Lose all your players spells and magic items two weeks early because we dont believe in consent and our leadership figured no one would buy the new stuff if they can still use the old.
Since there's an obvious troll who is clogging the replies with repeated massive quote blocks, let me clarify:
i am someone who wants the 2024 rules, I like most of the improvements. I STILL object to the outright REMOVAL of our access to the functionality of the character builder by removing the items/spells/etc. Whether you love or hate the 2024 rules, whether they give you anything for free fundamentally does not address the change they are making to the base line usage of this entire system.
The reason people are so heated up, and rightfully so, is that just because "it's still in the compendium" is not the same thing as using the functions of the website. You cannot except every single player who wants that functionality to homebrew every last spell and item they are currently using when DnDB has shown time and again that they have the capability to differentiate between multiple items with the same base names. It would literally be easier from a databasing standpoint to label all the existing content on the builder from 2014 as legacy than the overwriting and replacing they are purposing. If this was a storage issue (which is assuredly is not), then it will only get worse with thousands upon thousands of users who would need to create individual entries for each spell/item, all for themselves rather than having the same already existing functions and content remain in place along side the new 2024 variations.
You did not have to make this difficult. You have the technology and know-how. Fix it!
This is a hilarious "clarification." You know full well that people who want to continue using the 2014 rules in the character creator aren't going to be happy with being told that actually, everyone is getting a "free upgrade" of all the spells and we should all be grateful for having the old content taken away. Try again and this time please actually listen to our feedback and walk this change back.
It literally won't be impossible, as stated now by 2 separate official statements and breakdowns on the how and why. I don't understand how you people can read something that definitively says "Here's how to do the thing you want to do" and so confidently scream "IT'S IMPOSSIBLE! YOU'RE RUINING/TAKING AWAY EVERYTHING!". But, then again, I've been silently watching this community do it since I was 12.
Edit: Just making a note here to expect the future of this conversation to keep repeating "taking away what I paid for" and "removing content" despite neither of those things happening. Someone already responded with a "pay an intern overtime to make it work" and that tells me all I need to know about you folks.
What do you mean by you folks?
(Sidenote: Get out a dictionary and look up "hyperbole" and "comprehension".)
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock) Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric) Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue) Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
i am someone who wants the 2024 rules, I like most of the improvements. I STILL object to the outright REMOVAL of our access to the functionality of the character builder by removing the items/spells/etc. Whether you love or hate the 2024 rules, whether they give you anything for free fundamentally does not address the change they are making to the base line usage of this entire system.
Hear hear!
My games are on the current ruleset. Moving to 5.5 is not a utility to me.
In fact, on a personal level, I would be fine with WotC reneging on giving free 5.5 versions of spells/items so long as I could keep my current spells and items. (I understand other might be ticked, now that they've promised it. But this is my personal take.)
If I wanted the 5.5 spells and items then I would've purchased the 5.5 books. But I like my current 5.0 spells and items and all that jazz.
And even for those moving on to 5.5, lots of them want to have time to make that transition.
right? They didn’t clarify anything. They just confirmed that we won’t have the spells on our character sheets anymore. I just canceled my master tier annul subscription. I’ll have to wrap my 3 weekly campaigns by November 25! Gives me time to also learn a new system.
Yesterday, we released a Changelog detailing the upcoming updates to the D&D Beyond site. We have been listening to your feedback and want to provide some important clarifications regarding spells, magic items, and access to the 2014 Core Rulebook compendiums. We also would like to provide clarity on the partnered content we’ve brought to D&D Beyond.
2014 Rulebook Compendiums
Players will not lose access to their 2014 content in the Compendium. 2014 content will continue to be accessible on the D&D Beyond site and available for purchase after the release of the 2024 Core Rulebook. The information in them will remain unchanged, and players will not lose access to any of their 2014 content.
