I stumbled on a role playing use of the spell Conjure Woodland Beings that my druid has been using to pretty useful effect in recent sessions. The spell allows you to summon Sprites, which have Invisibility and a Heart Sight ability that allows them to learn a creature's alignment. This can be very useful to know if an important NPC is really on your side. It can't tell you as much detail about their schemes as Detect Thoughts, but what you lose in depth you gain in breadth. Detect Thoughts might tell you something specific about their current goals, but their alignment tells you about their long-term allegiances. And Heart Sight's Charisma save might be more of a weak point for some creatures than Detect Thoughts' Wisdom save.
I like it, but as a DM I would feel a lot of pressure (read: annoyance) having to nail down every NPC's alignment if asked. Also, a table with 5 players is going to have 5 different interpretations of what motivates creatures of X alignment. It's just such a contentious topic that I'm not sure how useful it would ultimately be.
Heart Sight. The sprite touches a creature and magically knows the creature's current emotional state. If the target fails a DC 10 Charisma saving throw, the sprite also knows the creature's alignment. Celestials, fiends, and undead automatically fail the saving throw.
So this tells you the targets emotional sense - you know if they are happy or sad, scared or excited, angry or indifferent. It also tells you it's alignment if it fails the saving throw - just a DC 10. This would not tell you absolutely anything about a creatures plans or ambitions, what it is going to have for breakfast or anything else. It certainly does not tell you who they are friends with or any such. It literally does what it says on the tin. Not only that the target would be aware that someone cast a spell on it whether it succeeds or fails the saving throw, and the pixie becomes visible as this counts as an attack. So it would not be remotely the same as detect thoughts.
It's a big investment of resources. A 4th level spell slot for a chance to get sprites (DNDBeyond lists seven fey of CR ¼ or less). Then the sprites have to get into touch range of the target. Then the target has to fail a saving throw.
From a social aspect, many of the NPCs you want to use this on will take this very badly. Some will take it violently, attacking the sprites and maybe the PCs. I imagine a high chance of the NPC ending their relationship with the PCs.
As a GM, try turning it around. Have an NPC do this on the PCs and see how the players react.
I suspect that the ability to know the alignment of a target by reading their emotions will have the wording changed someday. They can't have meant "Alignment" in the sense of Player Character Alignment. How would reading emotions get you that? If all you know is that someone is sad, what does that tell you? Perhaps they are sad because it rained yesterday, or their puppy died a year ago. Perhaps they are sad because the Sprite touched them and then flew away. There's no knowing. That has nothing whatever to do with the moral and ethical make up of the target's personality.
Detect Thoughts wouldn't really do it either. People think all sorts of things. A momentary annoyance at something wouldn't mean your target was Evil, even if they were thinking terribly violent thoughts.
Not only that the target would be aware that someone cast a spell on it whether it succeeds or fails the saving throw, and the pixie becomes visible as this counts as an attack. So it would not be remotely the same as detect thoughts.
Heart Sight is in the section describing monster actions, not necessarily attacks. Since the ability doesn't use the word attack, doesn't have an attack roll, and doesn't do damage, I wouldn't regard it as an attack. Nor is it explicitly a spell.
It would be reasonable to rule that the target felt a touch, though I think if they had low enough passive perception they'd be unaware. Also, invisible is not undetectable, and it's reasonable to ask the Sprites to make Stealth checks. If they roll low, people might hear "a buzzing like a large insect".
It's a big investment of resources. A 4th level spell slot for a chance to get sprites (DNDBeyond lists seven fey of CR ¼ or less). Then the sprites have to get into touch range of the target. Then the target has to fail a saving throw.
From a social aspect, many of the NPCs you want to use this on will take this very badly. Some will take it violently, attacking the sprites and maybe the PCs. I imagine a high chance of the NPC ending their relationship with the PCs.
As a GM, try turning it around. Have an NPC do this on the PCs and see how the players react.
My DM lets me pick the creature. The spell doesn't seem to be explicit one way or the other about whether the player or DM chooses the specific creature. This is a point where, if you are annoyed about this tactic as a DM, you could rule that the DM chooses.
Not only that the target would be aware that someone cast a spell on it whether it succeeds or fails the saving throw, and the pixie becomes visible as this counts as an attack. So it would not be remotely the same as detect thoughts.
Heart Sight is in the section describing monster actions, not necessarily attacks. Since the ability doesn't use the word attack, doesn't have an attack roll, and doesn't do damage, I wouldn't regard it as an attack. Nor is it explicitly a spell.
It would be reasonable to rule that the target felt a touch, though I think if they had low enough passive perception they'd be unaware. Also, invisible is not undetectable, and it's reasonable to ask the Sprites to make Stealth checks. If they roll low, people might hear "a buzzing like a large insect".
