My friend is incredibly stupid when it comes to DnD. He has tried to kill nobles in public to get there money and when he gets jailed by guards he get mad at the dnd and calls it stupid, just to want to play it again the next day. The latest thing he did was try to rob a casino owner at knife point in the middle of his casino, surrounded by at least 20 guards https://100001****/https://1921681254.mx/. What do I do to help him have a character in my campaign that doesn’t die every other session. We had 4 sessions and he is on character #3
Have you spoken to this player about how, even though it's a fantasy game, there are consequences to actions? It sounds like, as opposed to being the classic 'Murder Hobo', they sound like the 'Mad Scientist' described in Matt Colville's video Different Kinds of Players | Running the Game.
Talk to the player - regardless of whether you're the player or the DM, tell them that their behaviour is very disruptive and is ruining the run for you. If they still can't see the error of their ways, it may be best to boot them from the game or play a different game entirely. As has often been said, no DnD is better than bad Dnd.
The other approach is, if you're doing a homebrew game, maybe let them be a Mad Scientist player. Take out the social intrigue and complex plot and just run them through a monster filled dungeon. Of course, if you're the DM and that's not a game you want to run, then refer to the boot player/different game scenario.
Of course, this is advice from someone who doesn't know your group and only has one side of the story. Do the other players feel the same?
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Have a conversation with him. Explain to him that this isn’t GTA, that there are consequences to what his character does. Explain that this isn’t the type of game where a PC can do any foolish thing that pops into the players mind and just expect to get away with it, but that it’s instead a game about telling a story. And the next time he gets his character arrested don’t let him just roll up a new one, but instead make him play his PC in prison.
My friend is incredibly stupid when it comes to DnD. He has tried to kill nobles in public to get there money and when he gets jailed by guards he get mad at the dnd and calls it stupid, just to want to play it again the next day. The latest thing he did was try to rob a casino owner at knife point in the middle of his casino, surrounded by at least 20 guards. What do I do to help him have a character in my campaign that doesn’t die every other session. We had 4 sessions and he is on character #3
counter intuitively, i'd recommend introducing their next character with some extra attention. people point, stare, and close their doors to this guy. or maybe he's super attractive. clearly here stands a main character and he is seen. basically, find or invent an aspect of this character that gets noticed and commented on often. like, really often. and it doesn't have to be a slave's forehead brand, it could also be... eyes of wildly different colors, a purple broken nose, handsome claw marks across their face, savagely protruding tusks or fangs, zebra-striped skin, curly blond pigtails and painted rosy cheeks, a constantly flicking lizard tongue he denies having, an expensive but dusty dress-jacket they found that's of the colors of a recently exiled unpopular noble, reading glasses, mirror sunglasses, geordi laforge visor but with a menacing red glow, illusory green fire instead of hair, etc... and he will be a (small) part of every conversation. every time. even if it's just "yikes other-party-member, your [smiley/frowny/glowing] friend gives me the creeps." to feel like he's still in the game. if you don't give him attention from the main NPC addressing the party, then he's likely to pull attention. if you don't give him attention from the background people (merchant guards tightening their grip then continuing to scan the crowd, tavern bouncer giving him a nod as if to equals, shopkeeper clutching their pearls), then he might not even be able to process that those background people can see him anymore than the chandelier or vase of flowers the dm mentioned when painting the scene.
this probably sounds like it would make things worse and there certainly are people you shouldn't encourage this way. but just like attention deficit disorder therapies affect differently the brain of the intended patient than the brain of any random skittle eaters, this might just counter-intuitively solve the problem calmly and immediately. also, it's something you can totally expect to phase out after it clicks for him that he's part of a team in a world. if that sounds a little too out-there, then alternatively let him start with a big fancy item they think is powerful and want to protect rather than lose. get him thinking about consequences. not a weapon or he'll use it. maybe a shiny helm of the gods (Nylea) and then point out a celestial masquerading as human in the market. they disappear before he can get close but now maybe he'll be attentive for another chance to be a part of some perceived plot... whether that's true or not. definitely won't want to lose it to guards or bandits before he can uncover a hidden devil or something. maybe?
basically, my advice is give the guy one more chance and both of you really try. tell the player it's their last chance. express a goal of every character in the party working with the others as a team that wants to be a team. nothing i said above is going to result in a healthy and happy table if communication was the problem all along.
