i think its just i don't understand why people are so up in arms about having an entire class just to be based around a damage type and the ability to move stuff with your mind. It feels very redundant to me, and in all honesty not something as see as fitting into the High Fantasy world that is Dungeons and Dragons
It isn't just doing psychic damage and telekinesis, it is manipulating the world with your mind. It's speaking telepathically, moving objects with your mind, psychically blasting others, shifting the nature of the world all with psychic power.
It is present in many D&D worlds, Eberron, Dark Sun, and Forgotten Realms. It is connected especially to the Far Realm.
I think the fact is that it is so alien and familiar that draws people in. There's something about it that surprisingly fits in well with a fantasy world, IMO though.
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i think its just i don't understand why people are so up in arms about having an entire class just to be based around a damage type and the ability to move stuff with your mind. It feels very redundant to me, and in all honesty not something as see as fitting into the High Fantasy world that is Dungeons and Dragons
Psionics has been in every edition of D&D.
While yes Forgotten Realms is a High Fantasy setting, there are a dozen other settings not counting Homebrew settings that exist.
Soulknife: Psi-Bolstered Knack is a gem, and possibly worth the price of admission if you want to play a rogue that doesn't particularly need a subclass i.e. an archer (with the new cunning action) or a charmer - basically just a common rogue with brilliant intuition. Psychic Whispers is fun, but telepathy is also everywhere at the moment and surely a bit tiresome at the table after a point. Psychic Blades continues to be for very specific campaigns/scenarios, and I'm not a fan of them personally because it just tends to suit solo jaunts (same as disguising armor as clothes... when standing next to party members in plate armor). Beyond that just RNG, and waiting till level 13 to get self-targeting Invisibility that eats up subclass resources.
How are what are effectively daggers that deal psychic damage (one of the least resisted damage types) and that you can just make when you need them, for very specific campaigns/scenarios? Unless you're facing swaths of enemies with psychic damage resistance/immunity, I can't think of a campaign where these blades won't be useful.
Rogues are all-or-nothing attackers due to Sneak Attack, so passing up even a vanilla +1 weapon for a superior damage type is a very tough call - and unless the DM has a habit of throwing NPC barbarian foes around, psychic damage is not statistically superior to magical piercing damage against monsters (particularly as monsters may resist magical piercing but if they are anti-psychic they'll be straight-up immune to it).
The 2nd attack option of Psychic Blades is only likely to be for melee team-ups, since still need to hide between every attack otherwise. Disappearing blades that leave no mark is only likely to be relevant in campaigns/scenarios where the rogue is off on a solo jaunt or the entire party needs to be equally discrete, and RAW there are tons of spells that can kill just as subtly. Wrapping up the whole package on offer, it just amounts to Bolts from the Grave with 1d6 more damage and a ton of caveats; requires Sneak Attack set-up, requires free hands, requires Action...
I don't think it is awful by any stretch, but like Path of the Beast (and perhaps even The Returned too) i.m.o. it is a UA pattern of giving super-cool subclass defining features at level 3 that simply fizzle out when magic weapons show up.
Psi-Talent die Overall: I like that they came up with a new mechanic. I think it will be kind of frustrating early on, since you have such a high chance to roll max on the die, but that's the point. At early levels you are supposed to have strong limitations. Would like some clarification as to if you can use psi-replenishment (or whatever it's called) to restore your die from completely spent (rolled 4 don d4)
Psi-Knight, pretty cool, a good focus on forced movement and defense with just a touch of extra damage.
Soul Knife: I like the psi-knack, since that is part of what rogues do, wish they brought more into that later, like letting you get temporary expertise in a skill you don't already have it in by lowering your psi-talent die. and as has been stated, It is a little over relight on the soul blade. IF they could throw in "you can coat any light finesse weapon you use with psychic energy and half of the damage done with it will be psychic and it will count as your soul-knife" that would solve the issue of getting no +x on to hit rolls.