It’s a magical ability that requires touch to work, and requires the target to fail a saving throw. That makes it an offensive ability use which breaks invisibility. It make not be explicitly described as a spell or an attack but it clearly is. Sacred Flame doesn’t have an attack roll, just a saving throw, neither does Flaming Sphere or Lightning Bolt or Polymorph. There is a feat that gives the ability to perform a ‘telekinetic shove’ that isn’t a spell, doesn’t require an attack roll and doesn’t do damage - but it is still an attack nonetheless. Moreover as per RAW the player does not get to pick what the summoned creatures are either.
An even more important fact is that knowing my current emotional state does not even remotely tell you what my long term plans and ambitions are. You use the ability on me just after I get stung by a wasp - I’m angry. After an attractive npc just paid me a compliment - I’m happy, my friend recently died - I’m sad, and so on. Nothing in the description of this ability says that it can tell you who my friends are, what I am planning to do next week, how I’m going to obtain global domination by this time next year. The whole concept of this is ridiculous, and completely unsupported by RAW.
As per the RAW you do not get to decide what creature you get when you cast Conjure spells. You only get to choose the CR, DM chooses or randomly rolls the creature.
This is done because some of the creatures have radically over-powered abilities. The main example is Pixie.
I.E. If you can allow the player to choose the creature, then you can use the 4th level Conjure Woodland Beings to get 8 pixies, a CR 1/4 creature. Which means you now have EIGHT Polymorph, a 4th level spell. Not to mention several 3rd level spells: Fly, Dispel Magic, etc. A 7th level wizard can cast one polymorph and has to concentrate on it. A 7th level Druid should not be able to summon pixies and transform 4 players into Flying Giant Apes.
In other words, the rules do not allow this as it is clearly very over-powered.
Now a lot of the time a lot of DM's ignore this rule, as long as you are not trying to abuse it by picking a creature with a spell and having it cast that. But if you are choosing a specific creature, just to get a specific spell, then do not be surprised if the DM laughs and roll randomly.
I suspect that the ability to know the alignment of a target by reading their emotions will have the wording changed someday. They can't have meant "Alignment" in the sense of Player Character Alignment. How would reading emotions get you that? If all you know is that someone is sad, what does that tell you? Perhaps they are sad because it rained yesterday, or their puppy died a year ago. Perhaps they are sad because the Sprite touched them and then flew away. There's no knowing. That has nothing whatever to do with the moral and ethical make up of the target's personality.
Detect Thoughts wouldn't really do it either. People think all sorts of things. A momentary annoyance at something wouldn't mean your target was Evil, even if they were thinking terribly violent thoughts.
Heart Sight actually just says that the sprite learns their emotional state, and then also learns their alignment on a failed safe. It doesn't say they are the same thing.
I agree that if you only learnt their current emotional state then this would not offer you much information at all. An NPC whose plan to lead the party into a trap has gone flawlessly might have exactly the same emotional state as an NPC who is pleased that the party is doing so well - pleased, and maybe a little nervous.
You also have to consider the motivations of the NPC's - a thief who is helping the party because they made a deal will show up as chaotic evil, perhaps, but alignment isn't loyalty. They might be chaotic because they steal from anyone, but they might still be loyal to their word. They also might just happen to be doing it properly this time because the party just got back from choking a dragon to death and that's really not someone you want to get on the wrong side of!
So yeah, emotions won't tell you much, alignment might tell you a little bit more, but as for their intentions, it won't tell you anything. A lawful good person could lead you into a trap if the bandits have their family hostage. They would also show as afraid when checked, which you might think is because they are showing you where the camp is, not because their family is at stake.
I stumbled on a role playing use of the spell Conjure Woodland Beings that my druid has been using to pretty useful effect in recent sessions. The spell allows you to summon Sprites, which have Invisibility and a Heart Sight ability that allows them to learn a creature's alignment. This can be very useful to know if an important NPC is really on your side. It can't tell you as much detail about their schemes as Detect Thoughts, but what you lose in depth you gain in breadth. Detect Thoughts might tell you something specific about their current goals, but their alignment tells you about their long-term allegiances. And Heart Sight's Charisma save might be more of a weak point for some creatures than Detect Thoughts' Wisdom save.
I like this. I use a shepherd druid w/ life cleric dip. Been using reflections for the combat recently, but this will make the rp very nice. Thanks!
I like it, but as a DM I would feel a lot of pressure (read: annoyance) having to nail down every NPC's alignment if asked. Also, a table with 5 players is going to have 5 different interpretations of what motivates creatures of X alignment. It's just such a contentious topic that I'm not sure how useful it would ultimately be.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm
Heart Sight. The sprite touches a creature and magically knows the creature's current emotional state. If the target fails a DC 10 Charisma saving throw, the sprite also knows the creature's alignment. Celestials, fiends, and undead automatically fail the saving throw.
So this tells you the targets emotional sense - you know if they are happy or sad, scared or excited, angry or indifferent. It also tells you it's alignment if it fails the saving throw - just a DC 10. This would not tell you absolutely anything about a creatures plans or ambitions, what it is going to have for breakfast or anything else. It certainly does not tell you who they are friends with or any such. It literally does what it says on the tin. Not only that the target would be aware that someone cast a spell on it whether it succeeds or fails the saving throw, and the pixie becomes visible as this counts as an attack. So it would not be remotely the same as detect thoughts.