Free Rules
We will be releasing D&D Free Rules (2024) covering similar content as the 2014 Free Basic Rules, with more details to come pending the release of the Player’s Handbook. Players will not need to buy the 2024 Core Rulebooks to access Free Rules (2024). The Free Rules (2024) will not require an account or purchase to use or view. Content that was free in the 2014 Free Basic Rules will remain free when the D&D Free Rules (2024) are released. We will also add new Spells and Feats in the D&D Free Rules (2024).
Spells
When updated, Spell descriptions on character sheets will default to 2024 Core Rulebook descriptions. All users, regardless of whether they have purchased the 2024 Player’s Handbook, will be able to access these updated Spells for free if they previously purchased the 2014 Player’s Handbook. All 2014 versions of Spells will still be accessible in the D&D Beyond Compendium and available for players to access.
Magic Items
All users, regardless of whether they have purchased the 2024 rulebooks, will be able to access updated magic items for free if they have previously purchased the 2014 Player’s Handbook.
Only two magic items are impacted by the 2024 update, with minor changes to their text: Potion of Healing and Spell Scroll. The 2014 versions of these items will still be accessible in the D&D Beyond Compendium. We will evaluate upcoming changes to other magic items with the release of the 2024 Dungeon Master’s Guide.
Partnered Content
We have been working with our partners ahead of these changes to ensure that their content will remain compatible with D&D Beyond’s updates. Our partners have made amazing content that we are proud to have on D&D Beyond, and we will continue to work to create compatibility.
This clarification largely wasn't needed. People's outrage and the noise isn't coming from the fact that people think they're going to lose access to the materials in the compendium.
It's coming from the fact that they'll lose access to it in the "toolset" and be forced to rebuild it themselves - despite buying the books and items being the original solution to not having to build it ourselves. Also, when you purchase a book, the book itself tells you that you purchasing the information for use in the "toolset" not just in the compenduims. So what I bought was access to the 2014 spells in the toolset. What you're giving me is not access to the 2014 spells in the toolset.
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i use dndbeyond to make characters using the 2014 rules. so if i can't do that no reason to have sub. will cancel if this changes goes through without a way to pick which ruleset you want to use for character creation. as if i can't make a character using the 2014 rules. there is no reason to have the sub
You cannot except every single player who wants that functionality to homebrew every last spell and item they are currently using when DnDB has shown time and again that they have the capability to differentiate between multiple items with the same base names.
That's not the only problem! There are things we can't house rule, like 2014 warlock invocations, mundane equipment, etc. There's literally going to be no way to use the D&D Beyond character sheet purely for 2014 games.
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I just can’t fathom the reasoning behind this decision. If it was just some obviously scummy cash-grab like the ogl I could at least understand it as a business decision. But this seems like just total incompetence from WotC to me at this point. Its cartoonish.
Gotta love the official post getting ratioed so hard by so many comments below it.
As others have stated, the issue was never compendium access. The primary reason D&D Beyond is used over physical books is ease of use. That applies primarily to quick-filled character sheets and search functions.
By forcing the 2024 update on people instead of allowing people to use the content as Legacy, WotC/Hasbro are effectively stealing from their user base.
I really hope that, if Beyond doesn't reverse course on this change (which would be incredibly easy for them to do), a class-action lawsuit comes about. We didn't pay for Compendium-only access of the content, we paid for full use in the character builder and searches.
Side note to those defending Beyond here: Just stop. You're only riling people up worse.
Roll20 spent yesterday and today advertising how on their platform you'll be able to pick between a 2014 and 2024 character sheet and won't lose any functionality if you decide to stick with the older ruleset. They specifically said "both Sheets are compatible with 2014 and 2024 rules, so you can keep using your existing spells, magic items, & monsters without interruption" which seems fairly targeted at what D&D Beyond said you won't be able to do following the update. It's always hard to leave a walled garden if you've invested heavily into D&D Beyond but Roll20 is pitching hard to be where you land if decide to leave.
Don't like the idea of WotC getting kickbacks from Roll20 purchases, but as a curiosity what are their prices like?
