Oh, absolutely. I love the concept and if I had $300 just lying around I'd be all over it. I think this tool/service could be a huge boon for new players and DMs. However, I think it's too expensive. I used it during the beta in a couple sessions to look up info, and with all of the books being put into it it could be an incredible resource for people willing to pay - it's not that I won't, it's that I can't. I can't justify rebuying the books to use them in the DDB character creator or as a DM when I can do it the old fashioned way, and it is a bit disappointing that I've been basically priced out of the service (if I want everything, which I do :P).
That's the thing though, isn't it? We ALL would love to have access to everything on Day 1, but I'm sure there are relatively few people for who that is feasible. $280 for the Legendary Bundle plus another $55 for a full year IS a ton of money to drop at once and I certainly can't do that either, but that doesn't make the pricing unreasonable. Like any other hobby purchase, I need to spend what I can when I can.
With the core three, I can do most of what I need to, and run the adventures out of the books I already own. I will do a Master sub so my players can access that as well. If THEY need something special from SCAG or Volo's to build their character, well then they can buy it themselves, or add it as homebrew in many cases. Its not on me to pay for EVERYTHING they need. Over time, I'll buy more, add an adventure as I need it, but it's not a requirement on launch day, as nice as that would be.
So, Day 1, $60 for books, plus maybe only 6 month sub to start. A lot less than $300. Then I can put away that $5 a week or month until I have the cash free to add another book. If we started playing today and only wanted to buy books, we couldn't afford to buy it all at once, why would you expect Beyond to be any different?
Oh, absolutely. I love the concept and if I had $300 just lying around I'd be all over it. I think this tool/service could be a huge boon for new players and DMs. However, I think it's too expensive. I used it during the beta in a couple sessions to look up info, and with all of the books being put into it it could be an incredible resource for people willing to pay - it's not that I won't, it's that I can't. I can't justify rebuying the books to use them in the DDB character creator or as a DM when I can do it the old fashioned way, and it is a bit disappointing that I've been basically priced out of the service (if I want everything, which I do :P).
That's the thing though, isn't it? We ALL would love to have access to everything on Day 1, but I'm sure there are relatively few people for who that is feasible. $280 for the Legendary Bundle plus another $55 for a full year IS a ton of money to drop at once and I certainly can't do that either, but that doesn't make the pricing unreasonable. Like any other hobby purchase, I need to spend what I can when I can.
With the core three, I can do most of what I need to, and run the adventures out of the books I already own. I will do a Master sub so my players can access that as well. If THEY need something special from SCAG or Volo's to build their character, well then they can buy it themselves, or add it as homebrew in many cases. Its not on me to pay for EVERYTHING they need. Over time, I'll buy more, add an adventure as I need it, but it's not a requirement on launch day, as nice as that would be.
So, Day 1, $60 for books, plus maybe only 6 month sub to start. A lot less than $300. Then I can put away that $5 a week or month until I have the cash free to add another book. If we started playing today and only wanted to buy books, we couldn't afford to buy it all at once, why would you expect Beyond to be any different?
Plus, all of those little purchases can build towards the Legendary Bundle over time. If you buy the core books for $60 right now, then slowly make your purchases over time, you can slowly pick away at the total cost of the Legendary Bundle until it becomes manageable later. So, if you get Volo's, Xanathar's, and the SCAG, plus a couple of adventures between now and say next spring, that's $200 that's been taken off the top of the price of the Legendary Bundle, with only probably about $125 left (including the additional prices of Xanathar's and Tomb of Annihilation). You may or may not be able to afford the rest at that point, but at least you'll still be able to see the light at the end of the tunnel, and it'll feel less daunting than it does right now. Their completed purchase feature makes it so it's very viable to continue to add content to your growing library while still not losing out on the bigger purchases in the long run. Really, the same thing can be said even at the book level. If you start out by purchasing parts of each of the books that you need for play, and completing the purchase at more opporune times, when they've been reduced to the next affordable price, then it'll be easier to complete your purchases without having to get everything at once.