It's a big investment of resources. A 4th level spell slot for a chance to get sprites (DNDBeyond lists seven fey of CR ¼ or less). Then the sprites have to get into touch range of the target. Then the target has to fail a saving throw.
From a social aspect, many of the NPCs you want to use this on will take this very badly. Some will take it violently, attacking the sprites and maybe the PCs. I imagine a high chance of the NPC ending their relationship with the PCs.
As a GM, try turning it around. Have an NPC do this on the PCs and see how the players react.
I suspect that the ability to know the alignment of a target by reading their emotions will have the wording changed someday. They can't have meant "Alignment" in the sense of Player Character Alignment. How would reading emotions get you that? If all you know is that someone is sad, what does that tell you? Perhaps they are sad because it rained yesterday, or their puppy died a year ago. Perhaps they are sad because the Sprite touched them and then flew away. There's no knowing. That has nothing whatever to do with the moral and ethical make up of the target's personality.
Detect Thoughts wouldn't really do it either. People think all sorts of things. A momentary annoyance at something wouldn't mean your target was Evil, even if they were thinking terribly violent thoughts.
<Insert clever signature here>
Heart Sight is in the section describing monster actions, not necessarily attacks. Since the ability doesn't use the word attack, doesn't have an attack roll, and doesn't do damage, I wouldn't regard it as an attack. Nor is it explicitly a spell.
It would be reasonable to rule that the target felt a touch, though I think if they had low enough passive perception they'd be unaware. Also, invisible is not undetectable, and it's reasonable to ask the Sprites to make Stealth checks. If they roll low, people might hear "a buzzing like a large insect".
My DM lets me pick the creature. The spell doesn't seem to be explicit one way or the other about whether the player or DM chooses the specific creature. This is a point where, if you are annoyed about this tactic as a DM, you could rule that the DM chooses.
As a player, I slipped my DM a note that I would like to Heart Sight a couple of my party members. They were unaware.
It’s a magical ability that requires touch to work, and requires the target to fail a saving throw. That makes it an offensive ability use which breaks invisibility. It make not be explicitly described as a spell or an attack but it clearly is. Sacred Flame doesn’t have an attack roll, just a saving throw, neither does Flaming Sphere or Lightning Bolt or Polymorph. There is a feat that gives the ability to perform a ‘telekinetic shove’ that isn’t a spell, doesn’t require an attack roll and doesn’t do damage - but it is still an attack nonetheless. Moreover as per RAW the player does not get to pick what the summoned creatures are either.
An even more important fact is that knowing my current emotional state does not even remotely tell you what my long term plans and ambitions are. You use the ability on me just after I get stung by a wasp - I’m angry. After an attractive npc just paid me a compliment - I’m happy, my friend recently died - I’m sad, and so on. Nothing in the description of this ability says that it can tell you who my friends are, what I am planning to do next week, how I’m going to obtain global domination by this time next year. The whole concept of this is ridiculous, and completely unsupported by RAW.
A person always knows when they have to make a saving throw because some one is doing something to them.
As per the RAW you do not get to decide what creature you get when you cast Conjure spells. You only get to choose the CR, DM chooses or randomly rolls the creature.
This is done because some of the creatures have radically over-powered abilities. The main example is Pixie.
I.E. If you can allow the player to choose the creature, then you can use the 4th level Conjure Woodland Beings to get 8 pixies, a CR 1/4 creature. Which means you now have EIGHT Polymorph, a 4th level spell. Not to mention several 3rd level spells: Fly, Dispel Magic, etc. A 7th level wizard can cast one polymorph and has to concentrate on it. A 7th level Druid should not be able to summon pixies and transform 4 players into Flying Giant Apes.
In other words, the rules do not allow this as it is clearly very over-powered.
Now a lot of the time a lot of DM's ignore this rule, as long as you are not trying to abuse it by picking a creature with a spell and having it cast that. But if you are choosing a specific creature, just to get a specific spell, then do not be surprised if the DM laughs and roll randomly.
Heart Sight actually just says that the sprite learns their emotional state, and then also learns their alignment on a failed safe. It doesn't say they are the same thing.
I agree that if you only learnt their current emotional state then this would not offer you much information at all. An NPC whose plan to lead the party into a trap has gone flawlessly might have exactly the same emotional state as an NPC who is pleased that the party is doing so well - pleased, and maybe a little nervous.
You also have to consider the motivations of the NPC's - a thief who is helping the party because they made a deal will show up as chaotic evil, perhaps, but alignment isn't loyalty. They might be chaotic because they steal from anyone, but they might still be loyal to their word. They also might just happen to be doing it properly this time because the party just got back from choking a dragon to death and that's really not someone you want to get on the wrong side of!
So yeah, emotions won't tell you much, alignment might tell you a little bit more, but as for their intentions, it won't tell you anything. A lawful good person could lead you into a trap if the bandits have their family hostage. They would also show as afraid when checked, which you might think is because they are showing you where the camp is, not because their family is at stake.
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