I'm gonna pipe back in here, cause while we may disagree on an issue like psionics vs. spells, I think there's also a lot we can agree on as well. In this case, I agree with Sposta in regards to using Disciplines to define the Subclasses. It gives each subclass a very distinct thematic focus, and I think it also allows each discipline/subclass to have a somewhat distinct play style.
You guys also already hit the five traditional disciplines. In 3e/3.5e the sixth discipline was Metacreation, which overall I was not a fan of even though I did like the idea of Astral Constructs. What I would prefer to see is something that represents the idea of the spirit medium - the psychic with a natural connection to the spirit realms. That's actually what I did for my design and called it Spiritualism. Its powers don't reach into the divine or infernal, but they do reach into the border realms of the ethereal and the astral.
My idea for the 6th was Psychopotentience (energy manipulation) I figured it this way:
Telepathy (mind)
Psychometabolism (body)
Clairsentience (perceive spacetime)
Psychoportation (move through spacetime)
Psychokinesis (mater)
Psychopotentience (energy)
And Metapsionics (the original 6th) would now be the “7th” discipline as a main-class discipline.
Yeah, I think we're all on board with the traditional five. Although I've just never liked the name Psychometabolism, the idea of mental manipulation of the body is a classic. But I don't see energy manipulation as really being part of the psionic repertoire. To me, and its just my opinion, that's more the domain of wizards and sorcerers. But a psion plagued by the whispers of spirits and voices from beyond the grave, that seems more in keeping to me with the way psychics are often portrayed in fiction and lore.
Yeah, I think we're all on board with the traditional five. Although I've just never liked the name Psychometabolism, the idea of mental manipulation of the body is a classic. But I don't see energy manipulation as really being part of the psionic repertoire. To me, and its just my opinion, that's more the domain of wizards and sorcerers. But a psion plagued by the whispers of spirits and voices from beyond the grave, that seems more in keeping to me with the way psychics are often portrayed in fiction and lore.
Energy manipulation is a classic. Like Firestarter, for example.
And I was including spirit mediumship with Telepathy/Clairsentience because it’s mind-mind or extrasensory.
Ahhh, gotcha. I see where you're coming from there and Firestarter is indeed a classic. But I guess I've always seen pyrokinesis as a subset of psychokinesis rather than as its own thing. I'd also be concerned that giving that kind of firepower to psions will overly step on the toes of the wizard and sorcerer.
Ahhh, gotcha. I see where you're coming from there and Firestarter is indeed a classic. But I guess I've always seen pyrokinesis as a subset of psychokinesis rather than as its own thing. I'd also be concerned that giving that kind of firepower to psions will overly step on the toes of the wizard and sorcerer.
Not just pyrokinesis, but other energy forms as well. And I don’t think it steps on spellcasters because they have a breadth of spells to chose from where the Psionicist would only have a limited number of “powers” that fall under an umbrella but each could have broader applications.
So instead of choosing a bunch of spells, if you went for the Psychopotentience Discipline (subclass) there would be maybe a half dozen powers from which to choose 3-4 over the course of 20 levels and one of those powers would be “Pyrokinesis.”
Every spellcaster can potentially manipulate fire in some way, even if it’s just Prestidigitation, or Searing Smite, so that alone is not enough to preclude other classes from from doing it. But instead of a shed load of spells that each let you manipulate fire in a different way, I would make it just one power that can manipulate fire in a shed load of ways. Those ways would start limited and then grow with class level, but still all just be the one power. With a half-dozen powers that work like that, it could be balanced with Spellcasting, be unique, and not step on anyone’s toes.
I would chop down the list and make Discipline=Subclass. The traditional disciplines are psychokinesis, telepathy, psychoportation, psychometabolism, clairsentience, and a sixth one that has varied from edition to edition. I would just make it as simple as that.
Fair enough.
also i only have the 2E Psionics Handbook and Ultimate Psionics on hand, but energy manipulation is covered by Psychokinesis. This is especially true if we go with the idea that psionic powers are SCIENCE! instead of being a mystical force.
I would chop down the list and make Discipline=Subclass. The traditional disciplines are psychokinesis, telepathy, psychoportation, psychometabolism, clairsentience, and a sixth one that has varied from edition to edition. I would just make it as simple as that.
Fair enough.
also i only have the 2E Psionics Handbook and Ultimate Psionics on hand, but energy manipulation is covered by Psychokinesis. This is especially true if we go with the idea that psionic powers are SCIENCE! instead of being a mystical force.
I know Pyrokinesis was included in Psychokineses. I have the original Complete Psionics Handbook from 2e, and the book from 3.5. I decided to shuffle things around. And I don’t think of it as “science” but more like... college crossed with superpowers.
I actually made a psion class for my D&D group, before I gave up hope for a real new mechanic with the recent psion options revisited video where they declare that the majority from the community considers the Psidie a too hard mechanic to use in the game. I used the six disciplines from the 3.5 psion for the subclasses:
1. Psychokinesis - manipulate the energy and momentum around
2. Psychometabolism - manipulate the body and vital energy (support mostly)
3. Metacriativity - create matter and energy
4. Telepathy - can read and manipulate thoughts, and of course a lot of psychic damage
5. Psychoportation - manipulate the time and space, mastering teleportation
6. Clairsentience - amplify the senses, sees what is being hidden, predict the future
Maybe I should post this here, but the site not allows homebrew classes, only subclasses, for some reason.