Psionic Soul Sorcerer: I like that they added some things to do with your sorcery points, some nice flavors, but with no additional spells added to their list at least, it's a bit underwealming. it should have some spells from the Bard spell list thrown in there.
i think its just i don't understand why people are so up in arms about having an entire class just to be based around a damage type and the ability to move stuff with your mind. It feels very redundant to me, and in all honesty not something as see as fitting into the High Fantasy world that is Dungeons and Dragons
Psionics isn’t just about psychic damage and telekinesis. The Complete Psionics Handbook came out the same year I started D&Ding (1991). The first negative reaction I ever had about D&D was toward the Vancian system of magic. Psionics offered a great alternative to that Vancian system, and has for every edition of the game I have played until now. The 5e system of Vancian magic is way better than it was back in 2e, but it is still my least favorite part of the game. Psionics has always represented that D&D “counter culture” to me. That’s where it’s roots have always been: “Magic without Spells.” To take that away from the game is to take something away from what it has always meant to the game, and the people who play it.
Punishing players for using an ability/Rolling high.
Rolling max damage in 5e is seen as a good thing the vast vast vast majority of the time- WHy make it bad this time?
Using the ability puts you at risk for losing it for the day- Why discourage people from using the ability?
Yes I know you use an ability when you use it but you know for sure if you have 3 uses of something per day that you will get 3 uses...this is uncertain and every time you use it you have a chance to make it less powerful/be gone completely
Taking away player agency around power use
The mechanic (at least for some of the uses) does not allow you to chose when your power die decreases, rather it is done via chance.
Changing it to you get to choose when to overcharge your Psi Die and get the max roll but then it decreases would be a better choice IMO.
Variability of output over a given day
You could use your powers infinitely all day with no drop in die power....or you could lose it in 2 uses.
Not knowing how much you will get to use your powers for an entire day is frustrating and counter-intuitive to the rest of 5e design. Its poor design overall IMO.
Yes I know the math suggests that you wont likely lose your uses in 2 rolls...but a chance is a chance and could happen.
Overall I think the basic idea of a die dropping in power is ok...but the mechanics need to be changed to address the above.
I think the wild talent feat that grants you die should make your die 1 size larger if you have a class feature that grants a psychic die, so if your a variant human with the wild talent feat and a psychic sorcerer at level 1 have a d6 instead of a d4 as your base die.
The Psionic Talent die already starts at a d6, and increasing that even further is too much. A d6 already gives you an average of 16 rolls before you bust, so that's 32 rolls per day with Psi Replenishment.
The math for starting with a d8 is kinda complicated but suffice to say it becomes really hard to go below a d4 since you're just as likely to go back up a size as you are to go down a size and now you have two chances to go back up. You're starting with a 1/8 chance of going down a size, then you have a 1/6 chance of going down and a 1/6 chance of going up, then a 1/4 chance of losing your die and a 1/4 chance of going up. It takes a lot of rolls to reach that failure state and then you use Psi Replenishment and just start over.
Basically every die size you go up makes it exponentially harder to lose your psionic talent die (though this is offset by the stronger abilities always shrinking your die.) Since the starting d6 is already very generous and Wild Talent lets your die scale with character level instead of class level which is also very generous, stacking them in any way would be absolute overkill.
What if the player had a choice when using Psionic Talent die?
Roll the die and take what's rolled. No die change on a 1 or 6
or
Don't roll and take a 6 but the next time they want to use it, it's at a lower die
or
Don't roll and take a 1 and the next time it is at a higher die
The challenge here is that some of the features are just straight up "shrink your die to use this ability."
It seems to me like every subclass should have a feature like the Sorcerer's Psi Replenishment. (EDIT: They do. I just fail at reading comprehension.) At the risk of overusing a mechanic (sorry Yurei), maybe you get X uses a day where you can increase your Psi die. (Where X is . . . I dunno, Int modifier? Con modifier? Half class level? The number of brains you've consumed?) It gives that measure of control that seems to be absent from the mechanic otherwise.
I think the wild talent feat that grants you die should make your die 1 size larger if you have a class feature that grants a psychic die, so if your a variant human with the wild talent feat and a psychic sorcerer at level 1 have a d6 instead of a d4 as your base die.