I know it's frustrating to not be able to get everything up front. I've had more than my share of times in my life when I've had to piecemeal my way through life. In this exact moment in my life, and frankly it's merely just good timing for me right now, I can afford to get it all now, which I'm grateful for, because I know that likely wouldn't have been the case if they didn't launch for another few months, nor could I have afforded it even a few months ago, so I get how frustrating it is to want to have it all, but not being able to. Fortunately, Curse is offering a very flexible pricing structure, which can allow us to make more bite-sized purchases that lend towards the big ones.
It is easier to spare 5$ every month, than 70$ at once.
Eh... Sparing $5 every month, and sparing 70$ once, are the same amount of ease 14 months in. And the $70 is easier from then to the end of time, since it'd be over and done with.
It is easier to spare 5$ every month, than 70$ at once.
Eh... Sparing $5 every month, and sparing 70$ once, are the same amount of ease 14 months in. And the $70 is easier from then to the end of time, since it'd be over and done with.
another subjective thing some will never agree on, because it's subjective. This is why places like "rent-a-center" exist in the states, for some people paying a little bit every month (even though it's more in the long run) is easier, for others who can put the cash up front that is easier.
With the current model, you can already pay bit by bit each month by purchasing parts of the book you need until the price of the whole is low enough that you can buy it outright.
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another subjective thing some will never agree on, because it's subjective. This is why places like "rent-a-center" exist in the states, for some people paying a little bit every month (even though it's more in the long run) is easier, for others who can put the cash up front that is easier.
It's only subjective in the sense that the reason some people see a difference is that they don't want to just not spend their money - it is entirely objective to say that a person that can afford $5 a month every month for 14 months can afford $70 once 14 months from now.
The only thing that gets in the way is "I have $5 now, and I decided I'd rather spend it now on anything than hang on to it so I can later get a thing I claim to want."
And places like "rent-a-center" exist for the same reason that people buy things because they are on sale or they had a coupon - which is to say because there are a lot of consumers that just plain aren't thinking about what is really a good deal, and what is a marketing trick to make the company more money (i.e. a coupon to get a third item free when you buy the first two - and some people go right on and buy that and think "I got a good deal" when the reality is they only needed one of the thing in the first place and have been tricked into paying for two instead.)
So I'm just going to come out and ask... Can we release NOW???? I NEED THIS IN MY LIFE. :-D
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Grant K. Smith A+, Network+, MCP x 2, BSIT/VC, MIS
Software Engineer & Dungeon Master
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." - J. R. R. Tolkien "Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup" - Anonymous
So far I have been super impressed with the work you guys have put into this and its really coming along!
I will definitely buy the core books, but I already have the adventures I want, and I mostly run home brew campaigns, it would be nice if I could get a version of the "Legendary Bundle" that is just core books, not adventures. Kinda lame you don't get the discount if you only run home brew campaigns.
So far I have been super impressed with the work you guys have put into this and its really coming along!
I will definitely buy the core books, but I already have the adventures I want, and I mostly run home brew campaigns, it would be nice if I could get a version of the "Legendary Bundle" that is just core books, not adventures. Kinda lame you don't get the discount if you only run home brew campaigns.
I second that motion. Just the PHB, DMG, MM, VGtM, XGtE, chapters 3-5 of SCAG, and the useful stuff from the adventures. Maybe 10% off.
Not yet, sorry. Might have to wait until the shopfront goes live on 15th to see what the international prices are, though I will ask staff if there's any info that can be released in advance.
I have an end of life question in regards to purchases that wasn't made clear in the FAQ. I'm very interested in owning digital versions of all the books, which I already own in physical form. I think I would only be willing to purchase the books a second time if I knew that in perpetuity, I'd have access to said books. I'm wondering things like:
What happens when the 6th edition comes out
What happens if Curse goes out of business
If the answer is something along the lines of "there's already funds set aside to keep a server with the content online and maintained for 100 years," or "in the event of going out of business, all content will be downloadable for X months," then I'm comfortable making the purchase. I'm sure Wizards/Hasbro has obligated Curse to make it impossible for users to get full digital copies that can be kept out of the gate, and while I disagree with it, they own the content so can more or less dictate what happens with it. I'm not concerned with getting a "for keeps" copy of the content out of the gate upon purchase, but there's no way I'm doing it if what I purchased isn't made mine permanently.
Have any end of life plans been made?