I actually made a psion class for my D&D group, before I gave up hope for a real new mechanic with the recent psion options revisited video where they declare that the majority from the community considers the Psidie a too hard mechanic to use in the game. I used the six disciplines from the 3.5 psion for the subclasses:
Also, I gave each subclass at level 1, one distinct cantrip, with an improvement, and removing the somatic, verbal and material components, of course. Sincerely, at this point is just a lost cause trying to make them to actually create a psionic subclass without dipping in spells stuff... and I really did not have the patience to create a new set of power for everything, considering how 'happy' I am with D&D right now. (I use '' for sarcasm, just clarifying)
Whelp, I guess we're stuck with homebrew Sposta. If a single dice with cantrip style scaling is too complicated for the masses, then that does not bode well for any future content, period...
EDIT: Finished watching it the whole way through. It sounds like they aren't completely disregarding what psionics aficionados are asking for, but this still does not bode well.
FURTHER EDIT: Aaaaaand, now I'm reading comments from people complaining they didn't fill out the survey forms. Come on, people...
Whelp, I guess we're stuck with homebrew Sposta. If a single dice with cantrip style scaling is too complicated for the masses, then that does not bode well for any future content, period...
EDIT: Finished watching it the whole way through. It sounds like they aren't completely disregarding what psionics aficionados are asking for, but this still does not bode well.
FURTHER EDIT: Aaaaaand, now I'm reading comments from people complaining they didn't fill out the survey forms. Come on, people...
Yeah same here. I don't think this mechanic was perfect, but it was solid, and workable.
The sad thing is, I'm pretty sure with a couple of tweaks, a very similar mechanic could have worked. The main objections to the die mechanic seemed to be:
1) It's a unique mechanic, and people don't like those (surprising to me but okay).
2) The fact that it could stop working seemed to upset a lot of people or make them anxious.
3) The fact that the increases/decreases were random seemed to be the focus of a lot of negativity.
4) Not something I've seen people say, but I think on a less-conscious level, a lot of people really hated that "roll low = good thing happens", and "roll high = bad thing happens" aspect of the mechanic, because it goes against literally everything in 5E's design. I get the logic of it, but... I sort of agree.
I think the solution would have been to make the Psi die a fixed value, and only decrease or increase based on voluntary actions taken by the PC (if at all!). They should also have made some of the "Psi die" abilities be Stat Mod/rest, rather than decreasing the die or the like. If they'd done that, people wouldn't have seen it as a "unique mechanic" and been upset by it, and people wouldn't have objected to the other aspects, and we'd have at least two Psi subclasses basically ready to go (with the Sorcerer just needing "more mucus" lol).
Sadly I never got to take the survey, because it crashed on me repeatedly, then said I'd taken it, which wasn't great (never happened with other surveys).
I'm not even mad at the developers. I'm mad at people who thought the Psi Dice was cool but couldn't be bothered to fill out the survey. Back when I worked at a restaurant, we were told at a meeting that customers who have a bad experience are more likely to tell others than customers who have a good experience. So if you like a UA, post your feedback, because the people who hate it most certainly will be.
This might mean a return of the older sorcerer with the mucus as stated in the video lol which is cool I liked that so much better then the last sorcerer.
I'm not even mad at the developers. I'm mad at people who thought the Psi Dice was cool but couldn't be bothered to fill out the survey. Back when I worked at a restaurant, we were told at a meeting that customers who have a bad experience are more likely to tell others than customers who have a good experience. So if you like a UA, post your feedback, because the people who hate it most certainly will be.
This might mean a return of the older sorcerer with the mucus as stated in the video lol which is cool I liked that so much better then the last sorcerer.
I loved the Aberrant Mind! I want it back!
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
My idea for the 6th was Psychopotentience (energy manipulation) I figured it this way:
And Metapsionics (the original 6th) would now be the “7th” discipline as a main-class discipline.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Yeah, I think we're all on board with the traditional five. Although I've just never liked the name Psychometabolism, the idea of mental manipulation of the body is a classic. But I don't see energy manipulation as really being part of the psionic repertoire. To me, and its just my opinion, that's more the domain of wizards and sorcerers. But a psion plagued by the whispers of spirits and voices from beyond the grave, that seems more in keeping to me with the way psychics are often portrayed in fiction and lore.
Energy manipulation is a classic. Like Firestarter, for example.
And I was including spirit mediumship with Telepathy/Clairsentience because it’s mind-mind or extrasensory.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Ahhh, gotcha. I see where you're coming from there and Firestarter is indeed a classic. But I guess I've always seen pyrokinesis as a subset of psychokinesis rather than as its own thing. I'd also be concerned that giving that kind of firepower to psions will overly step on the toes of the wizard and sorcerer.