Looks like most sourcebooks are between $25 and $30 with their Player Bundle (PHB, Xanathar's, Tasha's) at $76.47 & their DM Starter Bundle (PHB, MM, DMG, Essentials Kit) at $98.12. Both bundles are 15% off from buying individual titles and I guess have some sort of built in discount if you already own a title on their platform. However, I'm not sure if Wizards will be pulling the 2014 core rulebooks from all digital platforms (like Roll20) when they launch the 2024 ruleset; when Wizards pulled Volo's Guide to Monsters and Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes from D&D Beyond, they also pulled it from their digital partners like Roll20.
I don't want the 2024 content, free or not. I want to use the 2014 content that I paid for, and that you are continuing to sell, in the character builder. If that requires me to do all the work, then I don't see a need to use your site any more, or purchase anything from you any more.
Sarah the “clarification” wasn’t needed… we already knew what you meant, we understood it perfectly.
what you seem to not understand is WE DON’T WANT THE PROPOSED CHANGE, we haven’t misunderstood and we’re not confused. Your proposed change is absolute trash and is literally miss selling of products.
also Forcing us to have stuff for free for an edition that we didn’t want anyway is nonsense and isn’t the selling point you seem to think it is.
your store front said that buying this content unlocked it for the TOOLSET, that’s why we bought it here and not in book format - FOR THE TOOLSET!!!!!
if I wanted to access it via compendium, I would literally just have bought the paper books as it gives me no added functionality.
i paid for the use of the toolset along with the books contents, the point is that it makes playing the game easier by automating stuff on character sheets that I don’t want to deal with - removing that by changing it to the 2024 version with only a few weeks notice, doesn’t need clarified - it needs an apology and an explanation as to how exactly you think you’ve not broken trading standards regulations on fair trading and advertising.
so my clarification to you guys is: “actually respond to what we, the player base, are concerned about rather than just repeating the same thing that we’ve told you already we generally do not like!!!!”
Glad to hear that 2014 material will still appear in the compendium, but it's not enough. We need to retain character sheet functionality. My groups are not ready, willing, or able to switch at the drop of a hat, and I don't have time to relearn hundreds of spell effects overnight (or in the next few months, either, honestly).
Deeply disappointed and honestly bewildered by the reasoning on this decision. If D&D Beyond's character sheets won't do what I need, I can't justify spending money or effort here.
This isn't a clarification in any way. Nor is it going to claw back the people who are unhappy and have already cancelled their subscriptions like myself.
There are some...questionable changes in the 2024 spells that I just don't think work well. One of my players uses Conjure Animals as a crowd control method and a meat shield in choke points. The 2024 version of that spell is now going to render that tactic entirely impossible for said player. So, no I don't want the 2024 spells for free. In fact I don't want anything that the 2024 rulebooks have to offer.
I said in other threads that I don't believe that this is a Dev or DDB staff decision and I stand by that. I genuinely believe that this is interference from parent companies here. The choice now here though is perhaps for DDB staff to take these complaints to the higher ups and let them know that if their competitors are offering what people are asking for (retention of 2014 in functionality alongside the new 2024 functionality) this approach is not the correct one. It will lose users, which means losing money. That sadly is the only language 'higher ups' tend to understand.
For my part I've spent a full day ensuring that my players' transition to a new service will be smooth. I can't say if any 23 of the players that I DM for will leave the site for good with me...but just consider the DMs for a moment - if they start fleeing the site over this...it's bad news across the board especially if they take players with them.
It is clear than when people have expressed concerns WotC hasn't listened, Crawford hasn't listened, and now DDB isn't listening. People have asked for 2024 to be effectively treated as a new edition and to retain access to both ways of playing the game they love. I understand that it is a decision made outside of DDB (assuming that DDB is still a separate company with WotC as its parent company, rather than simply a division of WotC), but there are ways of doing better. I feel sorry for the customer-facing staff who will be dealing with this.
Lose all your players spells and magic items two weeks early because we dont believe in consent and our leadership figured no one would buy the new stuff if they can still use the old.
Subscribe to be disrespected today!
Since there's an obvious troll who is clogging the replies with repeated massive quote blocks, let me clarify:
i am someone who wants the 2024 rules, I like most of the improvements. I STILL object to the outright REMOVAL of our access to the functionality of the character builder by removing the items/spells/etc. Whether you love or hate the 2024 rules, whether they give you anything for free fundamentally does not address the change they are making to the base line usage of this entire system.
The reason people are so heated up, and rightfully so, is that just because "it's still in the compendium" is not the same thing as using the functions of the website. You cannot except every single player who wants that functionality to homebrew every last spell and item they are currently using when DnDB has shown time and again that they have the capability to differentiate between multiple items with the same base names. It would literally be easier from a databasing standpoint to label all the existing content on the builder from 2014 as legacy than the overwriting and replacing they are purposing. If this was a storage issue (which is assuredly is not), then it will only get worse with thousands upon thousands of users who would need to create individual entries for each spell/item, all for themselves rather than having the same already existing functions and content remain in place along side the new 2024 variations.
You did not have to make this difficult. You have the technology and know-how. Fix it!
I remember that album. I just deleted it from my library again this past week because the stupid thing keeps showing up again.
This is a hilarious "clarification." You know full well that people who want to continue using the 2014 rules in the character creator aren't going to be happy with being told that actually, everyone is getting a "free upgrade" of all the spells and we should all be grateful for having the old content taken away. Try again and this time please actually listen to our feedback and walk this change back.
What do you mean by you folks?
(Sidenote: Get out a dictionary and look up "hyperbole" and "comprehension".)
Not if the 'something' has no value to you
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Hear hear!
My games are on the current ruleset. Moving to 5.5 is not a utility to me.
In fact, on a personal level, I would be fine with WotC reneging on giving free 5.5 versions of spells/items so long as I could keep my current spells and items. (I understand other might be ticked, now that they've promised it. But this is my personal take.)
If I wanted the 5.5 spells and items then I would've purchased the 5.5 books. But I like my current 5.0 spells and items and all that jazz.
And even for those moving on to 5.5, lots of them want to have time to make that transition.
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right? They didn’t clarify anything. They just confirmed that we won’t have the spells on our character sheets anymore. I just canceled my master tier annul subscription. I’ll have to wrap my 3 weekly campaigns by November 25! Gives me time to also learn a new system.
This clarification largely wasn't needed. People's outrage and the noise isn't coming from the fact that people think they're going to lose access to the materials in the compendium.
It's coming from the fact that they'll lose access to it in the "toolset" and be forced to rebuild it themselves - despite buying the books and items being the original solution to not having to build it ourselves. Also, when you purchase a book, the book itself tells you that you purchasing the information for use in the "toolset" not just in the compenduims. So what I bought was access to the 2014 spells in the toolset. What you're giving me is not access to the 2014 spells in the toolset.
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i use dndbeyond to make characters using the 2014 rules. so if i can't do that no reason to have sub. will cancel if this changes goes through without a way to pick which ruleset you want to use for character creation. as if i can't make a character using the 2014 rules. there is no reason to have the sub
Just a Dragonborn looking for games to play.
That's not the only problem! There are things we can't house rule, like 2014 warlock invocations, mundane equipment, etc. There's literally going to be no way to use the D&D Beyond character sheet purely for 2014 games.
Really?! I haven't ever had it show up again after deleting it the first time.
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I just can’t fathom the reasoning behind this decision. If it was just some obviously scummy cash-grab like the ogl I could at least understand it as a business decision. But this seems like just total incompetence from WotC to me at this point. Its cartoonish.
Gotta love the official post getting ratioed so hard by so many comments below it.
As others have stated, the issue was never compendium access. The primary reason D&D Beyond is used over physical books is ease of use. That applies primarily to quick-filled character sheets and search functions.
By forcing the 2024 update on people instead of allowing people to use the content as Legacy, WotC/Hasbro are effectively stealing from their user base.
I really hope that, if Beyond doesn't reverse course on this change (which would be incredibly easy for them to do), a class-action lawsuit comes about. We didn't pay for Compendium-only access of the content, we paid for full use in the character builder and searches.
Side note to those defending Beyond here: Just stop. You're only riling people up worse.
Looks like most sourcebooks are between $25 and $30 with their Player Bundle (PHB, Xanathar's, Tasha's) at $76.47 & their DM Starter Bundle (PHB, MM, DMG, Essentials Kit) at $98.12. Both bundles are 15% off from buying individual titles and I guess have some sort of built in discount if you already own a title on their platform. However, I'm not sure if Wizards will be pulling the 2014 core rulebooks from all digital platforms (like Roll20) when they launch the 2024 ruleset; when Wizards pulled Volo's Guide to Monsters and Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes from D&D Beyond, they also pulled it from their digital partners like Roll20.
I don't want the 2024 content, free or not. I want to use the 2014 content that I paid for, and that you are continuing to sell, in the character builder. If that requires me to do all the work, then I don't see a need to use your site any more, or purchase anything from you any more.
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Sarah the “clarification” wasn’t needed… we already knew what you meant, we understood it perfectly.
what you seem to not understand is WE DON’T WANT THE PROPOSED CHANGE, we haven’t misunderstood and we’re not confused. Your proposed change is absolute trash and is literally miss selling of products.
also Forcing us to have stuff for free for an edition that we didn’t want anyway is nonsense and isn’t the selling point you seem to think it is.
your store front said that buying this content unlocked it for the TOOLSET, that’s why we bought it here and not in book format - FOR THE TOOLSET!!!!!
if I wanted to access it via compendium, I would literally just have bought the paper books as it gives me no added functionality.
i paid for the use of the toolset along with the books contents, the point is that it makes playing the game easier by automating stuff on character sheets that I don’t want to deal with - removing that by changing it to the 2024 version with only a few weeks notice, doesn’t need clarified - it needs an apology and an explanation as to how exactly you think you’ve not broken trading standards regulations on fair trading and advertising.
so my clarification to you guys is: “actually respond to what we, the player base, are concerned about rather than just repeating the same thing that we’ve told you already we generally do not like!!!!”
Glad to hear that 2014 material will still appear in the compendium, but it's not enough. We need to retain character sheet functionality. My groups are not ready, willing, or able to switch at the drop of a hat, and I don't have time to relearn hundreds of spell effects overnight (or in the next few months, either, honestly).
Deeply disappointed and honestly bewildered by the reasoning on this decision. If D&D Beyond's character sheets won't do what I need, I can't justify spending money or effort here.
This isn't a clarification in any way. Nor is it going to claw back the people who are unhappy and have already cancelled their subscriptions like myself.
There are some...questionable changes in the 2024 spells that I just don't think work well. One of my players uses Conjure Animals as a crowd control method and a meat shield in choke points. The 2024 version of that spell is now going to render that tactic entirely impossible for said player. So, no I don't want the 2024 spells for free. In fact I don't want anything that the 2024 rulebooks have to offer.
I said in other threads that I don't believe that this is a Dev or DDB staff decision and I stand by that. I genuinely believe that this is interference from parent companies here. The choice now here though is perhaps for DDB staff to take these complaints to the higher ups and let them know that if their competitors are offering what people are asking for (retention of 2014 in functionality alongside the new 2024 functionality) this approach is not the correct one. It will lose users, which means losing money. That sadly is the only language 'higher ups' tend to understand.
For my part I've spent a full day ensuring that my players' transition to a new service will be smooth. I can't say if any 23 of the players that I DM for will leave the site for good with me...but just consider the DMs for a moment - if they start fleeing the site over this...it's bad news across the board especially if they take players with them.
It is clear than when people have expressed concerns WotC hasn't listened, Crawford hasn't listened, and now DDB isn't listening. People have asked for 2024 to be effectively treated as a new edition and to retain access to both ways of playing the game they love. I understand that it is a decision made outside of DDB (assuming that DDB is still a separate company with WotC as its parent company, rather than simply a division of WotC), but there are ways of doing better. I feel sorry for the customer-facing staff who will be dealing with this.
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