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My friend is incredibly stupid when it comes to DnD. He has tried to kill nobles in public to get there money and when he gets jailed by guards he get mad at the dnd and calls it stupid, just to want to play it again the next day. The latest thing he did was try to rob a casino owner at knife point in the middle of his casino, surrounded by at least 20 guards. What do I do to help him have a character in my campaign that doesn’t die every other session. We had 4 sessions and he is on character #3
Boot him and have him watch the other players play. Try to teach him how to play through example.
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I wanted to put something funny but I couldn’t think of anything.
Like some others have said, this calls for an out of character conversation. Be very blunt so you can be sure he understands. Something along the lines of “Dude, you’re being a jerk and it’s making the game less fun for everyone. Stop.”
Then, if he doesn’t stop, that’s when you kick him. But I’d give him a warning first.
Talk to the guy and let him know how disruptive he is being for the game.
There is a possibility that he just wants to kill stuff like a Diablo type game. This is ok, some folks are like that. But the GM has to run this style of game.
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"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
Run a solo mission with him. Make him escape from prison. Leave town and get a new identity. Being a known criminal sucks. If he dies in the attempt then he does not get to play anymore. Explain to him that is the only way he can keep playing.
If he makes a better attempt at playing then let him live and rejoin the party.
We had a player who was robbing the other party members sometimes at blade point. Until he was called out for it by another party member and and was killed for it. The player didn't like it at all and quit.
Don't listen to all the people jumping straight to booting him, throwing him in prison, etc. That's easy for people on forums to say because to us he's some random guy playing DnD completely wrong, but that's not how anyone would treat someone who was actually their friend.
I agree with the people saying to keep talking to him out of the game about how it's not how DnD works, he's being disruptive, etc. Also whenever he's wanting to do something really stupid, try giving him an indication that he's bound to fail and ask "are you SURE your character really wants to do that", and let him walk his decision back if he changes his mind. That might be enough to nudge him in the right direction if he wants to learn but is just new to DnD and doesn't really get it yet
Another tactic that can work is once the party is getting higher in level and finding powerful magic items, make sure he realizes he'll fall way behind the rest of the party if he keeps dying and making new characters with no money and items. I've seen this work with disruptive players who fully understand how DnD works but just love pushing the DM's buttons because they aren't afraid of the consequences. Falling behind on character power is a powerful consequence for most players
Tell him he's not playing GTA Medieval. Aks if he understands that is a cooperative RPG. If not explain him it's not about entertaining himself with stupid stunts. If he continues, kill his character off (Guards etc.) and say you're sorry that he died as consequence of his characters reckless actions and tell him to roll up a new one. Rinse and repeat.
Have a conversation with him. Explain to him that this isn’t GTA, that there are consequences to what his character does. Explain that this isn’t the type of game where a PC can do any foolish thing that pops into the players mind and just expect to get away with it, but that it’s instead a game about telling a story. And the next time he gets his character arrested don’t let him just roll up a new one, but instead make him play his PC in prison.
Hell, even in GTA you get a wanted star when you pull stuff like this. It's not like he's deriving this behavior from a video game mentality, because video games punish this type of behavior as well. Maybe point out to him that there's no such thing as a game that let's you do whatever you want whenever you want with no difficulty or thought to the rules or interior structure. In order to BE a game, there need to be limitations imposed on the player that they need to work within the framework of, from which fun is generated. Explain that no game, especially not dnd, is just four people sitting around a table telling a story about how cool and powerful and good-looking your character is. That's not a game, that's Sword Art Online, and it's kinda cringe.
There is no wrong way to play D&D provided everyone at the table is having a good time
I strongly advise that you avoid saying, "You are being a jerk and doing it wrong!"
Instead, try the approach of "There are a lot of ways to play D&D and I don't think we match up as a player and DM. You like to play pretty wild, violent, and evil, and I have more fun with people who want to immerse themselves in the setting and story that I work hard on. I don't see us as a match but am willing to give you a chance to try playing in a way that suits my table at our next session. If that doesn't work out, I'm going to have to let you go so you can find a DM who enjoys D&D the way you do."
There's no reason to use any language that's conflict based. Nobody is doing it wrong - but you two aren't a match and giving him one last chance before you cut bait is generous and clear.
I'd also let the other players at the table know that this person is getting one last chance and then being asked to find a different DM. That way they know you are addressing the disruptions this player is causing.