Sorry I'm not wishing Curse bad luck, I hope they stay in business because then I know what I buy from them will be mine. I just looked over at my first D&D book, a 2nd edition players guide from 1989 that I'm going to give to my kids when they're old enough. If you're going to give me the ability to do that in digital form, then awesome. You've got my business for every D&D book going forward. On the other hand, if I can't pass these materials to my kids, then you'll never get a cent from me.
Sorry I'm not wishing Curse bad luck, I hope they stay in business because then I know what I buy from them will be mine. I just looked over at my first D&D book, a 2nd edition players guide from 1989 that I'm going to give to my kids when they're old enough. If you're going to give me the ability to do that in digital form, then awesome. You've got my business for every D&D book going forward. On the other hand, if I can't pass these materials to my kids, then you'll never get a cent from me.
If you want something to pass on to others, then get the books, and pass them on. No one can guarantee that Curse will be around for thousands of years and that the data will still be accessible (or compatible) with future technology. Besides, whatever cool thing is available for playing D&D in the year 2067? You'll want to use that instead of D&D Beyond.
Bottom line: if the idea of a well organized digital ruleset and character builder for 5e appeals to you, buy it, and enjoy it now.
Thank you for replying, subsistcyber, but you didn't answer my questions in any way.
1) I don't doubt that Curse will lead the way into 6th edition - but I do care what happens to the digital copies of my 5th edition books when 6th comes out. What happens? Will I always be able to "see" my books regardless of what the current edition is? What happens if Curse gets bought/sold/liquidated? Recall that some years ago, AOL essentially purchased Time Warner. Since then AOL has probably shrunk to 1% of its value at the time. Sometimes you're at the top of the mountain, and that's great, but there's only one way to go from there (assuming you have only legs for locomotion).
2) I'm glad you mentioned Amazon. They have a really good setup for this. When I buy a movie on Amazon, I can see it on all my network connected devices. But they also have this fabulous little button that says, "download". It's limited, I can't download unlimited copies, but I can hold onto my own. So if Amazon folds, the things I've bought over the years are still mine, regardless of the state of their business.
I'm not looking to debate the future of Curse. I hope they last 200 years. I'm simply trying to ensure that if they don't, whatever I've purchased from them is still mine.
Thank you for replying, subsistcyber, but you didn't answer my questions in any way.
1) I don't doubt that Curse will lead the way into 6th edition - but I do care what happens to the digital copies of my 5th edition books when 6th comes out. What happens? Will I always be able to "see" my books regardless of what the current edition is? What happens if Curse gets bought/sold/liquidated? Recall that some years ago, AOL essentially purchased Time Warner. Since then AOL has probably shrunk to 1% of its value at the time. Sometimes you're at the top of the mountain, and that's great, but there's only one way to go from there (assuming you have only legs for locomotion).
2) I'm glad you mentioned Amazon. They have a really good setup for this. When I buy a movie on Amazon, I can see it on all my network connected devices. But they also have this fabulous little button that says, "download". It's limited, I can't download unlimited copies, but I can hold onto my own. So if Amazon folds, the things I've bought over the years are still mine, regardless of the state of their business.
I'm not looking to debate the future of Curse. I hope they last 200 years. I'm simply trying to ensure that if they don't, whatever I've purchased from them is still mine.
They are planning offline functionality which would imply a download. But that use may depend on the app which may not run on any device forever.
I'd say that if one of the values you need from a digital toolset is availability in perpetuity, this isn't the product for you. The physical books serve that purpose better. And I suppose you can scan your physical books to pdf's. Though, arguably, you might not be able to hand down pdf's to your grandchildren either, since all file formats are subject to obsolescence. Even if it doesn't seem like it now (i've been through some file format obsolescence in my time).
At any rate, if you need an in perpetuity guarantee of data availability, then DDB is probably not going to be the product you need.
For me, the value of a the toolset-- quick searchability, really great organization, character builder, etc.-- make it well worth the price for the value I'll get in the coming years. I'll stick to my physical copies for archival purposes.
But we all have different perspectives. That's fine.
How will the pricing be done for those outside the US?
Will it be set in local currency or will it use live exchange rates?