The Psionic Talent die already starts at a d6, and increasing that even further is too much. A d6 already gives you an average of 16 rolls before you bust, so that's 32 rolls per day with Psi Replenishment.
The math for starting with a d8 is kinda complicated but suffice to say it becomes really hard to go below a d4 since you're just as likely to go back up a size as you are to go down a size. You're starting with a 1/8 chance of going down a size, then you have a 2/3 chance of staying the same, a 1/6 chance of going down and a 1/6 chance of going up. If you go up you're back to another 8 rolls on average before you go back down. If you go down to a d4 you still have a 1/2 chance of staying at that size and a 1/4 chance of going back up to the d6.
Basically every die size you go up makes it exponentially harder to lose your psionic talent die (though this is offset by the stronger abilities always shrinking your die.) Since the starting d6 is already very generous and Wild Talent lets your die scale with character level instead of class level which is also very generous, stacking them in any way would be absolute overkill.
For me its less about the Math and more about the feeling. You roll max three times in a row thats usually a time of celebration but for you it means you are done for the day with your subclass. You also dont get to choose when your power is "tapped". The flavor they give is you "holding back" but you literally arent choosing to do it....the dice are. It takes away agency in your character and is backwards design logic.
Statistically its not super likely but you want to use abilties/features with confidence and this does not really invoke that for me.
I would never sit at a d4 unless I HAD to as the currently language of the Psi Refresh is not clear if it actually allows you to use the die even if you take it back to its actual size.
i personally dont care about the mystic, and would almost say that i dont want it so i cannot say i agree with you there
Is there any reason why you don't care about it?
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i think its just i don't understand why people are so up in arms about having an entire class just to be based around a damage type and the ability to move stuff with your mind. It feels very redundant to me, and in all honesty not something as see as fitting into the High Fantasy world that is Dungeons and Dragons
It isn't just doing psychic damage and telekinesis, it is manipulating the world with your mind. It's speaking telepathically, moving objects with your mind, psychically blasting others, shifting the nature of the world all with psychic power.
It is present in many D&D worlds, Eberron, Dark Sun, and Forgotten Realms. It is connected especially to the Far Realm.
I think the fact is that it is so alien and familiar that draws people in. There's something about it that surprisingly fits in well with a fantasy world, IMO though.
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
Spells, Monsters, Subclasses, Races, Arcknight Class, Occultist Class, World, Enigmatic Esoterica forms
Psionics has been in every edition of D&D.
While yes Forgotten Realms is a High Fantasy setting, there are a dozen other settings not counting Homebrew settings that exist.
She/Her Player and Dungeon Master
I pretty much decided that this UA sucked the moment I saw that Psychic Blast was removed. I liked that spell.
After reading through the entire entry, I believe it can be summed up thusly:
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Rogues are all-or-nothing attackers due to Sneak Attack, so passing up even a vanilla +1 weapon for a superior damage type is a very tough call - and unless the DM has a habit of throwing NPC barbarian foes around, psychic damage is not statistically superior to magical piercing damage against monsters (particularly as monsters may resist magical piercing but if they are anti-psychic they'll be straight-up immune to it).
The 2nd attack option of Psychic Blades is only likely to be for melee team-ups, since still need to hide between every attack otherwise. Disappearing blades that leave no mark is only likely to be relevant in campaigns/scenarios where the rogue is off on a solo jaunt or the entire party needs to be equally discrete, and RAW there are tons of spells that can kill just as subtly. Wrapping up the whole package on offer, it just amounts to Bolts from the Grave with 1d6 more damage and a ton of caveats; requires Sneak Attack set-up, requires free hands, requires Action...
I don't think it is awful by any stretch, but like Path of the Beast (and perhaps even The Returned too) i.m.o. it is a UA pattern of giving super-cool subclass defining features at level 3 that simply fizzle out when magic weapons show up.
Don't like it at all. The fighter is kind of jedi like. That is ok. But none of them feel distinguished, or different from the other psi subclasses.