Your friend isn't stupid, he just doesn't take the game seriously. Explain to him that you do. The first response nailed it with the reference to Colville's Mad Scientist player. Some people are introduced to The Game Where You Can Do Anything and feel compelled to see how far they can push that concept. You just need to sit everyone down and align your expectations for the game.
My friend is incredibly stupid when it comes to DnD. He has tried to kill nobles in public to get there money and when he gets jailed by guards he get mad at the dnd and calls it stupid, just to want to play it again the next day. The latest thing he did was try to rob a casino owner at knife point in the middle of his casino, surrounded by at least 20 guards https://100001****/ https://1921681254.mx/ . What do I do to help him have a character in my campaign that doesn’t die every other session. We had 4 sessions and he is on character #3
Have you spoken to this player about how, even though it's a fantasy game, there are consequences to actions? It sounds like, as opposed to being the classic 'Murder Hobo', they sound like the 'Mad Scientist' described in Matt Colville's video Different Kinds of Players | Running the Game.
Talk to the player - regardless of whether you're the player or the DM, tell them that their behaviour is very disruptive and is ruining the run for you. If they still can't see the error of their ways, it may be best to boot them from the game or play a different game entirely. As has often been said, no DnD is better than bad Dnd.
The other approach is, if you're doing a homebrew game, maybe let them be a Mad Scientist player. Take out the social intrigue and complex plot and just run them through a monster filled dungeon. Of course, if you're the DM and that's not a game you want to run, then refer to the boot player/different game scenario.
Of course, this is advice from someone who doesn't know your group and only has one side of the story. Do the other players feel the same?
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Boot the player from your game. Tell them very clearly why you are doing it.
Have a conversation with him. Explain to him that this isn’t GTA, that there are consequences to what his character does. Explain that this isn’t the type of game where a PC can do any foolish thing that pops into the players mind and just expect to get away with it, but that it’s instead a game about telling a story. And the next time he gets his character arrested don’t let him just roll up a new one, but instead make him play his PC in prison.
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counter intuitively, i'd recommend introducing their next character with some extra attention. people point, stare, and close their doors to this guy. or maybe he's super attractive. clearly here stands a main character and he is seen. basically, find or invent an aspect of this character that gets noticed and commented on often. like, really often. and it doesn't have to be a slave's forehead brand, it could also be... eyes of wildly different colors, a purple broken nose, handsome claw marks across their face, savagely protruding tusks or fangs, zebra-striped skin, curly blond pigtails and painted rosy cheeks, a constantly flicking lizard tongue he denies having, an expensive but dusty dress-jacket they found that's of the colors of a recently exiled unpopular noble, reading glasses, mirror sunglasses, geordi laforge visor but with a menacing red glow, illusory green fire instead of hair, etc... and he will be a (small) part of every conversation. every time. even if it's just "yikes other-party-member, your [smiley/frowny/glowing] friend gives me the creeps." to feel like he's still in the game. if you don't give him attention from the main NPC addressing the party, then he's likely to pull attention. if you don't give him attention from the background people (merchant guards tightening their grip then continuing to scan the crowd, tavern bouncer giving him a nod as if to equals, shopkeeper clutching their pearls), then he might not even be able to process that those background people can see him anymore than the chandelier or vase of flowers the dm mentioned when painting the scene.
this probably sounds like it would make things worse and there certainly are people you shouldn't encourage this way. but just like attention deficit disorder therapies affect differently the brain of the intended patient than the brain of any random skittle eaters, this might just counter-intuitively solve the problem calmly and immediately. also, it's something you can totally expect to phase out after it clicks for him that he's part of a team in a world. if that sounds a little too out-there, then alternatively let him start with a big fancy item they think is powerful and want to protect rather than lose. get him thinking about consequences. not a weapon or he'll use it. maybe a shiny helm of the gods (Nylea) and then point out a celestial masquerading as human in the market. they disappear before he can get close but now maybe he'll be attentive for another chance to be a part of some perceived plot... whether that's true or not. definitely won't want to lose it to guards or bandits before he can uncover a hidden devil or something. maybe?
basically, my advice is give the guy one more chance and both of you really try. tell the player it's their last chance. express a goal of every character in the party working with the others as a team that wants to be a team. nothing i said above is going to result in a healthy and happy table if communication was the problem all along.
unhappy at the way in which we lost individual purchases for one-off subclasses, magic items, and monsters?
tell them you don't like features disappeared quietly in the night: provide feedback!