Not just pyrokinesis, but other energy forms as well. And I don’t think it steps on spellcasters because they have a breadth of spells to chose from where the Psionicist would only have a limited number of “powers” that fall under an umbrella but each could have broader applications.
So instead of choosing a bunch of spells, if you went for the Psychopotentience Discipline (subclass) there would be maybe a half dozen powers from which to choose 3-4 over the course of 20 levels and one of those powers would be “Pyrokinesis.”
Every spellcaster can potentially manipulate fire in some way, even if it’s just Prestidigitation, or Searing Smite, so that alone is not enough to preclude other classes from from doing it. But instead of a shed load of spells that each let you manipulate fire in a different way, I would make it just one power that can manipulate fire in a shed load of ways. Those ways would start limited and then grow with class level, but still all just be the one power. With a half-dozen powers that work like that, it could be balanced with Spellcasting, be unique, and not step on anyone’s toes.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Fair enough.
also i only have the 2E Psionics Handbook and Ultimate Psionics on hand, but energy manipulation is covered by Psychokinesis. This is especially true if we go with the idea that psionic powers are SCIENCE! instead of being a mystical force.
I know Pyrokinesis was included in Psychokineses. I have the original Complete Psionics Handbook from 2e, and the book from 3.5. I decided to shuffle things around. And I don’t think of it as “science” but more like... college crossed with superpowers.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
I actually made a psion class for my D&D group, before I gave up hope for a real new mechanic with the recent psion options revisited video where they declare that the majority from the community considers the Psidie a too hard mechanic to use in the game. I used the six disciplines from the 3.5 psion for the subclasses:
1. Psychokinesis - manipulate the energy and momentum around
2. Psychometabolism - manipulate the body and vital energy (support mostly)
3. Metacriativity - create matter and energy
4. Telepathy - can read and manipulate thoughts, and of course a lot of psychic damage
5. Psychoportation - manipulate the time and space, mastering teleportation
6. Clairsentience - amplify the senses, sees what is being hidden, predict the future
Maybe I should post this here, but the site not allows homebrew classes, only subclasses, for some reason.
You get the link to that video?
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NY78Dt0cBms
This one. Jump for 3:25 for the feedback stuff.
Also, I gave each subclass at level 1, one distinct cantrip, with an improvement, and removing the somatic, verbal and material components, of course. Sincerely, at this point is just a lost cause trying to make them to actually create a psionic subclass without dipping in spells stuff... and I really did not have the patience to create a new set of power for everything, considering how 'happy' I am with D&D right now. (I use '' for sarcasm, just clarifying)
I am so disappointed.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Whelp, I guess we're stuck with homebrew Sposta. If a single dice with cantrip style scaling is too complicated for the masses, then that does not bode well for any future content, period...
EDIT: Finished watching it the whole way through. It sounds like they aren't completely disregarding what psionics aficionados are asking for, but this still does not bode well.
FURTHER EDIT: Aaaaaand, now I'm reading comments from people complaining they didn't fill out the survey forms. Come on, people...
Shit, I took the survey twice.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Yeah same here. I don't think this mechanic was perfect, but it was solid, and workable.
The sad thing is, I'm pretty sure with a couple of tweaks, a very similar mechanic could have worked. The main objections to the die mechanic seemed to be:
1) It's a unique mechanic, and people don't like those (surprising to me but okay).
2) The fact that it could stop working seemed to upset a lot of people or make them anxious.
3) The fact that the increases/decreases were random seemed to be the focus of a lot of negativity.
4) Not something I've seen people say, but I think on a less-conscious level, a lot of people really hated that "roll low = good thing happens", and "roll high = bad thing happens" aspect of the mechanic, because it goes against literally everything in 5E's design. I get the logic of it, but... I sort of agree.
I think the solution would have been to make the Psi die a fixed value, and only decrease or increase based on voluntary actions taken by the PC (if at all!). They should also have made some of the "Psi die" abilities be Stat Mod/rest, rather than decreasing the die or the like. If they'd done that, people wouldn't have seen it as a "unique mechanic" and been upset by it, and people wouldn't have objected to the other aspects, and we'd have at least two Psi subclasses basically ready to go (with the Sorcerer just needing "more mucus" lol).
Sadly I never got to take the survey, because it crashed on me repeatedly, then said I'd taken it, which wasn't great (never happened with other surveys).
I'm not even mad at the developers. I'm mad at people who thought the Psi Dice was cool but couldn't be bothered to fill out the survey. Back when I worked at a restaurant, we were told at a meeting that customers who have a bad experience are more likely to tell others than customers who have a good experience. So if you like a UA, post your feedback, because the people who hate it most certainly will be.
This might mean a return of the older sorcerer with the mucus as stated in the video lol which is cool I liked that so much better then the last sorcerer.
This^^
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
I loved the Aberrant Mind! I want it back!
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
Spells, Monsters, Subclasses, Races, Arcknight Class, Occultist Class, World, Enigmatic Esoterica forms
Maybe they’ll revisit the Mystic too!
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Or at least a psionic class.
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
Spells, Monsters, Subclasses, Races, Arcknight Class, Occultist Class, World, Enigmatic Esoterica forms