For about 3 months now my friend and I have been playing a D&D 5e campaign with a DM we connected with in an online forum. We communicate over Discord, where the DM uploads pics of characters, monsters, and the occasional overhead map.
The DM is a really nice guy and does an amazing job role-playing and investing the NPCs with life and personality. However, I find the theater-of-the-mind combat he uses is often frustrating and confusing, especially in battles with large groups of enemies and a lot of movement. He will do his best to describe what's happening, but I never feel confident that I have an accurate understanding of the battlefield. There have been several instances where this lack of understanding has led to unforseen and unfortunate consequences. In one session my friend tried to run towards an NPC who was being dragged off by a werewolf. As he was moving, the DM said he passed by three wolves and gave each an attack of opportunity against him. All 3 attacks landed and my friend was downed as a result. Later, my friend said to me privately that there was no way he would have moved if he thought doing so would cause him to take 3 opportunity attacks.
I'm quite familiar and happy with playing on the Roll20 virtual table-top. My DM is aware of Roll20, but is either not technologically inclined or just doesn't feel a map and grid are necessary for battles. Indeed, by his descriptions of the battlefield, it seems that he has a very good sense of where everyone is at all times. From this I imagine he thinks we would have a similar sense of battlefield awareness.
I've mentioned several times to the DM how difficult I find the theatre-of-the-mind combat. He seems to be at a loss for what to do to help me, citing that the other group he plays with are fine with it.
I'm becoming increasingly more frustrated. I really don't want seem ungrateful to the DM and I do mostly enjoy the game, but I'm starting to think I might be better off finding another group that employs a virtual tabletop.
Is there anything I can do myself to understand theater-of-the-mind combat better? Is there a low-tech way the DM could give us more battlefield awareness? How can I ask the DM to do even more work on account of me when the DM's role is already so laborious?
I'm not a big fan of theater of the mind for combat because I'm not spatial, but my Roll 20 group has been doing more of it lately. As much as I hate slowing things down during combat, I do find I have to ask more questions such as "If I move 5 feet to the left will I provoke any attacks of opportunity" or "How many feet away from the paladin is the carrion crawler." Our DM understands that it is harder to figure out what's going on without visual aids so she is really patient with me.
You could try using graph paper. Mark down where your character is and as your DM describes things ask how many feet away from you something is. You can quickly mark those things on your grid. Usually 1 square on the grid is 5 ft so if the master is five feet away from you, mark a big red X next to you. Draw a compass rose on your graph so that when the DM says something is 20 ft to the north you can mark that down. That will give you a visual reference. It may feel like you are slowing the game down but as you keep using it things will go faster. Eventually you might not even need the graph paper.
Yeah, I'm just going to add to the choir. Ask questions. If you don't know what's going, have the DM clarify for you. The DM is the narrator of the story you're building.
It's really not tthat complicated (most RPGs don't utilize battle maps), you just need to keep focus on the important bits. "Am I close enough to hit enemy X?" "If I move towards the door will I that get me close enough so that the wolves can hit me?" "Do I seem to be close enough to hit the dragon with my bow?" Basic things like that. If you can read a book and imagine what's happening you can do TotM.
It's interesting that you mention, "If you can read a book and imagine what's happening you can do TotM," because, ever since I was little, I've had an extremely difficult time visualizing scenery in novels. More so, scenes with a lot of movement also tend to confuse. Reading Ender's Game and the descriptions of zero gravity matches in battle school, I was only able to get a vague sense of what was happening in those scenes.
So I guess my sense of spatial reasoning is particularly low, whereas my DM's spatial reasoning is very high.
It's interesting that you mention, "If you can read a book and imagine what's happening you can do TotM," because, ever since I was little, I've had an extremely difficult time visualizing scenery in novels. More so, scenes with a lot of movement also tend to confuse. Reading Ender's Game and the descriptions of zero gravity matches in battle school, I was only able to get a vague sense of what was happening in those scenes.
So I guess my sense of spatial reasoning is particularly low, whereas my DM's spatial reasoning is very high.
Yeah, that can make it difficult of course. I would take advantage of your DM's spatial reasoning and have him explains as much as possible to you so that it helps with you getting a clear picture of what is going on. If you explain your difficulty, this shouldn't be something that the DM should have any problems with. Keeping track yourself by taking notes and using graph paper is also good advice.
I think if you’re relying on ToM, lots of questions are to be expected. I wouldn’t feel bad about it. Making your own sketch map is a great idea and hey, maybe you’re not the only one in your group that would find it useful. I would definitely use a map myself.
+1 for using your own map. For quick editing, you can use squares in Excel instead of graph paper.
It sounds like you may be interested in researching "aphantasia", which is the term for lacking the capacity for visual, or other sensory, imagination. There may be forums available with useful coping mechanisms for similar situations.
In the instance you're describing, a DM should probably have said something along the lines of: "Moving the way you're suggesting would draw attacks of opportunity from two or three wolves. You could try to move around the wolves, but you might not get there this turn in that case." This empowers the player to make choices without getting caught up in the minutiae of combat positioning: Would my character rush headlong through attacks to save the helpless ally? Would I try to fight through the wolves? Or would I dash or disengage to avoid the attacks and just position myself next to the werewolf to get an attack of opportunity if they try to drag off the NPC?
But give everyone a break: DMing is not a professional activity, and part of collaborative storytelling is that not everyone will generate the same mental scene from the same description. Treat this as a chance to learn and improve your ability to generate a scene without a map, and work with your DM to understand the way things are set up. If there are differences in the way you understand what your DM is describing, update your heuristic for asking questions or clarifying what the scene is like for them.
Personally, I find cut-and-dried battle maps highlight how limited 5e tactical combat is. Players position spell templates to hit enemies and miss allies; they move awkwardly in circles around enemies to avoid attacks from the simplistic opportunity system; they use details their character likely wouldn't be able to see to inform their decisions. Think about how theater-of-the-mind combat allows the DM to make combat feel more urgent and realistic. Urge your DM to give you information that your character should have, but also allow them to surprise you, because combat should be a messy business despite what battle maps have trained us to think.
It's not just aphantasia that can stand in the way of TotM. I love to read and have no trouble visualizing what I'm reading, but I find it extremely difficult to do the same thing with something I hear. I also have a lot more trouble remembering details and even sometimes following the plot when I try to listen to an audio book - to the point where it's just not an option for me if I'm interested in reading a certain book. I had this issue in school as well - lectures were near worthless to me without visual aids to go along with it. Pretty sure this is also why I just don't "get" podcasts even when they are covering material I'm really interested in.
On the other hand, I can visualize from music as easily as reading, and recall lyrics really well as long as they are "embedded" in music. It's like the connection between my ears and the left hemisphere of my brain is disabled. Brains are really weird and some people just have a harder time processing certain kinds of information in certain ways.
That being said, I can do theater of the mind even though I think I get less out of it than most. It just means I'm just going to be asking a lot of questions. If you're about to run after someone like your friend did, it's totally appropriate and fair to first ask if you would draw any opportunity attacks by doing so.
I looked up aphantasia. Fascinating! I think I have a touch of it, especially in regards to visualizing scenery. The website said that visualizing imagery is a skill that can be improved, so that's great news 😀
There is also the difficult task for the DM to be able to describe a scene, and the way it is changing, accurately enough so that all the players can imagine pretty-much the same scene in their minds.
When using TotM, the DM needs to warn players if their movement will provoke attacks or leave them unusually exposed. If the DM doesn't give that warning, players need to challenge the DM a little on the positioning of the enemies. Challenge them enough and they'll either start giving the warnings necessary or start using a battlemap.
personally as a dm who likes ToTM I think your dm was a little unfair here for me painting a picture of ToTM is not about feet and inches of movement, it’s about player asking can I reach a thing and hit it, it’s about being a lot freeer about combat for instance in your situation I would have described it as follows.
The werewolf grabs Constance by the throat dragging her off, the 3 dire wolves between you and the werewolf snarl and snap at you blocking a direct route through.
From there a player can ask me any other questions about the terrain and situation before asking me, can I get past the wolves without getting in attack range. Now the whole point of ToTM is to be cinematic rather then mechanical so I might allow a dex roll to dodge around them, or jump over them.
Now personally on discord I use a combination of ToTM and static maps to describe the situation. I personally don’t like table top simulators like roll 20, but I use inkarnate for my maps and so it is really easy to put tokens on it for the players and enemies starting point and then use them to track positions on the map taking a screenshot as needed if the party get a little confused with positioning. But really ToTM is not about mechanics and if your dm is running it like that they need to provide some sort of visual aid to help. But I would say you and your friend should feel free to just ask question before you do what you do and your dm should let you do over something if an effect happens you genuinely did not visualise.
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For about 3 months now my friend and I have been playing a D&D 5e campaign with a DM we connected with in an online forum. We communicate over Discord, where the DM uploads pics of characters, monsters, and the occasional overhead map.
The DM is a really nice guy and does an amazing job role-playing and investing the NPCs with life and personality. However, I find the theater-of-the-mind combat he uses is often frustrating and confusing, especially in battles with large groups of enemies and a lot of movement. He will do his best to describe what's happening, but I never feel confident that I have an accurate understanding of the battlefield. There have been several instances where this lack of understanding has led to unforseen and unfortunate consequences. In one session my friend tried to run towards an NPC who was being dragged off by a werewolf. As he was moving, the DM said he passed by three wolves and gave each an attack of opportunity against him. All 3 attacks landed and my friend was downed as a result. Later, my friend said to me privately that there was no way he would have moved if he thought doing so would cause him to take 3 opportunity attacks.
I'm quite familiar and happy with playing on the Roll20 virtual table-top. My DM is aware of Roll20, but is either not technologically inclined or just doesn't feel a map and grid are necessary for battles. Indeed, by his descriptions of the battlefield, it seems that he has a very good sense of where everyone is at all times. From this I imagine he thinks we would have a similar sense of battlefield awareness.
I've mentioned several times to the DM how difficult I find the theatre-of-the-mind combat. He seems to be at a loss for what to do to help me, citing that the other group he plays with are fine with it.
I'm becoming increasingly more frustrated. I really don't want seem ungrateful to the DM and I do mostly enjoy the game, but I'm starting to think I might be better off finding another group that employs a virtual tabletop.
Is there anything I can do myself to understand theater-of-the-mind combat better? Is there a low-tech way the DM could give us more battlefield awareness? How can I ask the DM to do even more work on account of me when the DM's role is already so laborious?
Any advice would be appreciated.
I'm not a big fan of theater of the mind for combat because I'm not spatial, but my Roll 20 group has been doing more of it lately. As much as I hate slowing things down during combat, I do find I have to ask more questions such as "If I move 5 feet to the left will I provoke any attacks of opportunity" or "How many feet away from the paladin is the carrion crawler." Our DM understands that it is harder to figure out what's going on without visual aids so she is really patient with me.
You could try using graph paper. Mark down where your character is and as your DM describes things ask how many feet away from you something is. You can quickly mark those things on your grid. Usually 1 square on the grid is 5 ft so if the master is five feet away from you, mark a big red X next to you. Draw a compass rose on your graph so that when the DM says something is 20 ft to the north you can mark that down. That will give you a visual reference. It may feel like you are slowing the game down but as you keep using it things will go faster. Eventually you might not even need the graph paper.
Yeah, I'm just going to add to the choir. Ask questions. If you don't know what's going, have the DM clarify for you. The DM is the narrator of the story you're building.
It's really not tthat complicated (most RPGs don't utilize battle maps), you just need to keep focus on the important bits. "Am I close enough to hit enemy X?" "If I move towards the door will I that get me close enough so that the wolves can hit me?" "Do I seem to be close enough to hit the dragon with my bow?" Basic things like that. If you can read a book and imagine what's happening you can do TotM.
Using graph paper is a great idea! Thanks 😊
It's interesting that you mention, "If you can read a book and imagine what's happening you can do TotM," because, ever since I was little, I've had an extremely difficult time visualizing scenery in novels. More so, scenes with a lot of movement also tend to confuse. Reading Ender's Game and the descriptions of zero gravity matches in battle school, I was only able to get a vague sense of what was happening in those scenes.
So I guess my sense of spatial reasoning is particularly low, whereas my DM's spatial reasoning is very high.
Yeah, that can make it difficult of course. I would take advantage of your DM's spatial reasoning and have him explains as much as possible to you so that it helps with you getting a clear picture of what is going on. If you explain your difficulty, this shouldn't be something that the DM should have any problems with. Keeping track yourself by taking notes and using graph paper is also good advice.
Best of lucK!
Thank you! 😁
I think if you’re relying on ToM, lots of questions are to be expected. I wouldn’t feel bad about it. Making your own sketch map is a great idea and hey, maybe you’re not the only one in your group that would find it useful. I would definitely use a map myself.
DM - And In The Darkness, Rot: The Sunless Citadel
DM - Our Little Lives Kept In Equipoise: Curse of Strahd
DM - Misprize Thou Not These Shadows That Belong: The Lost Mines of Phandelver
PC - Azzure - Tyranny of Dragons
+1 for using your own map. For quick editing, you can use squares in Excel instead of graph paper.
It sounds like you may be interested in researching "aphantasia", which is the term for lacking the capacity for visual, or other sensory, imagination. There may be forums available with useful coping mechanisms for similar situations.
In the instance you're describing, a DM should probably have said something along the lines of: "Moving the way you're suggesting would draw attacks of opportunity from two or three wolves. You could try to move around the wolves, but you might not get there this turn in that case." This empowers the player to make choices without getting caught up in the minutiae of combat positioning: Would my character rush headlong through attacks to save the helpless ally? Would I try to fight through the wolves? Or would I dash or disengage to avoid the attacks and just position myself next to the werewolf to get an attack of opportunity if they try to drag off the NPC?
But give everyone a break: DMing is not a professional activity, and part of collaborative storytelling is that not everyone will generate the same mental scene from the same description. Treat this as a chance to learn and improve your ability to generate a scene without a map, and work with your DM to understand the way things are set up. If there are differences in the way you understand what your DM is describing, update your heuristic for asking questions or clarifying what the scene is like for them.
Personally, I find cut-and-dried battle maps highlight how limited 5e tactical combat is. Players position spell templates to hit enemies and miss allies; they move awkwardly in circles around enemies to avoid attacks from the simplistic opportunity system; they use details their character likely wouldn't be able to see to inform their decisions. Think about how theater-of-the-mind combat allows the DM to make combat feel more urgent and realistic. Urge your DM to give you information that your character should have, but also allow them to surprise you, because combat should be a messy business despite what battle maps have trained us to think.
Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in awhile.
It's not just aphantasia that can stand in the way of TotM. I love to read and have no trouble visualizing what I'm reading, but I find it extremely difficult to do the same thing with something I hear. I also have a lot more trouble remembering details and even sometimes following the plot when I try to listen to an audio book - to the point where it's just not an option for me if I'm interested in reading a certain book. I had this issue in school as well - lectures were near worthless to me without visual aids to go along with it. Pretty sure this is also why I just don't "get" podcasts even when they are covering material I'm really interested in.
On the other hand, I can visualize from music as easily as reading, and recall lyrics really well as long as they are "embedded" in music. It's like the connection between my ears and the left hemisphere of my brain is disabled. Brains are really weird and some people just have a harder time processing certain kinds of information in certain ways.
That being said, I can do theater of the mind even though I think I get less out of it than most. It just means I'm just going to be asking a lot of questions. If you're about to run after someone like your friend did, it's totally appropriate and fair to first ask if you would draw any opportunity attacks by doing so.
My homebrew subclasses (full list here)
(Artificer) Swordmage | Glasswright | (Barbarian) Path of the Savage Embrace
(Bard) College of Dance | (Fighter) Warlord | Cannoneer
(Monk) Way of the Elements | (Ranger) Blade Dancer
(Rogue) DaggerMaster | Inquisitor | (Sorcerer) Riftwalker | Spellfist
(Warlock) The Swarm
I looked up aphantasia. Fascinating! I think I have a touch of it, especially in regards to visualizing scenery. The website said that visualizing imagery is a skill that can be improved, so that's great news 😀
There is also the difficult task for the DM to be able to describe a scene, and the way it is changing, accurately enough so that all the players can imagine pretty-much the same scene in their minds.
When using TotM, the DM needs to warn players if their movement will provoke attacks or leave them unusually exposed. If the DM doesn't give that warning, players need to challenge the DM a little on the positioning of the enemies. Challenge them enough and they'll either start giving the warnings necessary or start using a battlemap.
personally as a dm who likes ToTM I think your dm was a little unfair here for me painting a picture of ToTM is not about feet and inches of movement, it’s about player asking can I reach a thing and hit it, it’s about being a lot freeer about combat for instance in your situation I would have described it as follows.
The werewolf grabs Constance by the throat dragging her off, the 3 dire wolves between you and the werewolf snarl and snap at you blocking a direct route through.
From there a player can ask me any other questions about the terrain and situation before asking me, can I get past the wolves without getting in attack range. Now the whole point of ToTM is to be cinematic rather then mechanical so I might allow a dex roll to dodge around them, or jump over them.
Now personally on discord I use a combination of ToTM and static maps to describe the situation. I personally don’t like table top simulators like roll 20, but I use inkarnate for my maps and so it is really easy to put tokens on it for the players and enemies starting point and then use them to track positions on the map taking a screenshot as needed if the party get a little confused with positioning. But really ToTM is not about mechanics and if your dm is running it like that they need to provide some sort of visual aid to help. But I would say you and your friend should feel free to just ask question before you do what you do and your dm should let you do over something if an effect happens you genuinely did not visualise.