Boot him and have him watch the other players play. Try to teach him how to play through example.
I wanted to put something funny but I couldn’t think of anything.
Like some others have said, this calls for an out of character conversation. Be very blunt so you can be sure he understands. Something along the lines of “Dude, you’re being a jerk and it’s making the game less fun for everyone. Stop.”
Then, if he doesn’t stop, that’s when you kick him. But I’d give him a warning first.
Talk to the guy and let him know how disruptive he is being for the game.
There is a possibility that he just wants to kill stuff like a Diablo type game. This is ok, some folks are like that. But the GM has to run this style of game.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Do not let him have a new character.
Run a solo mission with him. Make him escape from prison. Leave town and get a new identity. Being a known criminal sucks. If he dies in the attempt then he does not get to play anymore. Explain to him that is the only way he can keep playing.
If he makes a better attempt at playing then let him live and rejoin the party.
We had a player who was robbing the other party members sometimes at blade point. Until he was called out for it by another party member and and was killed for it. The player didn't like it at all and quit.
Don't listen to all the people jumping straight to booting him, throwing him in prison, etc. That's easy for people on forums to say because to us he's some random guy playing DnD completely wrong, but that's not how anyone would treat someone who was actually their friend.
I agree with the people saying to keep talking to him out of the game about how it's not how DnD works, he's being disruptive, etc. Also whenever he's wanting to do something really stupid, try giving him an indication that he's bound to fail and ask "are you SURE your character really wants to do that", and let him walk his decision back if he changes his mind. That might be enough to nudge him in the right direction if he wants to learn but is just new to DnD and doesn't really get it yet
Another tactic that can work is once the party is getting higher in level and finding powerful magic items, make sure he realizes he'll fall way behind the rest of the party if he keeps dying and making new characters with no money and items. I've seen this work with disruptive players who fully understand how DnD works but just love pushing the DM's buttons because they aren't afraid of the consequences. Falling behind on character power is a powerful consequence for most players
Tell him he's not playing GTA Medieval. Aks if he understands that is a cooperative RPG. If not explain him it's not about entertaining himself with stupid stunts. If he continues, kill his character off (Guards etc.) and say you're sorry that he died as consequence of his characters reckless actions and tell him to roll up a new one. Rinse and repeat.
Hell, even in GTA you get a wanted star when you pull stuff like this. It's not like he's deriving this behavior from a video game mentality, because video games punish this type of behavior as well. Maybe point out to him that there's no such thing as a game that let's you do whatever you want whenever you want with no difficulty or thought to the rules or interior structure. In order to BE a game, there need to be limitations imposed on the player that they need to work within the framework of, from which fun is generated. Explain that no game, especially not dnd, is just four people sitting around a table telling a story about how cool and powerful and good-looking your character is. That's not a game, that's Sword Art Online, and it's kinda cringe.
A key thing that nobody has said so far...
There is no wrong way to play D&D provided everyone at the table is having a good time
I strongly advise that you avoid saying, "You are being a jerk and doing it wrong!"
Instead, try the approach of "There are a lot of ways to play D&D and I don't think we match up as a player and DM. You like to play pretty wild, violent, and evil, and I have more fun with people who want to immerse themselves in the setting and story that I work hard on. I don't see us as a match but am willing to give you a chance to try playing in a way that suits my table at our next session. If that doesn't work out, I'm going to have to let you go so you can find a DM who enjoys D&D the way you do."
There's no reason to use any language that's conflict based. Nobody is doing it wrong - but you two aren't a match and giving him one last chance before you cut bait is generous and clear.
I'd also let the other players at the table know that this person is getting one last chance and then being asked to find a different DM. That way they know you are addressing the disruptions this player is causing.
Because the second clause in that sentence is the issue.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
He either needs to play an evil campaign, or go play GTA..
Enjoy your slop. I'll be enjoying good products elsewhere.
Your friend isn't stupid, he just doesn't take the game seriously. Explain to him that you do. The first response nailed it with the reference to Colville's Mad Scientist player. Some people are introduced to The Game Where You Can Do Anything and feel compelled to see how far they can push that concept. You just need to sit everyone down and align your expectations for the game.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm