level of fighter provides limited benefits.  You get an inconsequential boost to HP, a new fighting style that probably doesn't actually benefit you by this point, and a self-heal that's too weak to be useful.