Eh... Sparing $5 every month, and sparing 70$ once, are the same amount of ease 14 months in. And the $70 is easier from then to the end of time, since it'd be over and done with.
How do you get a one-armed goblin out of a tree?
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So I'm just going to come out and ask... Can we release NOW???? I NEED THIS IN MY LIFE. :-D
Grant K. Smith
A+, Network+, MCP x 2, BSIT/VC, MIS
Software Engineer & Dungeon Master
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." - J. R. R. Tolkien
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup" - Anonymous
So far I have been super impressed with the work you guys have put into this and its really coming along!
I will definitely buy the core books, but I already have the adventures I want, and I mostly run home brew campaigns, it would be nice if I could get a version of the "Legendary Bundle" that is just core books, not adventures. Kinda lame you don't get the discount if you only run home brew campaigns.
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both" -- allegedly Benjamin Franklin
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An all mechanics and monsters bundle would be great. As mentioned elsewhere I'd also love to be able to buy monsters and items from the adventures.
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Is there a price list in GBP?
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I have an end of life question in regards to purchases that wasn't made clear in the FAQ. I'm very interested in owning digital versions of all the books, which I already own in physical form. I think I would only be willing to purchase the books a second time if I knew that in perpetuity, I'd have access to said books. I'm wondering things like:
If the answer is something along the lines of "there's already funds set aside to keep a server with the content online and maintained for 100 years," or "in the event of going out of business, all content will be downloadable for X months," then I'm comfortable making the purchase. I'm sure Wizards/Hasbro has obligated Curse to make it impossible for users to get full digital copies that can be kept out of the gate, and while I disagree with it, they own the content so can more or less dictate what happens with it. I'm not concerned with getting a "for keeps" copy of the content out of the gate upon purchase, but there's no way I'm doing it if what I purchased isn't made mine permanently.
Have any end of life plans been made?
Sorry I'm not wishing Curse bad luck, I hope they stay in business because then I know what I buy from them will be mine. I just looked over at my first D&D book, a 2nd edition players guide from 1989 that I'm going to give to my kids when they're old enough. If you're going to give me the ability to do that in digital form, then awesome. You've got my business for every D&D book going forward. On the other hand, if I can't pass these materials to my kids, then you'll never get a cent from me.
1 - When 6th edition comes out Curse will most likely be leading the charge into the new edition.
2 - If Curse (Owned by Amazon) goes out of business it'll likely be due to the next depression - You'll have bigger things to worry about. ;)
In reality, Curse is here for the long haul. I honestly believe WotC has a better chance of going out of business than Curse does.
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If you want something to pass on to others, then get the books, and pass them on. No one can guarantee that Curse will be around for thousands of years and that the data will still be accessible (or compatible) with future technology. Besides, whatever cool thing is available for playing D&D in the year 2067? You'll want to use that instead of D&D Beyond.
Bottom line: if the idea of a well organized digital ruleset and character builder for 5e appeals to you, buy it, and enjoy it now.
-HM
Thank you for replying, subsistcyber, but you didn't answer my questions in any way.
1) I don't doubt that Curse will lead the way into 6th edition - but I do care what happens to the digital copies of my 5th edition books when 6th comes out. What happens? Will I always be able to "see" my books regardless of what the current edition is? What happens if Curse gets bought/sold/liquidated? Recall that some years ago, AOL essentially purchased Time Warner. Since then AOL has probably shrunk to 1% of its value at the time. Sometimes you're at the top of the mountain, and that's great, but there's only one way to go from there (assuming you have only legs for locomotion).
2) I'm glad you mentioned Amazon. They have a really good setup for this. When I buy a movie on Amazon, I can see it on all my network connected devices. But they also have this fabulous little button that says, "download". It's limited, I can't download unlimited copies, but I can hold onto my own. So if Amazon folds, the things I've bought over the years are still mine, regardless of the state of their business.
I'm not looking to debate the future of Curse. I hope they last 200 years. I'm simply trying to ensure that if they don't, whatever I've purchased from them is still mine.
I'm sorry that my opinion doesn't help answer your question. Hopefully someone else will be able to give you the answer you're looking for.
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Please feel free to message either Sorce or another moderator if you have any concerns.