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Psi-Talent die Overall: I like that they came up with a new mechanic. I think it will be kind of frustrating early on, since you have such a high chance to roll max on the die, but that's the point. At early levels you are supposed to have strong limitations. Would like some clarification as to if you can use psi-replenishment (or whatever it's called) to restore your die from completely spent (rolled 4 don d4)
Psi-Knight, pretty cool, a good focus on forced movement and defense with just a touch of extra damage.
Soul Knife: I like the psi-knack, since that is part of what rogues do, wish they brought more into that later, like letting you get temporary expertise in a skill you don't already have it in by lowering your psi-talent die. and as has been stated, It is a little over relight on the soul blade. IF they could throw in "you can coat any light finesse weapon you use with psychic energy and half of the damage done with it will be psychic and it will count as your soul-knife" that would solve the issue of getting no +x on to hit rolls.
Psionic Soul Sorcerer: I like that they added some things to do with your sorcery points, some nice flavors, but with no additional spells added to their list at least, it's a bit underwealming. it should have some spells from the Bard spell list thrown in there.
Psionics isn’t just about psychic damage and telekinesis. The Complete Psionics Handbook came out the same year I started D&Ding (1991). The first negative reaction I ever had about D&D was toward the Vancian system of magic. Psionics offered a great alternative to that Vancian system, and has for every edition of the game I have played until now. The 5e system of Vancian magic is way better than it was back in 2e, but it is still my least favorite part of the game. Psionics has always represented that D&D “counter culture” to me. That’s where it’s roots have always been: “Magic without Spells.” To take that away from the game is to take something away from what it has always meant to the game, and the people who play it.
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Reasons I do not like the Psi Dice Mechanic
Overall I think the basic idea of a die dropping in power is ok...but the mechanics need to be changed to address the above.
Everything you hate about it is exactly everything I love about it. This is the most interesting mechanic in all of 5e.
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Its design is very Anti-5e. If that is what they are going for they nailed it.
Oh?
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I know, isn’t it refreshing!?!
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The Psionic Talent die already starts at a d6, and increasing that even further is too much. A d6 already gives you an average of 16 rolls before you bust, so that's 32 rolls per day with Psi Replenishment.
The math for starting with a d8 is kinda complicated but suffice to say it becomes really hard to go below a d4 since you're just as likely to go back up a size as you are to go down a size and now you have two chances to go back up. You're starting with a 1/8 chance of going down a size, then you have a 1/6 chance of going down and a 1/6 chance of going up, then a 1/4 chance of losing your die and a 1/4 chance of going up. It takes a lot of rolls to reach that failure state and then you use Psi Replenishment and just start over.
Basically every die size you go up makes it exponentially harder to lose your psionic talent die (though this is offset by the stronger abilities always shrinking your die.) Since the starting d6 is already very generous and Wild Talent lets your die scale with character level instead of class level which is also very generous, stacking them in any way would be absolute overkill.
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No not really IMO.
My favorite parts of 5e are play agency and balance at low/mid tier. This is bad for both of those.
Yes
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The challenge here is that some of the features are just straight up "shrink your die to use this ability."
It seems to me like every subclass should have a feature like the Sorcerer's Psi Replenishment. (EDIT: They do. I just fail at reading comprehension.) At the risk of overusing a mechanic (sorry Yurei), maybe you get X uses a day where you can increase your Psi die. (Where X is . . . I dunno, Int modifier? Con modifier? Half class level? The number of brains you've consumed?) It gives that measure of control that seems to be absent from the mechanic otherwise.
For me its less about the Math and more about the feeling. You roll max three times in a row thats usually a time of celebration but for you it means you are done for the day with your subclass. You also dont get to choose when your power is "tapped". The flavor they give is you "holding back" but you literally arent choosing to do it....the dice are. It takes away agency in your character and is backwards design logic.
Statistically its not super likely but you want to use abilties/features with confidence and this does not really invoke that for me.
I would never sit at a d4 unless I HAD to as the currently language of the Psi Refresh is not clear if it actually allows you to use the die even if you take it back to its actual size.